TPercy wrote:Why was he fired?

Sinix wrote:

TPercy wrote:Why was he fired?

No official word but it's clear he was going to make more moves for bad contracts without a committment that Lebron is staying past this year. I think Gilbert doesn't like that and he's attempting to take the franchise back from Lebron unless Lebron signs to stay longer.

TPercy wrote:

Sinix wrote:

TPercy wrote:Why was he fired?

No official word but it's clear he was going to make more moves for bad contracts without a committment that Lebron is staying past this year. I think Gilbert doesn't like that and he's attempting to take the franchise back from Lebron unless Lebron signs to stay longer.

Ah so from what you and crush are saying is that he likes giving bad contracts

He was all in to win a 'chip, which he did, as well as put together a team that made 3 straight finals appearances...I'm sure if Lebron didn't come back, they would have rebuilt that roster with Wiggins and Kyrie...

Sinix wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

Sinix wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

Sinix wrote:

Chandler wrote:

Sinix wrote:He's most known for drafting Anthony Bennet and the large contracts he's given to lebrons CAA buddies.

Now that I think about it, that's why he might likely get the job. Without Phil, CAA creeps back into power with the Knicks.

Expect some sh-tty contracts for CAA guys going forward. But hey, we'll be liked around the league now right?

Are u sure about Bennet? He wasn't GM then.

Guess I'm wrong about that one, griffin came in half a season later.

Yeah, he actually traded away Bennet (and Wiggins) for Love. He was 2nd in exec of the year voting that year. I don't know anything about his philosophy but he can't be more out of touch than Phil. I'd rather have Ujiri though.

Was Love for Wiggins even a good move? Cavs would be in much better position with Wiggins right now imo.

No one really has anything they can point to and say, that's Griffins fingerprints all over that and he did a great job.

I see a Cavs team right now with a ton of overpriced contracts, lack of talent and no draft picks. No thank you to that.

To me it was an excellent deal and they'd be much worse off with Wiggins chucking. This really depends on whether you look at the volume stats (PPG, rpg, etc) that GMs favored until about 10 years ago or the modern analytics though.

But Kevin Love took less shots that Wiggins this year with worse efficiency. You don't think Wiggins efficiency would increase plying with Lebron?

Bonn1997 wrote:

Sinix wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

Sinix wrote:

Chandler wrote:

Sinix wrote:He's most known for drafting Anthony Bennet and the large contracts he's given to lebrons CAA buddies.

Now that I think about it, that's why he might likely get the job. Without Phil, CAA creeps back into power with the Knicks.

Expect some sh-tty contracts for CAA guys going forward. But hey, we'll be liked around the league now right?

Are u sure about Bennet? He wasn't GM then.

Guess I'm wrong about that one, griffin came in half a season later.

Yeah, he actually traded away Bennet (and Wiggins) for Love. He was 2nd in exec of the year voting that year. I don't know anything about his philosophy but he can't be more out of touch than Phil. I'd rather have Ujiri though.

Was Love for Wiggins even a good move? Cavs would be in much better position with Wiggins right now imo.

No one really has anything they can point to and say, that's Griffins fingerprints all over that and he did a great job.

I see a Cavs team right now with a ton of overpriced contracts, lack of talent and no draft picks. No thank you to that.

To me it was an excellent deal and they'd be much worse off with Wiggins chucking. This really depends on whether you look at the volume stats (PPG, rpg, etc) that GMs favored until about 10 years ago or the modern analytics though.

Not just stats but fit. Love complements Lebron's game better. Better rebounding and outside shooting

Red Auerbach used to say team chemistry is like having a 6th man on the court.

Chandler wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

Sinix wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

Sinix wrote:

Chandler wrote:

Sinix wrote:He's most known for drafting Anthony Bennet and the large contracts he's given to lebrons CAA buddies.

Now that I think about it, that's why he might likely get the job. Without Phil, CAA creeps back into power with the Knicks.

Expect some sh-tty contracts for CAA guys going forward. But hey, we'll be liked around the league now right?

Are u sure about Bennet? He wasn't GM then.

Guess I'm wrong about that one, griffin came in half a season later.

Yeah, he actually traded away Bennet (and Wiggins) for Love. He was 2nd in exec of the year voting that year. I don't know anything about his philosophy but he can't be more out of touch than Phil. I'd rather have Ujiri though.

Was Love for Wiggins even a good move? Cavs would be in much better position with Wiggins right now imo.

No one really has anything they can point to and say, that's Griffins fingerprints all over that and he did a great job.

I see a Cavs team right now with a ton of overpriced contracts, lack of talent and no draft picks. No thank you to that.

To me it was an excellent deal and they'd be much worse off with Wiggins chucking. This really depends on whether you look at the volume stats (PPG, rpg, etc) that GMs favored until about 10 years ago or the modern analytics though.

Not just stats but fit. Love complements Lebron's game better. Better rebounding and outside shooting

Red Auerbach used to say team chemistry is like having a 6th man on the court.

