martin wrote:

jaydh wrote:

franco12 wrote:but what Thibs is saying doesn't make really make sense. I mean, look at the box score and our wings play more minutes than the Celtics players he is mentioning. And that doesn't even factor in the fact we've gotten blown in most of the games, so why keep them out there.

Now- if Thibs doesn't want to say either the bench is full of scrubs he doesn't trust or they aren't good and he wants the best guys out there- ok - that is an explanation I will accept. It's not right, and I'd rather lose games and be fresh for the playoffs than drive guys into the ground - but its a fair thing for a coach to do.

exactly, you can easily go to the box scores and discredit this.

Which wing guys are you guys playing off the bench in replacement of OG, Hart, Mikal?

Give or take, Knicks bench early in the season is Payne, Deuce, Shamet, Precious, Sims, Huk. Sims, Huk are centers. Shamet was not available. Deuce was a little hurt. Precious missed 20 games.

You are down to Payne and GLeague bros and rookies. So, Dadiet, Toppin, Kolek. Those are the wing replacement options Thibs had for most of the season.

Who are you guys playing to win games? Deal in reality. It's really a no win situation for a coach and team unless you are completely AOK with losing games to get minutes for Dadiet who can't dominate a GLeague game and Toppin who is not an NBA player.

What you got?

Deuce and Shamet finally got their injury bugs kinda over and seems like minutes for the wings are starting to come down. Do not wonder why that is happening.

Down 40 against Boston, I’m, getting my scrubs out there, like Dadiet- what, is he afraid to lose by 60?

I totally get the reality that there were not better options. But I think some scrubs can hold their own for short stretches - I’m not saying go with a bunch of them all at once.

franco12 wrote:

martin wrote:

jaydh wrote:

franco12 wrote:but what Thibs is saying doesn't make really make sense. I mean, look at the box score and our wings play more minutes than the Celtics players he is mentioning. And that doesn't even factor in the fact we've gotten blown in most of the games, so why keep them out there.

Now- if Thibs doesn't want to say either the bench is full of scrubs he doesn't trust or they aren't good and he wants the best guys out there- ok - that is an explanation I will accept. It's not right, and I'd rather lose games and be fresh for the playoffs than drive guys into the ground - but its a fair thing for a coach to do.

exactly, you can easily go to the box scores and discredit this.

Which wing guys are you guys playing off the bench in replacement of OG, Hart, Mikal?

Give or take, Knicks bench early in the season is Payne, Deuce, Shamet, Precious, Sims, Huk. Sims, Huk are centers. Shamet was not available. Deuce was a little hurt. Precious missed 20 games.

You are down to Payne and GLeague bros and rookies. So, Dadiet, Toppin, Kolek. Those are the wing replacement options Thibs had for most of the season.

Who are you guys playing to win games? Deal in reality. It's really a no win situation for a coach and team unless you are completely AOK with losing games to get minutes for Dadiet who can't dominate a GLeague game and Toppin who is not an NBA player.

What you got?

Deuce and Shamet finally got their injury bugs kinda over and seems like minutes for the wings are starting to come down. Do not wonder why that is happening.

Down 40 against Boston, I’m, getting my scrubs out there, like Dadiet- what, is he afraid to lose by 60?

I totally get the reality that there were not better options. But I think some scrubs can hold their own for short stretches - I’m not saying go with a bunch of them all at once.

If you are worried about the Boston game, that's fair, but also not really the main topic just the side show.

Otherwise, sprout out a real wing rotation and let us know you don't mind a lot more loses. Cause it's Dadiet and Jacob Toppin and that may introduce more problems than it really solves. Those guys are not even GLeague all stars.

blkexec wrote:👀

If Kolek isnt ready next year there is no bigger need than another PG. Anytime Brunson sits it's Cam/McBride shucking 3s and KAT driving into a crowd. It's been a big problem all year and has been since we lost IQ really

ToddTT wrote:Me: Why won’t Thibodeau play the rookies?

ChatGPT:

Tom Thibodeau has a long-standing reputation for favoring veteran players over rookies, and there are several reasons why he might be reluctant to give young players significant minutes:

1. **Trust in Experience** – Thibs values defensive effort, discipline, and consistency, which veterans typically provide more reliably than rookies. He prefers players who already understand NBA-level schemes and don’t make as many mistakes.

2. **Win-Now Mentality** – Thibodeau is known for prioritizing winning in the short term. If he feels a rookie isn't ready to contribute to a playoff-contending team, he’s more likely to limit their minutes.

3. **Defensive Standards** – His teams are built around strong defense, and rookies often struggle with NBA defensive schemes. If a young player isn’t executing defensively, Thibs won’t hesitate to bench them.

