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IT butchers Greg Anthony
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islesfan
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10/19/2006  1:46 AM
Nice of Isiah to once again show what a classless, egomaniacal, petty, vindictive, weeny and gutless a-hole he is.

If he really felt that strongly about what critics said about Balkman then why did he wait until now to say something? Because he thinks 2 preseason games proves him right?

So you have to be a better player than the person you're criticizing for it to be valid? Larry Bird was a better player than Isiah. I guess what he thinks about Isiah is valid. Michael Jordan was a better player than Isiah. I guess what he thinks about Isiah is valid too.

The sooner Isiah is no longer associated with the Knicks, the better off the Knicks will be.
If it didn’t work in Phoenix with Nash and Stoutamire... it’s just not a winning formula. It’s an entertaining formula, but not a winning one. - Derek Harper talking about D'Antoni's System
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codeunknown
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10/19/2006  2:32 AM
Posted by islesfan:

Nice of Isiah to once again show what a classless, egomaniacal, petty, vindictive, weeny and gutless a-hole he is.


Let's be fair and balanced here. Your forgot pretentious weasel, managerial circus buffoon, self-proclaimed suit connoiseur, chronic pedophile, illiterate drug peddler, Oklahoma city bomber and overall fascist.
Sh-t in the popcorn to go with sh-t on the court. Its a theme show like Medieval times.
TheGame
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10/19/2006  2:49 AM
What is funny about this whole Marcus Williams debate is that everyone wants to criticize IT for passing on Williams when 19 other teams did the same thing. In fact, the Pacers have only two real PGs (armstrong does not count) and everyone knows that Tinsley is going to be hurt for half the season and the other guy did not really impress me last year. Williams would have been a perfect fit there but they pass on him to pick up Shawne Williams who plays the exact same position as Danny Granger, who they drafted last year. I have not heard one commentator berate Larry Bird for making that pick, but people still criticize IT for passing on a PG with a questionable background when we already had 4 people under contract on the team that could play PG. I know the haters hate everything dealing with IT, but I fail to see how the logic of the pick escapes you. And this whole, he would have been available at pick 29 thing (which was not the first argument most people made but has become the fall back position since people now cannot dispute that Balkman can play) is not credible to me. If your pick is up and the player you want and need is available, you better get him unless you are ABSOLUTELY certain that he will be available later. IT was not certain of that fact and did not think picking a PG was more beneficial to the Knicks than getting the defensive SF that the team really needed. You can criticize IT about alot of things, but getting Balkman seems like one of his better moves. And the fact is, if IT had gotten Williams, he would not have played as much as he has in NJ and people would be saying how IT does not know how to create a balanced team and is always picking talent over chemistry. The whole thing is comical really.

I do agree that he should have ignored Greg Anthony's comments, but I would rather a coach that attacks the media defending his players than one that attacks his players in the media.
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simrud
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10/19/2006  3:12 AM
Are people really suprised about IT acting w/out any class again?

Maybe this is good, helps the whole us against the world mentality.

I just hope Marbury, Francis, Jerome James, and both Roses rush the fans, get into a fight in the stands and get suspended from the league forever lol.
A glimmer of hope maybe?!?
Allanfan20
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10/19/2006  4:03 AM
This has nothing to do with whoever the better basketball player is yet Isiah seems to be making it that. How does he know Greg Anthony knows nothing of Balkman? Maybe Isiah needs to get his head out of Marbury's arse.
“I couldn’t dunk it so I tried to, you know, just touched it.”- OG Anunoby
joec32033
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10/19/2006  5:33 AM
Posted by PhilinLA:
Posted by joec32033:
Posted by PhilinLA:

When did most GM's tell you Balkman wasn't a first rounder, joe? Anyone who saw him in the NIT could tell he could play.

When did most Gm's tell you he could? If you're gonna hold me to the standard of "a gm had to tell me" I'll hold you to the same one. Show me on GM that had him as a first rounder. I start doing research on the draft about 2-3 months before the draft. I saw his name once-at the end of the second round.

I nor Anthony ever said he couldn't play. Keep to the argument. Anthony said he was a second round talent. The projected picks from like 7 all the way to 30 didn't stand out talent wise. I've said it before in draft threads.

You call a kid who averaged 9 pts and 6 rebs, who wasn't even a solid starter for an NIT team, a guy who was average at best against teams in the actual tournament during season play (2 PT, 2 REB, 1 TO in 12 MIN in loss to No. 21 LSU , Started in win at No. 6 UF (first start since UT (1/8/06); 8 PT, 8 REB, 2 AST, 2 STL in 35 MIN -,
Shot off the bench
like a rocket, scoring 14 PT (6-7) w/ team-high 6 REB in win over No. 4 Florida; 3 STL, 2 AST in 28MIN ) a first round talent for the NBA draft? The CBA-oops, don't exist anymore-the D-League draft, maybe.

