FiveThirtyEight

Best Job of Making Himself Indispensable to a Team That Seemed Skeptical: Immanuel Quickley

For some reason, the Knicks for a while seemed intent on finding someone, anyone, who could play ahead of Quickley. That was true during his rookie season, when they traded for Derrick Rose while Elfrid Payton was clearly struggling as the starting point guard. It was true last season, when they started Alec Burks at the point for most of the year after Kemba Walker washed out of Tom Thibodeau’s rotation. And it was even true this season, when they spent the first portion of the year giving Quickley even fewer minutes than he got in his first two NBA seasons.

Yes, Quickley had a dreadful first month of the season, during which he shot just 35.6 percent from the field and 27 percent from beyond the arc. But since the Knicks adjusted their rotation in early December and finally gave Quickley the playing time he had clearly earned, he’s been dynamite: 14.4 points, 3.8 rebounds and 3.3 assists in 30.9 minutes per game, shooting 45.5 percent from the field and 37.2 percent from deep. New York has once again been considerably better with Quickley on the floor than off, and if he keeps up this level of play he could make a push for the Sixth Man of the Year trophy.

In particular, the unlocking of Quickley’s floater game has turned him into a much more effective offensive player. He is one of the highest-volume floater-takers in the NBA, and this year, he’s finally been one of the best at converting those shots.

Quickley is floating his way to the top of the Sixth Man race
Effective FG percentage, Quantified Shot Quality (qSQ) and Quantified Shooter Impact (qSI) on floaters for Immanuel Quickley by season

SEASON FLOATERS % OF FGA EFG% QSQ QSI
2020-21 147 25.3% 35.4% 35.5% -0.2%
2021-22 128 17.7 45.7 37.1 8.6
2022-23 113 18.9 51.3 36.5 14.8
qSQ measures the expected eFG% of a player’s shots based on a variety of factors including distance and defensive pressure. qSI measures a player’s “shot-making” ability — i.e., the difference between his actual and expected eFG%.

SOURCE: SECOND SPECTRUM

On defense, though, is where Quickley has really shined. He’s got the best defensive RAPTOR of his career; New York’s defense has been 11.4 points stingier per 100 possessions with him on the floor than on the bench; and he has been one of the league’s most effective pick-and-roll defenders. According to Second Spectrum, opponents have averaged just 0.868 points per play when Quickley’s man has been the ball-handler in a pick and roll, the second-best mark among 88 players who have defended the action at least 500 times so far this season.

gradyandrew wrote:FiveThirtyEight

Best Job of Making Himself Indispensable to a Team That Seemed Skeptical: Immanuel Quickley

For some reason, the Knicks for a while seemed intent on finding someone, anyone, who could play ahead of Quickley. That was true during his rookie season, when they traded for Derrick Rose while Elfrid Payton was clearly struggling as the starting point guard. It was true last season, when they started Alec Burks at the point for most of the year after Kemba Walker washed out of Tom Thibodeau’s rotation. And it was even true this season, when they spent the first portion of the year giving Quickley even fewer minutes than he got in his first two NBA seasons.

The Knicks have really made it difficult for Quickley. After a killer rookie year, they went ahead and drafted two guards - McBride (a PG) and Grimes (a SG) to make sure he had two more to beat for PT. And then they put in the nail in the coffin by signing Brunson.

But in spite all of this, he always ends up with like 25mpg.

I think the Knicks have had concerns that he was a tweener - and interestingly, a shooter who hasn't actually shot well since his rookie year. His arsenal of 30ft 3pt shots and floaters from everywhere inside the arc was a bit strange - it's like he didn't know how to shoot a normal jumper nor could he take a normal layup/finger roll/anything with spin.

His offense has come around this year. He takes shots inside the paint like a normal player. He uses his speed and shiftiness to probe the defense and now that they can't just defend the floater (ie just stay in front of him) he's dramatically more dangerous. This has come at the detriment of his FT% (I guess he's tired from all of the lateral movement and dribbling!).

technomaster wrote:

gradyandrew wrote:FiveThirtyEight

Best Job of Making Himself Indispensable to a Team That Seemed Skeptical: Immanuel Quickley

For some reason, the Knicks for a while seemed intent on finding someone, anyone, who could play ahead of Quickley. That was true during his rookie season, when they traded for Derrick Rose while Elfrid Payton was clearly struggling as the starting point guard. It was true last season, when they started Alec Burks at the point for most of the year after Kemba Walker washed out of Tom Thibodeau’s rotation. And it was even true this season, when they spent the first portion of the year giving Quickley even fewer minutes than he got in his first two NBA seasons.

The Knicks have really made it difficult for Quickley. After a killer rookie year, they went ahead and drafted two guards - McBride (a PG) and Grimes (a SG) to make sure he had two more to beat for PT. And then they put in the nail in the coffin by signing Brunson.

But in spite all of this, he always ends up with like 25mpg.

