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Araton with the first "Trade Anthony" article
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dk7th
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12/11/2014  6:04 PM
mreinman wrote:
dk7th wrote:
mreinman wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
mreinman wrote:knx, do you not see how many passes melo misses???

When he passes, nothing good happens haha. I want to see good ball movement as much as the next guy, but who do you want him to pass to? I have been watching for 2 years him go thru stretches of making the right passes and guys just miss shots. That was a main reason i was excited to get Calderon, we need guys who can shoot.

this is the biggest bull sh1t excuse and is really getting old.

when pablo prigioni is wide open because his man left him to double melo knowing that melo will of course refuse to pass, and priggy is waving his hands in desperation while melo would rather shoot his 1 on 2 stupid long contested 2 while pablo is leading the league in 3 point efficiency and korver type level ... etc

no more excuses.

you pass to the open man. if he can't hit his shots then its on the coach to remove him.

Melo's teammates would shoot better if their idiot star had some confidence in them. instead let him go be some chump up in the locker room.

Trust me ... nobody has studied melo and his passing more than me.

so you have finally reached the breaking point. it didn't need to take this long but whatever.

kind of but as soon as he starts passing and being less selfish I will be happy to jump right back on the wagon.

No personal hate

hell will freeze over first.

knicks win 38-43 games in 16-17. rose MUST shoot no more than 14 shots per game, defer to kp6 + melo, and have a usage rate of less than 25%
AUTOADVERT
dk7th
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12/11/2014  6:06 PM
SwishAndDish13 wrote:
dk7th wrote:
SwishAndDish13 wrote:
H1AND1 wrote:http://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/12/sports/basketball/carmelo-anthony-knicks-rebuild-might-be-better-off-as-a-tear-down.html?partner=rssnyt&emc=rss&_r=0

Guy is probably just bitter that he bought into Phil's jedi mind tricks in the offseason.

he never did that but pretty sure you did.

You just like being a troll, but I'll entertain this comment regardless. Do you know him? Reading the article, it is written from the perspective that he thought they would be better this year. Personally, I sorta bought it. I thought they would be somewhat competitive and didn't really believe this was a full fledged tank prior to the season. About 5 games in I was suspect, after the Orlando game I was certain it was a tank. He puts all this non-sense into the media to keep them relevant, but this is clearly a tank job. To be honest it's a good strategy given the roster they have and cap space after this season.

if by "troll" you mean " prescient truth-teller" then i agree. everything else in your post is sheer ignorance masquerading as guesswork and conjecture.

knicks win 38-43 games in 16-17. rose MUST shoot no more than 14 shots per game, defer to kp6 + melo, and have a usage rate of less than 25%
Splat
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12/11/2014  6:12 PM
dk7th wrote:
mreinman wrote:
dk7th wrote:
mreinman wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
mreinman wrote:knx, do you not see how many passes melo misses???

When he passes, nothing good happens haha. I want to see good ball movement as much as the next guy, but who do you want him to pass to? I have been watching for 2 years him go thru stretches of making the right passes and guys just miss shots. That was a main reason i was excited to get Calderon, we need guys who can shoot.

this is the biggest bull sh1t excuse and is really getting old.

when pablo prigioni is wide open because his man left him to double melo knowing that melo will of course refuse to pass, and priggy is waving his hands in desperation while melo would rather shoot his 1 on 2 stupid long contested 2 while pablo is leading the league in 3 point efficiency and korver type level ... etc

no more excuses.

you pass to the open man. if he can't hit his shots then its on the coach to remove him.

Melo's teammates would shoot better if their idiot star had some confidence in them. instead let him go be some chump up in the locker room.

Trust me ... nobody has studied melo and his passing more than me.

so you have finally reached the breaking point. it didn't need to take this long but whatever.

kind of but as soon as he starts passing and being less selfish I will be happy to jump right back on the wagon.

No personal hate

hell will freeze over first.

Unfortunately, the bias of historical probability lies in that direction

I've got a fever and the only prescription is more cowbell!
gunsnewing
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12/11/2014  6:12 PM    LAST EDITED: 12/11/2014  6:25 PM
How do you trade a guy with back, knee and shoulder issues on year one of a $124mil contract?
markvmc
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12/11/2014  6:14 PM
gunsnewing wrote:How do you trade a guy with back, knee and shoulder issues?

You get the Knicks on the phone. oh...wait.....

mreinman
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12/11/2014  6:16 PM
Bonn1997 wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
mreinman wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
Splat wrote:
mreinman wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
mreinman wrote:knx, do you not see how many passes melo misses???

