http://sports.espn.go.com/new-york/mlb/news/story?id=6010831

TMS wrote:any chance you know if Duchscherer is a class A free agent?

cuz if we're gonna give up a 1st rounder for a 33 yo starter who throws mostly offspeed junk coming off 2 years of inactivity due to injury & clinical depression, but not willing to do so for a flame throwing reliever that saved the most games in the majors last season & dominated the AL East, then i'm gonna recommend he go see a headshrink this offseason.

No, I don't think he is: http://baseball.about.com/od/newsrumors/a/2011-Mlb-Free-Agents-Starting-Pitchers.htm

I really don't know what to say, man. Just not a Duchscherer fan at all. I'm with you TMS--if we would've had to give up a draft pick for this guy I think I would've **** myself..I mean I would've been fine with Brad Penny (I think he went to the Tigers I believe on a 1-yr deal). See to me a guy like Penny, if we would've caught him right, has a chance to be DOMINANT. 95-97 MPH last year before he went down for the Cards...Hey maybe I'm wrong about this guy Duchscherer, he's had success before, but I just don't see it. And we're not getting him off his best year. This is by far the worst off-season we've had in some time.

Do you have any idea what salary we have coming off the books next off-season and then what top 2012 FAs we could be looking at??

Personally I'd move Joba back into the rotation, but I think I'm the only one on the site who thinks that. I think his problem is fastball command and he'd be fine in either role once he gets that back. He's a 4 pitch guy and if can be good in the rotation he's more valuable there.

Anyway, without a doubt we have one of the best back ends of the bullpen in the league, if not the best pen overall. Feliciano and Logan will be good against lefties and now you can go with Robertson, Soriano, Mariano...thats quite good.

TMS wrote:

BigSm00th wrote:Des i agree about moving joba back into the rotation. Theres really no need for him in the bullpen and with seemingly no plan re: a 5th starter maybe this is what they are thinking. Either move him or trade him but joba in the pen makes zero sense

with the loss of Aceves we will need Joba to provide depth in the pen... Joba did not work out well as a starting pitcher... Mitre posted better numbers as a spot starter last year... he should have just been left to be the setup guy from the start but the Yankees tried to get cute w/his development & it came to bite us in the ass... i think it's time to stop jerking this guy around & let him focus on being the best relief pitcher he can be... otherwise trade him for a player that can fill the starter's role.

I don't agree that he failed as a starter. By that same logic, Hughes would've been considered a failure as a starter and better as a reliever too. I think in generalyou can't expect a young pitcher to be lights out right away- Joba came up with 3-4 pitches he could use and still could be a good starter. Its not like he's tried starting for 4 years and failed- he only has 43 starts.

His main problem right now is his fastball command which hurt him in the relief role last year at times too. Both he and Hughes still have a tendency to try and make a perfect pitch rather than agressively go after batters with the fastball. When both Hughes and Joba focused on doing that as relievers the results were much, much better. CC Sabathia is a guy who struggled with that a bit the first 4-5 years of his career too, but now he challenges hitters all the time. As a result you've seen his walks per innings pitched number decline signifcantly and he's one of the best pitchers in the league. When your velocity and movement is that good you can't be afraid of batters making contact because more often than not it will be weak contact, which equals outs, foul balls and getting ahead in counts...

But anyway, if the Yanks brass really believes Joba can't pitch more confidently with better command than they absolutely have to move him. There is no way you take a talented piece like that and make him a long reliever. If that is his role, he is much, much more valuable in a trade. IMO, he's got to be in the rotation or moved for a piece that can help us more.

Frankly, from the very beginning, the Soriano signing never seemed like a Cashman signing. It goes against his bullpen strategy of the past three years, and it goes against his public comments of the previous week. But in the end, this is not his team, and if ownership wants to make a move, ownership can make a move.

don't really think this matters b/c of the opt outs. i don't think soriano will be a yankee beyond 1 season. i think he's lights out for us this year and opts out. he's a boras client -- have these weasels ever done it differently?

so if it amounts to a 1 yr 12 mil for soriano i think its an excellent signing.

cashman also is apparently set to keep joba in the bullpen -- and i guess cede the 5th spot to sergio mitre if pettitte doesn't come back? i personally don't get this -- you've already basically screwed joba's career enough, why not just completely **** him and use him how u need him - now as a 5th starter. we shall see.

Yankees aren't looking to trade Joba -- yet
Yankees Blog

By BRIAN COSTELLO

Last Updated: 11:47 AM, January 15, 2011

The arrival of Rafael Soriano to the Yankees could lead to the departure of Joba Chamberlain.

Just not yet, according to a source.

When the Yankees agreed to a three-year deal with reliever Soriano on Thursday, it immediately cast doubt on the future of Chamberlain. He had been viewed as Mariano Rivera's successor after his memorable arrival in 2007. But three up-and-down seasons later, it is clear the Yankees have lost confidence in the 25-year-old former phenom.

The Yankees did not believe he could handle being Rivera's primary setup man -- a role he failed in last year -- and they grabbed Soriano off the free agent market.

So, where does that leave Chamberlain?

According to a source, the Yankees have no plans of trading Chamberlain right now, but they would listen to offers. There is also no talk of moving him back to the starting rotation, where he failed in 2008 and 2009.

