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We can't afford to go no smaller than 6'10" in this draft with our first pick
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Knick2001
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5/20/2005  12:14 PM
[quote]The lottery???? dude after the first 3 or 4 picks you are to be lucky to find a star.... [/quote

Hey dude...not this year!
AUTOADVERT
Killa4luv
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5/20/2005  1:09 PM
Posted by rvhoss:
Posted by diderotn:

enough is enough with drafting guards...We can always find them through FA...Plenty of guards will be available, frankly if we can't get Hughes, I would go for Dixon....he is an excellent defender and when his shots are on he is a much better player than Crawfford...Dixon is a tweener like Iverson, but between the two, I don't know who has the biggest heart...

He's better than crawford "when his shots are on"...please explain to me what that means? Where does Crawford rank when his shots are on?

I thought this was an excellent question. Crawford puts up 40+ when his shots are on. I would say that makes him among the best in he game when his shots are on. Many players have career highs in the 30's but not many put can up 40+ games several times in a season.
NYKBocker
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5/20/2005  2:57 PM
Posted by diderotn:

The lottery???? dude after the first 3 or 4 picks you are to be lucky to find a star....

OK. Let's see where current superstars have been selected. The lottery being picks 1-14

Kevin Garnett - 1995 Draft - 5th pick overall
Kobe Bryant - 1996 Draft - 13th pick overall
Shaq - 1992 Draft - 1st pick overall
Jason Kidd - 1994 Draft - 2nd pick overall
Grant Hill - 1994 Draft - 3rd pick overall
Tracy McGrady - 1997 Draft - 9th overall
Tim Duncan - 1997 Draft - 1st overall
Allen Iverson - 1996 Draft - 1st overall
Stephon Marbury - 1996 Draft - 4th overall
Ray Allen - 1996 Draft - 5th overall
Rasheed Wallace - 1995 Draft - 4th overall
Antawn Jamison - 1998 Draft - 4th overall
Vince Carter - 1998 Draft - 5th overall
Dirk Nowitzki - 1998 Draft - 9th overall
Paul Pierce - 1998 Draft - 10th overall

Should I go on? Almost all the superstars are found in the lottery.
gunsnewing
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5/20/2005  3:07 PM
Posted by NYKBocker:
Posted by diderotn:

The lottery???? dude after the first 3 or 4 picks you are to be lucky to find a star....

OK. Let's see where current superstars have been selected. The lottery being picks 1-14

Kevin Garnett - 1995 Draft - 5th pick overall
Kobe Bryant - 1996 Draft - 13th pick overall
Shaq - 1992 Draft - 1st pick overall
Jason Kidd - 1994 Draft - 2nd pick overall
Grant Hill - 1994 Draft - 3rd pick overall
Tracy McGrady - 1997 Draft - 9th overall
Tim Duncan - 1997 Draft - 1st overall
Allen Iverson - 1996 Draft - 1st overall
Stephon Marbury - 1996 Draft - 4th overall
Ray Allen - 1996 Draft - 5th overall
Rasheed Wallace - 1995 Draft - 4th overall
Antawn Jamison - 1998 Draft - 4th overall
Vince Carter - 1998 Draft - 5th overall
Dirk Nowitzki - 1998 Draft - 9th overall
Paul Pierce - 1998 Draft - 10th overall

Should I go on? Almost all the superstars are found in the lottery.

throw Ewing, Jordan, Hakeem, Robinson, Reggie & Webber in there too. They were pretty good!

[Edited by - gunsnewing on 05/20/2005 15:07:38]
diderotn
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5/20/2005  10:36 PM
Again, you are to be lucky to find a true Super-Star after the first 5 picks........Kobe, TMack,,,,that is luck my friend....
The true Knickabocker..........
Killa4luv
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5/21/2005  12:28 AM
T-Mac, Dirk, Ron Artest all came after the 8th pick.
Solace
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5/21/2005  2:46 AM
Hate to even remotely agree with diderotn, but I have to agree on some level. We can't afford to take another 6'8" power forward in this draft. We can't afford to take an undersized player at ANY position, for that matter. I'm not going to put a broad height limit on an overall height, but here's my minimal requirements height-wise:

6'11"+ center
6'10"+ power forward (otherwise why bother when we have Sweetney?)
6'8"+ small forward
6'5"+ shooting guard
6'1"+ point guard

Those are minimums at those positions. If the best available player at those slots doesn't fit the requirements, don't draft a big guy for the hell of it... trade down to get players that will help the system. Drafting four or five undersized players in the next two years with the draft picks we have will IMHO extend the torture and agony that is the New York Knicks for a long time further. This upcoming draft, the next one, and making *smart* use of our assets over the next two seasons will completely determine the fate of this franchise.

