nixluva wrote:

arkrud wrote:

nixluva wrote:

arkrud wrote:

nixluva wrote:

arkrud wrote:

nixluva wrote:

arkrud wrote:

nixluva wrote:

arkrud wrote:

nixluva wrote:

arkrud wrote:

nixluva wrote:

arkrud wrote:

holfresh wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

arkrud wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

arkrud wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

arkrud wrote:

nixluva wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

nixluva wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

nixluva wrote:

djsunyc wrote:

nixluva wrote:The Dems are something else! They RAN from Obama in the last Mid Term Election when they should've stuck by him! They didn't listen to him or his people this election and screwed the pooch!!! They didn't use the same methods Obama's Campaign did in reaching out to White Working Class Voters or Minorities.

This Russia thing was a mess but Obama was in a tough spot! He's damned if he went hard on Russia and damned if he didn't. He's a professional and tries to do things the right way. IMO Obama is not the one to really bash over this. This is on EVERYONE including the Republicans in Congress that KNEW the Russians were interfering and blocked telling the American people cuz it benefited them!!!

i agree obama was in a tough spot. there were choices though - he took the high road trying to work with people that had no real intention of working with him. this country is showing us that the high road is not necessarily the right way to go. i think there needs to be some recognition by the dems regarding that and to not give too much credit to the american people.

a tough option would've been to expose the republican party the past 4 years but i understand why he didn't go that route. but with the benefit of hindsight, it's would've probably been the better road to take.

i'm trying to figure out why the republican party are so united and don't always take the high road when working with dems while the dems come off as a bit weak and disjointed. i have a few hypothesis...and it's just me spitballing...but it seems the republicans have 2 strong common characteristics between their government officials...they are mostly white and they are mostly christian. i think there is a built in bond there, even if it's not openly acknowledged. the dems are a bit more racially diverse with diverse religious backgrounds...combine that with historic systemic oppression for people of color and it's tougher to unite and build a cohesive attack.

now i'm not sure i believe any of that but it's just some thoughts in my head trying to understand. does anybody else have an ideas or theories?

I've tried to make it clear to people like arkrud that the Republican Party is basically the descendants of the old Dixiecrats from the original Democratic Party. The guys who have ALWAYS been organized to protect the status quo of a racist system that also protects the rich and could give a crap about the poor! They represent businesses and social conservatives. They have ties that run deep and they are VICIOUS!

These were the people against the Civil Rights movement and back in the day they had no problem resorting to violence. They used KKK Terrorism to keep power. So to me it's clear why Trump went with the Southern Strategy in this election. It's worked for the Republicans for a long time.

I think this will be the last time it's effective in this country tho. It's a dying strategy and it only worked this time cuz Hillary was such a flawed candidate. The Rural strongholds are weakening as the racial demographics keep changing. This election was the last hurrah for the old order.

Nixluva--do you dislike white people? I mean listen to your own words? They used KKK Terrorism to keep power. So to me it's clear why Trump went with the Southern Strategy in this election. It's worked for the Republicans for a long time.

These comments make no sense--theyre racist.

I just now saw this post. I have no idea what you're talking about!!! My KKK reference is based in FACT and I was clearly talking about the Civil Rights Era! It's clear in the context of the sentence I wrote. Surely you're not going to try and argue with me about the Terrorist actions of the KKK?

Regarding the "Southern Strategy" just look it up for yourself! Perhaps you just don't know what that is but it's a very real tactic.

Your question about me disliking White People is ridiculous. Talking about Racism doesn't make you a racist. That's a Republican mind trick. Just so you know there is more comfort with White People in the Black community than there is comfort with Blacks in White Communities. There are more Blacks with some White ancestry than Whites with Black ancestry. I have LOTS of White relatives!

Nix. Nothing personal but almost everyone of your posts are filled with racial proclamations. If you need to scream RACE as much as you do it just seems like you may have an outstanding issue I hope not you seem Like avery decent guy. Maybe it's time to put down the race stuff

Put down the race stuff??? What do you know about it??? I know FIRST HAND that this so called "race stuff" is still a huge problem in this country and this last 8 years plus this election have exposed the truth that it's still a big problem!!!

I have children and now a grandchild so you better believe this "race stuff" is gonna be important to me! Race and class are the 2 massive issues in this country as they've always been. My talking about Systemic Racism doesn't mean I have a problem with Race!!! You and the Republicans who love to try and flip this will not silence those who see the inequities of this system.

I can tell that you haven't really read a thing I've posted. All you do is key in on the fact that I'm pointing to racial injustice, which is a proven FACT in this country since it's inception. If it's not an issue anymore I'd LOVE to see your proof of this belief. Why don't you lay out your argument for the case that this is a post racial society and an equal system!!!

People like Nix are in the golden list of KKK and other white supremacist.
They want divisive people to do their thing to aid their agenda.
I had a Zionist schoolmate who was going on and on about supremacy of Jews and was very educated and argumentative about it.
Antisemitic dudes in my school including some teaches, principal, and such loved this dude.
He was making their life so easy. Just let him talk and the job is done.
I hated the dude...

No one really cares about the Civil Rights era--in fact its an embarrassment to compare eras. You live your life you work hard you take care of your family have friends try to to the right thing and color/race means little to nothing

That's an ideal. Those are not facts.

In NC there were laws that were created in order to suppress votes from minorities. Because minorities vote a certain way for a certain party. Voting suppression so that a specific party can win an election and impose their ideals into society.

Ideals tend to differ when it comes to race which is y race will always be an issue. There are clear fact based evidence on how racist and biased the justice system is. Which also ties into voting suppression. So if race means little to nothing then y have these justice system racial biases been occurring?

Lets be factual. What are the laws that you referring to?
This is not some opinions, its written thing, so easy to examine.
If you have some examples of precedents when law used with racial bias also please give some reference.
I have no doubt that this is the case and the only way to get read of this issues is to bring attention to them.
We do not need statistical crap but specific real life cases.
As per voting - why any law obedient citizen will have a problem to bring passport, social security, drivers license, or ID to the voting place?
Why activists who care about voting right will not assist all citizens with obtaining the required documents if they do not have one and want to get it?

A federal appeals court decisively struck down North Carolina’s voter identification law on Friday, saying its provisions deliberately “target African-Americans with almost surgical precision” in an effort to depress black turnout at the polls.

These are facts. Law makers created and implemented laws that "targeted African-Americans with almost surgical precision". There is no defense for it, any excuse you can come up with is shot down that it was taken to court and ruled what was ruled after investigation in supreme court.

You can't claim stuff like color race has no meaning when laws created in 2011 have to be taken into supreme court in 2016 and *ruled* racist.

We all know about the dude Brock who was caught raping a girl and given a slap on the wrist in terms of sentencing. And then there is Levar Allen who was charged with child pornography for sexting his white girlfriend who sexted him first. In both cases the punishment didn't fit the crime. Brock was charged too light and Allen was charged to harsh. And that's our criminal justice system. Sympathy shown for one, and no sympathy shown for another. Since the system relies on human judgement a person can let racist/sexist views effect their judgement. Rather then everyone uniting in order to expose and weed out those who can ruin the system with racist views excuses are made.

So the law that was racist was overturned. That's great.
The judgments in court will be always dependent on the judge and jury but can always be appealed both when the sentence is to harsh or to light.
Public and press can take on it and force the process to correct itself.
So I cannot see any problem with that.
Couple of isolated cases is not an indictment to whole system.

I knew you would focus on the fact that it was overturned after 4 yrs in court. But what about the fact that it was implemented in the first place? Why were African Americans habits researched and laws put in place around their habits in the first place? Probably because guys like Arkud and Briggs would then make excuses about it. How many of these law makers lost their position for making such blatant racist laws? I can bet if it wasn't yet ruled racist in supreme court that you would be claiming how there isn't any issue with it and how African Americans should just adapt. You think randomly in 2011 this is the first time since slavery that laws were created after researching the habits of African Americans and embedded in the system?

Having to fight it with the public and press and try to force the change goes without saying and is after the fact. Having racist, racial bias would be the root of the problem. You go after the root of the problem then there is less need for people who have been done wrong to have to spend the time and energy fighting to correct it. But of course you rarely ever want to discuss that side.

Don't waste your time..He craftily dances around the point you are making and doesn't acknowledge what is said...You get sucked into the bad spelling and grammar, but he knows what's exactly what he is doing...

He just needs to get "they are all looking for government handouts" a few more times off his chest...

I never said this. This is what you said.
"government handouts" needed by people who are economically disadvantaged - mentally and physically handicapped, orphans, elderly, single moms, pure.
This has nothing to do with race criteria.
We agreed that AA were enslaved, displaced, segregated, and silenced by terror.
We agreed that racism exist, that some laws are still have racist smell and such.
My question stays unanswered.
What is you plan of actions to improve race relations in America you consider (and rightfully so) unacceptable?
For now I see that you want anyone who is looking for dialog to shut up and stop bringing it up, and let you vent you frustration to the wind.
Did I get it right?

This is not an African American Problem!!! This is about the larger White Society that has allowed this kind of crap to continue to go on!!! If I keep burning your house down no matter where you go and what you do to try and prevent it, is that your fault??? NO YOU'RE BEING ATTACKED!!!

This is what is happening and has always happened to African Americans, Native Americans and other Minorities. They are just trying to live like every average American but they have powerful forces who are constantly doing detrimental things to AA's. Such as Police Forces that over-police Black Neighborhoods like Stop and Frisk and extract money to pay for the Cities needs like Ferguson. Predatory Lending. Longer Sentences for the same crimes. Voter Suppression Laws. etc.

Arkrud you keep thinking that AA's and those who support them have somehow not been working to try and change things. There has ALWAYS been efforts to change things for the better. Perhaps you simply aren't paying attention to what has been presented in this thread. This is also about the Poor and Middle Class, but as i've pointed out before, there are people who don't want Poor and Middle Class of all Races to come together. This has been the fear of those in power since the beginning.

This is why I posted the racist political ad above. It proves that this is a tactic that has been used since the end of the Civil War.

There have always been multiracial efforts to fight against this. This is Frederick Douglas and White Abolitionists.

Do you get it now???

I never denied anything that you said.
I interact with many AA people every day and cannot see them being any different from other folks and cannot see them being treated differently.
I guess I never lived in areas where is not like that.
Lived in Brooklyn and in NJ in various counties and all is pretty civilized out there.
I do not even pay attention to race, color, and accents at all because this is irrelevant to me.