Averaged 25.7 mpg/9.6 ppg/6.3 rpg/1.9 apg/1.3 bpg/1.7 spg ... Led team in RPG, STL; 3rd in PPG; 4th in APG ... In NIT finals win over Michigan, scored 10 PT w/ 12 REB, 5 BLK, 4 STL in 35 MIN ... In NIT semi-final win vs. Louisville, scored 23 PT w/ 8 REB, 3 AST, 4 BLK in 36 MIN ... In NIT second round OT win at Florida State pulled in 13 REB (6 off, 7 def) w/ 8 PT, 3 AST, 5 STL (tied career high) in 42 MIN ... In SEC Tournament final loss to Florida, scored 12 PT w/ 11 REB (fourth double-double of the year), 4 STL, 1 BLK in 34 MIN ... Scored 8 PT w/ 8 REB, 3 AST, 2 STL in 27 MIN in SEC semifinal win over Kentucky ... Tacked together second super game off the bench in SEC Tourney win over UT scoring 16 PT w/ 7 REB, 2 AST, 3 STL and 1 BLK in 27 MIN ... Scored game-high 12 PT w/ 3 REB, 2 AST, 2 BLK, 1 STL in 28 MIN of play in win over MSU in SEC Tourney ... After starting five straight, hasn't started the past three games, but played very well off the bench in win at AU: 6 PT, 6 REB, 2 AST, 1 STL in 26 MIN ... No very effective: 2 PT, 2 REB, 1 TO in 12 MIN in loss to No. 21 LSU ... Scored 10 PT 2/ 6 REB, 3 STL in 24 MIN in loss to Vandy ... Had the game of his life in win over Alabama: 28 PT (11-15 including 2-3 3 PT), 16 REB (7 off, 9 def), 4 STL, 2 BLK, 1 AST in 35 MIN -- career high in points, FG made, FT att, minutes played; tied career high in rebounds, FT att, 3PT made (rewrote almost all season highs) ... Started second straight game in win over MSU, playing 24 MIN w/ 6 PT, 3 REB, 2 BLK and 3 STL ... Started in win at No. 6 UF (first start since UT (1/8/06); 8 PT, 8 REB, 2 AST, 2 STL in 35 MIN -- played with Renaldo-type positive energy ... Shot off the bench like a rocket, scoring 14 PT (6-7) w/ team-high 6 REB in win over No. 4 Florida; 3 STL, 2 AST in 28MIN ... Team leader in REB had just 1 in the 1st half and 1 in the 2nd half vs. UGA; team leader with 14 PT; 1 AST, 1 STL; 12 of 16 games in double figures ... Scored 12 PT w/ 7 REB, 1 BLK, 1 STL in 21 MIN off the bench in loss at Ole Miss ... Tacked together another fine game, scoring 9 PT w/ 9 REB, a career-high 5 AST, 4 STL in 24 MIN in win over S.C. State ... Led team in PT, REB, STL, AST, BLK in Clemson loss, playing heart out in 34 MIN he was on the floor; scored 15 PT, 12 REB (2nd career DD) ... Scored 16 PT (1 off a career high) in win over UNCG; added game-high 7 REB, 2 AST, career-high 5 STL in 27 MIN ... Named to Great Alaska Shootout All-Tournament team; averaged 14.7 PPG, 8.7 RPG, 2.7 APG, 3.0 BPG, 1.3 SPG ... In OT Shootout loss to Marquette again scored in double figures w/ 16 PT, 8 REB, career-high 6 AST, 3 BLK in 30 MIN ... In Monmouth win scored 14 PT w/ 6 REB, 6 TO, 2 BLK, 1 STL in 26 MIN ... Named Player of the Game in win over UAA; first double-double of his career w/ 14 PT, 12 REB, 4 BLK, 3 STL in 34 MIN ... Played on the Score International team with teammate Stephen McDowell that traveled to Germany for competition this past summer playing in five games against international competition ... Led the USA team in rebounds and was second in ppg playing in the Nation's Cup.

http://uscsports.cstv.com/sports/m-baskbl/mtt/balkman_renaldo00.html

[Edited by - joec32033 on 10-18-2006 9:29 PM]
You're the one who said "most gm's" not me. I was just wondering when you got to talk to all of them as your post suggested you had.

OK........

