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What was the Knicks biggest mistake over the last ten years?


Author Poll
CrushAlot
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What was the Knicks biggest mistake over the last ten years?
Signing Amare despite his knee issues and not being able to insure his deal
Drafting Hill over DeRozan, Jennings, Teague, Holiday
Including a first round pick in the Bargs trade
Tyson Chandler trade
Hiring Mike D'Antoni over Mark Jackson
Trading Hill, Jeffries, and a first round pick for cap space to chase lbj
View Results


Author Thread
Knixkik
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8/17/2016  10:49 AM
jrodmc wrote:Incredible, the stupidity of hate. Yawn is absolutely correct.

Only in Melohate world can you offer up these brilliant responses, over and over again, for years:

1) Losing less than before "the Trade" is not as good as losing more before "the Trade".
2) Constantly talking about all the "assets" that were lost in "the Trade" without mentioning what Denver managed to become with all those "assets".
(Remember the world beaters Ujiri was going to turn that franchise into in just a few short years? Remember all that? WCF!!! Gallo, the legit All Star Stud!!! Moz, the project who was going to burn up the league!!! My Mayor, oh my Mayor!!!)
3) Constantly referring to LinLove. The loss of a two week wonder who became nothing more than a another shyte-covered rhoid that Melohaters with head firmly up their azzes can pine and moan for. Oh yeah, and ignore the fact he amounted to an overpaid journeyman who other franchises had to give up draft picks to dump. Who also never played in anything but the "jv season" for us. All the while whining about Melo's contracts and not seriously wondering if Lin's contract to back up Patrick Beverly and Toney Fuhucquing Douglas actually was, ridiculous.
4) Equating Melo with Starbury, at any level. Unblushingly.
5) Having warm, wet memories of Landry Fields and his parabola jumpshyte.
6) Getting to the second round or being at the top of the division are things not to speak of. Neither are scoring championships or franchise records. Tanking is, though.
7) Talking up Rashweed and Jkidd as true saviors of the franchise. Anything but Melo. And believe in your heart that this shows incredible BB IQ.
8) When all else fails, ignore rationality, and just say "Dolan".
9) Whining about all the All-Stars who don't, and never will have, the balls to come to NY to play, but would rather take their talents elsewhere. Usually with two other superfriends. And somehow this is Melo's fault. I guess a benefit of having your Melohating head up your azz, is you get incredible insights into the actual quality of other people's balls.
10) Posting pics of the Hibbert block (in the second round of the playoffs) and seriously thinking that's worse than any Barg's meme on the internet.

I applaud the dynamic duo's unswerving dedication to being the poster children for deranged Melohate. Somewhere, tkf is shedding tears of pride.

Continue to have a nice next 3 seasons fellas!

Nice work right here. Amazing how true all of this is. This is the knockout punch to any Melo argument.

AUTOADVERT
Nalod
Posts: 72112
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8/17/2016  10:57 AM
ChuckBuck wrote:
Nalod wrote:Eddy trade and the Marbury trade as corrective moves to undo the Ewing decline/trade was awful.
The picks we gave for eddy became Aldridge and Noah.
Then, the next opportunity was undoing that group which by directive of the owner had us dumping contracts on discount that we paid a premium for. Larry and Isiah could not do much with them, nor could MDA who I assume was a draw at the time and hope for Lebron.
The Amare and Melo show dictated a "Win now" assumption and that made the gamble for Bargs interesting. Bargs biggest crime at that time was he got hurt a lot. Im not defending him, but that move, like any other you have to go to that exact moment in time and look at the team, and the options available. We can look back with the benefit of hindsight and be all so brilliant about things.

Biggest mistake was abandoning what ever Scott Layden had in his head before he was fired. The team was awfully boring at the time but Layden was not making panic moves after the Dice Disaster. That I fully blame on Dolan. At the time it had some logic, but it was a stretch. Layden after year had his picks and expiring contracts. That moment in time was prime for rebuilding. It was rumored that the marbury deal was on Laydens desk and he did not want to do it. Its why he was fired mid season (remember, no body fires GM's mid season but knicks!!!)and then Isiah did the deal QUICK! That of course made firing Chaney (CLumsey) and when Isiah botched hiring Fratello, he turned to Wilkens at the last moment.

Thus, you have to go back 12 years and say that the moment Isiah was hired, it set upon series of events that had ramifications for years after. There is not eddy trade without Isiah (remember, the phat phuck was taking ephedra and the Bulls forbid hiim to play basketball!!! They were ready to retire him!!! So Isiah gave them 2 no. 1 picks unprotected!!!)

Again, go back in time and think of the how Eddy left the Bulls. The stupidity at that moment is of course magnified over time. But it was insane then as well.

Isiah has no bearing on Walsh's or Grunwald's or Phil's moves. Isiah didn't hire D'Antoni, didn't draft Jordan Hill, didn't make the Melo trade, the Bargnani trade, use his Amnesty too early on Billups instead of Amare, didn't choose to let Lin go, didn't trade Tyson Chandler for dog doo doo, didn't trade JR and Shump for the remnants of dog doo doo, and certainly didn't resign an aging injury prone player in Melo to another 5 years.

Isiah is cleansed on the Knicks side of things a long time ago....well not totally!

LIke I said.......

"It set upon a series of events that had ramifications for years after!"

YOu like to connect dots without really thinking about all that is entailed. I laid it out. You don't have to agree with it. You forget that Billips amnesty was all about getting Tyson, who had just come off a chip and had been playing great. The thought was it made Amare's job easier. It was logical. At the same time, Tyson has sucked since he left, so I don't know what great trade chip some think he was.
We ridded ourselves of Felton, had a look at early, Larkin and Jose was still better than Felton.
JR is a clown without Lebron. Shump was an expiring we were not going to sign.

I defend my thesis which is a stretch for you and not convenient for the simple dot connecting you like to do. One can even say that if Isiah was not so bad a whole lot of things would have been different!!!
This franchise went to hell when Isiah came in and got Marbury. From there it got worse. In a better world the knicks are a decent team and Lebron signs on to complete it. Big difference when you have Dolan and Wheelchair Walsh making a pitch about building then Riley who already had Wade.