Well MOST African Americans don't live in NYC!!! The vast Majority are living where they've always lived in the Old Slave States. It's called the Black Belt. These states have a history of mistreating AA's and the Laws are constantly being written to disadvantage AA's in every way they can get away with. Sure you can sue but they just come up with another law and you're constantly chasing and fighting which doesn't leave much time or money for people to PROGRESS!!!

This is what i've been trying to explain to you. Perhaps now you are ready to accept that this is a very difficult situation. The People in these areas are STUBBORN and were brought up with the Racist Mentality from the Old Days. There are some who want to change that but there is a very large group that doesn't want change! Why do you think they've had Segregated Proms even up to recent years???

Once you get out of the Big Cities it's pretty much like going back in time in the rest of the country!!! There's a certain order of things in Rural America and it's the Old Order that still dominates. In the South we have Holidays you don't have!

8 States Still Have Holidays Celebrating The Confederacy

Over 150 years ago, the state of Alabama took up arms against the United States in order to defend the state’s practice of enslaving black people and forcing them to work to enrich white property owners. Today, the state celebrates its four years of treason in defense of slavery with a statewide holiday.

Under Alabama law, the fourth Monday in April is “Confederate Memorial Day” — and this is actually one of two Confederate-themed holidays celebrated by the state. State law also recognizes the first Monday in January as a celebration of Confederate General Robert E. Lee’s birthday. State offices, courts, and licensing offices are all closed on Monday because of the state holiday.

Nor is Alabama alone in using today to celebrate the Confederacy. Mississippi also celebrates Confederate Memorial Day, although Mississippi state offices will only close “at the discretion of the executive head of the department or agency.” Until recently, Georgia celebrated the same holiday — in 2015, Gov. Nathan Deal (R) renamed Confederate Memorial Day with the generic term “state holiday.”

In total, eight states — Alabama, Mississippi, North Carolina, South Carolina, Virginia, Louisiana, Tennessee, and Texas — still celebrate some sort of Confederate holiday, although the nature of the celebration (and whether state workers get the day off) varies from state to state. Texas’ holiday, which the state celebrated on January 19th, is called “Confederate Heroes Day.” Meanwhile, Virginia has long used its Confederate holiday as a counterbalance to the federal holiday honoring a fallen civil rights leader.

Shortly after federal legislation created a national holiday honoring Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr., Virginia combined that holiday with another celebration honoring Confederate Generals Lee and Thomas “Stonewall” Jackson. This “Lee-Jackson-King Day” existed until 2000, when it was split into two holidays.

Now, Virginia honors the man who died advancing the cause of racial justice on a Monday and the two men who fought to maintain slavery on the proceeding Friday.

https://thinkprogress.org/8-states-still-have-holidays-celebrating-the-confederacy-886db691da54#.xyei56s03

It is difficult to me and most new emigrants who are not leaving in the South to get into your shoes but I can relate.
I was leaving in the countries where antisemitism is the second nature of the absolute majority of the population.
It was no other way to survive and stop leaving in fear but to leave.
This what makes us refugees.
And this people who we left behind will not get better. They will find some other way to separate and abuse somebody.
Until they will self-destruct.
We can see this self-distraction happening all over the world. The ricochet.
But people never learn... so may be it is fair at the end.

It used to be that European Immigrants were mistreated in America by Native Born White Americans. Over time they were able to blend into the larger White Society. That doesn't work for Non White people here. I can't just blend in.

Originally there were White Indentured Servants in America but they were not slaves for life. Then they decided that the easier path was to make a law that Negro Servants should be Slaves for life. Skin color made an easy way to establish the order of class in American society.

AFRICANS ARRIVE IN VIRGINIA, 1619

The social status of the first Africans in Jamestown was confusing, and perhaps deliberately ambiguous. Records from 1623 and 1624 list the black inhabitants of the colony as servants, not slaves. In these same records, however, white indentured servants are listed along with the year in which they were to attain freedom; no such year accompanies the names of black servants. Freedom was the birthright of William Tucker, the first African born in the colonies. Yet court records show that at least one African had been declared a slave by 1640, the year that slavery was officially instituted in Jamestown. After the legalization of slavery by the Virginia colony, the African population began to rise slowly and steadily. The number of blacks increased from 23 in 1625 to approximately three hundred in 1650.

http://www.encyclopedia.com/history/encyclopedias-almanacs-transcripts-and-maps/africans-arrive-virginia-1619

Works same way for Africans, Indians, Chines, Argentinians, and others as for Europeans.
I know a couple of people personally. They came to US from Kenya and Nigeria and do quite well.
They do notice some police profiling but after actual conversations with officers thay have no farther issues.
I am not saying that there are no issues. They are. But not as drastic as you portrait.

HOW THE PHUCK WOULD YOU KNOW???

You know you say a lot of dumb shyte! Come down here and hangout with some of the Sons of the Confederacy on Confederates Day and see what you think. It's a very convenient thing to be smug and flippant when you live in a Big City in the North East per se but not everyone is so fortunate. Some people have never escaped the ravages of Slavery and Jim Crow and that poverty and lack of education has them trapped in bad situations.

You need to get in a car and travel the country. Don't go to all the glamorous hot spots. Go into the backwaters and small towns and you might learn something.

I am not hanging out with racists of any color or nation.
And they exist of any kind.
I knew some racist Jews and they are disgusting regardless of justifications they try to sell.
Think about what you are saying yourself "...very convenient thing to be smug and flippant when you live in a Big City in the North East per se but not everyone is so fortunate." Do you really know all this people and the issues they have in their life? Do you think they all deserve your dismissal?
Anger and hate are bad for anyone... they became like those who they hate and start hating the whole world. Why to self-distract?

My father is very distrustful of White people. He of course was born in the 1940's and his life experiences with White people were not good. I didn't know anything about this kind of experience since my best friend growing up in Queens was White. We we started out in kindergarten and now both of us are grandparents. I of course have had my own run ins with White Racists but unlike my father I had the benefit of growing up in an integrated society and yet even I realize things were not just or equal for everyone.

You are trying to put me in the category of a racist or bigot when all I'm doing is stating the facts about how things are and why. You have a convenient situation that allows you to look for moral equivalence but if you were an African American in this country your entire life you would not have had this luxury!!! I didn't have it being chased along a country road as a child by the KKK. You would've been running right alongside me if you were there! Don't tell me anything about racism.

This is a problem. You don't want to hear anything that shaking your view of the world.
That's why you recycling the same arguments ignoring most of my points.
Contrary I am open to change my views and I did already based on our conversation.
World is changing every moment so should our view.
Its not a problem, it is strength.
Flexibility and acceptance is a key to individual and societal success.
I am just sharing the knowledge I have and which worked wonders for a lot of people.
You a welcome to use it or reject it. It is up to you.

Arkrud you don't know what you don't know! That's the problem. You can't drop in and try to teach me about this country that my family has been in since before the American Revolution!!! You don't understand the dynamics of life in this country. You're relatively new and instead of being humble about your lack of knowledge you're arrogantly trying to lecture us about subjects you don't fully understand.

I wish things were so simple as you think they are. I can assure you that the solutions are not just about African Americans working harder. That is F'n insulting in addition to being flat out wrong. People of color have been disadvantaged by this system for a very long time and it's still happening only the tactics are less overt. If you have to spend so much effort, time and money trying to overcome these obstacles how can you ever make progress?

What you fail to recognize is that AA's already started off with less and with the negative impact of poverty and poor education. Then pile on top of that a system built to disadvantage them and keep them from power over their lives and do this for a few hundred years. It's going to have long lasting impact. If you're poor and living in a Black neighborhood there aren't the same resources available. No fresh food but plenty of liquor stores and drug dealers. Food deserts are a very real thing. There are so many issues I can point to and it's not an accident that things are like this. Redlinig and packing AA's into ghettos was done on purpose and still goes on!!! Man I'm done talking to you cuz you have nothing to add to this conversation.

Yep. So do you.
We are like two ships in the open ocean.
We met, exchange the horns, and went in opposite directions.
Its fine. Ocean is huge. Every ship will find his cost.
But do not stuck in you misery, the world is a beautiful place.
Don't worry, Be happy!!!

Man you have no idea what you're talking about. I have a lovely family. I have a wonderful active life and I have a lot of people I work with that look to help less fortunate and oppressed people. There is no need for you to try and lecture me about being happy. The world can be a beautiful place but it can also be an ugly place if you don't actually work to try and correct the wrongs. I know what I do working with youth and community organizations. I don't just talk Shyte on a forum. I especially don't need to be told to "work hard" that's for sure!!!

Very good.
I wish you success in all your work.

nixluva wrote:

arkrud wrote:

nixluva wrote:

arkrud wrote:

nixluva wrote:

arkrud wrote:

nixluva wrote:

arkrud wrote:

nixluva wrote:

arkrud wrote:

nixluva wrote:

arkrud wrote:

nixluva wrote:

arkrud wrote:

holfresh wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

arkrud wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

arkrud wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

arkrud wrote:

nixluva wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

nixluva wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

nixluva wrote:

djsunyc wrote:

nixluva wrote:The Dems are something else! They RAN from Obama in the last Mid Term Election when they should've stuck by him! They didn't listen to him or his people this election and screwed the pooch!!! They didn't use the same methods Obama's Campaign did in reaching out to White Working Class Voters or Minorities.

This Russia thing was a mess but Obama was in a tough spot! He's damned if he went hard on Russia and damned if he didn't. He's a professional and tries to do things the right way. IMO Obama is not the one to really bash over this. This is on EVERYONE including the Republicans in Congress that KNEW the Russians were interfering and blocked telling the American people cuz it benefited them!!!

i agree obama was in a tough spot. there were choices though - he took the high road trying to work with people that had no real intention of working with him. this country is showing us that the high road is not necessarily the right way to go. i think there needs to be some recognition by the dems regarding that and to not give too much credit to the american people.

a tough option would've been to expose the republican party the past 4 years but i understand why he didn't go that route. but with the benefit of hindsight, it's would've probably been the better road to take.

i'm trying to figure out why the republican party are so united and don't always take the high road when working with dems while the dems come off as a bit weak and disjointed. i have a few hypothesis...and it's just me spitballing...but it seems the republicans have 2 strong common characteristics between their government officials...they are mostly white and they are mostly christian. i think there is a built in bond there, even if it's not openly acknowledged. the dems are a bit more racially diverse with diverse religious backgrounds...combine that with historic systemic oppression for people of color and it's tougher to unite and build a cohesive attack.

now i'm not sure i believe any of that but it's just some thoughts in my head trying to understand. does anybody else have an ideas or theories?