In the NBA's official draft guide, which was released to all reporters covering the draft, Balkman was not included in the list of the 300 top players eligible to be drafted in the 2006-07 rookie class.-This is made by the NBA scouting department. You don't think they would've known a little something about Balkman?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Renaldo_Balkman

After selecting Balkman, Thomas originally claimed that the Suns were ready to snap him up; it turned out that the Suns had pubilicly announced that they were trading their 21st and 27th picks after the 16th selection. Forced to choose between admitting that he lied and admitting that the Suns outmaneuvered him, he was forced to beckpedal and refuse to answer any more questions on the topic.http://www.nj.com/weblogs/knicks/index.ssf?/mtlogs/njo_knicks/archives/2006_07.html

On draft night, Thomas said he took Balkman early because he was sure he would be gone when the Knicks selected again at No. 29 (they did not have a second-round pick). According to Thomas, the Phoenix Suns were set to draft Balkman with one of their two picks, at 21 or 27.

"That's funny," Mike D'Antoni, the Suns' president and coach, told a Phoenix radio station. "He wasn't even on our radar."http://www.truehoop.com/2006-draft-26773-mike-dantoni-blows-isiahs-story-to-bits.html

I need to apologize. You're right. Most GM's didn't say anything about Balkman. Because they didn't care enough to. He wasn't high enough on theor radar worth discussing apparently. About an hour trying to find stuff and not one other team mentioned Balkman's name-or being intersted in him. Even his coach was surprised he was picked so high (he same coach that coached Tim Duncan at Wake).

~You can't run from who you are.~
joec32033
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10/19/2006  5:39 AM
Posted by Silverfuel:
Posted by joec32033:
Posted by PhilinLA:

When did most GM's tell you Balkman wasn't a first rounder, joe? Anyone who saw him in the NIT could tell he could play.

When did most Gm's tell you he could? If you're gonna hold me to the standard of "a gm had to tell me" I'll hold you to the same one. Show me on GM that had him as a first rounder.
I think its your job to prove he would've been there at #29 not the other way. Stupid debate but you are being a bit biased here saying Greg was right and Isiah is wrong. This will very quickly turn into a "you are wrong, no you are wrong" flame war. Basically, Gregg Anthony had no clue (and has obviously been proven wrong in the 1st 3 games) what Balkman is capable of.

[Edited by - Silverfuel on 10-18-2006 2:33 PM]

Silver it's preseason, If Isiah was right and Balkman plays up to 1st round standards, I'll be one of the first to admit it. I am not saying anything about who is rght and who is wrong. I said the only comment from Zeke that annoyed me alot was the "true Knick" comment. I am only saying what every other scout, source, media outlet has been saying. Anthony did not say anything that far off from anyone else EXCEOT Zeke. If Zeke wants to preotect his player so bad, where was this defense 5 months ago when he actually drafted Balkman? Zeke had to make sure he played well before defending him?
~You can't run from who you are.~
joec32033
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10/19/2006  5:42 AM
Posted by TMS:

Rondo & Marcus are clearly better than Collins, that's not in debate at all i'm sure... i just don't think people who aren't in the know about what went on during draft night behind the scenes should be complaining about Isiah taking Balkman too early when they really have no idea if he would have been there for the taking or not at #29... that's all speculation... all we can go by is what actually happened on draft night, & what we saw was 19 other GM's pass up Marcus Williams... Isiah went into the draft w/a mission to draft a defensive minded player who could impact a game... i think he got such a player in Balkman from what little i've seen of him so far... if he turns out to be a Junkyard Dog w/Ariza's athleticism, he can grow into very valuable player on this team... God forbid he ever develops a jumpshot, he can potentially be an Allstar someday... but i won't put him on the level of Doctor J or Michael Jordan just yet... maybe by the Allstar break tho.

And I'd have alot more respect for the pick if Isiah just said that Balkman was the guy he wanted, as opposed to, "well, phoenix was gonna take him." PHX traded out of their spot after the 16th pick. Once again I am not knocking Balkman, he is a good player. Noone has ever said anything different about him. But a guy that averages 9 pts and 6 boards and doesn't even start on his team-and is a junior, not a freshman- is not known as sure fire first round pick stuff.

~You can't run from who you are.~
joec32033
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10/19/2006  5:47 AM
BTW, just out of curiosity-Oak has called out the Knicks and the Knicks roster on numerous occassions. I wonder why Isiah hasn't railed off on him yet.

~You can't run from who you are.~
oohah
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10/19/2006  6:40 AM
a serious lotteryb talent with the best passing ability I have seen since Magic Johnson.

Better than Jason Kidd and Mark Jackson? Come on.
did any of you READ what Briggs said? He said PASSING ABILITY. Thats it. If I said Balkman reminds me of Marion the way he rebounds the ball do you hear "Balkman is as good as Marion" ????