Guess what Chuck, everyone knows Melo is a starphuch player who does not bring championships. What your trying to do is convince all that he should be made gone and get a mob mentality going. Think is, shyt don't work that way. We don't have a say. You also don't put together any logical pattern by which you can demonstrate how the team would have been better. You make assumptions that really cannot be substantiated except in theory and that was ok a few years ago, but its not relevant.

Best most of us have done is appreciate Melo as someone who grew up, is attempting to round out his game, and wants to live in NY.
We rooted for H20 and other over paid knicks before. Sometimes it don't work out.

dk7th
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8/17/2016  10:58 AM
meloshouldgo wrote:
NardDogNation wrote:
ChuckBuck wrote:
NardDogNation wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
ChuckBuck wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
ChuckBuck wrote:
dk7th wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
ChuckBuck wrote:Should be 2 options for Melo.

1)Trading all those picks and assets instead of waiting until he was a free agent in 2011

2)Resigning Melo to a 5 year Max contract with a No Trade Clause kicker instead of doing a proper rebuild

Another option that should be included is using the Amnesty provision on Chauncey Billups instead of saving it for Amare, but I guess that could be rolled up into the Tyson Chandler trade.

I can think of 25+ things worse than those 2, thats for sure.

maybe you can but that melo deal did not bring the knicks even within smelling distance of a conference finals, which would have justified the trade even to those like myself who hated it from the beginning, if only because we knew nothing would come of it.

and nothing has.

the main point is the article is rubbish for not even mentioning that transaction as a possibility for debate.

Exactly. What has the last 6 years of Melo sucking for the Knicks brought the franchise? Nothing but embarrassment and pain.

The only good thing about Melo sucking for the Knicks is his mediocrity has brought us KP. All by accident of course. If he even played close to the top 25 player he's supposed to be, we wouldn't even be in the lottery and players would flock to New York to get a chance to win a ring.

We made the playoffs 3 of those years, and won a playoff series. There is your answer. Is it a lot of success? NO. But more than we had experienced prior to him? Absolutely. Enjoy continuing to be the laughing stock of this board. You wear it well.

Uhhh...Hate to break it to you but half the teams in the NBA make the playoffs. Not an accomplishment by any means.

Just for reference, the Knicks made the playoffs with Stephon phucking Marbury. SO

Someone on this board has to speak the truth and stop sugarcoating mediocrity. Anyone actually happy about the Knicks the last 16 years, is living in denial about reality.

The last time the Knicks were truly relevant was when Jeff Van Gundy was still driving a Honda Civic as coach for the Knicks.

Me. Laughingstock? Sure, if you say so boss.

WINNING a playoff series is the sole accomplishment for this team in the past 10 years on the court. Melo carried that team. End of argument.

Knixkik for the winnnnnnnnn.....YES!


Really? What did he win?

The argument, silly.

Nope not even close. The question was what was the worst move. One playoff series win in the context of the long term of damage done by the Amare and two Melo contracts is the worst move ever. Would we have had more playoff wins without those contracts and by acquiring different players at different times. I think yes, you probably disagree. It's an argument we will never settle.

The premise of thread is stupid though.

this thread is a truly stupid contribution, meant to provoke and not in a good way. the writer is a turd.

knicks win 38-43 games in 16-17. rose MUST shoot no more than 14 shots per game, defer to kp6 + melo, and have a usage rate of less than 25%
dk7th
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8/17/2016  11:02 AM
Knixkik wrote:
ChuckBuck wrote:
NardDogNation wrote:
ChuckBuck wrote:
NardDogNation wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
ChuckBuck wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
ChuckBuck wrote:
dk7th wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
ChuckBuck wrote:Should be 2 options for Melo.

1)Trading all those picks and assets instead of waiting until he was a free agent in 2011

2)Resigning Melo to a 5 year Max contract with a No Trade Clause kicker instead of doing a proper rebuild

Another option that should be included is using the Amnesty provision on Chauncey Billups instead of saving it for Amare, but I guess that could be rolled up into the Tyson Chandler trade.

I can think of 25+ things worse than those 2, thats for sure.

maybe you can but that melo deal did not bring the knicks even within smelling distance of a conference finals, which would have justified the trade even to those like myself who hated it from the beginning, if only because we knew nothing would come of it.

and nothing has.

the main point is the article is rubbish for not even mentioning that transaction as a possibility for debate.

Exactly. What has the last 6 years of Melo sucking for the Knicks brought the franchise? Nothing but embarrassment and pain.

The only good thing about Melo sucking for the Knicks is his mediocrity has brought us KP. All by accident of course. If he even played close to the top 25 player he's supposed to be, we wouldn't even be in the lottery and players would flock to New York to get a chance to win a ring.

We made the playoffs 3 of those years, and won a playoff series. There is your answer. Is it a lot of success? NO. But more than we had experienced prior to him? Absolutely. Enjoy continuing to be the laughing stock of this board. You wear it well.

Uhhh...Hate to break it to you but half the teams in the NBA make the playoffs. Not an accomplishment by any means.

Just for reference, the Knicks made the playoffs with Stephon phucking Marbury. SO

Someone on this board has to speak the truth and stop sugarcoating mediocrity. Anyone actually happy about the Knicks the last 16 years, is living in denial about reality.

The last time the Knicks were truly relevant was when Jeff Van Gundy was still driving a Honda Civic as coach for the Knicks.

Me. Laughingstock? Sure, if you say so boss.

WINNING a playoff series is the sole accomplishment for this team in the past 10 years on the court. Melo carried that team. End of argument.

Knixkik for the winnnnnnnnn.....YES!


Really? What did he win?

The argument, silly.

Not really. Dumb argument, it's like saying his shyt stunk a little less. Still stinks,just like the Knicks the last 16 years.