I've tried to make it clear to people like arkrud that the Republican Party is basically the descendants of the old Dixiecrats from the original Democratic Party. The guys who have ALWAYS been organized to protect the status quo of a racist system that also protects the rich and could give a crap about the poor! They represent businesses and social conservatives. They have ties that run deep and they are VICIOUS!

These were the people against the Civil Rights movement and back in the day they had no problem resorting to violence. They used KKK Terrorism to keep power. So to me it's clear why Trump went with the Southern Strategy in this election. It's worked for the Republicans for a long time.

I think this will be the last time it's effective in this country tho. It's a dying strategy and it only worked this time cuz Hillary was such a flawed candidate. The Rural strongholds are weakening as the racial demographics keep changing. This election was the last hurrah for the old order.

Nixluva--do you dislike white people? I mean listen to your own words? They used KKK Terrorism to keep power. So to me it's clear why Trump went with the Southern Strategy in this election. It's worked for the Republicans for a long time.

These comments make no sense--theyre racist.

I just now saw this post. I have no idea what you're talking about!!! My KKK reference is based in FACT and I was clearly talking about the Civil Rights Era! It's clear in the context of the sentence I wrote. Surely you're not going to try and argue with me about the Terrorist actions of the KKK?

Regarding the "Southern Strategy" just look it up for yourself! Perhaps you just don't know what that is but it's a very real tactic.

Your question about me disliking White People is ridiculous. Talking about Racism doesn't make you a racist. That's a Republican mind trick. Just so you know there is more comfort with White People in the Black community than there is comfort with Blacks in White Communities. There are more Blacks with some White ancestry than Whites with Black ancestry. I have LOTS of White relatives!

Nix. Nothing personal but almost everyone of your posts are filled with racial proclamations. If you need to scream RACE as much as you do it just seems like you may have an outstanding issue I hope not you seem Like avery decent guy. Maybe it's time to put down the race stuff

Put down the race stuff??? What do you know about it??? I know FIRST HAND that this so called "race stuff" is still a huge problem in this country and this last 8 years plus this election have exposed the truth that it's still a big problem!!!

I have children and now a grandchild so you better believe this "race stuff" is gonna be important to me! Race and class are the 2 massive issues in this country as they've always been. My talking about Systemic Racism doesn't mean I have a problem with Race!!! You and the Republicans who love to try and flip this will not silence those who see the inequities of this system.

I can tell that you haven't really read a thing I've posted. All you do is key in on the fact that I'm pointing to racial injustice, which is a proven FACT in this country since it's inception. If it's not an issue anymore I'd LOVE to see your proof of this belief. Why don't you lay out your argument for the case that this is a post racial society and an equal system!!!

People like Nix are in the golden list of KKK and other white supremacist.
They want divisive people to do their thing to aid their agenda.
I had a Zionist schoolmate who was going on and on about supremacy of Jews and was very educated and argumentative about it.
Antisemitic dudes in my school including some teaches, principal, and such loved this dude.
He was making their life so easy. Just let him talk and the job is done.
I hated the dude...

No one really cares about the Civil Rights era--in fact its an embarrassment to compare eras. You live your life you work hard you take care of your family have friends try to to the right thing and color/race means little to nothing

That's an ideal. Those are not facts.

In NC there were laws that were created in order to suppress votes from minorities. Because minorities vote a certain way for a certain party. Voting suppression so that a specific party can win an election and impose their ideals into society.

Ideals tend to differ when it comes to race which is y race will always be an issue. There are clear fact based evidence on how racist and biased the justice system is. Which also ties into voting suppression. So if race means little to nothing then y have these justice system racial biases been occurring?

Lets be factual. What are the laws that you referring to?
This is not some opinions, its written thing, so easy to examine.
If you have some examples of precedents when law used with racial bias also please give some reference.
I have no doubt that this is the case and the only way to get read of this issues is to bring attention to them.
We do not need statistical crap but specific real life cases.
As per voting - why any law obedient citizen will have a problem to bring passport, social security, drivers license, or ID to the voting place?
Why activists who care about voting right will not assist all citizens with obtaining the required documents if they do not have one and want to get it?

A federal appeals court decisively struck down North Carolina’s voter identification law on Friday, saying its provisions deliberately “target African-Americans with almost surgical precision” in an effort to depress black turnout at the polls.

These are facts. Law makers created and implemented laws that "targeted African-Americans with almost surgical precision". There is no defense for it, any excuse you can come up with is shot down that it was taken to court and ruled what was ruled after investigation in supreme court.

You can't claim stuff like color race has no meaning when laws created in 2011 have to be taken into supreme court in 2016 and *ruled* racist.

We all know about the dude Brock who was caught raping a girl and given a slap on the wrist in terms of sentencing. And then there is Levar Allen who was charged with child pornography for sexting his white girlfriend who sexted him first. In both cases the punishment didn't fit the crime. Brock was charged too light and Allen was charged to harsh. And that's our criminal justice system. Sympathy shown for one, and no sympathy shown for another. Since the system relies on human judgement a person can let racist/sexist views effect their judgement. Rather then everyone uniting in order to expose and weed out those who can ruin the system with racist views excuses are made.

So the law that was racist was overturned. That's great.
The judgments in court will be always dependent on the judge and jury but can always be appealed both when the sentence is to harsh or to light.
Public and press can take on it and force the process to correct itself.
So I cannot see any problem with that.
Couple of isolated cases is not an indictment to whole system.

I knew you would focus on the fact that it was overturned after 4 yrs in court. But what about the fact that it was implemented in the first place? Why were African Americans habits researched and laws put in place around their habits in the first place? Probably because guys like Arkud and Briggs would then make excuses about it. How many of these law makers lost their position for making such blatant racist laws? I can bet if it wasn't yet ruled racist in supreme court that you would be claiming how there isn't any issue with it and how African Americans should just adapt. You think randomly in 2011 this is the first time since slavery that laws were created after researching the habits of African Americans and embedded in the system?

Having to fight it with the public and press and try to force the change goes without saying and is after the fact. Having racist, racial bias would be the root of the problem. You go after the root of the problem then there is less need for people who have been done wrong to have to spend the time and energy fighting to correct it. But of course you rarely ever want to discuss that side.

Don't waste your time..He craftily dances around the point you are making and doesn't acknowledge what is said...You get sucked into the bad spelling and grammar, but he knows what's exactly what he is doing...

He just needs to get "they are all looking for government handouts" a few more times off his chest...

I never said this. This is what you said.
"government handouts" needed by people who are economically disadvantaged - mentally and physically handicapped, orphans, elderly, single moms, pure.
This has nothing to do with race criteria.
We agreed that AA were enslaved, displaced, segregated, and silenced by terror.
We agreed that racism exist, that some laws are still have racist smell and such.
My question stays unanswered.
What is you plan of actions to improve race relations in America you consider (and rightfully so) unacceptable?
For now I see that you want anyone who is looking for dialog to shut up and stop bringing it up, and let you vent you frustration to the wind.
Did I get it right?

This is not an African American Problem!!! This is about the larger White Society that has allowed this kind of crap to continue to go on!!! If I keep burning your house down no matter where you go and what you do to try and prevent it, is that your fault??? NO YOU'RE BEING ATTACKED!!!

This is what is happening and has always happened to African Americans, Native Americans and other Minorities. They are just trying to live like every average American but they have powerful forces who are constantly doing detrimental things to AA's. Such as Police Forces that over-police Black Neighborhoods like Stop and Frisk and extract money to pay for the Cities needs like Ferguson. Predatory Lending. Longer Sentences for the same crimes. Voter Suppression Laws. etc.

Arkrud you keep thinking that AA's and those who support them have somehow not been working to try and change things. There has ALWAYS been efforts to change things for the better. Perhaps you simply aren't paying attention to what has been presented in this thread. This is also about the Poor and Middle Class, but as i've pointed out before, there are people who don't want Poor and Middle Class of all Races to come together. This has been the fear of those in power since the beginning.

This is why I posted the racist political ad above. It proves that this is a tactic that has been used since the end of the Civil War.

There have always been multiracial efforts to fight against this. This is Frederick Douglas and White Abolitionists.

Do you get it now???

I never denied anything that you said.
I interact with many AA people every day and cannot see them being any different from other folks and cannot see them being treated differently.
I guess I never lived in areas where is not like that.
Lived in Brooklyn and in NJ in various counties and all is pretty civilized out there.
I do not even pay attention to race, color, and accents at all because this is irrelevant to me.

Well MOST African Americans don't live in NYC!!! The vast Majority are living where they've always lived in the Old Slave States. It's called the Black Belt. These states have a history of mistreating AA's and the Laws are constantly being written to disadvantage AA's in every way they can get away with. Sure you can sue but they just come up with another law and you're constantly chasing and fighting which doesn't leave much time or money for people to PROGRESS!!!

This is what i've been trying to explain to you. Perhaps now you are ready to accept that this is a very difficult situation. The People in these areas are STUBBORN and were brought up with the Racist Mentality from the Old Days. There are some who want to change that but there is a very large group that doesn't want change! Why do you think they've had Segregated Proms even up to recent years???

Once you get out of the Big Cities it's pretty much like going back in time in the rest of the country!!! There's a certain order of things in Rural America and it's the Old Order that still dominates. In the South we have Holidays you don't have!

8 States Still Have Holidays Celebrating The Confederacy

Over 150 years ago, the state of Alabama took up arms against the United States in order to defend the state’s practice of enslaving black people and forcing them to work to enrich white property owners. Today, the state celebrates its four years of treason in defense of slavery with a statewide holiday.

Under Alabama law, the fourth Monday in April is “Confederate Memorial Day” — and this is actually one of two Confederate-themed holidays celebrated by the state. State law also recognizes the first Monday in January as a celebration of Confederate General Robert E. Lee’s birthday. State offices, courts, and licensing offices are all closed on Monday because of the state holiday.

