Posted by diderotn:

Why is it that no one criticize TMack for not winning? Let's face it, TMack played with a dominant Center in Yao and still failed....Hello, Hello, Hello

Dude, I have heard plenty of criticism for Tmac for not winning. KG was criticized for not winning!!

Posted by diderotn:

Why is it that no one criticize TMack for not winning? Let's face it, TMack played with a dominant Center in Yao and still failed....Hello, Hello, Hello

Zzzzz... ridiculous.

You get credit in the NBA based on results. Marbury doesn't have the results, so that's why many people don't give him the credit. If Marbury puts up his normal 20 + 8 and the Knicks win 50 games, everyone will give Marbury credit (just look at Nash in Phoenix).

My big issue with Marbury is that the team we've made doesn't fit the player that we have in Marbury. If we're building around Marbury, IMHO, we have a lot of work to do. That's just an indicator that building around a PG is the toughest position to build around in the NBA, and thus takes the most work. So, I think we're still a ways away.

But, of course, by giving my honest assessment that I don't see Marbury leading us to 83 wins last year (because he's so good that we'd get a bonus win for shutting out the Nets) that I'm a hater. Off the court his personality leaves something to be desired, but who cares? On the court, I want him to win as much as anyone. So far, I've seen why we don't win; some of it's Marbury's fault and much of it is the players surrounding. But, since I truly believe you have to put another star along with Marbury, I don't see us going anywhere for a while.

As for LB, he's a step in the right direction and could help us win some of those close games. That being said, we still have a lot more work to go than just a good coach.

Tmac does not play for the knicks!

TMac is a phuching idiot. KG is also. These are primadonnas whom are super talented, but don't have the heart to be champions.

Maybe they are ego maniacs, stat whores, or blinded by the bling!

Starbury has a little of those tendencies and must decide whats important. You don't play for larry if you don't got the heart.

I have killed TMac saying he isnt a top 10 NBA player. I was made a joke of because I said Iverson was better. Tmac quit on his coach (who was coach of the year), Tmac's team lost 19 straight games. 19... thats unreal. I have questioned his heart and his effort repeatedly, and dont want to get into it again.

Steph will have to focus on D or other guards will bleed into his minutes. You KNOW Nate will play D. If MArbury isnt effective there LB will cut into his minutes.

The thing with LB and Marbury right now is Steph KNOWS this is his coach for a long time. The only other guy he could say that about of his previous 10 coaches was Flip Saunders.

Marbs has had:

Flip Saunders
John Calapari
Byron Scott
Don Casey
Scott Skiles
Frank Johnson

All before Don Chaney, Lenny Wilkens. Plus the mentorship of Isiah Thomas and the olympic experience of Larry Brown.

Just about everywhere he has gone he has been toxic to the team, or the coach. Thats a long list of coaches, and he is labeled a loser.

This is his history, and if he is been added to the list, so be it.

Now while some might not like it, and some beat writers who sit and watch 82 plus games a year, in person, sitting court side, access to the lockerrooms, all don't exactly lay blame on the lack of talent he has had, nor praise him and say how unfortunate his career has been.

As a fan, one must lay SOME blame on him. Nobody disputes his talent, just his abiilty to be a complete player.

I won't defend his career, in fact, why should anyone, its his damm career, but I wish for him, and the team for the fans, that he combines maturity with that talent and seeks not to make sure his stats stay up for his next contract, but he is remembered as being a winner.

Posted by diderotn:

all of the coaches that you have named were rooky coaches when they coached Marb. But now he has a guy that is a proven winner in Larry Brown to drive for a very long period of time. I sure hope that Larry and the organization is patient enough to allow this kid to develop into the super star that he can be. Zeke will put the talents around him,

Flip Saunders
John Calapari
Byron Scott
Don Casey
Scott Skiles
Frank Johnson

Posted by Nalod:

Marbs has had:

Flip Saunders
John Calapari
Byron Scott
Don Casey
Scott Skiles
Frank Johnson

All before Don Chaney, Lenny Wilkens. Plus the mentorship of Isiah Thomas and the olympic experience of Larry Brown.

Just about everywhere he has gone he has been toxic to the team, or the coach. Thats a long list of coaches, and he is labeled a loser.

This is his history, and if he is been added to the list, so be it.

Now while some might not like it, and some beat writers who sit and watch 82 plus games a year, in person, sitting court side, access to the lockerrooms, all don't exactly lay blame on the lack of talent he has had, nor praise him and say how unfortunate his career has been.

As a fan, one must lay SOME blame on him. Nobody disputes his talent, just his abiilty to be a complete player.