Bonn1997 wrote:

Sinix wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

Sinix wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

Sinix wrote:

Chandler wrote:

Sinix wrote:He's most known for drafting Anthony Bennet and the large contracts he's given to lebrons CAA buddies.

Now that I think about it, that's why he might likely get the job. Without Phil, CAA creeps back into power with the Knicks.

Expect some sh-tty contracts for CAA guys going forward. But hey, we'll be liked around the league now right?

Are u sure about Bennet? He wasn't GM then.

Guess I'm wrong about that one, griffin came in half a season later.

Yeah, he actually traded away Bennet (and Wiggins) for Love. He was 2nd in exec of the year voting that year. I don't know anything about his philosophy but he can't be more out of touch than Phil. I'd rather have Ujiri though.

Was Love for Wiggins even a good move? Cavs would be in much better position with Wiggins right now imo.

No one really has anything they can point to and say, that's Griffins fingerprints all over that and he did a great job.

I see a Cavs team right now with a ton of overpriced contracts, lack of talent and no draft picks. No thank you to that.

To me it was an excellent deal and they'd be much worse off with Wiggins chucking. This really depends on whether you look at the volume stats (PPG, rpg, etc) that GMs favored until about 10 years ago or the modern analytics though.

But Kevin Love took less shots that Wiggins this year with worse efficiency. You don't think Wiggins efficiency would increase plying with Lebron?

And to me, Wiggins is so bad that it really doesn't matter. He's not going to have an astronomical increase in efficiency with Lebron. I don't think anyone has. And 538 called Wiggins the worst defender in the league. Whoever he was guarding actually shot the same for the season whether Wiggins was guarding him vs. wide open. Wiggins guarding you is statistically the same as having no defender! I know people like to mock Love's defense but he's improved a lot and statistically is nowhere close to Wiggins.
https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/the-nba-haters-ball/

I don't know, I find it hard to call a guy in his 3rd season scoring 24 a game on pretty decent efficiency 'so bad'. That's taking it a bit far.

I don't know much about Wiggins defense but I know Love's isn't anything to write home about.

Maybe if the Cavs had another weapon like him at forward, Durant has to focus on him a lot and it tires him out. Love camping out the 3 point line keeps Durants legs fresh.

Sinix wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

Sinix wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

Sinix wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

Sinix wrote:

Chandler wrote:

Sinix wrote:He's most known for drafting Anthony Bennet and the large contracts he's given to lebrons CAA buddies.

Now that I think about it, that's why he might likely get the job. Without Phil, CAA creeps back into power with the Knicks.

Expect some sh-tty contracts for CAA guys going forward. But hey, we'll be liked around the league now right?

Are u sure about Bennet? He wasn't GM then.

Guess I'm wrong about that one, griffin came in half a season later.

Yeah, he actually traded away Bennet (and Wiggins) for Love. He was 2nd in exec of the year voting that year. I don't know anything about his philosophy but he can't be more out of touch than Phil. I'd rather have Ujiri though.

Was Love for Wiggins even a good move? Cavs would be in much better position with Wiggins right now imo.

No one really has anything they can point to and say, that's Griffins fingerprints all over that and he did a great job.

I see a Cavs team right now with a ton of overpriced contracts, lack of talent and no draft picks. No thank you to that.

To me it was an excellent deal and they'd be much worse off with Wiggins chucking. This really depends on whether you look at the volume stats (PPG, rpg, etc) that GMs favored until about 10 years ago or the modern analytics though.

But Kevin Love took less shots that Wiggins this year with worse efficiency. You don't think Wiggins efficiency would increase plying with Lebron?

And to me, Wiggins is so bad that it really doesn't matter. He's not going to have an astronomical increase in efficiency with Lebron. I don't think anyone has. And 538 called Wiggins the worst defender in the league. Whoever he was guarding actually shot the same for the season whether Wiggins was guarding him vs. wide open. Wiggins guarding you is statistically the same as having no defender! I know people like to mock Love's defense but he's improved a lot and statistically is nowhere close to Wiggins.
https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/the-nba-haters-ball/

I don't know, I find it hard to call a guy in his 3rd season scoring 24 a game on pretty decent efficiency 'so bad'. That's taking it a bit far.

I don't know much about Wiggins defense but I know Love's isn't anything to write home about.

newyorknewyork wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

Sinix wrote:

Chandler wrote:

Sinix wrote:He's most known for drafting Anthony Bennet and the large contracts he's given to lebrons CAA buddies.

Now that I think about it, that's why he might likely get the job. Without Phil, CAA creeps back into power with the Knicks.

Expect some sh-tty contracts for CAA guys going forward. But hey, we'll be liked around the league now right?

Are u sure about Bennet? He wasn't GM then.

Guess I'm wrong about that one, griffin came in half a season later.

Yeah, he actually traded away Bennet (and Wiggins) for Love. He was 2nd in exec of the year voting that year. I don't know anything about his philosophy but he can't be more out of touch than Phil. I'd rather have Ujiri though.

Ujiri will definitely cost the knicks a pick or 2, while griff perhaps can package a pick for a very solid young player.