Nor is Alabama alone in using today to celebrate the Confederacy. Mississippi also celebrates Confederate Memorial Day, although Mississippi state offices will only close “at the discretion of the executive head of the department or agency.” Until recently, Georgia celebrated the same holiday — in 2015, Gov. Nathan Deal (R) renamed Confederate Memorial Day with the generic term “state holiday.”

In total, eight states — Alabama, Mississippi, North Carolina, South Carolina, Virginia, Louisiana, Tennessee, and Texas — still celebrate some sort of Confederate holiday, although the nature of the celebration (and whether state workers get the day off) varies from state to state. Texas’ holiday, which the state celebrated on January 19th, is called “Confederate Heroes Day.” Meanwhile, Virginia has long used its Confederate holiday as a counterbalance to the federal holiday honoring a fallen civil rights leader.

Shortly after federal legislation created a national holiday honoring Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr., Virginia combined that holiday with another celebration honoring Confederate Generals Lee and Thomas “Stonewall” Jackson. This “Lee-Jackson-King Day” existed until 2000, when it was split into two holidays.

Now, Virginia honors the man who died advancing the cause of racial justice on a Monday and the two men who fought to maintain slavery on the proceeding Friday.

https://thinkprogress.org/8-states-still-have-holidays-celebrating-the-confederacy-886db691da54#.xyei56s03

It is difficult to me and most new emigrants who are not leaving in the South to get into your shoes but I can relate.
I was leaving in the countries where antisemitism is the second nature of the absolute majority of the population.
It was no other way to survive and stop leaving in fear but to leave.
This what makes us refugees.
And this people who we left behind will not get better. They will find some other way to separate and abuse somebody.
Until they will self-destruct.
We can see this self-distraction happening all over the world. The ricochet.
But people never learn... so may be it is fair at the end.

It used to be that European Immigrants were mistreated in America by Native Born White Americans. Over time they were able to blend into the larger White Society. That doesn't work for Non White people here. I can't just blend in.

Originally there were White Indentured Servants in America but they were not slaves for life. Then they decided that the easier path was to make a law that Negro Servants should be Slaves for life. Skin color made an easy way to establish the order of class in American society.

AFRICANS ARRIVE IN VIRGINIA, 1619

The social status of the first Africans in Jamestown was confusing, and perhaps deliberately ambiguous. Records from 1623 and 1624 list the black inhabitants of the colony as servants, not slaves. In these same records, however, white indentured servants are listed along with the year in which they were to attain freedom; no such year accompanies the names of black servants. Freedom was the birthright of William Tucker, the first African born in the colonies. Yet court records show that at least one African had been declared a slave by 1640, the year that slavery was officially instituted in Jamestown. After the legalization of slavery by the Virginia colony, the African population began to rise slowly and steadily. The number of blacks increased from 23 in 1625 to approximately three hundred in 1650.

http://www.encyclopedia.com/history/encyclopedias-almanacs-transcripts-and-maps/africans-arrive-virginia-1619

Works same way for Africans, Indians, Chines, Argentinians, and others as for Europeans.
I know a couple of people personally. They came to US from Kenya and Nigeria and do quite well.
They do notice some police profiling but after actual conversations with officers thay have no farther issues.
I am not saying that there are no issues. They are. But not as drastic as you portrait.

HOW THE PHUCK WOULD YOU KNOW???

You know you say a lot of dumb shyte! Come down here and hangout with some of the Sons of the Confederacy on Confederates Day and see what you think. It's a very convenient thing to be smug and flippant when you live in a Big City in the North East per se but not everyone is so fortunate. Some people have never escaped the ravages of Slavery and Jim Crow and that poverty and lack of education has them trapped in bad situations.

You need to get in a car and travel the country. Don't go to all the glamorous hot spots. Go into the backwaters and small towns and you might learn something.

I am not hanging out with racists of any color or nation.
And they exist of any kind.
I knew some racist Jews and they are disgusting regardless of justifications they try to sell.
Think about what you are saying yourself "...very convenient thing to be smug and flippant when you live in a Big City in the North East per se but not everyone is so fortunate." Do you really know all this people and the issues they have in their life? Do you think they all deserve your dismissal?
Anger and hate are bad for anyone... they became like those who they hate and start hating the whole world. Why to self-distract?

My father is very distrustful of White people. He of course was born in the 1940's and his life experiences with White people were not good. I didn't know anything about this kind of experience since my best friend growing up in Queens was White. We we started out in kindergarten and now both of us are grandparents. I of course have had my own run ins with White Racists but unlike my father I had the benefit of growing up in an integrated society and yet even I realize things were not just or equal for everyone.

You are trying to put me in the category of a racist or bigot when all I'm doing is stating the facts about how things are and why. You have a convenient situation that allows you to look for moral equivalence but if you were an African American in this country your entire life you would not have had this luxury!!! I didn't have it being chased along a country road as a child by the KKK. You would've been running right alongside me if you were there! Don't tell me anything about racism.

This is a problem. You don't want to hear anything that shaking your view of the world.
That's why you recycling the same arguments ignoring most of my points.
Contrary I am open to change my views and I did already based on our conversation.
World is changing every moment so should our view.
Its not a problem, it is strength.
Flexibility and acceptance is a key to individual and societal success.
I am just sharing the knowledge I have and which worked wonders for a lot of people.
You a welcome to use it or reject it. It is up to you.

Arkrud you don't know what you don't know! That's the problem. You can't drop in and try to teach me about this country that my family has been in since before the American Revolution!!! You don't understand the dynamics of life in this country. You're relatively new and instead of being humble about your lack of knowledge you're arrogantly trying to lecture us about subjects you don't fully understand.

I wish things were so simple as you think they are. I can assure you that the solutions are not just about African Americans working harder. That is F'n insulting in addition to being flat out wrong. People of color have been disadvantaged by this system for a very long time and it's still happening only the tactics are less overt. If you have to spend so much effort, time and money trying to overcome these obstacles how can you ever make progress?

What you fail to recognize is that AA's already started off with less and with the negative impact of poverty and poor education. Then pile on top of that a system built to disadvantage them and keep them from power over their lives and do this for a few hundred years. It's going to have long lasting impact. If you're poor and living in a Black neighborhood there aren't the same resources available. No fresh food but plenty of liquor stores and drug dealers. Food deserts are a very real thing. There are so many issues I can point to and it's not an accident that things are like this. Redlinig and packing AA's into ghettos was done on purpose and still goes on!!! Man I'm done talking to you cuz you have nothing to add to this conversation.

Yep. So do you.
We are like two ships in the open ocean.
We met, exchange the horns, and went in opposite directions.
Its fine. Ocean is huge. Every ship will find his cost.
But do not stuck in you misery, the world is a beautiful place.
Don't worry, Be happy!!!

Man you have no idea what you're talking about. I have a lovely family. I have a wonderful active life and I have a lot of people I work with that look to help less fortunate and oppressed people. There is no need for you to try and lecture me about being happy. The world can be a beautiful place but it can also be an ugly place if you don't actually work to try and correct the wrongs. I know what I do working with youth and community organizations. I don't just talk Shyte on a forum. I especially don't need to be told to "work hard" that's for sure!!!

I agree, I also work with children and young people, survivors of sexual abuse etc- there are some absolute horrors in the world, and just pretending not to see or acknowledge them does not make it go away- in fact it helps sustain it because it means you don't confront or challenge it.

arkrud wrote:

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nixluva wrote:

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nixluva wrote:

arkrud wrote:

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arkrud wrote:

holfresh wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

arkrud wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

arkrud wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

arkrud wrote:

nixluva wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

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djsunyc wrote:

nixluva wrote:The Dems are something else! They RAN from Obama in the last Mid Term Election when they should've stuck by him! They didn't listen to him or his people this election and screwed the pooch!!! They didn't use the same methods Obama's Campaign did in reaching out to White Working Class Voters or Minorities.

This Russia thing was a mess but Obama was in a tough spot! He's damned if he went hard on Russia and damned if he didn't. He's a professional and tries to do things the right way. IMO Obama is not the one to really bash over this. This is on EVERYONE including the Republicans in Congress that KNEW the Russians were interfering and blocked telling the American people cuz it benefited them!!!

i agree obama was in a tough spot. there were choices though - he took the high road trying to work with people that had no real intention of working with him. this country is showing us that the high road is not necessarily the right way to go. i think there needs to be some recognition by the dems regarding that and to not give too much credit to the american people.

a tough option would've been to expose the republican party the past 4 years but i understand why he didn't go that route. but with the benefit of hindsight, it's would've probably been the better road to take.

i'm trying to figure out why the republican party are so united and don't always take the high road when working with dems while the dems come off as a bit weak and disjointed. i have a few hypothesis...and it's just me spitballing...but it seems the republicans have 2 strong common characteristics between their government officials...they are mostly white and they are mostly christian. i think there is a built in bond there, even if it's not openly acknowledged. the dems are a bit more racially diverse with diverse religious backgrounds...combine that with historic systemic oppression for people of color and it's tougher to unite and build a cohesive attack.

now i'm not sure i believe any of that but it's just some thoughts in my head trying to understand. does anybody else have an ideas or theories?

I've tried to make it clear to people like arkrud that the Republican Party is basically the descendants of the old Dixiecrats from the original Democratic Party. The guys who have ALWAYS been organized to protect the status quo of a racist system that also protects the rich and could give a crap about the poor! They represent businesses and social conservatives. They have ties that run deep and they are VICIOUS!

These were the people against the Civil Rights movement and back in the day they had no problem resorting to violence. They used KKK Terrorism to keep power. So to me it's clear why Trump went with the Southern Strategy in this election. It's worked for the Republicans for a long time.

I think this will be the last time it's effective in this country tho. It's a dying strategy and it only worked this time cuz Hillary was such a flawed candidate. The Rural strongholds are weakening as the racial demographics keep changing. This election was the last hurrah for the old order.

Nixluva--do you dislike white people? I mean listen to your own words? They used KKK Terrorism to keep power. So to me it's clear why Trump went with the Southern Strategy in this election. It's worked for the Republicans for a long time.

These comments make no sense--theyre racist.

I just now saw this post. I have no idea what you're talking about!!! My KKK reference is based in FACT and I was clearly talking about the Civil Rights Era! It's clear in the context of the sentence I wrote. Surely you're not going to try and argue with me about the Terrorist actions of the KKK?

Regarding the "Southern Strategy" just look it up for yourself! Perhaps you just don't know what that is but it's a very real tactic.

