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Isiah Thomas is not fired, just banned-Posted 8:15 last night on NYPOST.
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KNICKSdom
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4/22/2008  10:53 PM
Isiah is like the elephant man, Walsh is explaining to the media that the elephant man is banned from the players and such. Makes sense, the circus has to stop now. Just need put elephant man in cage until his contract is finished.
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GKFv2
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4/22/2008  10:54 PM
Posted by KNICKSdom:

Isiah is like the elephant man, Walsh is explaining to the media that the elephant man is banned from the players and such. Makes sense, the circus has to stop now. Just need put elephant man in cage until his contract is finished.

The Elephant Man was a very smart person. Comparing him to Isiah is an insult.
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JrZyHuStLa
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4/22/2008  11:02 PM
KNICKSdom
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4/22/2008  11:38 PM
Posted by JrZyHuStLa:


That is Isiah in three years when his contract is up.
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Solace
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4/23/2008  7:53 AM
Posted by nyk4ever:
Posted by Bonn1997:
Posted by nyk4ever:
Posted by Bonn1997:
Posted by nyk4ever:

The idea is for Isiah to fire himself and breach his contract so then Dolan won't be on the hook for ANY of it. Does anyone think Isiah can really stay away for 3 years and refrain from doing any of the ridiculous clauses I'm sure that Dolan put in his contract?

I don't.
Great, so when Dolan tries to fire Isiah with cause, we can look forward to another trial. The dysfunction of this organization never ends.

Oh well, I could care less about dysfunction now. Walsh is hired and making the decisions, that's all I'm really focused on.

Well, Walsh is hired. I agree with that part. We have no idea, though, whether Walsh, Isiah, or Dolan is the one determining the direction of the team and what kind of rebuilding will occur. Everyone here seems to think they know, even though they don't.

[Edited by - bonn1997 on 04-22-2008 6:14 PM]

Well that's the beauty of WATCHING THINGS UNFOLD instead of making vast assumptions before things even happen. I'm willing to give things a chance, if I wasn't, then what would the point of being here be? Certainly not a whole lot.

IMHO, you've been going just as gung-ho as everyone else, just in the other direction. There's only a few active posters on this board who can legitimately make that comment about watching things unfold. Everyone else has stated their view and their confidence that they are correct.

Anyway, I think Bonn makes a good point about having serious concern for the direction of the Knicks with this move. Not that we haven't been concerned, but it would take massive changes to ease the concern, and we haven't hit it yet.

As for posting, I think the majority comes here for the virtual beer, virtual nachos and virtual alba. Why would anyone want to discuss the Knicks too seriously?
Wishing everyone well. I enjoyed posting here for a while, but as I matured I realized this forum isn't for me. We all evolve. Thanks for the memories everyone.
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4/23/2008  12:22 PM
Solace, I guess you're saying I should stick to an "agenda." I'm sorry, but I'm not agenda-driven when it comes to the Knicks, like yourself and others might be. I call things as I see them, if something is **** and continues to be ****, I'm going to call it **** for however long it's **** for. I don't care what I've said in the past, the past had to do with Isiah Thomas at the helm of this franchise and now he's gone. I'm willing to let things unfold with Donnie Walsh, because he's a proven executive in this league who is widely respected. If you can't deal with that, then I don't know what to tell you.
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Solace
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4/23/2008  1:49 PM
Posted by nyk4ever:

Solace, I guess you're saying I should stick to an "agenda." I'm sorry, but I'm not agenda-driven when it comes to the Knicks, like yourself and others might be. I call things as I see them, if something is **** and continues to be ****, I'm going to call it **** for however long it's **** for. I don't care what I've said in the past, the past had to do with Isiah Thomas at the helm of this franchise and now he's gone. I'm willing to let things unfold with Donnie Walsh, because he's a proven executive in this league who is widely respected. If you can't deal with that, then I don't know what to tell you.