Exactly right. I'm glad you finally get it. By saying his shyt stunk less, you are solidifying my view that there is no way anything to do with Melo can be associated with the worst moves of the past 10 years. In a world where most of our moves were bad, his proved to be at worst neutral and led to 3 years of extremely moderate success (meaning only a little success) in an era otherwise plagued with complete fsilure. If you are basing this on your expectations, thats a different argument. The name of this thread is worst move in the last 10 years, and i'm glad we can agree that Melo was not one of them (quite the opposite) and move on.

what were your expectations of a melo-entric knicks team, starting back in february 2011? are you saying melo never had a hand in his own destiny or fate? that it's on others and he is an innocent victim, a baby?

knicks win 38-43 games in 16-17. rose MUST shoot no more than 14 shots per game, defer to kp6 + melo, and have a usage rate of less than 25%
CrushAlot
Posts: 59764
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8/17/2016  11:03 AM
Knixkik wrote:
jrodmc wrote:Incredible, the stupidity of hate. Yawn is absolutely correct.

Only in Melohate world can you offer up these brilliant responses, over and over again, for years:

1) Losing less than before "the Trade" is not as good as losing more before "the Trade".
2) Constantly talking about all the "assets" that were lost in "the Trade" without mentioning what Denver managed to become with all those "assets".
(Remember the world beaters Ujiri was going to turn that franchise into in just a few short years? Remember all that? WCF!!! Gallo, the legit All Star Stud!!! Moz, the project who was going to burn up the league!!! My Mayor, oh my Mayor!!!)
3) Constantly referring to LinLove. The loss of a two week wonder who became nothing more than a another shyte-covered rhoid that Melohaters with head firmly up their azzes can pine and moan for. Oh yeah, and ignore the fact he amounted to an overpaid journeyman who other franchises had to give up draft picks to dump. Who also never played in anything but the "jv season" for us. All the while whining about Melo's contracts and not seriously wondering if Lin's contract to back up Patrick Beverly and Toney Fuhucquing Douglas actually was, ridiculous.
4) Equating Melo with Starbury, at any level. Unblushingly.
5) Having warm, wet memories of Landry Fields and his parabola jumpshyte.
6) Getting to the second round or being at the top of the division are things not to speak of. Neither are scoring championships or franchise records. Tanking is, though.
7) Talking up Rashweed and Jkidd as true saviors of the franchise. Anything but Melo. And believe in your heart that this shows incredible BB IQ.
8) When all else fails, ignore rationality, and just say "Dolan".
9) Whining about all the All-Stars who don't, and never will have, the balls to come to NY to play, but would rather take their talents elsewhere. Usually with two other superfriends. And somehow this is Melo's fault. I guess a benefit of having your Melohating head up your azz, is you get incredible insights into the actual quality of other people's balls.
10) Posting pics of the Hibbert block (in the second round of the playoffs) and seriously thinking that's worse than any Barg's meme on the internet.

I applaud the dynamic duo's unswerving dedication to being the poster children for deranged Melohate. Somewhere, tkf is shedding tears of pride.

Continue to have a nice next 3 seasons fellas!

Nice work right here. Amazing how true all of this is. This is the knockout punch to any Melo argument.

+1
I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
Knixkik
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8/17/2016  12:06 PM
dk7th wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
ChuckBuck wrote:
NardDogNation wrote:
ChuckBuck wrote:
NardDogNation wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
ChuckBuck wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
ChuckBuck wrote:
dk7th wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
ChuckBuck wrote:Should be 2 options for Melo.

1)Trading all those picks and assets instead of waiting until he was a free agent in 2011

2)Resigning Melo to a 5 year Max contract with a No Trade Clause kicker instead of doing a proper rebuild

Another option that should be included is using the Amnesty provision on Chauncey Billups instead of saving it for Amare, but I guess that could be rolled up into the Tyson Chandler trade.

I can think of 25+ things worse than those 2, thats for sure.

maybe you can but that melo deal did not bring the knicks even within smelling distance of a conference finals, which would have justified the trade even to those like myself who hated it from the beginning, if only because we knew nothing would come of it.

and nothing has.

the main point is the article is rubbish for not even mentioning that transaction as a possibility for debate.

Exactly. What has the last 6 years of Melo sucking for the Knicks brought the franchise? Nothing but embarrassment and pain.

The only good thing about Melo sucking for the Knicks is his mediocrity has brought us KP. All by accident of course. If he even played close to the top 25 player he's supposed to be, we wouldn't even be in the lottery and players would flock to New York to get a chance to win a ring.

We made the playoffs 3 of those years, and won a playoff series. There is your answer. Is it a lot of success? NO. But more than we had experienced prior to him? Absolutely. Enjoy continuing to be the laughing stock of this board. You wear it well.

Uhhh...Hate to break it to you but half the teams in the NBA make the playoffs. Not an accomplishment by any means.

Just for reference, the Knicks made the playoffs with Stephon phucking Marbury. SO

Someone on this board has to speak the truth and stop sugarcoating mediocrity. Anyone actually happy about the Knicks the last 16 years, is living in denial about reality.

The last time the Knicks were truly relevant was when Jeff Van Gundy was still driving a Honda Civic as coach for the Knicks.

Me. Laughingstock? Sure, if you say so boss.

WINNING a playoff series is the sole accomplishment for this team in the past 10 years on the court. Melo carried that team. End of argument.

Knixkik for the winnnnnnnnn.....YES!


Really? What did he win?

The argument, silly.

Not really. Dumb argument, it's like saying his shyt stunk a little less. Still stinks,just like the Knicks the last 16 years.


Exactly right. I'm glad you finally get it. By saying his shyt stunk less, you are solidifying my view that there is no way anything to do with Melo can be associated with the worst moves of the past 10 years. In a world where most of our moves were bad, his proved to be at worst neutral and led to 3 years of extremely moderate success (meaning only a little success) in an era otherwise plagued with complete fsilure. If you are basing this on your expectations, thats a different argument. The name of this thread is worst move in the last 10 years, and i'm glad we can agree that Melo was not one of them (quite the opposite) and move on.

what were your expectations of a melo-entric knicks team, starting back in february 2011? are you saying melo never had a hand in his own destiny or fate? that it's on others and he is an innocent victim, a baby?