I think the Knicks have had concerns that he was a tweener - and interestingly, a shooter who hasn't actually shot well since his rookie year. His arsenal of 30ft 3pt shots and floaters from everywhere inside the arc was a bit strange - it's like he didn't know how to shoot a normal jumper nor could he take a normal layup/finger roll/anything with spin.

His offense has come around this year. He takes shots inside the paint like a normal player. He uses his speed and shiftiness to probe the defense and now that they can't just defend the floater (ie just stay in front of him) he's dramatically more dangerous. This has come at the detriment of his FT% (I guess he's tired from all of the lateral movement and dribbling!).

I feel wildly positive about Grimes/IQ as top flight rotation guys for years to come

gradyandrew wrote:

Nalod wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:Totally disagree.
Since day one as a 21 year he earned 20 minutes a game with a coach with affinity for vets.
He also shot 38% from three. Made an impact as soon as he came in the game.
Second year he earned more minutes but was asked to be the lead PG in second year. Too much imho. Despite that he had a decent year. The truth of the matter is he was put in a bad position.
Some expected too much. Not on him
This year, in only his third year he is a candidate for 6tj man, is a big reason why we are playing well. Disagree that there were any concerns about his shot, dribbling or being dependent on contact. He had all the tools and the only question was how much trust and time he would be given.
Rewarding Thibs for doing so this year.

1. "Affinity" for guys that do their job. he did it. Thus he got minutes.
2. Lets be real, his defense needed improvement and playmaking. Too much too soon? Not if your a professional. Rules change mattered. What drew fouls now caused them. He had to adjust.
Too much? He had to learn it, think it, then be instinctive.
3. This year he proved it.

On him or not, it is what it is. Blame don't matter.
Others in front of him. He had to prove his worth.
The notion that he "deserves" is not what Im talking about. He earns it.
I know its hard to keep RJ out of this convo but we talking two different players, strengths and weaknesses. Some feel RJ has had a more privileged knick experience where poor orphaned IQ had to scrounge for every morsal. RJ waltz's in with is Duke air of superiority and starts right away while others fight for morsals!
Poor OBI last year was denied as teh big bad grumpy randle was greedily taking food from Obi's mouth.
This is how it comes off from some fans. That Thibs holds back these kids.

Now IQ is Manu Ginobli? Not sure Im quite there but I love what this team is doing.
Its all a work in progress. Even IQ, he had bumps the start of the season and he has earned a place in Thibs rotation and in his heart. That is a massive compliment.
I don't suppose RJ needs to be punished but his minutes are down and Jhart is bring the defensive tenacity that Thibs needs to close out games. His coach says what he brings is "indispensable".

I am just going to repost what I wrote two pages ago because it seems relevant to your conversation:

Oh, and let's give a shout out for Thibs vision in keeping IQ more or less in the same role since day one. I really thought IQ should have been starting last season since December. Thibs stuck to his guns and we're reaping the benefits of it now. IQ is the Knicks Manu.

I think starting is over valued in the media. The trick is to have 2 of your top 3 on the court at all times and finish games with your best guys.
Having IQ come off the bench is way more suited because of his uptempo style. Games always start at slow so you are better off having a taller team that kind grind it out and then bringing in speedier guys once the players get warmed up. We should really be appreciating Thibs ability to plan 3 years in the future and having a stable rotation rather than changing rotations night in and out.

Good take.
Im not sure that what is happening now is what happens in the future. We are structured to make a trade. Young players are inconsistent and contracts matter.
We love to guess about things on these pages and impatient to some extent.
In time it all gets answered.
Its part of the fun, is it not?

martin wrote:The one thing I think IQ and even Mitch has done that Obi is still lacking in is adding to his body. Obi seems like the same physical specimen he was coming out of college whereas IQ, Mitch have transformed to a stronger version of themselves without losing too much in the quickness department

Tweet was deleted or there was problem with the URL:

https://twitter.com/Tom_Piccolo/status/1631322644531359745

Despite missing a dunk I thought Obi had a semi break out game yesterday. What does he do when shots go up? Yesterday was the first time I remember him leaking out for the break all season. Maybe he has been boxing out this year and so he's lost a lot of those easy attempts. I don't know if I ever saw anyone get as many quality looks as Obi rookie year. It looked like he should be shooting 70%. Kind of weird after his big break out at the end of last season.

Nalod wrote:

Rookie wrote:

BigDaddyG wrote:

martin wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:Last year I thought Brunson might be valued as a max contract or close. He didn’t get it but in retrospect he was worthy.
I think the same thing is happening with Iq. He’s a burgeoning star two way guard. Won’t a team try to pay up to get him— can the Knicks even match? What a turn around by the way. At points he was a Mendoza line player. Always tough but Mendoza like.

IQ on rookie contract. They can extend him 4 years this summer OR he plays the year out and can sign a 5 year deal. He would be a RFA after this summer (if he doesn't sign) and Knicks could match any offer by another team.

I think he will sign 4 year extension this summer for under the $100M mark.

4 years/$76-$80M? Sounds about right. But it only takes one team to throw things out of wack.

There is no way he gets less than Barrett money. He is a more valuable player. Just look who is in the game at the end.