I won't defend his career, in fact, why should anyone, its his damm career, but I wish for him, and the team for the fans, that he combines maturity with that talent and seeks not to make sure his stats stay up for his next contract, but he is remembered as being a winner.

I understand the point that Marbury has had a lot of good coeaches, but how many of those coaches did he get more than one season to learn from? Learning takes time.

I can tell you all this much....I am so happy with what has happened with the Knicks the last few days, I am going to take a brake from this site and others until the beginning of training camp. The hiring of Brown, plus the draft and the FAs that we have acquired fulfilled everything that I have wanted for the Knicks this season.




So long fans, I will talk to you all come training camp.

Posted by Killa4luv:

Posted by djsunyc:

it's AMAZING but this is marbury's legacy.

all the talent, yet all the criticism. you either love him or hate him. it's very weird. i don't think iverson went through anything like this from philly fans. alot of the media painted him out to be a thug yet he's always been loved in philly. then he won, and now he's almost untouchable.

only thing marbury can do now is win. that's it. he could average 30/15 and it won't change jack until the team wins. IF the knicks win 50 games next season (i know), then the marbury stigma will start to change, and change quite rapidly.

it's a shame tho b/c he's a DAMN good player. i don't think he's a rocket scientist but he takes ALOT of criticism and doesn't really say anything about it.

in his interview with SAS, SAS asked him about the "i'm the best" comment. and steph pretty much said that "hey man, i'm from brooklyn. i am not going to say anybody else out there is better than me." and then when asked about being a leader, he responded "what can i do? is it my fault they can't make layups or hit jumpers?".

what can you do? i don't hate him for saying stuff like that. i think that everybody looks to him to be a leader and b/c he isn't, he gets all this hate. i say screw that. just b/c he's the PG doesn't mean he has to be the leader.

this guy is DAMN GOOD. he has his flaws but he's still DAMN GOOD.

If we win 50 games next year and he is averaging 20 and 10, Larry Brown will get all of the credit and the Steph haters still wont give him his props. I guarantee it!! They'll be like, it was LArry Browns system that did it, it wasn't him.

If we win 50 games larry will get the props adn be the catalyst that improved Stph. Look, Larry got the track record, not step on

There are 2 incidents that basically has labled Marbury a selfish player.

1. Forcing a trade out of Minny because he did not want to play 2nd fiddle to KG.
2. Writing "All Alone" in his sneakers when he was with the Nets.

I don't think people have forgiven him for those 2 deeds.

Also, I actually heard the Marbury interview with Stephen A. Smith last week when the replayed it on the Michael Kay Show. He came across as an offense first type player. He also liked to blame other players. He was rambling about the players he had to play with. When Smith told him you need to play defense to win he says "you need to score also to win". I guess he didn't watch the Riley/JVG Knicks. Oh, that's right. He bashed Childs and Ward during that time.

Marbury is a Knick and I want him to do good because it will benefit my team, but I would not shed a tear if he was traded tomorrow.

Posted by diderotn:

I can tell you all this much....I am so happy with what has happened with the Knicks the last few days, I am going to take a brake from this site and others until the beginning of training camp. The hiring of Brown, plus the draft and the FAs that we have acquired fulfilled everything that I have wanted for the Knicks this season.




So long fans, I will talk to you all come training camp.

see ya when training camp rolls around.

Posted by Solace:

Posted by NYKBocker:

There are 2 incidents that basically has labled Marbury a selfish player.

1. Forcing a trade out of Minny because he did not want to play 2nd fiddle to KG.
2. Writing "All Alone" in his sneakers when he was with the Nets.

I don't think people have forgiven him for those 2 deeds.

Also, I actually heard the Marbury interview with Stephen A. Smith last week when the replayed it on the Michael Kay Show. He came across as an offense first type player. He also liked to blame other players. He was rambling about the players he had to play with. When Smith told him you need to play defense to win he says "you need to score also to win". I guess he didn't watch the Riley/JVG Knicks. Oh, that's right. He bashed Childs and Ward during that time.

Marbury is a Knick and I want him to do good because it will benefit my team, but I would not shed a tear if he was traded tomorrow.

Excellent post and I agree with everything you said. This is NY and you have to earn your spot here.

I think all that stuff gets transcended by winning. THat stuff only gets focused on when a guy's teams lose.

Rememebr Kidd's reputation before NJ? Looked at as an a-hole who got in petty battles with teammates and couldn't win (Dallas), a coach-killer (college and yes, ultimately NJ), a playoff choke and domestic terrorizer (Phoenix). Gets to NJ and wins, suddenly he's GOd's gift to basketball in every way possible.

STeph wins and all the BS goes away. Everyone loves a redemption story, don't they?

How quickly we forget that todays heroes were yesterdays suckers.

so when is it my turn?