He had a hand in it. His ego created a domino effect in the Lin situation where we let him walk for free, and i wish sometimes he would have kept his mouth shut about what the team needed and wanting to lead the Knicks to a title and let his play dictate whatever results we had. He created our expectation of this team and him, in a sense, and left us disappointed with the results. I don't think Melo is a victim, but i don't think he has had luck of other stars either. I respect him for not taking the easy road and trying to build this thing in new york, but I hold him accountable for the problems he caused. I don't blame him for wanting his contract settled and forcing his way to NY via trade, and i will always believe the deal was a plus for us as we desperately needed a face of the franchise and we were stuck with what turned out to be a bad Amare contract for 4 years. Nothing we dealt for Melo became a success and the Nuggets were unable to successfully rebuild with any pieces that were a direct result of the trade. My expectation were higher than the success we had, but i don't blame Melo for the quick decline of Amare and the poor front office decisions.

ChuckBuck
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8/17/2016  12:12 PM
jrodmc wrote:Incredible, the stupidity of hate. Yawn is absolutely correct.

Only in Melohate world can you offer up these brilliant responses, over and over again, for years:

1) Losing less than before "the Trade" is not as good as losing more before "the Trade".
2) Constantly talking about all the "assets" that were lost in "the Trade" without mentioning what Denver managed to become with all those "assets".
(Remember the world beaters Ujiri was going to turn that franchise into in just a few short years? Remember all that? WCF!!! Gallo, the legit All Star Stud!!! Moz, the project who was going to burn up the league!!! My Mayor, oh my Mayor!!!)
3) Constantly referring to LinLove. The loss of a two week wonder who became nothing more than a another shyte-covered rhoid that Melohaters with head firmly up their azzes can pine and moan for. Oh yeah, and ignore the fact he amounted to an overpaid journeyman who other franchises had to give up draft picks to dump. Who also never played in anything but the "jv season" for us. All the while whining about Melo's contracts and not seriously wondering if Lin's contract to back up Patrick Beverly and Toney Fuhucquing Douglas actually was, ridiculous.
4) Equating Melo with Starbury, at any level. Unblushingly.
5) Having warm, wet memories of Landry Fields and his parabola jumpshyte.
6) Getting to the second round or being at the top of the division are things not to speak of. Neither are scoring championships or franchise records. Tanking is, though.
7) Talking up Rashweed and Jkidd as true saviors of the franchise. Anything but Melo. And believe in your heart that this shows incredible BB IQ.
8) When all else fails, ignore rationality, and just say "Dolan".
9) Whining about all the All-Stars who don't, and never will have, the balls to come to NY to play, but would rather take their talents elsewhere. Usually with two other superfriends. And somehow this is Melo's fault. I guess a benefit of having your Melohating head up your azz, is you get incredible insights into the actual quality of other people's balls.
10) Posting pics of the Hibbert block (in the second round of the playoffs) and seriously thinking that's worse than any Barg's meme on the internet.

I applaud the dynamic duo's unswerving dedication to being the poster children for deranged Melohate. Somewhere, tkf is shedding tears of pride.

Continue to have a nice next 3 seasons fellas!

-Zillion Melo Emojis

SupremeCommander
Posts: 34074
Alba Posts: 35
Joined: 4/28/2006
Member: #1127

8/17/2016  12:20 PM
CrushAlot wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
jrodmc wrote:Incredible, the stupidity of hate. Yawn is absolutely correct.

Only in Melohate world can you offer up these brilliant responses, over and over again, for years:

1) Losing less than before "the Trade" is not as good as losing more before "the Trade".
2) Constantly talking about all the "assets" that were lost in "the Trade" without mentioning what Denver managed to become with all those "assets".
(Remember the world beaters Ujiri was going to turn that franchise into in just a few short years? Remember all that? WCF!!! Gallo, the legit All Star Stud!!! Moz, the project who was going to burn up the league!!! My Mayor, oh my Mayor!!!)
3) Constantly referring to LinLove. The loss of a two week wonder who became nothing more than a another shyte-covered rhoid that Melohaters with head firmly up their azzes can pine and moan for. Oh yeah, and ignore the fact he amounted to an overpaid journeyman who other franchises had to give up draft picks to dump. Who also never played in anything but the "jv season" for us. All the while whining about Melo's contracts and not seriously wondering if Lin's contract to back up Patrick Beverly and Toney Fuhucquing Douglas actually was, ridiculous.
4) Equating Melo with Starbury, at any level. Unblushingly.
5) Having warm, wet memories of Landry Fields and his parabola jumpshyte.
6) Getting to the second round or being at the top of the division are things not to speak of. Neither are scoring championships or franchise records. Tanking is, though.
7) Talking up Rashweed and Jkidd as true saviors of the franchise. Anything but Melo. And believe in your heart that this shows incredible BB IQ.
8) When all else fails, ignore rationality, and just say "Dolan".
9) Whining about all the All-Stars who don't, and never will have, the balls to come to NY to play, but would rather take their talents elsewhere. Usually with two other superfriends. And somehow this is Melo's fault. I guess a benefit of having your Melohating head up your azz, is you get incredible insights into the actual quality of other people's balls.
10) Posting pics of the Hibbert block (in the second round of the playoffs) and seriously thinking that's worse than any Barg's meme on the internet.

I applaud the dynamic duo's unswerving dedication to being the poster children for deranged Melohate. Somewhere, tkf is shedding tears of pride.

Continue to have a nice next 3 seasons fellas!

Nice work right here. Amazing how true all of this is. This is the knockout punch to any Melo argument.

+1

+2

DLeethal wrote: Lol Rick needs a safe space
HofstraBBall
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8/17/2016  1:16 PM
ChuckBuck wrote:
dk7th wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
ChuckBuck wrote:Should be 2 options for Melo.

1)Trading all those picks and assets instead of waiting until he was a free agent in 2011

2)Resigning Melo to a 5 year Max contract with a No Trade Clause kicker instead of doing a proper rebuild

Another option that should be included is using the Amnesty provision on Chauncey Billups instead of saving it for Amare, but I guess that could be rolled up into the Tyson Chandler trade.

I can think of 25+ things worse than those 2, thats for sure.

maybe you can but that melo deal did not bring the knicks even within smelling distance of a conference finals, which would have justified the trade even to those like myself who hated it from the beginning, if only because we knew nothing would come of it.

and nothing has.

the main point is the article is rubbish for not even mentioning that transaction as a possibility for debate.

Exactly. What has the last 6 years of Melo sucking for the Knicks brought the franchise? Nothing but embarrassment and pain.