4. **Shorter Rotations** – Thibodeau typically sticks to a tight rotation, often playing 8–9 guys heavily. If there’s already depth at a rookie’s position, they may struggle to crack the lineup.

5. **Proving Themselves in Practice** – Thibs has said in the past that players need to earn their minutes in practice. If he feels a rookie hasn’t done enough behind the scenes, they won’t see the floor much.

That said, if a rookie earns his trust—especially on the defensive end—he will play them (like Quentin Grimes and Immanuel Quickley in past seasons). But generally, he makes them wait their turn.

My money is on all of the above, and double for #5.

SergioNYK wrote:Let's ask ourselves what is the top ceiling for this team? I know we had championship aspirations but clearly that is not realistic this season. We are way too flawed and lack depth. So I think the ceiling is giving the Celtics a competitive series.

1. The top ceiling is to win a championship. That doesn’t change all season.
2. Where we are? Hoping to get out of first round. Seems like any team can blow us out.
3. Where we should be? Thinking about how our twin tower line up can be used to win that Celtics series.

SergioNYK wrote:Let's ask ourselves what is the top ceiling for this team? I know we had championship aspirations but clearly that is not realistic this season. We are way too flawed and lack depth. So I think the ceiling is giving the Celtics a competitive series.

We don’t take enough 3’s to beat any of the Celtics, Cavs or Thunder. Also our perimeter D has been lacking though if OG and Mitch are both healthy and available in the playoffs that could change.

Our offense is too half-court, ISO centric. That works against 90% of the teams in the nba because we are more talented but against those top 3 teams the offense has to be different

shinmen wrote:I wonder how practices are going to find out if the rookies will be able to perform. We heard from players multiple times that the practices are tough mentally but not really physically.
Do the bench players have a different practice than the starters? If not how can Thibs assess if rookies are able to play against real competition?

Ask yourself how varsity coaches in high school have a good sense who on JV has it to come up to the varsity club or if D1 coaches know which high school kids may be able to succeed at the next level.

It's not an exact science but you get a feel. Do kids surprise you? Of course.

They have eyes. And experience.

martin wrote:

shinmen wrote:I wonder how practices are going to find out if the rookies will be able to perform. We heard from players multiple times that the practices are tough mentally but not really physically.
Do the bench players have a different practice than the starters? If not how can Thibs assess if rookies are able to play against real competition?

Ask yourself how varsity coaches in high school have a good sense who on JV has it to come up to the varsity club or if D1 coaches know which high school kids may be able to succeed at the next level.

It's not an exact science but you get a feel. Do kids surprise you? Of course.

They have eyes. And experience.

You just don’t know how they will do until you put them out there, and give them some real PT, not just garbage time. That’s how “Linsanity” started. If the bench didn’t badly need a floor general, I’d understand the wait and see attitude. Would also understand if our starters weren’t leading the league in minutes. Kolek has been getting less PT than his peers on other teams.

GustavBahler wrote:

martin wrote:

shinmen wrote:I wonder how practices are going to find out if the rookies will be able to perform. We heard from players multiple times that the practices are tough mentally but not really physically.
Do the bench players have a different practice than the starters? If not how can Thibs assess if rookies are able to play against real competition?

Ask yourself how varsity coaches in high school have a good sense who on JV has it to come up to the varsity club or if D1 coaches know which high school kids may be able to succeed at the next level.

It's not an exact science but you get a feel. Do kids surprise you? Of course.

They have eyes. And experience.

You just don’t know how they will do until you put them out there, and give them some real PT, not just garbage time. That’s how “Linsanity” started. If the bench didn’t badly need a floor general, I’d understand the wait and see attitude. Would also understand if our starters weren’t leading the league in minutes. Kolek has been getting less PT than his peers on other teams.

Who is that You in that sentence? You or seasoned coaches who are at the top of their game as far as tracking analytics during practice and whatnot? Cause it's certainly not me.

There will always be Linsanity examples, that's the exception. You seem to frame Linsanity like it happens every year, while it is rather the unique, one-time exception.

You are advocating for a "win now only" position as a fan. Try anything and try it now, see if it sticks to the wall. That's not really a plan and that's OK.

Fans keep complaining that Thibs is a win-only coach and actually advocating for that exact opposite.

Deuce is the well documented reference here, not Linsanity. PG's typically take a long time to develop. Witness Nash and Billups.

You need to learn your position as well as the others and where they will be. It's a long process and throwing your players to the wolves is typically not the best development path.

Unless you are really not an advocate of development?