[ IMAGES: Images ON turn off | ACCOUNT: User Status is LOCKED why? ]

Tim Hardaway
Author Thread
fishmike
Posts: 53864
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 7/19/2002
Member: #298
USA
1/31/2014  9:21 AM
jrodmc wrote:wow, Tim Hardaway Jr, the new Shump.


Remember, just short months ago, when everyone was worried we were trading Shump and all our 2027 first rounders for Iggy or Rudy Gay?

no. I would have loved that trade
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
AUTOADVERT
TheGame
Posts: 26637
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 7/15/2006
Member: #1154
USA
1/31/2014  9:21 AM
THJ looks good but it is still too early to predict how his career is going to go. He has to improve his defense, and once defenses start focusing on him, will he still be able to score consistently? He is definitely a good player and if the draft was today, he would probably be a top-10 pick, but I am not ready to say he is going to be All-Star just yet. All in all, he is a solid piece to the team that should be around when we retool in 2015.
Trust the Process
GustavBahler
Posts: 42864
Alba Posts: 15
Joined: 7/12/2010
Member: #3186

1/31/2014  9:28 AM
TheGame wrote:THJ looks good but it is still too early to predict how his career is going to go. He has to improve his defense, and once defenses start focusing on him, will he still be able to score consistently? He is definitely a good player and if the draft was today, he would probably be a top-10 pick, but I am not ready to say he is going to be All-Star just yet. All in all, he is a solid piece to the team that should be around when we retool in 2015.

Consistency and D need to be improved or he will probably end up being a perennial 6th man. As far as figuring out his game, if he was strictly a jump shooter or a PG who handles the ball more I might be a little more worried about that. THJ is already showing veteran skills when it comes to moving without the ball.

jrodmc
Posts: 32927
Alba Posts: 50
Joined: 11/24/2004
Member: #805
USA
1/31/2014  9:41 AM
fishmike wrote:
jrodmc wrote:wow, Tim Hardaway Jr, the new Shump.


Remember, just short months ago, when everyone was worried we were trading Shump and all our 2027 first rounders for Iggy or Rudy Gay?

no. I would have loved that trade

Would you have loved the neverending "we shoot all our yoots and draft picks" threads? I am so tired of reading how stupid our idiot troll owner is.

How bout this: Keep Shump. Keep THjr. Keep Tyler.
Then actually stop trading picks.

Trade Cole though. I read on the UK where he's actually a big white stiff.

GustavBahler
Posts: 42864
Alba Posts: 15
Joined: 7/12/2010
Member: #3186

1/31/2014  9:43 AM
jrodmc wrote:
fishmike wrote:
jrodmc wrote:wow, Tim Hardaway Jr, the new Shump.


Remember, just short months ago, when everyone was worried we were trading Shump and all our 2027 first rounders for Iggy or Rudy Gay?

no. I would have loved that trade

Would you have loved the neverending "we shoot all our yoots and draft picks" threads? I am so tired of reading how stupid our idiot troll owner is.

How bout this: Keep Shump. Keep THjr. Keep Tyler.
Then actually stop trading picks.

Trade Cole though. I read on the UK where he's actually a big white stiff.

Guess that only leaves you!

jrodmc
Posts: 32927
Alba Posts: 50
Joined: 11/24/2004
Member: #805
USA
1/31/2014  9:47 AM
GustavBahler wrote:
jrodmc wrote:
fishmike wrote:
jrodmc wrote:wow, Tim Hardaway Jr, the new Shump.


Remember, just short months ago, when everyone was worried we were trading Shump and all our 2027 first rounders for Iggy or Rudy Gay?

no. I would have loved that trade

Would you have loved the neverending "we shoot all our yoots and draft picks" threads? I am so tired of reading how stupid our idiot troll owner is.

How bout this: Keep Shump. Keep THjr. Keep Tyler.
Then actually stop trading picks.

Trade Cole though. I read on the UK where he's actually a big white stiff.

Guess that only leaves you!

Please, don't make me have to Tristan Thompson you!

playa2
Posts: 34922
Alba Posts: 15
Joined: 5/15/2003
Member: #407

1/31/2014  9:47 AM
Real coaches will make sure whoever HARDAWAY is guarding when he gets hot will get him in foul trouble.

He's still a neophyte that lacks strength in his arms to defend stronger sg in the association.