The only good thing about Melo sucking for the Knicks is his mediocrity has brought us KP. All by accident of course. If he even played close to the top 25 player he's supposed to be, we wouldn't even be in the lottery and players would flock to New York to get a chance to win a ring.

Chuck and DK dreaming about what could have been.

'Knicks focus should be on players that have grown up playing soccer or cricket' - Triplethreat 8/28/2020
HofstraBBall
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Member: #6192

8/17/2016  1:29 PM    LAST EDITED: 8/17/2016  1:34 PM
What was the Knicks biggest mistake over the last ten years?


Signing Amare despite his knee issues and not being able to insure his deal

Drafting Hill over DeRozan, Jennings, Teague, Holiday

Including a first round pick in the Bargs trade

Tyson Chandler trade

Hiring Mike D'Antoni over Mark Jackson

Trading Hill, Jeffries, and a first round pick for cap space to chase lbj

Its a toss up between signing Amare and giving up a First rounder for Bags. Either way, you were taking on well known health issues, a proven deficient player and giving up way too much. Amare's contract/injury handcuffed any possible deal to upgrade. Bags was what he was, a declining player with many proven weaknesses. Giving up that 1st rounder prevented a good addition to KP or a very important asset to use in a trade for a key piece. Think the other choices are more hindsight or hard to prove scenarios that we would never be able to prove a better outcome. Lets hope we start a thread in ten years that is titled " What was the Knicks biggest contribution to their big turn around"

'Knicks focus should be on players that have grown up playing soccer or cricket' - Triplethreat 8/28/2020
HofstraBBall
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8/17/2016  1:52 PM    LAST EDITED: 8/17/2016  1:55 PM
SupremeCommander wrote:
CrushAlot wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
jrodmc wrote:Incredible, the stupidity of hate. Yawn is absolutely correct.

Only in Melohate world can you offer up these brilliant responses, over and over again, for years:

1) Losing less than before "the Trade" is not as good as losing more before "the Trade".
2) Constantly talking about all the "assets" that were lost in "the Trade" without mentioning what Denver managed to become with all those "assets".
(Remember the world beaters Ujiri was going to turn that franchise into in just a few short years? Remember all that? WCF!!! Gallo, the legit All Star Stud!!! Moz, the project who was going to burn up the league!!! My Mayor, oh my Mayor!!!)
3) Constantly referring to LinLove. The loss of a two week wonder who became nothing more than a another shyte-covered rhoid that Melohaters with head firmly up their azzes can pine and moan for. Oh yeah, and ignore the fact he amounted to an overpaid journeyman who other franchises had to give up draft picks to dump. Who also never played in anything but the "jv season" for us. All the while whining about Melo's contracts and not seriously wondering if Lin's contract to back up Patrick Beverly and Toney Fuhucquing Douglas actually was, ridiculous.
4) Equating Melo with Starbury, at any level. Unblushingly.
5) Having warm, wet memories of Landry Fields and his parabola jumpshyte.
6) Getting to the second round or being at the top of the division are things not to speak of. Neither are scoring championships or franchise records. Tanking is, though.
7) Talking up Rashweed and Jkidd as true saviors of the franchise. Anything but Melo. And believe in your heart that this shows incredible BB IQ.
8) When all else fails, ignore rationality, and just say "Dolan".
9) Whining about all the All-Stars who don't, and never will have, the balls to come to NY to play, but would rather take their talents elsewhere. Usually with two other superfriends. And somehow this is Melo's fault. I guess a benefit of having your Melohating head up your azz, is you get incredible insights into the actual quality of other people's balls.
10) Posting pics of the Hibbert block (in the second round of the playoffs) and seriously thinking that's worse than any Barg's meme on the internet.

I applaud the dynamic duo's unswerving dedication to being the poster children for deranged Melohate. Somewhere, tkf is shedding tears of pride.

Continue to have a nice next 3 seasons fellas!

Nice work right here. Amazing how true all of this is. This is the knockout punch to any Melo argument.

+1

+2

10a.) After posting block, hide box score from game 6 in which he scored 39 and everyone else ran to hide. (7a. lose Jkids stats from game 6)

http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/201305180IND.html

11. Ignore long list of excellent Melo team mates that should have been enough for him to win a chip:
Ray Felton, Pablo, Chris Copeland, One legged Kenyon, Q Acy, Lou, Jose, Cole, Shane Larkin, Cleanthony, Timmy Hardaway, Grant, Gallo, Jason Smith, Ricky Ledo, Travis Wear, Bags, Q Richardson, Novak, James White, Earl Barron, Landry, Middle aged Wallace-Camby-Kidd. Sounds like a "Where are they now" episode.

'Knicks focus should be on players that have grown up playing soccer or cricket' - Triplethreat 8/28/2020
jrodmc
Posts: 32927
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8/17/2016  4:41 PM
HofstraBBall wrote:What was the Knicks biggest mistake over the last ten years?


Signing Amare despite his knee issues and not being able to insure his deal

Drafting Hill over DeRozan, Jennings, Teague, Holiday

Including a first round pick in the Bargs trade

Tyson Chandler trade

Hiring Mike D'Antoni over Mark Jackson

Trading Hill, Jeffries, and a first round pick for cap space to chase lbj

Its a toss up between signing Amare and giving up a First rounder for Bags. Either way, you were taking on well known health issues, a proven deficient player and giving up way too much. Amare's contract/injury handcuffed any possible deal to upgrade. Bags was what he was, a declining player with many proven weaknesses. Giving up that 1st rounder prevented a good addition to KP or a very important asset to use in a trade for a key piece. Think the other choices are more hindsight or hard to prove scenarios that we would never be able to prove a better outcome. Lets hope we start a thread in ten years that is titled " What was the Knicks biggest contribution to their big turn around"

Given that Amare gave us (and the Melohating grouplet) a half season of playing way, way over expectations, and Bargs essentially gave us nothing, I don't see how Stat finishes ahead of the dunkless one.

It's Bargs, all alone, way out in front.

dk7th
Posts: 30006
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Member: #4228
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8/17/2016  4:45 PM
ChuckBuck wrote:
jrodmc wrote:Incredible, the stupidity of hate. Yawn is absolutely correct.