The Yankees have to gauge Chamberlain's trade value. In 2007 and 2008 he was viewed as a future superstar, but his ERA has been over 4.00 in each of the past two seasons, and he has struggled in a variety of roles.

"He's definitely got value," an NL talent evaluator said yesterday. "The problem is in the past two years his stuff has gone backwards."

There is a belief around baseball that the Yankees will move him back into the starting rotation with Soriano now filling the setup role. The Yankees have said all winter that Chamberlain will remain a reliever after bouncing back and forth for his first three years.

Some teams also believe the Yankees have messed up Chamberlain, but he can be fixed in the proper situation with the proper coaching.

"It depends on how the organization that would be interested in him would view him," the talent evaluator said. "There's still some people that think he can start."

An AL talent evaluator said it will become clear in spring training how much value Chamberlain has. Then, everyone will see how the Yankees are using him, and you will be able to tell if there's interest based on how many scouts come to his outings.

The return on Chamberlain might not be enough for the Yankees to deal him. He still is viewed as an important piece of their bullpen, pitching mainly in the sixth or seventh innings along with David Robertson.

As for Soriano, the Yankees don't expect to make his contract official until Monday at the earliest.

ESPN reported yesterday there is a rift between general manager Brian Cashman and ownership, and the Steinbrenners, rather than Cashman and his staff, drove the Soriano signing. A team source denied there is any divide in the organization. Cashman did not return phone calls yesterday.

There is an appearance that Cashman was overruled on Soriano because of his public statements last week that he would not surrender a first-round pick for any of the remaining Type A free agents. With the Soriano signing, the Yankees surrendered their top pick to the Rays.

*

Chamberlain, Phil Hughes and Boone Logan filed for arbitration yesterday. Teams and players will exchange salary figures on Tuesday.

When Rafael Soriano showed up for the first day of spring training last season, the Tampa Bay Rays had no idea what to expect. They knew him from afar, a 6-1, 220-pound righthander with a menacing stare and a mid-90s fastball that helped him pile up saves with the Atlanta Braves. But neither manager Joe Maddon nor anyone else on his coaching staff really knew their new closer.

He didn't make a good first impression.

"He came in and told us what he wanted to do to get ready for the season and how he wanted to be used during it," Rays pitching coach Jim Hickey told the Daily News in a telephone interview Friday. "That usually goes over like a lead balloon."

It didn't take long for Soriano to change everyone's take. He seemed to be conserving himself physically in the first weeks of spring training, but it turned out to be a prelude to a season where he was arguably the most reliable, durable and effective finisher in baseball. Soriano was 'lights out' from Opening Day through the end of the season. He had a 3-2 record with 45 saves in 48 opportunities and posted a stunning 1.73 ERA over 64 appearances as the Rays won the AL East.

"It turned out he knew exactly what he needed to be the most effective player he could be," Hickey said. "He was the consummate pro. He took the ball every time he was asked, pitched well almost every single time we called on him and on days when I expected he would tell me he couldn't pitch he almost always said ‘whatever you need from me today.'

"I wish we were the ones signed up for three more years with him."

....

"I know people may wonder about how he will do going back to not finishing games, but I don't think there's any reason to think he will be less effective," Hickey said. "He's getting the ball to Mariano Rivera for the ninth inning. That's the same as pitching to end the game. At least that's how it's been with Rivera for the last 15 years."

....

There are some negative perceptions of Soriano in baseball, that he won't pitch through pain and that he resented being asked to pitch in non-save situations. Hickey saw none of it during their one year together. "I might have learned something else were there more adversity," he said, "but there never was any. It was smooth sailing through the whole season."

Soriano wanted a big-money deal this offseason, which may be the reason he fired agent Peter Greenberg in favor of Scott Boras. It seemed harsh treatment after Greenberg had taken the bold gamble that resulted in a closing role on a contending team with a $7.25 million contract. The Braves had signed Billy Wagner to close in 2010, but offered Soriano salary arbitration to ensure they'd get draft picks when he signed elsewhere; Greenberg had Soriano accept the offer so they could orchestrate the trade to the Rays.

But it's Soriano's pitching that is most important to the Yankees and their fans, and on that note he excels. Soriano throws two- and four-seam fastballs and mixes them with a cutter, a slider and an occasional changeup.

"He's not a 'stuff guy' even though he has great stuff and his career isn't defined by one incredible pitch that he throws," Hickey said. "He knows how to pitch, how to use all his pitches, and he is incredible at reading the hitters."

Hickey said it was not uncommon last season for Soriano to show up in the dugout during one of the early innings to point out that certain hitters were looking for specific pitches and to suggest what they might be vulnerable against.

"How many closers do things like that?" Hickey asked. "But that's just Soriano. He was a great teammate to our guys.

"Now he's pitching in our division against us. I can only hope he struggles."

concerning the draft pick we gave up to sign Soriano:

As for losing the draft pick and giving Soriano three years when he seemingly didn't have a market, Cashman will get that draft pick back if Soriano chooses to exercise the opt out in any of the three years of the deal, and there are no no-trade clauses in the contract, which means the Yankees can deal him anywhere.

Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/baseball/yankees/2011/01/15/2011-01-15_rafael_soriano_is_new_setup_man_for_yankees_but_there_are_concerns_about_his_pri.html#ixzz1BE8ksPeX