This is the EXACT thing you have done to me perhaps ten times regarding my comparison to Ariza's style of play to Marion's.

oohah

Good luck Mike D'Antoni, 'cause you ain't never seen nothing like this before!
Silverfuel
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10/19/2006  7:15 AM
Posted by joec32033:

Silver it's preseason, If Isiah was right and Balkman plays up to 1st round standards, I'll be one of the first to admit it.
This is what I dont understand. Its ok for Greg Anthony to make us look like fools about picking Balkman when he hasn't played a single minute in uniform, but Isiah should wait? You would say that after 10 regular season games! Or you would say, he has only played as a rookie and wasn't even in the rookie game! You are being biased. You are giving Greg Anthony a chance to call out Zeke but Zeke can't respond after the guy has played a few preseason games? Its better than PURE speculation that Anthony was doing.
I am not saying anything about who is rght and who is wrong. I said the only comment from Zeke that annoyed me alot was the "true Knick" comment. I am only saying what every other scout, source, media outlet has been saying. Anthony did not say anything that far off from anyone else EXCEOT Zeke.
You were talking about right and wrong when you brought up Marcus Williams. You were saying Anthony was right cause Balkman would've dropped. Not in those words but thats what you meant.
If Zeke wants to preotect his player so bad, where was this defense 5 months ago when he actually drafted Balkman? Zeke had to make sure he played well before defending him?
Of course he had to make sure Balkman played a few minutes in uniform! Unlike Anthony, he waited to have atleast some evidence not just pure promise. He let Balkman play 3 preseason games and look pretty good in them before he said anything to the doubters. But I am sure he defended his pick 5 months ago too. Just not as brashly. I guarantee you he said Balkman will be a good player. So its not like he abandoned his player then. Its just that Balkman getting an ovation gives him a good feeling and when someone asks him about it, he calls out the people that made him look stupid.

[Edited by - Silverfuel on 10-19-2006 12:16 AM]
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fishmike
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10/19/2006  7:20 AM
not its not, but since you put exact in caps it must be true.

Once again the point in this is a bit lost. People arent down on Balkman as a player or a guy that can help up. Plenty of solid guys have gone undrafted and become impact players.

The point is Isiah passed on lottery talent which at the very worst could have been used as a chip later to take a player that wasnt on anyone's board or radar for that matter
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gunsnewing
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10/19/2006  7:23 AM
he said Balkman is the next Artest/Rodman. no joke lol
Silverfuel
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10/19/2006  7:25 AM
Posted by gunsnewing:

he said Balkman is the next Artest/Rodman. no joke lol
Holy ****!! Gunsnewing is posting at 7:30AM eastern!! Wtf? Just getting back from the bars?

P.S: I know guns, Isiah can't do anything right. He cant even draft anymore. Wonder what you would say if you were a Raptor fan when he drafted McGrady. Give his draft pick a chance to play. Maybe he could turn into the next big defensive SG or SF.
A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step.
oohah
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10/19/2006  7:27 AM
not its not, but since you put exact in caps it must be true.

100% true.
Once again the point in this is a bit lost. People arent down on Balkman as a player or a guy that can help up. Plenty of solid guys have gone undrafted and become impact players.

The point is Isiah passed on lottery talent which at the very worst could have been used as a chip later to take a player that wasnt on anyone's board or radar for that matter

That is the same exact strategy that Isiah used with Taylor that everyone has been complaining about.

IT got a player who can help NOW, who has a role on the team NOW, which Williams does not. A chip that does not play is a not a chip, it is a waste.

oohah

Good luck Mike D'Antoni, 'cause you ain't never seen nothing like this before!
Silverfuel
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10/19/2006  7:29 AM
Posted by oohah:

A chip that does not play is a not a chip, it is a waste.
NICE!
A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step.
fishmike
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10/19/2006  7:31 AM
pretty funny read
http://benchrenaldo.blogspot.com/

100% wrong

oohah, I had to laugh. Can you clarify this for me? Are you suggesting that Mo Taylor was a chip? This meaning he was regarded as an asset? Thats what your saying right?

Just like Jerome James was going to help us THEN, because we had no center THEN.

OK, your points are made
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
fishmike
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10/19/2006  7:32 AM
so by that logic how do you guys feel about Mardy?
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
oohah
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10/19/2006  7:44 AM
oohah, I had to laugh. Can you clarify this for me? Are you suggesting that Mo Taylor was a chip? This meaning he was regarded as an asset? Thats what your saying right?

Yes, Taylor was a chip. He was an expiring contract, which happens to be an extremely valuable asset even if you are a terrible player. As a matter of fact, the more money an expiring player is paid the more valuable he is regardless of how good he is.

You know that Fish.

oohah

Good luck Mike D'Antoni, 'cause you ain't never seen nothing like this before!
oohah
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10/19/2006  7:45 AM
Greg Anthony was a pretty bad NBA player.

oohah

Good luck Mike D'Antoni, 'cause you ain't never seen nothing like this before!
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