In the 2nd season the games become more physical than finesse. He will be ok after a off season work program.

JAMES DOLAN on Isiah : He's a good friend of mine and of the organization and I will continue to solicit his views. He will always have strong ties to me and the team.
yellowboy90
Posts: 33942
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 4/23/2011
Member: #3538

1/31/2014  9:49 AM
I was really on the Crabbe band wagon and was surprised when they picked Timmy but became open to Timmy as a player as I researched his spot up game.
GustavBahler
Posts: 42864
Alba Posts: 15
Joined: 7/12/2010
Member: #3186

1/31/2014  9:52 AM
jrodmc wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
jrodmc wrote:
fishmike wrote:
jrodmc wrote:wow, Tim Hardaway Jr, the new Shump.


Remember, just short months ago, when everyone was worried we were trading Shump and all our 2027 first rounders for Iggy or Rudy Gay?

no. I would have loved that trade

Would you have loved the neverending "we shoot all our yoots and draft picks" threads? I am so tired of reading how stupid our idiot troll owner is.

How bout this: Keep Shump. Keep THjr. Keep Tyler.
Then actually stop trading picks.

Trade Cole though. I read on the UK where he's actually a big white stiff.

Guess that only leaves you!

Please, don't make me have to Tristan Thompson you!

More like "Big Country" Reeves on you!

H1AND1
Posts: 21747
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 9/9/2013
Member: #5648

1/31/2014  11:34 AM    LAST EDITED: 1/31/2014  11:36 AM
jrodmc wrote:wow, Tim Hardaway Jr, the new Shump.


Remember, just short months ago, when everyone was worried we were trading Shump and all our 2027 first rounders for Iggy or Rudy Gay?

So you're saying the Knicks don't have a habit of trading away their young players? I don't know if out comment was directed at me but surely you cannot deny this and that it happening over and over again can leave a fan apprehensive. Kindve like a beaten dog

martin
Posts: 76421
Alba Posts: 108
Joined: 7/24/2001
Member: #2
USA
1/31/2014  11:37 AM
http://nba.si.com/2014/01/31/2013-nba-draft-redraft-giannis-antetokounmpo/

Re-drafting the 2013 NBA lottery

A lottery pick is a valuable commodity in the NBA. It not only allows teams the exclusive right to sign a young talent but it also empowers them to do so on the cheap. Still, that doesn’t guarantee a quality return on investment, particularly upfront.

Only one of the top 14 picks in the 2013 draft rates as even an average NBA player this season based on Player Efficiency Rating. Six lottery picks are shooting below 40 percent. One has not played at all. Two (both selected in the top three) have drawn headlines for the fact that they should really be logging minutes in the D-League, while several more would likely be helped by a D-League assignment. Even more alarming, nine of the top 14 picks failed to make the rookie team for the Rising Stars Challenge at All-Star Weekend.

With so many top picks underwhelming and a few later picks exceeding expectations, it seemed a fitting time to re-examine the 2013 draft. Assuming that NBA decision makers knew all that they know now, how would they go about selecting players from this year’s woeful rookie class? We took a stab at the new lottery below. Feel free to chime in with your new version of the first 14 picks in the comments section.

Note: For the sake of simplicity, all draft-day trades will still be reflected in the re-draft order. It’s certainly possible that the Timberwolves wouldn’t have traded the No. 9 pick to the Jazz for No. 14 and No. 21, having evaluated Shabazz Muhammad more thoroughly, but walking back that deal and others would then begin to unwind status quo rosters in other ways.

1. Cavaliers – Giannis Antetokounmpo, SG
Original pick: Anthony Bennett

By no means am I ready for initiation into the Cult of Giannis, but such a remarkable 19-year-old prospect at a position of weakness for the Cavs might be too good to pass up. Anteotkounmpo clearly benefits from substandard competition. There aren’t any immediate stars of this bunch, and thus it seems prudent for Cleveland to make a play for a young, versatile contributor who could well become the best talent of this class.

2. Magic – Michael Carter-Williams, PG
Original pick: Victor Oladipo

The most productive rookie is also one of the most promising. Carter-Williams checks many of the same boxes as actual No. 2 pick Oladipo, though at 6-6 the current Sixer (No. 11 pick) presents an unusual challenge for defenses. He hasn’t figured out all the best ways to use that height to his advantage yet, but already Carter-Williams is slippery enough offensively and pesky enough defensively to project as a franchise cornerstone.