That's not at all what I said. It actually has nothing to do with what I said. What I'm noticing from you is extreme impatience with views that disagree with your perceived view. You say wait and see, yet you attack anyone who has doubts about Walsh and what's really going on. Is it not reasonable to distrust anything having to do with the New York Knicks right now? For a lot of people, the Knicks have a long way to go to re-earn the benefit of the doubt. The other day you were cursing people out for no reason. I was just trying to gently suggest that you either follow your own advice or don't preach, so that you don't sound like a hypocrite.

Other than that, I have no issues with you.

[Edited by - Solace on Apr 23 2008 1:51 PM]
Wishing everyone well. I enjoyed posting here for a while, but as I matured I realized this forum isn't for me. We all evolve. Thanks for the memories everyone.
Bonn1997
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4/23/2008  2:15 PM
Posted by nyk4ever:

Solace, I guess you're saying I should stick to an "agenda." I'm sorry, but I'm not agenda-driven when it comes to the Knicks, like yourself and others might be. I call things as I see them, if something is **** and continues to be ****, I'm going to call it **** for however long it's **** for. I don't care what I've said in the past, the past had to do with Isiah Thomas at the helm of this franchise and now he's gone. I'm willing to let things unfold with Donnie Walsh, because he's a proven executive in this league who is widely respected. If you can't deal with that, then I don't know what to tell you.

Wow, this outburst really surprised me. I don't think anyone was implying something negative about you. It just seemed like standard message board talk.
Silverfuel
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4/23/2008  9:41 PM
Posted by nyk4ever:

I don't care what I've said in the past, the past had to do with Isiah Thomas at the helm of this franchise and now he's gone. I'm willing to let things unfold with Donnie Walsh, because he's a proven executive in this league who is widely respected.
Agreed!
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islesfan
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4/23/2008  10:31 PM
Posted by Silverfuel:
Posted by nyk4ever:

I don't care what I've said in the past, the past had to do with Isiah Thomas at the helm of this franchise and now he's gone. I'm willing to let things unfold with Donnie Walsh, because he's a proven executive in this league who is widely respected.
Agreed!

He was widely respected. Now he's a proven puppet.
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SlimPack
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4/23/2008  11:31 PM
I for the most part am going with the wait and see approach.

Right now, I think isiah still being here is about either the money he's owed (unlikely), Walsh wanting to stay in good graces with Dolan (a bit more likely), Walsh wanting Isiah to have a graceful exit (pretty likely) or, Walsh simply not having come to the conclusion that Isiah has to be completely removed from the team yet (somewhat likely).

The reason why I have that last reason in there is because, Walsh strikes me as the type of person who wouldn't make a move unless he's decided for himself that it has to be made. In other words, He doesn't look at the fans hating Isiah, and the media killing Isiah as reason for Isiah to have to be removed from the organization completely. He would only do that if he himself decided, based on his own fact gathering, that such a thing has to be done.

However, since Walsh apparently has moved on to looking for coaches (and has already conducted exit interviews), it's probable that he already knows enough about Isiah and the Graceful Exit theory is what's going on now. So I guess that's my official explanation.
BlueSeats
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4/24/2008  12:12 AM
Walsh's relationship with Isiah, and this concept of letting him down gently is nonsense, as proven by the fact that was not how he conducted business in Indy.

I don't even buy the theory that Dolan really likes Isiah and wants him around in some capacity. Dolan hardly attended games or met with Isiah this year, and his presence will be drastically reduced from that, so even if Dolan and Isiah choose to remain friends they'd probably see just as much of each other even after being released.

The only theory I subscribe to is that Dolan is hoping Isiah will want to take employment elsewhere, and will quit or negotiate a buyout, saving Dolan a few mil. And Walsh is humoring Dolan by saying "sure, that could happen."

But why should it happen? Isiah wont get close to 18M over the next 3 years anywhere else. And whatever money would be saved in a buyout would pale in comparison the embarrassment Isiah's continued presence garners the organization.

My disappointment is that Walsh was presumably brought in to elevate the frat house environment at MSG and provide sane counsel to Dolan, who seemingly can't find it elsewhere.