Your question about me disliking White People is ridiculous. Talking about Racism doesn't make you a racist. That's a Republican mind trick. Just so you know there is more comfort with White People in the Black community than there is comfort with Blacks in White Communities. There are more Blacks with some White ancestry than Whites with Black ancestry. I have LOTS of White relatives!

Nix. Nothing personal but almost everyone of your posts are filled with racial proclamations. If you need to scream RACE as much as you do it just seems like you may have an outstanding issue I hope not you seem Like avery decent guy. Maybe it's time to put down the race stuff

Put down the race stuff??? What do you know about it??? I know FIRST HAND that this so called "race stuff" is still a huge problem in this country and this last 8 years plus this election have exposed the truth that it's still a big problem!!!

I have children and now a grandchild so you better believe this "race stuff" is gonna be important to me! Race and class are the 2 massive issues in this country as they've always been. My talking about Systemic Racism doesn't mean I have a problem with Race!!! You and the Republicans who love to try and flip this will not silence those who see the inequities of this system.

I can tell that you haven't really read a thing I've posted. All you do is key in on the fact that I'm pointing to racial injustice, which is a proven FACT in this country since it's inception. If it's not an issue anymore I'd LOVE to see your proof of this belief. Why don't you lay out your argument for the case that this is a post racial society and an equal system!!!

People like Nix are in the golden list of KKK and other white supremacist.
They want divisive people to do their thing to aid their agenda.
I had a Zionist schoolmate who was going on and on about supremacy of Jews and was very educated and argumentative about it.
Antisemitic dudes in my school including some teaches, principal, and such loved this dude.
He was making their life so easy. Just let him talk and the job is done.
I hated the dude...

No one really cares about the Civil Rights era--in fact its an embarrassment to compare eras. You live your life you work hard you take care of your family have friends try to to the right thing and color/race means little to nothing

That's an ideal. Those are not facts.

In NC there were laws that were created in order to suppress votes from minorities. Because minorities vote a certain way for a certain party. Voting suppression so that a specific party can win an election and impose their ideals into society.

Ideals tend to differ when it comes to race which is y race will always be an issue. There are clear fact based evidence on how racist and biased the justice system is. Which also ties into voting suppression. So if race means little to nothing then y have these justice system racial biases been occurring?

Lets be factual. What are the laws that you referring to?
This is not some opinions, its written thing, so easy to examine.
If you have some examples of precedents when law used with racial bias also please give some reference.
I have no doubt that this is the case and the only way to get read of this issues is to bring attention to them.
We do not need statistical crap but specific real life cases.
As per voting - why any law obedient citizen will have a problem to bring passport, social security, drivers license, or ID to the voting place?
Why activists who care about voting right will not assist all citizens with obtaining the required documents if they do not have one and want to get it?

A federal appeals court decisively struck down North Carolina’s voter identification law on Friday, saying its provisions deliberately “target African-Americans with almost surgical precision” in an effort to depress black turnout at the polls.

These are facts. Law makers created and implemented laws that "targeted African-Americans with almost surgical precision". There is no defense for it, any excuse you can come up with is shot down that it was taken to court and ruled what was ruled after investigation in supreme court.

You can't claim stuff like color race has no meaning when laws created in 2011 have to be taken into supreme court in 2016 and *ruled* racist.

We all know about the dude Brock who was caught raping a girl and given a slap on the wrist in terms of sentencing. And then there is Levar Allen who was charged with child pornography for sexting his white girlfriend who sexted him first. In both cases the punishment didn't fit the crime. Brock was charged too light and Allen was charged to harsh. And that's our criminal justice system. Sympathy shown for one, and no sympathy shown for another. Since the system relies on human judgement a person can let racist/sexist views effect their judgement. Rather then everyone uniting in order to expose and weed out those who can ruin the system with racist views excuses are made.

So the law that was racist was overturned. That's great.
The judgments in court will be always dependent on the judge and jury but can always be appealed both when the sentence is to harsh or to light.
Public and press can take on it and force the process to correct itself.
So I cannot see any problem with that.
Couple of isolated cases is not an indictment to whole system.

I knew you would focus on the fact that it was overturned after 4 yrs in court. But what about the fact that it was implemented in the first place? Why were African Americans habits researched and laws put in place around their habits in the first place? Probably because guys like Arkud and Briggs would then make excuses about it. How many of these law makers lost their position for making such blatant racist laws? I can bet if it wasn't yet ruled racist in supreme court that you would be claiming how there isn't any issue with it and how African Americans should just adapt. You think randomly in 2011 this is the first time since slavery that laws were created after researching the habits of African Americans and embedded in the system?

Having to fight it with the public and press and try to force the change goes without saying and is after the fact. Having racist, racial bias would be the root of the problem. You go after the root of the problem then there is less need for people who have been done wrong to have to spend the time and energy fighting to correct it. But of course you rarely ever want to discuss that side.

Don't waste your time..He craftily dances around the point you are making and doesn't acknowledge what is said...You get sucked into the bad spelling and grammar, but he knows what's exactly what he is doing...

He just needs to get "they are all looking for government handouts" a few more times off his chest...

I never said this. This is what you said.
"government handouts" needed by people who are economically disadvantaged - mentally and physically handicapped, orphans, elderly, single moms, pure.
This has nothing to do with race criteria.
We agreed that AA were enslaved, displaced, segregated, and silenced by terror.
We agreed that racism exist, that some laws are still have racist smell and such.
My question stays unanswered.
What is you plan of actions to improve race relations in America you consider (and rightfully so) unacceptable?
For now I see that you want anyone who is looking for dialog to shut up and stop bringing it up, and let you vent you frustration to the wind.
Did I get it right?

This is not an African American Problem!!! This is about the larger White Society that has allowed this kind of crap to continue to go on!!! If I keep burning your house down no matter where you go and what you do to try and prevent it, is that your fault??? NO YOU'RE BEING ATTACKED!!!

This is what is happening and has always happened to African Americans, Native Americans and other Minorities. They are just trying to live like every average American but they have powerful forces who are constantly doing detrimental things to AA's. Such as Police Forces that over-police Black Neighborhoods like Stop and Frisk and extract money to pay for the Cities needs like Ferguson. Predatory Lending. Longer Sentences for the same crimes. Voter Suppression Laws. etc.

Arkrud you keep thinking that AA's and those who support them have somehow not been working to try and change things. There has ALWAYS been efforts to change things for the better. Perhaps you simply aren't paying attention to what has been presented in this thread. This is also about the Poor and Middle Class, but as i've pointed out before, there are people who don't want Poor and Middle Class of all Races to come together. This has been the fear of those in power since the beginning.

This is why I posted the racist political ad above. It proves that this is a tactic that has been used since the end of the Civil War.

There have always been multiracial efforts to fight against this. This is Frederick Douglas and White Abolitionists.

Do you get it now???

I never denied anything that you said.
I interact with many AA people every day and cannot see them being any different from other folks and cannot see them being treated differently.
I guess I never lived in areas where is not like that.
Lived in Brooklyn and in NJ in various counties and all is pretty civilized out there.
I do not even pay attention to race, color, and accents at all because this is irrelevant to me.

Well MOST African Americans don't live in NYC!!! The vast Majority are living where they've always lived in the Old Slave States. It's called the Black Belt. These states have a history of mistreating AA's and the Laws are constantly being written to disadvantage AA's in every way they can get away with. Sure you can sue but they just come up with another law and you're constantly chasing and fighting which doesn't leave much time or money for people to PROGRESS!!!

This is what i've been trying to explain to you. Perhaps now you are ready to accept that this is a very difficult situation. The People in these areas are STUBBORN and were brought up with the Racist Mentality from the Old Days. There are some who want to change that but there is a very large group that doesn't want change! Why do you think they've had Segregated Proms even up to recent years???

Once you get out of the Big Cities it's pretty much like going back in time in the rest of the country!!! There's a certain order of things in Rural America and it's the Old Order that still dominates. In the South we have Holidays you don't have!

8 States Still Have Holidays Celebrating The Confederacy

Over 150 years ago, the state of Alabama took up arms against the United States in order to defend the state’s practice of enslaving black people and forcing them to work to enrich white property owners. Today, the state celebrates its four years of treason in defense of slavery with a statewide holiday.

Under Alabama law, the fourth Monday in April is “Confederate Memorial Day” — and this is actually one of two Confederate-themed holidays celebrated by the state. State law also recognizes the first Monday in January as a celebration of Confederate General Robert E. Lee’s birthday. State offices, courts, and licensing offices are all closed on Monday because of the state holiday.

Nor is Alabama alone in using today to celebrate the Confederacy. Mississippi also celebrates Confederate Memorial Day, although Mississippi state offices will only close “at the discretion of the executive head of the department or agency.” Until recently, Georgia celebrated the same holiday — in 2015, Gov. Nathan Deal (R) renamed Confederate Memorial Day with the generic term “state holiday.”

In total, eight states — Alabama, Mississippi, North Carolina, South Carolina, Virginia, Louisiana, Tennessee, and Texas — still celebrate some sort of Confederate holiday, although the nature of the celebration (and whether state workers get the day off) varies from state to state. Texas’ holiday, which the state celebrated on January 19th, is called “Confederate Heroes Day.” Meanwhile, Virginia has long used its Confederate holiday as a counterbalance to the federal holiday honoring a fallen civil rights leader.

Shortly after federal legislation created a national holiday honoring Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr., Virginia combined that holiday with another celebration honoring Confederate Generals Lee and Thomas “Stonewall” Jackson. This “Lee-Jackson-King Day” existed until 2000, when it was split into two holidays.

Now, Virginia honors the man who died advancing the cause of racial justice on a Monday and the two men who fought to maintain slavery on the proceeding Friday.

https://thinkprogress.org/8-states-still-have-holidays-celebrating-the-confederacy-886db691da54#.xyei56s03

It is difficult to me and most new emigrants who are not leaving in the South to get into your shoes but I can relate.
I was leaving in the countries where antisemitism is the second nature of the absolute majority of the population.
It was no other way to survive and stop leaving in fear but to leave.
This what makes us refugees.
And this people who we left behind will not get better. They will find some other way to separate and abuse somebody.
Until they will self-destruct.
We can see this self-distraction happening all over the world. The ricochet.
But people never learn... so may be it is fair at the end.

It used to be that European Immigrants were mistreated in America by Native Born White Americans. Over time they were able to blend into the larger White Society. That doesn't work for Non White people here. I can't just blend in.