I'm very nervous that by the time next season starts, we're going to have signed a short point guard with the MLE (Damon Stoudamire?), drafted an undersized swing man, and gotten an undersized big man via the draft. Talent-wise they'll be too good to get us a top 5 pick next year either, but we'll be completely screwed. Did you guys see the team photo? It was like a plateau with one peak in the middle (Sundov).
Wishing everyone well. I enjoyed posting here for a while, but as I matured I realized this forum isn't for me. We all evolve. Thanks for the memories everyone.
diderotn
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5/22/2005  1:18 AM
One thing that a lot of folks fail to realize is that it takes time and patience to develop big boys....Kwame, Jermaine O'Neal and many others can attest to that...We have to make a commitment to a couple of Centers and allow them to develop in a system that will be around for no less than 2 years....the Nets drafted or traded for a young center along with the Carter deal, they have given him a lot of playing time this season and it paid off. The Bobcats did the same, and they were somewhat successful...We need to run away from the idea of using an undersize, unathletic Kurt Thomas as our Center....Draft 2 6'11/7' youngsters with crazy agility and play them a full 82 games under one system and great things might happen...
The true Knickabocker..........
diderotn
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5/22/2005  1:45 AM
With the way some of you are thinking, it appears to me that you guys are trying to collect nothing but 6'8 or 6'9 players. Way to go, especially since we already have 8 6'8 or 6'9 on our roster...
TT, Kurt, Butler, Ariza, Mo T, JYD and Sweetney....
Posted by Allanfan20:

If Bogut isn't available for us, the only 7 footer I am interested in is Andrew Bynum, and that is for the future/long run. He's not a now player. Other than him, guys that I am interested in are Green, Webster and Hakim Warrick. None of the other big guys like Tiago Splitter, from what I hear, don't really seem to be NBA players. Just ask DarkKnicks, b/c most of the really tall guys are in Europe, and he pays attention to those dudes.

I would definitely like to trade for a pick in the mid teens though. If we can use that to grab either Warrick or Webster, and take Bynum with the 8th, this will be a GREAT draft.
The true Knickabocker..........
diderotn
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5/23/2005  10:39 AM
TT is perhaps 6'8" and played like a PG 6'...while Amare is 6'9 or 6'10 and plays much bigger than he actually is...It is all about heart and desire...TT is not 6'10
The true Knickabocker..........
Pharzeone
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5/23/2005  12:29 PM
Posted by NYKBocker:
Posted by diderotn:

The lottery???? dude after the first 3 or 4 picks you are to be lucky to find a star....

OK. Let's see where current superstars have been selected. The lottery being picks 1-14

Kevin Garnett - 1995 Draft - 5th pick overall
Kobe Bryant - 1996 Draft - 13th pick overall
Shaq - 1992 Draft - 1st pick overall
Jason Kidd - 1994 Draft - 2nd pick overall
Grant Hill - 1994 Draft - 3rd pick overall
Tracy McGrady - 1997 Draft - 9th overall
Tim Duncan - 1997 Draft - 1st overall
Allen Iverson - 1996 Draft - 1st overall
Stephon Marbury - 1996 Draft - 4th overall
Ray Allen - 1996 Draft - 5th overall
Rasheed Wallace - 1995 Draft - 4th overall
Antawn Jamison - 1998 Draft - 4th overall
Vince Carter - 1998 Draft - 5th overall
Dirk Nowitzki - 1998 Draft - 9th overall
Paul Pierce - 1998 Draft - 10th overall

Should I go on? Almost all the superstars are found in the lottery.
LOL, you are trying to make your argument but you aren't being fair, where is your current MVP?, how about Manu, if you include Jamison you need to throw in Arenas, AK47 is an all-star, strange you also would leave out the League Defensive player Ben Wallace but include Rasheed who to be honest is playing 2nd fiddle right now in Detroit to Ben, Jermaine O'Neal. I don't care where someone is drafted, I just want a player who is capable of playing on a high level.
I don't like to play bad rookies , I like to play good rookies - Mike D'Antoni
NYKBocker
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5/23/2005  12:55 PM
Posted by Pharzeone:
Posted by NYKBocker:
Posted by diderotn:

The lottery???? dude after the first 3 or 4 picks you are to be lucky to find a star....

OK. Let's see where current superstars have been selected. The lottery being picks 1-14

Kevin Garnett - 1995 Draft - 5th pick overall
Kobe Bryant - 1996 Draft - 13th pick overall
Shaq - 1992 Draft - 1st pick overall
Jason Kidd - 1994 Draft - 2nd pick overall
Grant Hill - 1994 Draft - 3rd pick overall
Tracy McGrady - 1997 Draft - 9th overall
Tim Duncan - 1997 Draft - 1st overall
Allen Iverson - 1996 Draft - 1st overall
Stephon Marbury - 1996 Draft - 4th overall
Ray Allen - 1996 Draft - 5th overall
Rasheed Wallace - 1995 Draft - 4th overall
Antawn Jamison - 1998 Draft - 4th overall
Vince Carter - 1998 Draft - 5th overall
Dirk Nowitzki - 1998 Draft - 9th overall
Paul Pierce - 1998 Draft - 10th overall

Should I go on? Almost all the superstars are found in the lottery.
LOL, you are trying to make your argument but you aren't being fair, where is your current MVP?, how about Manu, if you include Jamison you need to throw in Arenas, AK47 is an all-star, strange you also would leave out the League Defensive player Ben Wallace but include Rasheed who to be honest is playing 2nd fiddle right now in Detroit to Ben, Jermaine O'Neal. I don't care where someone is drafted, I just want a player who is capable of playing on a high level.