Reportedly Walsh was given the authority to do what he thought best with Isiah, and it's just saddening that he'd rather indulge Dolan's inanity than do the right thing and clean up the mess. It just makes one wonder, what is the point in bringing in someone with credibility and respect if he's going to surrender better judgment to the moronic owner?

A Knicks rebirth may take a lot longer than any of us hope if Walsh is such a gentleman that he'll bow down to Dolan's ignorance.
SlimPack
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4/24/2008  12:47 AM
Posted by BlueSeats:

Walsh's relationship with Isiah, and this concept of letting him down gently is nonsense, as proven by the fact that was not how he conducted business in Indy.

I don't even buy the theory that Dolan really likes Isiah and wants him around in some capacity. Dolan hardly attended games or met with Isiah this year, and his presence will be drastically reduced from that, so even if Dolan and Isiah choose to remain friends they'd probably see just as much of each other even after being released.

The only theory I subscribe to is that Dolan is hoping Isiah will want to take employment elsewhere, and will quit or negotiate a buyout, saving Dolan a few mil. And Walsh is humoring Dolan by saying "sure, that could happen."

But why should it happen? Isiah wont get close to 18M over the next 3 years anywhere else. And whatever money would be saved in a buyout would pale in comparison the embarrassment Isiah's continued presence garners the organization.

My disappointment is that Walsh was presumably brought in to elevate the frat house environment at MSG and provide sane counsel to Dolan, who seemingly can't find it elsewhere.

Reportedly Walsh was given the authority to do what he thought best with Isiah, and it's just saddening that he'd rather indulge Dolan's inanity than do the right thing and clean up the mess. It just makes one wonder, what is the point in bringing in someone with credibility and respect if he's going to surrender better judgment to the moronic owner?

A Knicks rebirth may take a lot longer than any of us hope if Walsh is such a gentleman that he'll bow down to Dolan's ignorance.

A buyout. Yeah, it would be troubling if Walsh didn't do what needed to be done, just to carry out Dolan's insane idea on how to save money. Not to mention that trying to force someone into a buyout is kind of classless and not how a team's management should be conducting business.

Anyway how did he conduct business in Indiana that leads you to believe he wouldn't bother trying to smooth over Isiah's leave from the organization?

[Edited by - Slimpack on 04-24-2008 12:47 AM]
BlueSeats
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4/24/2008  12:51 AM
Posted by SlimPack:


Anyway how did he conduct business in Indiana that leads you to believe he wouldn't bother trying to smooth over Isiah's leave from the organization?


He was there for decades; who did he ever relieve of all duties, strip of an office, ban from practices and players, but not fire?
SlimPack
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4/24/2008  1:01 AM
Posted by BlueSeats:
Posted by SlimPack:


Anyway how did he conduct business in Indiana that leads you to believe he wouldn't bother trying to smooth over Isiah's leave from the organization?


He was there for decades; who did he ever relieve of all duties, strip of an office, ban from practices and players, but not fire?

I'm not sure how true the banning from players thing is. Anyway, in order to answer your question. I have, absolutely, no idea. I'm trying to find out information on what Walsh did with Indiana exactly but it's proving more difficult than I thought it would be. Maybe I just suck at this. So far I haven't even been able to find someone that Walsh fired while at Indiana.
nyk4ever
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4/24/2008  1:02 AM
I really can't wait for the draft and for Free-Agent, Trade market to start. I'm sick of all this damn talk.

Cautiously-Optimistic.
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SlimPack
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4/24/2008  1:05 AM
Posted by nyk4ever:

I really can't wait for the draft and for Free-Agent, Trade market to start. I'm sick of all this damn talk.

Cautiously-Optimistic.

I wouldn't be upset if Walsh, or the new GM, does little to nothing this offseason. That's because whoever is making that decision may want more information and to see the team play up front before making those kinds of choices.
martin
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4/24/2008  1:09 AM
Posted by BlueSeats:

Walsh's relationship with Isiah, and this concept of letting him down gently is nonsense, as proven by the fact that was not how he conducted business in Indy.