Only in Melohate world can you offer up these brilliant responses, over and over again, for years:

1) Losing less than before "the Trade" is not as good as losing more before "the Trade".
2) Constantly talking about all the "assets" that were lost in "the Trade" without mentioning what Denver managed to become with all those "assets".
(Remember the world beaters Ujiri was going to turn that franchise into in just a few short years? Remember all that? WCF!!! Gallo, the legit All Star Stud!!! Moz, the project who was going to burn up the league!!! My Mayor, oh my Mayor!!!)
3) Constantly referring to LinLove. The loss of a two week wonder who became nothing more than a another shyte-covered rhoid that Melohaters with head firmly up their azzes can pine and moan for. Oh yeah, and ignore the fact he amounted to an overpaid journeyman who other franchises had to give up draft picks to dump. Who also never played in anything but the "jv season" for us. All the while whining about Melo's contracts and not seriously wondering if Lin's contract to back up Patrick Beverly and Toney Fuhucquing Douglas actually was, ridiculous.
4) Equating Melo with Starbury, at any level. Unblushingly.
5) Having warm, wet memories of Landry Fields and his parabola jumpshyte.
6) Getting to the second round or being at the top of the division are things not to speak of. Neither are scoring championships or franchise records. Tanking is, though.
7) Talking up Rashweed and Jkidd as true saviors of the franchise. Anything but Melo. And believe in your heart that this shows incredible BB IQ.
8) When all else fails, ignore rationality, and just say "Dolan".
9) Whining about all the All-Stars who don't, and never will have, the balls to come to NY to play, but would rather take their talents elsewhere. Usually with two other superfriends. And somehow this is Melo's fault. I guess a benefit of having your Melohating head up your azz, is you get incredible insights into the actual quality of other people's balls.
10) Posting pics of the Hibbert block (in the second round of the playoffs) and seriously thinking that's worse than any Barg's meme on the internet.

I applaud the dynamic duo's unswerving dedication to being the poster children for deranged Melohate. Somewhere, tkf is shedding tears of pride.

Continue to have a nice next 3 seasons fellas!

-Zillion Melo Emojis

how did you know jrodmc loves softserve chocolate?

knicks win 38-43 games in 16-17. rose MUST shoot no more than 14 shots per game, defer to kp6 + melo, and have a usage rate of less than 25%
jrodmc
Posts: 32927
Alba Posts: 50
Joined: 11/24/2004
Member: #805
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8/18/2016  7:48 AM
dk7th wrote:
ChuckBuck wrote:
jrodmc wrote:Incredible, the stupidity of hate. Yawn is absolutely correct.

Only in Melohate world can you offer up these brilliant responses, over and over again, for years:

1) Losing less than before "the Trade" is not as good as losing more before "the Trade".
2) Constantly talking about all the "assets" that were lost in "the Trade" without mentioning what Denver managed to become with all those "assets".
(Remember the world beaters Ujiri was going to turn that franchise into in just a few short years? Remember all that? WCF!!! Gallo, the legit All Star Stud!!! Moz, the project who was going to burn up the league!!! My Mayor, oh my Mayor!!!)
3) Constantly referring to LinLove. The loss of a two week wonder who became nothing more than a another shyte-covered rhoid that Melohaters with head firmly up their azzes can pine and moan for. Oh yeah, and ignore the fact he amounted to an overpaid journeyman who other franchises had to give up draft picks to dump. Who also never played in anything but the "jv season" for us. All the while whining about Melo's contracts and not seriously wondering if Lin's contract to back up Patrick Beverly and Toney Fuhucquing Douglas actually was, ridiculous.
4) Equating Melo with Starbury, at any level. Unblushingly.
5) Having warm, wet memories of Landry Fields and his parabola jumpshyte.
6) Getting to the second round or being at the top of the division are things not to speak of. Neither are scoring championships or franchise records. Tanking is, though.
7) Talking up Rashweed and Jkidd as true saviors of the franchise. Anything but Melo. And believe in your heart that this shows incredible BB IQ.
8) When all else fails, ignore rationality, and just say "Dolan".
9) Whining about all the All-Stars who don't, and never will have, the balls to come to NY to play, but would rather take their talents elsewhere. Usually with two other superfriends. And somehow this is Melo's fault. I guess a benefit of having your Melohating head up your azz, is you get incredible insights into the actual quality of other people's balls.
10) Posting pics of the Hibbert block (in the second round of the playoffs) and seriously thinking that's worse than any Barg's meme on the internet.

I applaud the dynamic duo's unswerving dedication to being the poster children for deranged Melohate. Somewhere, tkf is shedding tears of pride.

Continue to have a nice next 3 seasons fellas!

-Zillion Melo Emojis

how did you know jrodmc loves softserve chocolate?

Excellent, concise response. Almost as brilliant as ChuckBuck.

ChuckBuck
Posts: 28851
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8/18/2016  8:14 AM
jrodmc wrote:
dk7th wrote:
ChuckBuck wrote:
jrodmc wrote:Incredible, the stupidity of hate. Yawn is absolutely correct.

Only in Melohate world can you offer up these brilliant responses, over and over again, for years:

1) Losing less than before "the Trade" is not as good as losing more before "the Trade".
2) Constantly talking about all the "assets" that were lost in "the Trade" without mentioning what Denver managed to become with all those "assets".
(Remember the world beaters Ujiri was going to turn that franchise into in just a few short years? Remember all that? WCF!!! Gallo, the legit All Star Stud!!! Moz, the project who was going to burn up the league!!! My Mayor, oh my Mayor!!!)
3) Constantly referring to LinLove. The loss of a two week wonder who became nothing more than a another shyte-covered rhoid that Melohaters with head firmly up their azzes can pine and moan for. Oh yeah, and ignore the fact he amounted to an overpaid journeyman who other franchises had to give up draft picks to dump. Who also never played in anything but the "jv season" for us. All the while whining about Melo's contracts and not seriously wondering if Lin's contract to back up Patrick Beverly and Toney Fuhucquing Douglas actually was, ridiculous.
4) Equating Melo with Starbury, at any level. Unblushingly.
5) Having warm, wet memories of Landry Fields and his parabola jumpshyte.
6) Getting to the second round or being at the top of the division are things not to speak of. Neither are scoring championships or franchise records. Tanking is, though.
7) Talking up Rashweed and Jkidd as true saviors of the franchise. Anything but Melo. And believe in your heart that this shows incredible BB IQ.
8) When all else fails, ignore rationality, and just say "Dolan".
9) Whining about all the All-Stars who don't, and never will have, the balls to come to NY to play, but would rather take their talents elsewhere. Usually with two other superfriends. And somehow this is Melo's fault. I guess a benefit of having your Melohating head up your azz, is you get incredible insights into the actual quality of other people's balls.
10) Posting pics of the Hibbert block (in the second round of the playoffs) and seriously thinking that's worse than any Barg's meme on the internet.