Originally there were White Indentured Servants in America but they were not slaves for life. Then they decided that the easier path was to make a law that Negro Servants should be Slaves for life. Skin color made an easy way to establish the order of class in American society.

AFRICANS ARRIVE IN VIRGINIA, 1619

The social status of the first Africans in Jamestown was confusing, and perhaps deliberately ambiguous. Records from 1623 and 1624 list the black inhabitants of the colony as servants, not slaves. In these same records, however, white indentured servants are listed along with the year in which they were to attain freedom; no such year accompanies the names of black servants. Freedom was the birthright of William Tucker, the first African born in the colonies. Yet court records show that at least one African had been declared a slave by 1640, the year that slavery was officially instituted in Jamestown. After the legalization of slavery by the Virginia colony, the African population began to rise slowly and steadily. The number of blacks increased from 23 in 1625 to approximately three hundred in 1650.

http://www.encyclopedia.com/history/encyclopedias-almanacs-transcripts-and-maps/africans-arrive-virginia-1619

Works same way for Africans, Indians, Chines, Argentinians, and others as for Europeans.
I know a couple of people personally. They came to US from Kenya and Nigeria and do quite well.
They do notice some police profiling but after actual conversations with officers thay have no farther issues.
I am not saying that there are no issues. They are. But not as drastic as you portrait.

HOW THE PHUCK WOULD YOU KNOW???

You know you say a lot of dumb shyte! Come down here and hangout with some of the Sons of the Confederacy on Confederates Day and see what you think. It's a very convenient thing to be smug and flippant when you live in a Big City in the North East per se but not everyone is so fortunate. Some people have never escaped the ravages of Slavery and Jim Crow and that poverty and lack of education has them trapped in bad situations.

You need to get in a car and travel the country. Don't go to all the glamorous hot spots. Go into the backwaters and small towns and you might learn something.

I am not hanging out with racists of any color or nation.
And they exist of any kind.
I knew some racist Jews and they are disgusting regardless of justifications they try to sell.
Think about what you are saying yourself "...very convenient thing to be smug and flippant when you live in a Big City in the North East per se but not everyone is so fortunate." Do you really know all this people and the issues they have in their life? Do you think they all deserve your dismissal?
Anger and hate are bad for anyone... they became like those who they hate and start hating the whole world. Why to self-distract?

My father is very distrustful of White people. He of course was born in the 1940's and his life experiences with White people were not good. I didn't know anything about this kind of experience since my best friend growing up in Queens was White. We we started out in kindergarten and now both of us are grandparents. I of course have had my own run ins with White Racists but unlike my father I had the benefit of growing up in an integrated society and yet even I realize things were not just or equal for everyone.

You are trying to put me in the category of a racist or bigot when all I'm doing is stating the facts about how things are and why. You have a convenient situation that allows you to look for moral equivalence but if you were an African American in this country your entire life you would not have had this luxury!!! I didn't have it being chased along a country road as a child by the KKK. You would've been running right alongside me if you were there! Don't tell me anything about racism.

This is a problem. You don't want to hear anything that shaking your view of the world.
That's why you recycling the same arguments ignoring most of my points.
Contrary I am open to change my views and I did already based on our conversation.
World is changing every moment so should our view.
Its not a problem, it is strength.
Flexibility and acceptance is a key to individual and societal success.
I am just sharing the knowledge I have and which worked wonders for a lot of people.
You a welcome to use it or reject it. It is up to you.

Arkrud you don't know what you don't know! That's the problem. You can't drop in and try to teach me about this country that my family has been in since before the American Revolution!!! You don't understand the dynamics of life in this country. You're relatively new and instead of being humble about your lack of knowledge you're arrogantly trying to lecture us about subjects you don't fully understand.

I wish things were so simple as you think they are. I can assure you that the solutions are not just about African Americans working harder. That is F'n insulting in addition to being flat out wrong. People of color have been disadvantaged by this system for a very long time and it's still happening only the tactics are less overt. If you have to spend so much effort, time and money trying to overcome these obstacles how can you ever make progress?

What you fail to recognize is that AA's already started off with less and with the negative impact of poverty and poor education. Then pile on top of that a system built to disadvantage them and keep them from power over their lives and do this for a few hundred years. It's going to have long lasting impact. If you're poor and living in a Black neighborhood there aren't the same resources available. No fresh food but plenty of liquor stores and drug dealers. Food deserts are a very real thing. There are so many issues I can point to and it's not an accident that things are like this. Redlinig and packing AA's into ghettos was done on purpose and still goes on!!! Man I'm done talking to you cuz you have nothing to add to this conversation.

Yep. So do you.
We are like two ships in the open ocean.
We met, exchange the horns, and went in opposite directions.
Its fine. Ocean is huge. Every ship will find his cost.
But do not stuck in you misery, the world is a beautiful place.
Don't worry, Be happy!!!

Man you have no idea what you're talking about. I have a lovely family. I have a wonderful active life and I have a lot of people I work with that look to help less fortunate and oppressed people. There is no need for you to try and lecture me about being happy. The world can be a beautiful place but it can also be an ugly place if you don't actually work to try and correct the wrongs. I know what I do working with youth and community organizations. I don't just talk Shyte on a forum. I especially don't need to be told to "work hard" that's for sure!!!

I agree, I also work with children and young people, survivors of sexual abuse etc- there are some absolute horrors in the world, and just pretending not to see or acknowledge them does not make it go away- in fact it helps sustain it because it means you don't confront or challenge it.

It's great work. Very important.
And I agree 100% with this approach.
This what really make a difference not politics.
If politicians will just stay away and let people do what their heart and soul asks it will be much less struggle and atrocities in the world.
Hopefully they will neutralize each other corrupt influence on world and local affairs.

This is why people are worried about Trump. His actions and rhetoric suggest he's not on the side of the people who have been disenfranchised and marginalized historically. Trump used the old Divide and Conquer Southern Strategy, which scares the hell out of Minorities. Trump has staffed his administration with only RICH and BIG BUSINESS people. These are not the champions of the poor and downtrodden. We've seen this movie before and it doesn't have a good ending.

Tweet was deleted or there was problem with the URL:

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/811975049431416832

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nixluva wrote:The Dems are something else! They RAN from Obama in the last Mid Term Election when they should've stuck by him! They didn't listen to him or his people this election and screwed the pooch!!! They didn't use the same methods Obama's Campaign did in reaching out to White Working Class Voters or Minorities.

This Russia thing was a mess but Obama was in a tough spot! He's damned if he went hard on Russia and damned if he didn't. He's a professional and tries to do things the right way. IMO Obama is not the one to really bash over this. This is on EVERYONE including the Republicans in Congress that KNEW the Russians were interfering and blocked telling the American people cuz it benefited them!!!

i agree obama was in a tough spot. there were choices though - he took the high road trying to work with people that had no real intention of working with him. this country is showing us that the high road is not necessarily the right way to go. i think there needs to be some recognition by the dems regarding that and to not give too much credit to the american people.

a tough option would've been to expose the republican party the past 4 years but i understand why he didn't go that route. but with the benefit of hindsight, it's would've probably been the better road to take.

i'm trying to figure out why the republican party are so united and don't always take the high road when working with dems while the dems come off as a bit weak and disjointed. i have a few hypothesis...and it's just me spitballing...but it seems the republicans have 2 strong common characteristics between their government officials...they are mostly white and they are mostly christian. i think there is a built in bond there, even if it's not openly acknowledged. the dems are a bit more racially diverse with diverse religious backgrounds...combine that with historic systemic oppression for people of color and it's tougher to unite and build a cohesive attack.

now i'm not sure i believe any of that but it's just some thoughts in my head trying to understand. does anybody else have an ideas or theories?

I've tried to make it clear to people like arkrud that the Republican Party is basically the descendants of the old Dixiecrats from the original Democratic Party. The guys who have ALWAYS been organized to protect the status quo of a racist system that also protects the rich and could give a crap about the poor! They represent businesses and social conservatives. They have ties that run deep and they are VICIOUS!

These were the people against the Civil Rights movement and back in the day they had no problem resorting to violence. They used KKK Terrorism to keep power. So to me it's clear why Trump went with the Southern Strategy in this election. It's worked for the Republicans for a long time.

I think this will be the last time it's effective in this country tho. It's a dying strategy and it only worked this time cuz Hillary was such a flawed candidate. The Rural strongholds are weakening as the racial demographics keep changing. This election was the last hurrah for the old order.

Nixluva--do you dislike white people? I mean listen to your own words? They used KKK Terrorism to keep power. So to me it's clear why Trump went with the Southern Strategy in this election. It's worked for the Republicans for a long time.

These comments make no sense--theyre racist.

I just now saw this post. I have no idea what you're talking about!!! My KKK reference is based in FACT and I was clearly talking about the Civil Rights Era! It's clear in the context of the sentence I wrote. Surely you're not going to try and argue with me about the Terrorist actions of the KKK?

Regarding the "Southern Strategy" just look it up for yourself! Perhaps you just don't know what that is but it's a very real tactic.

Your question about me disliking White People is ridiculous. Talking about Racism doesn't make you a racist. That's a Republican mind trick. Just so you know there is more comfort with White People in the Black community than there is comfort with Blacks in White Communities. There are more Blacks with some White ancestry than Whites with Black ancestry. I have LOTS of White relatives!

Nix. Nothing personal but almost everyone of your posts are filled with racial proclamations. If you need to scream RACE as much as you do it just seems like you may have an outstanding issue I hope not you seem Like avery decent guy. Maybe it's time to put down the race stuff

Put down the race stuff??? What do you know about it??? I know FIRST HAND that this so called "race stuff" is still a huge problem in this country and this last 8 years plus this election have exposed the truth that it's still a big problem!!!

I have children and now a grandchild so you better believe this "race stuff" is gonna be important to me! Race and class are the 2 massive issues in this country as they've always been. My talking about Systemic Racism doesn't mean I have a problem with Race!!! You and the Republicans who love to try and flip this will not silence those who see the inequities of this system.

I can tell that you haven't really read a thing I've posted. All you do is key in on the fact that I'm pointing to racial injustice, which is a proven FACT in this country since it's inception. If it's not an issue anymore I'd LOVE to see your proof of this belief. Why don't you lay out your argument for the case that this is a post racial society and an equal system!!!