3. Wizards – Nerlens Noel, C
Original pick: Otto Porter Jr.

It says a lot about this rookie class that a player who hasn’t logged a single NBA minute this season would be projected to go third in a re-draft. To be fair, it’s a little bit more complicated than that. Oladipo would be the value pick here if not for his redundancy with guards John Wall and Bradley Beal, and Noel is a prize of a prospect despite his season-derailing ACL tear. Washington has needs elsewhere, but the opportunity to add a long-term defensive piece like Noel is well worth a prime draft pick — particularly in comparison to the other options on the board.

4. Bobcats – Victor Oladipo, G
Original pick: Cody Zeller

Playing alongside Kemba Walker and Al Jefferson would relieve some of Oladipo’s ball-dominant tendencies, allowing the 21-year-old guard to pick his spots and channel his energies more productively. He still has all the tools necessary to be an impact perimeter defender, and, unlike most every other Bobcats wing, he could soon help space the floor. He fits the franchise’s win-now bent, he complements Walker and Michael Kidd-Gilchrist more effectively than Gerald Henderson does and he could offer Charlotte a touch of needed (and did I mention marketable?) dynamism.

5. Suns – Tim Hardaway Jr., SG

Original pick: Alex Len

The most intriguing prospect left is easily Trey Burke, but drafting a third point guard behind Eric Bledsoe and Goran Dragic would be an overstretch of the “best player available” framework. Instead, Burke’s college teammate Hardaway Jr. — who went 24th to the Knicks — would fit in nicely running the court for the Suns. He’s not a special talent and doesn’t address any particular need, but Hardaway’s value lies in playing safely and productively within himself.

6. 76ers (via Pelicans) – Trey Burke, PG
Original pick: Nerlens Noel

A better passer than advertised who could be a lot of fun running an offense at Philadelphia’s breakneck pace. Burke has been the second-best rookie this season, but situational specifics and the long-term potential of other prospects nudge him down to No. 6 here.

7. Kings – Kentavious Caldwell-Pope, SG
Original pick: Ben McLemore

McLemore is still available, but I like Caldwell-Pope as a similar value and slightly better fit. There’s a chance that McLemore could be an exceptional player if he focuses on improving his off-the-dribble game, but even then it seems unlikely that he’d have a chance to grow in that way alongside DeMarcus Cousins, Isaiah Thomas and Rudy Gay. Caldwell-Pope is just as interesting a player but better suited to a more restrained role. That he projects as a better perimeter defender than McLemore is also of high importance to the Kings, who field enough minus-defenders to give coach Mike Malone a perpetual headache.

8. Pistons – Ben McLemore, SG
Original pick: Kentavious Caldwell-Pope

McLemore works fine for the Pistons, who first and foremost need capable NBA players with three-point range. The 20-year-old guard is certainly that, with the aforementioned potential for growth if given room and freedom to operate.

9. Jazz (via Timberwolves) – Anthony Bennett, SF
Original pick: Trey Burke

Bennett’s play hasn’t justified being the ninth pick. But he possesses talent and skill, buried beneath a tough start, a crisis of confidence and poor conditioning. Utah, far more so than Cleveland, is in a position to put Bennett on the floor and allow him to play through his mistakes in hopes that he could turn out to be a nice complement to Derrick Favors and Enes Kanter in the frontcourt. It’s hard to imagine Bennett’s rookie season going much worse than it has, but the guy has played 380 NBA minutes. That’s not enough precedent to doom his career or overwrite the promise he showed in college.

10. Trail Blazers – Steven Adams, C
Original pick: C.J. McCollum

I could just as easily see the Blazers sticking with McCollum here, but why not opt for a clear upgrade over the Joel Freeland/Meyers Leonard reserve tandem? Adams could be groomed for the Robin Lopez role with the potential to be an even better rebounder.

11. 76ers – Alex Len, C
Original pick: Michael Carter-Williams

Drafting Burke and Len just doesn’t have the same appeal as adding Carter-Williams and Noel, but such is the nature of the hypothetical re-draft for a team that drafted as well as the Sixers actually did. Still, they could do worse than Len. It’s hard to get a bead on Len’s potential because he’s played only 152 minutes, but even in coming off injury he moves well for a 7-footer. There’s room for him to find a place as a quality contributor in a pick-and-roll league. The fact that Len has some solid base-level skills as a 20-year-old makes him all the more promising.