I applaud the dynamic duo's unswerving dedication to being the poster children for deranged Melohate. Somewhere, tkf is shedding tears of pride.

Continue to have a nice next 3 seasons fellas!

-Zillion Melo Emojis

how did you know jrodmc loves softserve chocolate?

Excellent, concise response. Almost as brilliant as ChuckBuck.

RonRon
Posts: 25531
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Member: #246
8/18/2016  10:14 AM
trading Ewing for GARBAGE

the trade that made us lose draft picks that became

Noah (a decade later)
LaMaRcus Aldridge (probably has a chance in couple more seasons)

Fredrick Weis and NOT RON ARTEST

voted for AB's 1st rounder though the above moves were probably worse

Sangfroid
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Member: #2784

8/18/2016  1:12 PM
I did some checking. Isiah Thomas Was the team president from 2003 and came down to coach in 2006, so he can be included in this poll. His trading two 1st round picks for Eddy Curry. His signing of Snacks James and Jared Jeffries to full MLE contracts, further hampering the teams' financial status. His fueds with Stephon Marbury was another bone of contention. The team has been misguided for several years, but Zeke takes the cake
"We are playing a game. We are playing at not playing a game..."
Nalod
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8/18/2016  1:50 PM
The New York Knicks seemed ready to acquire center Eddy Curry from the Bulls for quite some time. In 2004, the Knicks were attempting to trade for Curry.

The big man was a phenomenal talent. Taken with the fourth pick in the ‘01 NBA draft, Curry was talented but had his flaws. His offensive skill and athleticism were impressive, but his work ethic and lack of defense and rebounding raised several flags. The former Bulls first roynder had his best moments in a Bulls uniform during the 2004-05 seasonwhen he led the Bulls in scoring (16.1 PPG) as they made their first playoff push since 1998. After playing in 63 games, it was found that Curry had an enlarged heart and an irregular heartbeat. The ailment forced him to miss the final 13 games of the 2004-05 season as well as the playoffs.

Bulls general manager John Paxson wanted to keep Curry, offering him a one-year, $5 million deal if he passed the DNA test. And if he failed, Paxson said Chicago would offer Curry $400,000 annually for the next 50 years. Curry refused to take the DNA test. With the DNA test as a sticking point, the Bulls decided to shop Curry around.

The Knicks were compiling big contract after big contract and were not shying away from acquiring another (eventual) high-priced player in Eddy Curry. The Bulls signed Curry to a six-year, $56 million deal and then dealt him. Curry’s contract included an option allowing him to terminate the deal after the fourth year.

Curry appeared in 289 games (202 starts) during his career in Chicago. He left the Bulls with career averages of 11.8 PPG and 4.9 RPG in 23.1 MPG, while shooting 53% from the floor and 67% from the free-throw line.

Antonio Davis was originally acquired by the Bulls in a six-player deal between the Bulls an Toronto Raptors during the middle of the 2003-04 season. In one and a half seasons, Davis averaged 7.9 PPG, 7.0 RPG, and 1.5 APG while shooting 43% from the field and 76% from the free-throw line.

Davis was initially reluctant to come to New York in the trade. He was afraid of uprooting his family and took some time to ponder retirement. After some extended time, Davis agreed to report.

Mike Sweetney played 119 games averaged 7.0 PPG and 4.8 RPG. Last season, he made 77 appearances, including 28 starts, and averaged 8.4 PPG and 4.6 RPG in 19.6 MPG.

Tim Thomas continued to disappoint throughout his stint with the New York Knicks. He averaged 12.0 PPG, 3.5 RPG, and 1.0 APG with 44/41/79 splits from the field, three-point, and free-throw line with the Knicks over a season and a half before the trade.

Jermaine Jackson was acquired by the Knicks as a late-season ten day contract signing. Jackson would later sign for the rest of the season. He finished up the 2004-05 season with New York averaging 2.0 PPG, 1.1 RPG, and 1.1 APG in 21 games.

After the trade, Curry’s time in New York was a mixed bag at best. In his first season, the Knicks big man struggled to get in shape during training camp and got off to a slow start. Curry also dealt with a slew of injuries and the Knicks struggled with and without him. They finished 23-59 that season leading to coach Larry Brown’s departure after that season.

Curry’s second season was much more impressive. He had his best individual season averaging 19.5 PPG and 7.0 RPG. The Knicks still struggle finishing 33-49. The Knicks would then acquire another post presence in Zach Randolph. Curry and Randolph did not mesh well and the Knicks spent most of the 2007-08 season staggering Curry and Randolph’s minutes so they would not play together. Curry and Randolph posted a -250 +/- rating during that season according to 82 Games.

After the disappointing 2007-08 season, Curry showed up to camp out of shape in 2008. New Knicks coach Mike D'Antoni was angry with Curry and refused to play him. Under D'Antoni, he would play 10 games in three years before being traded to the Minnesota Timberwolves in the three-team deal that netted the Knicks Carmelo Anthony. Curry left New York with averages of 15.2 PPG, 5.8 RPG, and 0.5 APG in 222 games.

Davis played with the Knicks for 36 games (31 starts) before being dealt to the Toronto Raptors for Jalen Rose and a future first rounder. He finished his short stint with the Knicks with averages of 5.0 PPG and 4.3 RPG in 20.8 MPG. Davis is probably best known for running up into the stands as a Knick to protect his wife during a game between the Knicks and the Bulls.

Jermaine Jackson would be waived two weeks after being acquired by the Bulls. He would later sign with the Bucks for the rest of the 2005-06 season.