People like Nix are in the golden list of KKK and other white supremacist.
They want divisive people to do their thing to aid their agenda.
I had a Zionist schoolmate who was going on and on about supremacy of Jews and was very educated and argumentative about it.
Antisemitic dudes in my school including some teaches, principal, and such loved this dude.
He was making their life so easy. Just let him talk and the job is done.
I hated the dude...

No one really cares about the Civil Rights era--in fact its an embarrassment to compare eras. You live your life you work hard you take care of your family have friends try to to the right thing and color/race means little to nothing

That's an ideal. Those are not facts.

In NC there were laws that were created in order to suppress votes from minorities. Because minorities vote a certain way for a certain party. Voting suppression so that a specific party can win an election and impose their ideals into society.

Ideals tend to differ when it comes to race which is y race will always be an issue. There are clear fact based evidence on how racist and biased the justice system is. Which also ties into voting suppression. So if race means little to nothing then y have these justice system racial biases been occurring?

Lets be factual. What are the laws that you referring to?
This is not some opinions, its written thing, so easy to examine.
If you have some examples of precedents when law used with racial bias also please give some reference.
I have no doubt that this is the case and the only way to get read of this issues is to bring attention to them.
We do not need statistical crap but specific real life cases.
As per voting - why any law obedient citizen will have a problem to bring passport, social security, drivers license, or ID to the voting place?
Why activists who care about voting right will not assist all citizens with obtaining the required documents if they do not have one and want to get it?

A federal appeals court decisively struck down North Carolina’s voter identification law on Friday, saying its provisions deliberately “target African-Americans with almost surgical precision” in an effort to depress black turnout at the polls.

These are facts. Law makers created and implemented laws that "targeted African-Americans with almost surgical precision". There is no defense for it, any excuse you can come up with is shot down that it was taken to court and ruled what was ruled after investigation in supreme court.

You can't claim stuff like color race has no meaning when laws created in 2011 have to be taken into supreme court in 2016 and *ruled* racist.

We all know about the dude Brock who was caught raping a girl and given a slap on the wrist in terms of sentencing. And then there is Levar Allen who was charged with child pornography for sexting his white girlfriend who sexted him first. In both cases the punishment didn't fit the crime. Brock was charged too light and Allen was charged to harsh. And that's our criminal justice system. Sympathy shown for one, and no sympathy shown for another. Since the system relies on human judgement a person can let racist/sexist views effect their judgement. Rather then everyone uniting in order to expose and weed out those who can ruin the system with racist views excuses are made.

So the law that was racist was overturned. That's great.
The judgments in court will be always dependent on the judge and jury but can always be appealed both when the sentence is to harsh or to light.
Public and press can take on it and force the process to correct itself.
So I cannot see any problem with that.
Couple of isolated cases is not an indictment to whole system.

I knew you would focus on the fact that it was overturned after 4 yrs in court. But what about the fact that it was implemented in the first place? Why were African Americans habits researched and laws put in place around their habits in the first place? Probably because guys like Arkud and Briggs would then make excuses about it. How many of these law makers lost their position for making such blatant racist laws? I can bet if it wasn't yet ruled racist in supreme court that you would be claiming how there isn't any issue with it and how African Americans should just adapt. You think randomly in 2011 this is the first time since slavery that laws were created after researching the habits of African Americans and embedded in the system?

Having to fight it with the public and press and try to force the change goes without saying and is after the fact. Having racist, racial bias would be the root of the problem. You go after the root of the problem then there is less need for people who have been done wrong to have to spend the time and energy fighting to correct it. But of course you rarely ever want to discuss that side.

Don't waste your time..He craftily dances around the point you are making and doesn't acknowledge what is said...You get sucked into the bad spelling and grammar, but he knows what's exactly what he is doing...

He just needs to get "they are all looking for government handouts" a few more times off his chest...

I never said this. This is what you said.
"government handouts" needed by people who are economically disadvantaged - mentally and physically handicapped, orphans, elderly, single moms, pure.
This has nothing to do with race criteria.
We agreed that AA were enslaved, displaced, segregated, and silenced by terror.
We agreed that racism exist, that some laws are still have racist smell and such.
My question stays unanswered.
What is you plan of actions to improve race relations in America you consider (and rightfully so) unacceptable?
For now I see that you want anyone who is looking for dialog to shut up and stop bringing it up, and let you vent you frustration to the wind.
Did I get it right?

This is not an African American Problem!!! This is about the larger White Society that has allowed this kind of crap to continue to go on!!! If I keep burning your house down no matter where you go and what you do to try and prevent it, is that your fault??? NO YOU'RE BEING ATTACKED!!!

This is what is happening and has always happened to African Americans, Native Americans and other Minorities. They are just trying to live like every average American but they have powerful forces who are constantly doing detrimental things to AA's. Such as Police Forces that over-police Black Neighborhoods like Stop and Frisk and extract money to pay for the Cities needs like Ferguson. Predatory Lending. Longer Sentences for the same crimes. Voter Suppression Laws. etc.

Arkrud you keep thinking that AA's and those who support them have somehow not been working to try and change things. There has ALWAYS been efforts to change things for the better. Perhaps you simply aren't paying attention to what has been presented in this thread. This is also about the Poor and Middle Class, but as i've pointed out before, there are people who don't want Poor and Middle Class of all Races to come together. This has been the fear of those in power since the beginning.

This is why I posted the racist political ad above. It proves that this is a tactic that has been used since the end of the Civil War.

There have always been multiracial efforts to fight against this. This is Frederick Douglas and White Abolitionists.

Do you get it now???

I never denied anything that you said.
I interact with many AA people every day and cannot see them being any different from other folks and cannot see them being treated differently.
I guess I never lived in areas where is not like that.
Lived in Brooklyn and in NJ in various counties and all is pretty civilized out there.
I do not even pay attention to race, color, and accents at all because this is irrelevant to me.

Well MOST African Americans don't live in NYC!!! The vast Majority are living where they've always lived in the Old Slave States. It's called the Black Belt. These states have a history of mistreating AA's and the Laws are constantly being written to disadvantage AA's in every way they can get away with. Sure you can sue but they just come up with another law and you're constantly chasing and fighting which doesn't leave much time or money for people to PROGRESS!!!

This is what i've been trying to explain to you. Perhaps now you are ready to accept that this is a very difficult situation. The People in these areas are STUBBORN and were brought up with the Racist Mentality from the Old Days. There are some who want to change that but there is a very large group that doesn't want change! Why do you think they've had Segregated Proms even up to recent years???

Once you get out of the Big Cities it's pretty much like going back in time in the rest of the country!!! There's a certain order of things in Rural America and it's the Old Order that still dominates. In the South we have Holidays you don't have!

8 States Still Have Holidays Celebrating The Confederacy

Over 150 years ago, the state of Alabama took up arms against the United States in order to defend the state’s practice of enslaving black people and forcing them to work to enrich white property owners. Today, the state celebrates its four years of treason in defense of slavery with a statewide holiday.

Under Alabama law, the fourth Monday in April is “Confederate Memorial Day” — and this is actually one of two Confederate-themed holidays celebrated by the state. State law also recognizes the first Monday in January as a celebration of Confederate General Robert E. Lee’s birthday. State offices, courts, and licensing offices are all closed on Monday because of the state holiday.

Nor is Alabama alone in using today to celebrate the Confederacy. Mississippi also celebrates Confederate Memorial Day, although Mississippi state offices will only close “at the discretion of the executive head of the department or agency.” Until recently, Georgia celebrated the same holiday — in 2015, Gov. Nathan Deal (R) renamed Confederate Memorial Day with the generic term “state holiday.”

In total, eight states — Alabama, Mississippi, North Carolina, South Carolina, Virginia, Louisiana, Tennessee, and Texas — still celebrate some sort of Confederate holiday, although the nature of the celebration (and whether state workers get the day off) varies from state to state. Texas’ holiday, which the state celebrated on January 19th, is called “Confederate Heroes Day.” Meanwhile, Virginia has long used its Confederate holiday as a counterbalance to the federal holiday honoring a fallen civil rights leader.

Shortly after federal legislation created a national holiday honoring Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr., Virginia combined that holiday with another celebration honoring Confederate Generals Lee and Thomas “Stonewall” Jackson. This “Lee-Jackson-King Day” existed until 2000, when it was split into two holidays.

Now, Virginia honors the man who died advancing the cause of racial justice on a Monday and the two men who fought to maintain slavery on the proceeding Friday.

https://thinkprogress.org/8-states-still-have-holidays-celebrating-the-confederacy-886db691da54#.xyei56s03

It is difficult to me and most new emigrants who are not leaving in the South to get into your shoes but I can relate.
I was leaving in the countries where antisemitism is the second nature of the absolute majority of the population.
It was no other way to survive and stop leaving in fear but to leave.
This what makes us refugees.
And this people who we left behind will not get better. They will find some other way to separate and abuse somebody.
Until they will self-destruct.
We can see this self-distraction happening all over the world. The ricochet.
But people never learn... so may be it is fair at the end.

It used to be that European Immigrants were mistreated in America by Native Born White Americans. Over time they were able to blend into the larger White Society. That doesn't work for Non White people here. I can't just blend in.

Originally there were White Indentured Servants in America but they were not slaves for life. Then they decided that the easier path was to make a law that Negro Servants should be Slaves for life. Skin color made an easy way to establish the order of class in American society.

AFRICANS ARRIVE IN VIRGINIA, 1619

The social status of the first Africans in Jamestown was confusing, and perhaps deliberately ambiguous. Records from 1623 and 1624 list the black inhabitants of the colony as servants, not slaves. In these same records, however, white indentured servants are listed along with the year in which they were to attain freedom; no such year accompanies the names of black servants. Freedom was the birthright of William Tucker, the first African born in the colonies. Yet court records show that at least one African had been declared a slave by 1640, the year that slavery was officially instituted in Jamestown. After the legalization of slavery by the Virginia colony, the African population began to rise slowly and steadily. The number of blacks increased from 23 in 1625 to approximately three hundred in 1650.

http://www.encyclopedia.com/history/encyclopedias-almanacs-transcripts-and-maps/africans-arrive-virginia-1619

Works same way for Africans, Indians, Chines, Argentinians, and others as for Europeans.
I know a couple of people personally. They came to US from Kenya and Nigeria and do quite well.
They do notice some police profiling but after actual conversations with officers thay have no farther issues.
I am not saying that there are no issues. They are. But not as drastic as you portrait.