I don't even buy the theory that Dolan really likes Isiah and wants him around in some capacity. Dolan hardly attended games or met with Isiah this year, and his presence will be drastically reduced from that, so even if Dolan and Isiah choose to remain friends they'd probably see just as much of each other even after being released.

The only theory I subscribe to is that Dolan is hoping Isiah will want to take employment elsewhere, and will quit or negotiate a buyout, saving Dolan a few mil. And Walsh is humoring Dolan by saying "sure, that could happen."

But why should it happen? Isiah wont get close to 18M over the next 3 years anywhere else. And whatever money would be saved in a buyout would pale in comparison the embarrassment Isiah's continued presence garners the organization.

My disappointment is that Walsh was presumably brought in to elevate the frat house environment at MSG and provide sane counsel to Dolan, who seemingly can't find it elsewhere.

Reportedly Walsh was given the authority to do what he thought best with Isiah, and it's just saddening that he'd rather indulge Dolan's inanity than do the right thing and clean up the mess. It just makes one wonder, what is the point in bringing in someone with credibility and respect if he's going to surrender better judgment to the moronic owner?

A Knicks rebirth may take a lot longer than any of us hope if Walsh is such a gentleman that he'll bow down to Dolan's ignorance.

Blue, I think you are taking the whole Walsh thing a bit too far as it has to do with Isiah.

Walsh has come in and said he has full authority and will do things his way. Perhaps Dolan has asked Walsh to get as big a discount on Isiah's departure as he can and maybe Walsh is humoring the fuddy-dud. He did order Isiah to NOT have contact with players and Knicks staff, right?

Walsh has also said that he wants the Knicks organization to exercise fiscal responsibility with the cap... That can't extend to how he is managing the Knicks baskball organization as a whole? $18M is nothing to sneeze about especially if you can get an up to %50 discount on it and then redirect those funds into Euro scouting or something.

Isiah and his team - Glen and the fat man (jabba the hut dude) - are presumably knee deep into the draft assessment. Those 2 guys are also Isiah's close buddies. Don't you think it would be unwise to just rip Isiah away from those 2, and possibly others, at this juncture? That would leave Walsh on a very lonely island over the next month or so. Donnie has GOT to have time to access the landscape and THEN decide what to do; you never know how deep and long Isiah's tentacle have stretched to.

I mean, if you were tabbed as head of an organization that was floundering and were also new to every employee in it, would you start letting people go without taking the time to go through the whole org staff?
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BlueSeats
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4/24/2008  1:18 AM
Martin, if you're asking me if I think the new President of Basketball Operations should have fired Isiah promptly rather than letting the situation fester, my answer is yes, he should have fired him promptly.

Isiah's input into the draft is not that valuable, Suhr's opinion is more than enough, plus what Walsh already knows from his own research for Indiana. The real info will come from the workouts, which I'd like to think will be run by the new coach and GM, not the semi-fired guy who's twisting in the wind.

[Edited by - blueseats on 04-24-2008 01:19 AM]
martin
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4/24/2008  1:30 AM
Posted by BlueSeats:

Martin, if you're asking me if I think the new President of Basketball Operations should have fired Isiah promptly rather than letting the situation fester, my answer is yes, he should have fired him promptly.

Isiah's input into the draft is not that valuable, Suhr's opinion is more than enough, plus what Walsh already knows from his own research for Indiana. The real info will come from the workouts, which I'd like to think will be run by the new coach and GM, not the semi-fired guy who's twisting in the wind.

[Edited by - blueseats on 04-24-2008 01:19 AM]

why is the situation festering? Cause the fans and media keep asking when Isiah is going to get fired? Isiah is in a room by himself, talking to no one, waiting for Walsh to finish the rest of his business of getting and a coach and GM, and until that time, Isiah can't do nothin'. So what's the big deal? I think the only big deal left is to calm the over anxious knicks fans who are calling for immediate action (without forethought to prudence).

Plus, who is Donnie gonna call when he needs a good cup of coffee or a bowl of popcorn?

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Isiah Thomas is not fired, just banned-Posted 8:15 last night on NYPOST.

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