Objectively what is now is not what might be. This lineup works now, FOR NOW. Trying to piece the puzzle of the future is never easy for a fan. IQ is doing great but he does not have the body of work to warrant 20mil. Barrett need not be in the convo for IQ’s money. Its different player, position and Barretts 3 prior years of improvement.
I see IQ as a 15-18mm player. And yes, if another team sees it different then thats another story perhaps.

EF’s contract is a trade asset for next year. So is Grimes or IQ and with a pick your now in the conversation for a “star”. Who that is I cannot see.

Knicks are. Young, have picks, doing well, have a good base and are prime for a consolidation deal. Where is RJ in the conversation? I don’t know. I do know that this FO is professional and patient. Remember when Knicks were 3 under and Cavs came to town and Thibs was rumored on the hot seat? One month in and fans were freaking out.
I don’t know if RJ is a good fit going forward and his play is effected by Randle and Brunsons ascension.

My preference is to rehab him and if he is a knick going forward so be it. If he is part of a big trade, then let the cards fall as they may. Fact is he is playing under 30 min now and team is winning. JHart was a great add.

Be honest, few if any saw that coming. Its why fans suck at pretend GM. Except for NYKmentality who is flying high!

Barrett is not a good fit with Brunson and Randle. We don't need another high usage player looking for 20 shots in the starting line-up. Try to move him for OG.

GustavBahler wrote:

gradyandrew wrote:

martin wrote:The one thing I think IQ and even Mitch has done that Obi is still lacking in is adding to his body. Obi seems like the same physical specimen he was coming out of college whereas IQ, Mitch have transformed to a stronger version of themselves without losing too much in the quickness department

Tweet was deleted or there was problem with the URL:

https://twitter.com/Tom_Piccolo/status/1631322644531359745

Despite missing a dunk I thought Obi had a semi break out game yesterday. What does he do when shots go up? Yesterday was the first time I remember him leaking out for the break all season. Maybe he has been boxing out this year and so he's lost a lot of those easy attempts. I don't know if I ever saw anyone get as many quality looks as Obi rookie year. It looked like he should be shooting 70%. Kind of weird after his big break out at the end of last season.

Obi might not be as fast, or explosive with more bulk. Obi's biggest issue IMO is hesitation. There is a very brief window to take it to the rim (without a lot of dribbling) before a defender is locked in.

When he shows more of an ability to be "off to the races" as soon as he touches the ball, in a halfcourt set. I believe Obi will be on his way to becoming the player we hoped he would be.

Exactly. Obi’s game is running in transition to go in for the dunk or layup. He will never be a straight up post player who plays bullyball with a low center of gravity like Randle. That’s not what he’s suited for

Jmpasq wrote:

Nalod wrote:

Rookie wrote:

BigDaddyG wrote:

martin wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:Last year I thought Brunson might be valued as a max contract or close. He didn’t get it but in retrospect he was worthy.
I think the same thing is happening with Iq. He’s a burgeoning star two way guard. Won’t a team try to pay up to get him— can the Knicks even match? What a turn around by the way. At points he was a Mendoza line player. Always tough but Mendoza like.

IQ on rookie contract. They can extend him 4 years this summer OR he plays the year out and can sign a 5 year deal. He would be a RFA after this summer (if he doesn't sign) and Knicks could match any offer by another team.

I think he will sign 4 year extension this summer for under the $100M mark.

4 years/$76-$80M? Sounds about right. But it only takes one team to throw things out of wack.

There is no way he gets less than Barrett money. He is a more valuable player. Just look who is in the game at the end.

Objectively what is now is not what might be. This lineup works now, FOR NOW. Trying to piece the puzzle of the future is never easy for a fan. IQ is doing great but he does not have the body of work to warrant 20mil. Barrett need not be in the convo for IQ’s money. Its different player, position and Barretts 3 prior years of improvement.
I see IQ as a 15-18mm player. And yes, if another team sees it different then thats another story perhaps.

EF’s contract is a trade asset for next year. So is Grimes or IQ and with a pick your now in the conversation for a “star”. Who that is I cannot see.

Knicks are. Young, have picks, doing well, have a good base and are prime for a consolidation deal. Where is RJ in the conversation? I don’t know. I do know that this FO is professional and patient. Remember when Knicks were 3 under and Cavs came to town and Thibs was rumored on the hot seat? One month in and fans were freaking out.
I don’t know if RJ is a good fit going forward and his play is effected by Randle and Brunsons ascension.

My preference is to rehab him and if he is a knick going forward so be it. If he is part of a big trade, then let the cards fall as they may. Fact is he is playing under 30 min now and team is winning. JHart was a great add.

Be honest, few if any saw that coming. Its why fans suck at pretend GM. Except for NYKmentality who is flying high!

Barrett is not a good fit with Brunson and Randle. We don't need another high usage player looking for 20 shots in the starting line-up. Try to move him for OG.

I could be wrong, but isn't there reports he wants to be a higher usage guy looking for 20 shots a game?