HOW THE PHUCK WOULD YOU KNOW???

You know you say a lot of dumb shyte! Come down here and hangout with some of the Sons of the Confederacy on Confederates Day and see what you think. It's a very convenient thing to be smug and flippant when you live in a Big City in the North East per se but not everyone is so fortunate. Some people have never escaped the ravages of Slavery and Jim Crow and that poverty and lack of education has them trapped in bad situations.

You need to get in a car and travel the country. Don't go to all the glamorous hot spots. Go into the backwaters and small towns and you might learn something.

I am not hanging out with racists of any color or nation.
And they exist of any kind.
I knew some racist Jews and they are disgusting regardless of justifications they try to sell.
Think about what you are saying yourself "...very convenient thing to be smug and flippant when you live in a Big City in the North East per se but not everyone is so fortunate." Do you really know all this people and the issues they have in their life? Do you think they all deserve your dismissal?
Anger and hate are bad for anyone... they became like those who they hate and start hating the whole world. Why to self-distract?

My father is very distrustful of White people. He of course was born in the 1940's and his life experiences with White people were not good. I didn't know anything about this kind of experience since my best friend growing up in Queens was White. We we started out in kindergarten and now both of us are grandparents. I of course have had my own run ins with White Racists but unlike my father I had the benefit of growing up in an integrated society and yet even I realize things were not just or equal for everyone.

You are trying to put me in the category of a racist or bigot when all I'm doing is stating the facts about how things are and why. You have a convenient situation that allows you to look for moral equivalence but if you were an African American in this country your entire life you would not have had this luxury!!! I didn't have it being chased along a country road as a child by the KKK. You would've been running right alongside me if you were there! Don't tell me anything about racism.

This is a problem. You don't want to hear anything that shaking your view of the world.
That's why you recycling the same arguments ignoring most of my points.
Contrary I am open to change my views and I did already based on our conversation.
World is changing every moment so should our view.
Its not a problem, it is strength.
Flexibility and acceptance is a key to individual and societal success.
I am just sharing the knowledge I have and which worked wonders for a lot of people.
You a welcome to use it or reject it. It is up to you.

Arkrud you don't know what you don't know! That's the problem. You can't drop in and try to teach me about this country that my family has been in since before the American Revolution!!! You don't understand the dynamics of life in this country. You're relatively new and instead of being humble about your lack of knowledge you're arrogantly trying to lecture us about subjects you don't fully understand.

I wish things were so simple as you think they are. I can assure you that the solutions are not just about African Americans working harder. That is F'n insulting in addition to being flat out wrong. People of color have been disadvantaged by this system for a very long time and it's still happening only the tactics are less overt. If you have to spend so much effort, time and money trying to overcome these obstacles how can you ever make progress?

What you fail to recognize is that AA's already started off with less and with the negative impact of poverty and poor education. Then pile on top of that a system built to disadvantage them and keep them from power over their lives and do this for a few hundred years. It's going to have long lasting impact. If you're poor and living in a Black neighborhood there aren't the same resources available. No fresh food but plenty of liquor stores and drug dealers. Food deserts are a very real thing. There are so many issues I can point to and it's not an accident that things are like this. Redlinig and packing AA's into ghettos was done on purpose and still goes on!!! Man I'm done talking to you cuz you have nothing to add to this conversation.

Yep. So do you.
We are like two ships in the open ocean.
We met, exchange the horns, and went in opposite directions.
Its fine. Ocean is huge. Every ship will find his cost.
But do not stuck in you misery, the world is a beautiful place.
Don't worry, Be happy!!!

Man you have no idea what you're talking about. I have a lovely family. I have a wonderful active life and I have a lot of people I work with that look to help less fortunate and oppressed people. There is no need for you to try and lecture me about being happy. The world can be a beautiful place but it can also be an ugly place if you don't actually work to try and correct the wrongs. I know what I do working with youth and community organizations. I don't just talk Shyte on a forum. I especially don't need to be told to "work hard" that's for sure!!!

I agree, I also work with children and young people, survivors of sexual abuse etc- there are some absolute horrors in the world, and just pretending not to see or acknowledge them does not make it go away- in fact it helps sustain it because it means you don't confront or challenge it.

It's great work. Very important.
And I agree 100% with this approach.
This what really make a difference not politics.
If politicians will just stay away and let people do what their heart and soul asks it will be much less struggle and atrocities in the world.
Hopefully they will neutralize each other corrupt influence on world and local affairs.

We need GOOD government. You can't address everything by simply wishing and hoping good people will be able to defeat bad people. If that was the method that Abolitionists and Civil Rights fighters took, we'd still be in an awful situation in this country. NOTHING good in this country came about without a MASSIVE struggle. They had to fight a bloody Civil War to get rid of Slavery. People Died and they had to send in the National Guard to gain Civil Rights and end most of Jim Crow. There are still vestiges of this fight left and people on the wrong side of this fight are still trying to disadvantage people. That's why we need good Government that actually serves the people and not Big Business or those who wish to maintain the Old Order of things.

This is why people are worried about Trump. His actions and rhetoric suggest he's not on the side of the people who have been disenfranchised and marginalized historically. Trump used the old Divide and Conquer Southern Strategy, which scares the hell out of Minorities. Trump has staffed his administration with only RICH and BIG BUSINESS people. These are not the champions of the poor and downtrodden. We've seen this movie before and it doesn't have a good ending.

Yep.
The old concept of Good King... Russia running on this fumes for 400 years.
Ivan The Terrible, Peter The Great, Alexandr Freedom Giver, Nikolai 2, Lenin, Stalin, Putin...
Still no freedom and no dignity. Just death and oppression in the name of Great Goals.
Way to Paradise paved with dead bodies which turns to be a way straight to Hell.
Seems like nothing in this world can be obtained without struggle. And bigger the goals bigger the straggle.
May be it is time to stop the struggle and look in the eyes of each other to find God and fined yourself?

"What we've got here is failure to communicate.
Some men you just can't reach...
So, you get what we had here last week, which is the way he wants it!
Well, he gets it!
N' I don't like it any more than you men." *

In THIS country things only changed when members of the Majority who actually BELIEVED in the equality of man worked to confront the rest of the Majority and correct the inequities. That process continues because things have not fully been equalized as the law says they should be. There is still Systemic Racism and Inequality.

The Trump Campaign has given the Republicans, who DON'T Believe in full equality, the power again. This is why so many people are worried. Trump TALKS like a champion of the average man but he has NEVER been concerned with these people and knows nothing about living that way. He's stuffed his administration with BILLIONAIRES AND MILLIONAIRES. This level of Plutocrats in an administration is unprecedented.

Why it will be bad if Trump will compromise himself and Republicans along the way?
If this will happen Democrats can sweep next elections.
Then it will be a Golden Age...
Seriously speaking Majority in US believes not in equality which never existed and is unnatural but equal opportunity.
People should be given equal opportunity in life. What they do achieve after that depends on how every specific person make use of this opportunity.
You are right about this opportunity being dependent of every human upbringing and it takes long time to build the family foundation as springboard in life.
Human race evolving in very uneven fashion, the wealth is collected in pockets and is not big enough yet to equalize things for every human in the world.
But I think we slowly getting better at this as civilization. Need to work harder zo as lately too much wealth is destroyed in attempts to jump over hoops of history.

What I would like to see us do is become forefront in cyber security--I mean like all in. Advance laser technologies satellite technology deep water technology. Adding more missiles seems like it would lead itself to potential catastrophic mistake possibilities

nixluva wrote:

holfresh wrote:http://www.pbs.org/newshour/rundown/despite-rising-premiums-threat-repeal-6-4-million-people-signed-obamacare/
Despite rising premiums and GOP threat of repeal, 6.4 million people signed up for Obamacare so far...Since Nov.1st...

It's funny how the talking point is always about rising premiums as if they didn't go up before Obamacare!!! In fact the rate of increase has been lower and also more people are insured and most can access Credits to lower the cost. This system wasn't the best option but it was a step in the right direction.

The Republicans don't talk about all the people they are blocking from having ANY insurance in their states. They don't talk about all the small hospitals and clinics in rural areas that have had to close because the Republicans refused to accept the Medicaid Expansion. How about we insure millions of people rather than spend more on Nuclear Weapons?

All this is the truth!!..There are Governors in Republican States blocking Obamacare in their States and people are dying..Yet they say they are "pro life"...No one talks about this..All politics...The debates on rising premiums are silly...The alternative for these people is not having healthcare at all..So yeah I'll pay 20% increase on my $200 premium versus the real $900 tab without it...

nixluva wrote:

holfresh wrote:I remember someone posting this or something similar which turned out to be a black dude torching his own church...Made it look like Trump supporters may have done it..There are crazies on both sides...




http://www.nytimes.com/2016/12/21/us/mississippi-church-fire.html?module=WatchingPortal&region=c-column-middle-span-region&pgType=Homepage&action=click&mediaId=thumb_square&state=standard&contentPlacement=8&version=internal&contentCollection=www.nytimes.com&contentId=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.nytimes.com%2F2016%2F12%2F21%2Fus%2Fmississippi-church-fire.html&eventName=Watching-article-click&_r=0

Yes there are crazy and corrupt individuals on all sides. I never really argue that this isn't true. My focus is on SYSTEMIC INEQUITIES. That's why I hate when people conflate Individual Racism with Systemic Racism. One Individual hating another race or religion is bad but it's not going to hold an entire group of people back. When a system has negative Racial Impacts then we're talking about real harm.

I hate when guys do things like this, because it undermines the very real wrongs that others are suffering. It gives support to those who want to say that most of these things are fake and that is a very real problem for the victims of hate.

In many countries every day racism is so strong that no institutional racism required.
In today Russia for example Putin government is trying to protect Jews but antisemitism on the streets is so strong that last Jews are trying to get out.
Its almost no Jews left in Poland from couple millions before WW2. All those who returned from camps and immigration after war were also forced out without any government involvement. Many Muslim countries do not provide visas to Jew because that cannot protect them on the streets.
No Armenian can feel safe in Turkey or Azerbaijan and reverse is true for Turks in Armenia. List can go on and on.
Every day racism is foundation of institutional racism not the other way around. Especially in democratic countries run by majority elected governments.
You can hardly fined any country or corner of the world without this issues. Very sad... but this is The World We Living.