When he passes, nothing good happens haha. I want to see good ball movement as much as the next guy, but who do you want him to pass to? I have been watching for 2 years him go thru stretches of making the right passes and guys just miss shots. That was a main reason i was excited to get Calderon, we need guys who can shoot.

this is the biggest bull sh1t excuse and is really getting old.

when pablo prigioni is wide open because his man left him to double melo knowing that melo will of course refuse to pass, and priggy is waving his hands in desperation while melo would rather shoot his 1 on 2 stupid long contested 2 while pablo is leading the league in 3 point efficiency and korver type level ... etc

no more excuses.

you pass to the open man. if he can't hit his shots then its on the coach to remove him.

Melo's teammates would shoot better if their idiot star had some confidence in them. instead let him go be some chump up in the locker room.

Trust me ... nobody has studied melo and his passing more than me.

Yes, and even on a squad that is not full of good shooters, good ball movement always produces greater efficiencies. I don't know why the excuse that Melo doesn't pass because he doesn't trust his teammates is used as an excuse so often. It is really obnoxious and ignorant to cling to that argument IMO, but to this day it is invoked all the time.

Sorry, i just don't see it with this group. We saw him play that type of basketball in 2012-2013 when guys were making shots. Believe it or not, he was part of that great ball movement. But you can't expect the same with this group. It's just not there.


Look at the shooting percentages. Melo's shooting .456 and the team is at .453. Yet people are saying when the teammates shoot the ball, nothing good happens. What does that mean then when Melo shoots the ball?!

You can find a stat that tells just about anything you want it to. I am just pointing out what i see.

stop telling us what you see and show those easy to find stats that support your argument.

holfresh just did that. Besides that, anything i bring up you guys will discredit for one reason or another because you mind has been made up about Melo, which is fine.


I'm not going to bother praising myself here but mreinman went into this season with a very open-mind about Melo and it's clear his mind is still open to the possibility or hope that Melo will become a good passer.

thats a fair assessment.

And I specifically stated the criteria that I will look for (which he has failed in a big way to live up to)

I am sure that Phil is not excusing him either at this point.

so here is what phil is thinking ....
Splat
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12/11/2014  6:18 PM
markvmc wrote:
gunsnewing wrote:How do you trade a guy with back, knee and shoulder issues?

You get the Knicks on the phone. oh...wait.....

I've got a fever and the only prescription is more cowbell!
SwishAndDish13
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12/11/2014  6:47 PM
dk7th wrote:
SwishAndDish13 wrote:
dk7th wrote:
SwishAndDish13 wrote:
H1AND1 wrote:http://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/12/sports/basketball/carmelo-anthony-knicks-rebuild-might-be-better-off-as-a-tear-down.html?partner=rssnyt&emc=rss&_r=0

Guy is probably just bitter that he bought into Phil's jedi mind tricks in the offseason.

he never did that but pretty sure you did.

You just like being a troll, but I'll entertain this comment regardless. Do you know him? Reading the article, it is written from the perspective that he thought they would be better this year. Personally, I sorta bought it. I thought they would be somewhat competitive and didn't really believe this was a full fledged tank prior to the season. About 5 games in I was suspect, after the Orlando game I was certain it was a tank. He puts all this non-sense into the media to keep them relevant, but this is clearly a tank job. To be honest it's a good strategy given the roster they have and cap space after this season.

if by "troll" you mean " prescient truth-teller" then i agree. everything else in your post is sheer ignorance masquerading as guesswork and conjecture.

lol!

dk7th
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12/11/2014  9:27 PM
SwishAndDish13 wrote:
dk7th wrote:
SwishAndDish13 wrote:
dk7th wrote:
SwishAndDish13 wrote:
H1AND1 wrote:http://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/12/sports/basketball/carmelo-anthony-knicks-rebuild-might-be-better-off-as-a-tear-down.html?partner=rssnyt&emc=rss&_r=0

Guy is probably just bitter that he bought into Phil's jedi mind tricks in the offseason.

he never did that but pretty sure you did.