Thomas played just three games in Chicago before being sent home by the Bulls after complaining about his role. Thomas suggested that if he didn’t receive proper playing time, he should be traded. Here’s what John Paxson had to say about it (RealGM via Chicago Sun-Times):


“Tim has made some comments about being here, and I have mentioned that he is at a different stage of his professional career than most of our guys. He wants to play, and right now we’re in a position where that’s probably not going to happen here. I don’t want to put Tim and my coach in a position where every day they have to answer the question of when he’s coming off the inactive list and why he’s not playing. We’re going to try to accommodate him, but we’re going to do what we have to do as an organization. We’re not going to do anything that’s going to set us back.”

Thomas would be waived on March 1st. He would sign with the Phoenix Suns two days later and help them in their 2006 playoff run.

Mike Sweetney received solid playing time with the Bulls after being acquired from the Knicks. In two seasons, Sweetney averaged 6.0 PPG, 4.1 RPG, and 0.8 APG while shooting 45% from the field, and 63% from the free-throw line. He started 44 games with the Bulls in his first season, but that was due to the lack of depth up front for Chicago.

Once the Bulls acquired Ben Wallace and P.J. Brown for the 2006-07 season, Sweetney’s role and minutes declined vastly. After '07 Sweetney never played another game in the NBA.

The Knicks sent the Bulls a first-round draft pick in 2006, and their second-round picks in 2007 and 2009. The first-round pick was going to be either the Knicks’ or the San Antonio Spurs’ depending on whichever was higher. The Bulls also had the right to swap first-round picks with the Knicks in 2007.

After the trade, the Knicks finished 23-59 during the 2005-06 season which was great news for the Chicago Bulls. They ended up with the second draft pick in the 2006 draft. John Paxson expressed his pleasure with the pick (via Taipei Times):


“This is kind of like found money.”

The Bulls drafted LaMarcus Aldridge at the second slot in the draft and then traded Aldridge’s rights with a future second rounder to the Portland Trail Blazers for the rights to the fourth overall pick Tyrus Thomas as well as forward Viktor Khryapa.

The Bulls decided to swap picks with the Knicks after they finished with a 49-33 record and the Knicks finished with a 33-49 record that same season.

The 2007 first rounder that the Chicago Bulls acquired from the Knicks in the swap became the ninth pick in the '07 draft. The Bulls used that selection on center Joakim Noah. Noah has played with the Bulls for six seasons and has developed into a high caliber center. His ability as a mobile defender, shot-blocker, passer, and facilitator makes him a unique and very useful center. He recently made his first All-Star team in 2013 and has made two All-Defensive teams in his career. Through his first six seasons, Noah has averaged 9.4 PPG, 9.1 RPG, 2.1 APG, and 1.5 BPG in 396 career games with Chicago.

The 2007 first round draft pick that New York acquired was the 23rd pick. The Knicks used that selection on forward Wilson Chandler from DePaul. He would play with the Knicks for four seasons before being dealt to the Denver Nuggets in the multi-team deal that brought Carmelo Anthony to the Knicks. Chandler left the Knicks with averages of 14.0 PPG, 5.0 RPG, and 1.8 APG in 233 career games with the Knicks.

The Bulls traded the '07 second rounder that they acquired in the trade with Rodney Carney to the Philadelphia 76ers for the rights to Thabo Sefolosha. The pick would be traded by the Sixers to the Jazz and the Jazz would take center Kyrylo Fesenko with the 38th pick.

The Bulls also traded the '09 second rounder that they acquired from the Knicks in a three-team deal to the Portland Trail Blazers. The Blazers would later select Jon Brockman with the 39th pick in the '09 draft.

Eddy Curry on trade and heart (via Washington Post):


“I’m happy to have all that stuff behind me and people can start looking at me as a basketball player and not a patient. I go out there knowing and feeling I’m not at more risk than anybody else. I’m more worried about breaking my finger or something like that. I’m not worried about my heart.

On leaving the Bulls:


It was tough to hear the team that you grew up watching didn’t want you no more. It was a breath of fresh air what the New York Knicks did.”

New York Knicks president of basketball operations Isiah Thomas on looking into the trade (via NY Times):


“We’ve followed this for a while, and the research that we’ve done from afar led us to the point where we thought we could make a trade for him. We’ve talked to all of our doctors, and now the second phase of it is to get our hands on and get an eyeball on him. I feel very confident in our medical staff, that if he passes the physical, we’ll be real lucky to have gotten a guy such as this.

On the unique qualities within Curry’s talent:


They don’t come along that often. Do you gamble on this type of talent in big people? Without question. Every 15 to 20 years, a guy comes along with this size with this type of agility and skill. So when you have a chance to get one of them, you go and get him.”

(via Washington Post):


“This is a very complicated issue that required a lot of sensitivity and care. I’m extremely confident in what we have, and what was done. Eddy is going to be playing in the NBA and living a healthy life for a long time.”

Knicks head coach Larry Brown on Curry (via NY Post):


“Look around the league, everybody talking about young post players, most kids now don’t want to be post players. He is a true, pure, low-post presence."

New York Knicks guard Jamal Crawford on Eddy Curry (via NY Post):


"It’s scary how good he could be. Coach Brown is going to get the best out of him. I didn’t think when I came here he’d be my teammate a year later.”

Knicks guard Allan Houston on Curry:


“He’s an impact player. He’s one of those guys that when you play against him, you say, 'Man, if we had him, it’d be nice.’”

Knicks forward Maurice Taylor:


“It’s definitely a concern, because a guy that talented is having troubles getting a contract from Chicago. When you talk about someone’s heart, it’s definitely a crapshoot, but who are we to say? If he feels fine, if the doctor says he’s fine, that’s the only two people that really has to make the decision, is Eddy and the doctors.”

Chicago Bulls center Tyson Chandler on Curry (via ESPN):


“It’s tough. I’m sad to see him go.”

jrodmc
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8/18/2016  3:15 PM
Nalod feeling the aftereffects of a RonRon inoculation?
RicanHavok
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8/19/2016  12:51 PM
I agree that the worse move was the re-signing of Billups only to amnesty him...that could've mitigated the Amare deal. Basically the Front Office of the last ten years has been the biggest **** up.
What was the Knicks biggest mistake over the last ten years?

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