I've seen different reports about whether Ujiri can just walk. Having the right president is more important than 1 draft pick anyway, and I'm sure any pick would be protected. What do you mean Griffin can package a pick?

He seems like he has the win now attitude, or maybe that was because labron insisted the upgrade for love. either way, he doesn't seem like the rebuild through the draft type.

He's not the sharpest tool in the shed, but he would have some moveable pieces a little cap, and some picks he could juggle for some real players.

Oh I thought you meant getting picks. You want to go back to starphucking?!

I want to go back to winning, and I don't see how you can do that without talent. I certainly don't want the d league roster or 12 bench players and 1 star.

Was love a starphuck trade, would trading for haywood be a starphuck. If you target stars on the rise in there mid 20's, I don't see how that's starphucking. Now if your talking dwade, rondo, cp3 types..thats starphucking for me

Targeting legit stars isn't starphucking my view. Overpaying for more Melos and Roses is though. I know we'll disagree on whether Melo and Rose are legit stars but you asked me my view. I think Love is a legit star or at least near star and I think little of Wiggins and Bennet. So that would not be starphucking to me.

Wiggins being traded for Love was Lebron's move. So we don't know if Griffin would have looked at it metrically the way you do. Wiggins also was traded before he ever played a game in the NBA. For all anyone knew he would be a Jimmy Butler-Paul George type of impact player. He def had/has the talent to be that.

Knicks1248 isn't looking at things metrically I can tell you that. If you really want to win then you collect as much assets as possible and then you cherry pick the trades you make with those assets and proven stars. While still being able to fall back on the left over assets you have. AKA playing with house money. Like the Celtics are doing. You don't trade for stars when your assets are bare and you have to trade the few assets you have in order to get that star. Then limit the ability to improve with that star. Just so Knicks1248 could feel happy about winning 48 games.

We need at least one more lotto pick to pair with KP,Willy,Frank. Then next off season with the money we didn't spend this year(16mil) and maybe the opt outs of KOQ, Melo, and the expiring of Kuz etc. We can then hit the FA market to ADD to KP, Willy, Frank, top 10 lotto pick with proven vets.

Bonn1997 wrote:

Sinix wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

Sinix wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

Sinix wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

Sinix wrote:

Chandler wrote:

Sinix wrote:He's most known for drafting Anthony Bennet and the large contracts he's given to lebrons CAA buddies.

Now that I think about it, that's why he might likely get the job. Without Phil, CAA creeps back into power with the Knicks.

Expect some sh-tty contracts for CAA guys going forward. But hey, we'll be liked around the league now right?

Are u sure about Bennet? He wasn't GM then.

Guess I'm wrong about that one, griffin came in half a season later.

Yeah, he actually traded away Bennet (and Wiggins) for Love. He was 2nd in exec of the year voting that year. I don't know anything about his philosophy but he can't be more out of touch than Phil. I'd rather have Ujiri though.

Was Love for Wiggins even a good move? Cavs would be in much better position with Wiggins right now imo.

No one really has anything they can point to and say, that's Griffins fingerprints all over that and he did a great job.

I see a Cavs team right now with a ton of overpriced contracts, lack of talent and no draft picks. No thank you to that.

To me it was an excellent deal and they'd be much worse off with Wiggins chucking. This really depends on whether you look at the volume stats (PPG, rpg, etc) that GMs favored until about 10 years ago or the modern analytics though.

But Kevin Love took less shots that Wiggins this year with worse efficiency. You don't think Wiggins efficiency would increase plying with Lebron?

And to me, Wiggins is so bad that it really doesn't matter. He's not going to have an astronomical increase in efficiency with Lebron. I don't think anyone has. And 538 called Wiggins the worst defender in the league. Whoever he was guarding actually shot the same for the season whether Wiggins was guarding him vs. wide open. Wiggins guarding you is statistically the same as having no defender! I know people like to mock Love's defense but he's improved a lot and statistically is nowhere close to Wiggins.
https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/the-nba-haters-ball/

I don't know, I find it hard to call a guy in his 3rd season scoring 24 a game on pretty decent efficiency 'so bad'. That's taking it a bit far.

I don't know much about Wiggins defense but I know Love's isn't anything to write home about.

Right, it just depends on what information you look at. I do think of Wiggins as a talented prospect and would take him for free but I wouldn't give up an all-star for him.

I was actually more impressed with Lavine than Wiggins eventhough Lavine has some awful defensive numbers too. If Lavine was healthy I would take him over Wiggins. I honestly think Minny should try to sell Wiggins to the highest bidder while he is still young and on a rookie deal.

Re: What if Wiggins played with Lebron

I think Wiggins best case scenario would be Wiggins be the Cavs version of Harrsion Barnes when he played for GSW. His usg would have been restricted and he would have taken a lot more easy and open shots which would have probably improved his efficiency. The problem is that even if Wiggins would have peformed like Barnes he would still not be as good as Love has been. So to me regardless of how you look at it the Love/Wiggins trade was a good one.