You just like being a troll, but I'll entertain this comment regardless. Do you know him? Reading the article, it is written from the perspective that he thought they would be better this year. Personally, I sorta bought it. I thought they would be somewhat competitive and didn't really believe this was a full fledged tank prior to the season. About 5 games in I was suspect, after the Orlando game I was certain it was a tank. He puts all this non-sense into the media to keep them relevant, but this is clearly a tank job. To be honest it's a good strategy given the roster they have and cap space after this season.

if by "troll" you mean " prescient truth-teller" then i agree. everything else in your post is sheer ignorance masquerading as guesswork and conjecture.

lol!

yeah it's hilarious

knicks win 38-43 games in 16-17. rose MUST shoot no more than 14 shots per game, defer to kp6 + melo, and have a usage rate of less than 25%
F500ONE
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12/11/2014  9:42 PM
dk7th wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
mreinman wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
sidsanders wrote:i
mreinman wrote:
sidsanders wrote:
Splat wrote:
mreinman wrote:
Splat wrote:
Knixkik wrote:
Splat wrote:
Knixkik wrote:Melo is not going anywhere. Phil is going to attempt to retool around him the same way the Celtics did with Pierce when he was 30 years old. They will use their draft pick to net an all-star via trade (unless Phil falls in love with a player in the draft) and then sell a free agent on the ability to join melo and that player in turning the franchise around. We should have 2 all-star talents next to Melo by next year, otherwise Phil has not done his job. From there he will need to add the necessary role players to fill every other role. But you can't trade Melo when you finally have a free agent period to add the right talent around him, especially when it is likely we will have a top 5 pick anyways. Trading Melo won't alter our draft position, so why bother? And without control of our pick the following season, there is zero upside in doing so.

Fat chance

Obviously it will be challenging, but this has to be the goal at this point if all goes well.

Doesn't have to be if you have the guts to assess the direction you're going in and change the game plan. It is not too late to commit to a full rebuild if you can find a trading partner for Melo.

Melo is going to be a hobbling mess. Rebuilding around him is just a complete and utter joke in the making. The most courageous thing Phil could do is realize he fukked up and unload Melo while he still has some value. Dolan can eat another few ten million dollar losses.

is his contract tradeable?

That's the big question. I don't think so, but I'd like to see them try.

do you mean would anyone want to take on his contract or would he waive his no trade clause at all?

who would/could take on his salbatross let alone give up non sh1t for it?

is his health going to become a long term prob and would he like the destination to waive the NT clause. no help in any trade scenario. phil had to know this was gonna be rough

Why is it always assumed that he is going to have some lingering injury issues? He has a few injuries here and there, but its the ny media that draws extra attention to it. He is by most accounts a durable player who's body type and style of play should age relatively well into his 30s. Yet when this team underperforms or Melo sits because of soreness, he is deemed an injury risk moving forward, or my personal favorite "he is breaking down physically." It's too bad he is not immune to injury and soreness, that's the only way this type of talk will stop i guess.

I would worry about any 30+ player who is signed for 5 more years and is not in ripped shape

And his style is quite physical.

He doesn't rely on athletic ability though. He's style is mostly below the rim. And if we actually add talent alongside him he won't have to constantly work like this for shots. His game will come easy in the triangle and mostly be spot up shooting and mid range pullups. He should be extremely productive as long as he isn't playing like he has the past few years.

bully ball is what gets him in trouble-- his footwork and ball-handling is poor so he relies on initiating physical contact which has caused shoulder issues and now his left (plant) knee and back too. he has a ton of wear and tear that has reached critical mass and just in time for an astronomical payday.

DAT jab steppin can be a Bich

Melo is a Relic, an Artifact, an Ancient ruin,


A Dinosaur from the Flintstone Ages

lol @ fools who kept referring to this bozo as Top 5, Top 10


How Criminally Skull Dangerous they were and are

CrushAlot
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12/11/2014  9:54 PM
Splat wrote:The NY Times is rarely the first in line among local media to pitch worst case scenarios. That should tell you something about what's brewing.

Basically, now that Melo locked in his money, it is up to the Knicks to find a trading partner. Melo will bail and I think he'll agree to pretty much any club that is better than ours regardless of location. Melo will not stay to be booed for 5 years at MSG.

Everything us prescient sombers have been saying is reiterated in this article. The tide is turning.

I'm looking forward to a Knicks future without Carmelo Anthony.

Quote:

What George Karl, his former coach in Denver, told me about Anthony last spring was fair and astute: “I don’t think Melo understands that coming to work with the best attitude every single day is a precious commodity when you’re the best player,” he said. “That’s not the same thing as playing hard. That’s bringing the total package, 100 percent focused on all the little things. Those are rare breeds. Kevin Garnett. Michael Jordan. LeBron didn’t always have it, but he has it now. Melo doesn’t get an A in that department; maybe not much more than a B-minus.”

What Karl meant was that putting Anthony in the most optimal of conditions would involve having a player who may not be as productive and as much a brand-name star, but one who would hold more sway in the daily operation of the team.

Araton has written a lot of anti Melo articles including the one where he interviewed George Karl. I wouldn't read into this as even Araton of the Times is writing about the Knicks needing to trade Melo.
I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
Araton with the first "Trade Anthony" article

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