12. Thunder – Cody Zeller, PF
Original pick: Steven Adams

Oh, dear. With Adams and Len off the board and McCollum a needless addition with Reggie Jackson and Jeremy Lamb in tow, Zeller could well be the most sensible pick from a shallow pool of candidates. He hasn’t been effective as a rookie. Stronger opponents have made life difficult for Zeller inside, and he hasn’t managed to catch a groove with his mid-range jumper. That said, there’s a world of difference between operating in Charlotte’s cramped offense and feeding off Kevin Durant. Zeller could give Oklahoma City another rotation-worthy big man in time.

13. Celtics (via Mavericks) – C.J. McCollum, SG
Original pick: Kelly Olynyk

A nice scorer who can play off Rajon Rondo and beside him. That’s not a bad get for the Celtics at this position, particularly when McCollum is a better creator than he’s been given the chance to demonstrate this season.

14. Timberwolves (via Jazz) – Mason Plumlee, C
Original pick: Shabazz Muhammad

Plumlee is a difference-maker with his energy and athleticism. At the very least, he’d be more useful than Muhammad for a team facing pressure to win immediately and choosing between playing undersized (Dante Cunningham, Ronny Turiaf) or overmatched (No. 21 Gorgui Dieng) players at backup center.

Official sponsor of the PURE KNICKS LOVE Program
LivingLegend
Posts: 25745
Alba Posts: 2
Joined: 8/13/2007
Member: #1645

1/31/2014  11:48 AM
BRIGGS wrote:Has a chance to be a n NBA all star SG one day. That was really the best pick weve made in years

You really didn't like this pick Briggs.

What were your reservations about him and where has he surprised you at this point?

I seem to recall you didn't like his size, athleticism or his ability to get the basket.

Anji
Posts: 25523
Alba Posts: 9
Joined: 4/14/2006
Member: #1122
USA
1/31/2014  11:55 AM
Well I'm what some might describe as an NCAA 12'Expert, and clearly Reggie Bullock is a better ProSpect......


But TJR is transitioning to the NBA better than anyone could have expected.

"Really, all Americans want is a cold beer, warm p***y, and some place to s**t with a door on it." - Mr. Ford
BRIGGS
Posts: 53275
Alba Posts: 7
Joined: 7/30/2002
Member: #303
1/31/2014  12:00 PM
LivingLegend wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:Has a chance to be a n NBA all star SG one day. That was really the best pick weve made in years

You really didn't like this pick Briggs.

What were your reservations about him and where has he surprised you at this point?

I seem to recall you didn't like his size, athleticism or his ability to get the basket.

The player you see on the Knicks was not the player who played at Michigan. He looks much more explosive with a shot that has improved at an incredible rate in just months. I mean he shot 28% from 3 in his sophmore season with the 3 ball a full step in. He never shot better than 43% in his 3 years from the field. He was listed as a deep 2nd round pick until late in his last year where he shot up. At the time I thought we could use a 6-11 skill PF with Amare Kenyon hurt we lost KT Rasheed--and while I think THJ is a stud--I also think when Muscala gets to the NBA he will be a really good player in 2 years.

RIP Crushalot😞
yellowboy90
Posts: 33942
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 4/23/2011
Member: #3538

1/31/2014  12:28 PM
BRIGGS wrote:
LivingLegend wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:Has a chance to be a n NBA all star SG one day. That was really the best pick weve made in years

You really didn't like this pick Briggs.

What were your reservations about him and where has he surprised you at this point?

I seem to recall you didn't like his size, athleticism or his ability to get the basket.

The player you see on the Knicks was not the player who played at Michigan. He looks much more explosive with a shot that has improved at an incredible rate in just months. I mean he shot 28% from 3 in his sophmore season with the 3 ball a full step in. He never shot better than 43% in his 3 years from the field. He was listed as a deep 2nd round pick until late in his last year where he shot up. At the time I thought we could use a 6-11 skill PF with Amare Kenyon hurt we lost KT Rasheed--and while I think THJ is a stud--I also think when Muscala gets to the NBA he will be a really good player in 2 years.

Those are just raw numbers. When you pick a player you need to go deeper. Thats where advance stats like a player's synergy profile comes in handy to see how a player might do in a specific role. Especially comparing guarded and unguarded shooting, pull ups, rim%, and etc.