Keyword: Almost
Killa4luv
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5/23/2005  2:05 PM
Yeah good players almost always come in the first 20 picks. But * is not a bad spot at all. Especially this year with so many international players and high schoolers in the draft, there should be good talent there to be had.

Our draft position is what it is, Isiah will get us what we need, which is a good big man, he will pick the best one available wherever we pick.
diderotn
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5/24/2005  12:52 PM
Words of causion to my main man Isiah, please use the first 2 picks on no one shorter than 6'10". Now, if we win one of the first 3 picks, Isiah needs to consider trading that spot for 2 early first rounders which would give us an amount of 3 picks in the first round...Than we can consider picking a SG/SF.....


Posted by Killa4luv:

Yeah good players almost always come in the first 20 picks. But * is not a bad spot at all. Especially this year with so many international players and high schoolers in the draft, there should be good talent there to be had.

Our draft position is what it is, Isiah will get us what we need, which is a good big man, he will pick the best one available wherever we pick.
The true Knickabocker..........
diderotn
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5/24/2005  6:48 PM
With the second or third pick, Isiah better grab us a Center.....I am having a hard time deciding whether or not we can pass on Green or Williams at this point...They are both unproven, but very talented. However, we still have a need for a big man......Why can't **** just be easy????
The true Knickabocker..........
diderotn
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5/25/2005  7:31 AM
Denver has 2 picks that we can snatch away, with proper willing and dealing, we can definitely definitely add those 2picks on our board...What are they missing??? they need a SG, but we don't have one that we can offer besides the ailing Houston....
The true Knickabocker..........
diderotn
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5/25/2005  7:57 AM
I hear a lot of things about Bynum, but why not Frye??? They are the same size and Frye is more NBA ready.
The true Knickabocker..........
Marv
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5/25/2005  7:58 AM
FRom what I read, Bynum is much more the center prospect of the 2. Frye is not touted as being a post player.
diderotn
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5/25/2005  8:05 AM
How so when Bynum has only been playing with guys much smaller than him? At least we know that Frye has 4 years of College and maturity behind him..

Posted by Marv:

FRom what I read, Bynum is much more the center prospect of the 2. Frye is not touted as being a post player.
The true Knickabocker..........
Marv
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5/25/2005  8:19 AM
I'm only passing on what I read:

http://www.draftcity.com/viewprofile.php?p=85#

Physically, he has a very narrow frame that will likely not be able to carry too much weight. Right now he gets pushed around an awful lot and this hurts his potential as a big man in all aspects of the game. His foot-speed is fairly average, although at his height that usually wouldn’t be too much of a concern.

Offensively, he lacks the strength or tenacity to establish and hold position in the paint. If he does get the ball, he does not have the lower body strength or footwork to back his man down to the basket or finesse his way towards the hoop. A quick shove in the back and Frye usually finds himself outside the paint. Not being the most contact loving player in the world, he’s hardly the type of guy that will really push back either, so this could be even more of a problem in the much more physical NBA. When he does catch the ball inside the paint in a position to score, he often takes too long to gather himself for a strong finish, giving the defense time to react and stop him. He has some trouble finishing around the basket sometimes due to the fact that he is lacking in upper body strength. At times, usually when he is tired of being banged around inside, Frye has a tendency to settle for extremely soft shots outside of the paint.

Defensively, he does not have the strength to guard NBA post players right now, or the lateral quickness to take care of power forwards if they take him out to the perimeter. His man to man defense is fairly poor, using his hands far too much rather than his feet, although he makes up for this at the collegiate level with his shot-blocking ability. He also has a tendency at times to bite on pump fakes and leave his feet, or rotate over to help on defense and sacrifice his position for the defensive rebound in the process.

On the glass, Frye tends to rely too much on his size, length, athleticism and the fact that he is usually 3 inches taller than anyone else on the floor to come up with rebounds. He lacks great positioning and sheer desire in terms of boxing out his man and crashing the glass. It’s not rare to see him being out-muscled by a smaller player for a loose ball, simply because the other guy looks like he wants it more.

Frye didn’t seem to have a problem being a role player at the college level, despite the fact that he VERY rarely faced anyone in college who can match his size and talent level. Consistency has been an issue for Frye and his mental toughness has been questioned over and over again in his four year at Arizona, as he has problems staying focused and hungry throughout the course of an entire game, and can get extremely passive and tentative. He’s not the type of player who can really score many points if you aren’t running plays for him.

Some of the bigger questions around Frye are: what position is he going to play in the pros? Who exactly is he going to guard? How is he going to score his points?


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We can't afford to go no smaller than 6'10" in this draft with our first pick
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