I think people need to be reminded that Hardaway had troubles with consistency from year to year but hopefully he puts in the work to continue to develop as a pro.

BRIGGS
Posts: 53275
Alba Posts: 7
Joined: 7/30/2002
Member: #303
2/1/2014  1:23 PM
yellowboy90 wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:
LivingLegend wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:Has a chance to be a n NBA all star SG one day. That was really the best pick weve made in years

You really didn't like this pick Briggs.

What were your reservations about him and where has he surprised you at this point?

I seem to recall you didn't like his size, athleticism or his ability to get the basket.

The player you see on the Knicks was not the player who played at Michigan. He looks much more explosive with a shot that has improved at an incredible rate in just months. I mean he shot 28% from 3 in his sophmore season with the 3 ball a full step in. He never shot better than 43% in his 3 years from the field. He was listed as a deep 2nd round pick until late in his last year where he shot up. At the time I thought we could use a 6-11 skill PF with Amare Kenyon hurt we lost KT Rasheed--and while I think THJ is a stud--I also think when Muscala gets to the NBA he will be a really good player in 2 years.

Those are just raw numbers. When you pick a player you need to go deeper. Thats where advance stats like a player's synergy profile comes in handy to see how a player might do in a specific role. Especially comparing guarded and unguarded shooting, pull ups, rim%, and etc.

I think people need to be reminded that Hardaway had troubles with consistency from year to year but hopefully he puts in the work to continue to develop as a pro.

raw numbers--thats his play--thats his %. did you watch Tim Hardaway in college? He wasnt even draft pick until mid way through his junior year--he wouldve went undrafted the previous year. The 23 teams before the Knicks went for different SG's. The bottom line with the eye test is Tim Hardaway JR has simply elevated his skill level in the last 6-9 months in a way not too many people wouldve believed. The Knicks have made 2 great draft picks in the last 10 years David lee and I think Hardaway will be there--hes not going anywhere but getting better. The Knicks have drafted a ton of scrubs who showed promise and dissapeared--lets be thankful they got this one and that Dolan doesnt trade him for Andre Miller.

RIP Crushalot😞
misterearl
Posts: 38786
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 11/16/2004
Member: #799
USA
2/1/2014  1:58 PM    LAST EDITED: 2/1/2014  2:03 PM
The draft is a certified crapshoot

BRIGGS - there is no measure for a mans desire, passion for learning or parental influence.

There is no measure for his ability to adapt, improvise or process what a vet tells him during a timeout.

There is no measure for what percentage of information shared by his coaches, actually remains in his memory.

There is no measure for the height of his hilarious high step routine, leaping from the bench, after a JRSmith revese dunk

There is no measure for courage, playing in front of 19,763 high paying patrons, at the worlds most famous arena.

In 1980, Joe Barry Carroll was the first player selected.

Silly wabbit, college metrics are for kids

once a knick always a knick
gunsnewing
Posts: 55076
Alba Posts: 5
Joined: 2/24/2002
Member: #215
USA
2/1/2014  2:02 PM
Draft is a crapshoot but I rather take a chance on a cheap unknown then an expensive known like Amare
misterearl
Posts: 38786
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 11/16/2004
Member: #799
USA
2/1/2014  2:06 PM    LAST EDITED: 2/1/2014  2:06 PM
gunsnewing - In the 2002 NBA Draft, our beloved Knicks selected Nene with the seventh pick, while the Phoenix Suns took Amare Stoudemire with the ninth pick.

Nene turned out to become one of the better players the Knicks drafted in the first round, but he did not play one game for the franchise.

You so the math

once a knick always a knick
fitzfarm
Posts: 25165
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 10/28/2010
Member: #3285

2/1/2014  2:25 PM
I love thjr he would be a top five pick he's got a 5 tool offensive game, 3point shooter, mid range,transition,driver,can get to the line... Thjr will be a all star as long as he is healthy... Ultimate payback to hardaway sr. That his son is killing it with the Knicks.. I'm sure thjr is loving it too
Tim Hardaway

©2001-2025 ultimateknicks.comm All rights reserved. About Us.
This site is not affiliated with the NY Knicks or the National Basketball Association in any way.
You may visit the official NY Knicks web site by clicking here.

All times (GMT-05:00) Eastern Time.

Terms of Use and Privacy Policy