This is the reason why it is so important to hold others accountable and not allow them to get comfortable and settle on losing.

I know being critical is hard for some but if an athletics doesn't have tough skin then he doesn't belongs in New York.

Fans should not get upset when others are critical. Just be grateful that someone is actually seeing what is really happening on and off the court. Knicks will be better for it

gunsnewing wrote:Melo to Felton for the 3 and the lead

Yeaa Melo has no one to pass to. That's why he never passed prior to these past 2 weeks

You can't be serious with this post. You were one of the main posters on this board roasting Felton every chance you got because we lost Lin. Now, you want to pat Felton on the back as way to nudge Melo....Amazing!!!

Uptown wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:Melo to Felton for the 3 and the lead

Yeaa Melo has no one to pass to. That's why he never passed prior to these past 2 weeks

You can't be serious with this post. You were one of the main posters on this board roasting Felton every chance you got because we lost Lin. Now, you want to pat Felton on the back as way to nudge Melo....Amazing!!!

If Melo plays this way for the rest of his career I would consider bringing him back but only at the $18-20mil range so we can actually make moves to elevate the team to contender status

fishmike wrote:

dk7th wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

jrodmc wrote:

H1AND1 wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:

jrodmc wrote:

fishmike wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

Uptown wrote:

fishmike wrote:I thought he was pretty awsome last year also. He and MDA didnt work. Once that situation dissolved Melo has been a top 10 player for the Knicks, hands down. Only donkeys and tfk cant see that

Seriously...Dude was top 5 in MVP voting and helped us win the division with 54 wins.

MVP voting is basically by ill-informed casual observers.
Any statistically informed analysis at this point would indicate that Melo is still not a superstar but he is playing at a reasonably high level.

Stats are good for the ill-informed who don't understand the game and grope to quantify. Those who do understand can use their eyes and see what's happening.

Bonn's not a donkey or ill-informed. He's just a FG% lover/sort of closet Melo hater. I don't think Melo killed his dog, ala tkf, but it must be something personal. I'm guessing it's probably the headband, some deep-seated sort of Slick Watts Halloween nightmare thing.

FG% loving is okay, Barkley shot .600 and averaged at or over .500 for his career and never won sheet. FG% is great for Shaq's and Gilmore's who spend huge amounts of time in the paint. Melo loves the perimeter and will shoot first, always. It's the NBA, you only get to shoot high % at the free throw line. Or if you're Lebron or Durant getting superstar calls day in and day out. Which gets you to the line.

well to be accurate Bonn is not in love with fg%. He is more of an advance stat guy. He is the Lt. Chris Sabian of advance stats, imo.

I think what jrod meant was that Bonn was a hater of the FG% lover...

No, what jrod meant is that Bonn is a hater of the Melo lover... If Melo suddenly became authentically 'efficient' (say 51% shooting) things would get very interesting around here for Mr. Advanced Stat. Of course, it's not like that's going to happen, but hey, Bonn already begrudgingly loves the Melo improved rebounding.

You seem to mis-perceive a lot of what I write. I'm definitely happy with the improvement in Melo's turnovers and if it lasts, in his rebounding. There wouldn't be anything interesting or dramatic if Melo had a long-term improvement in his scoring efficiency. I would just declare that I was happy with it - like I've done for the improvement in turnover rate.
Likewise, if there's a long-term deterioration, I won't ignore it or blame his teammates like a few here do.

let me ask you this: if he remains inefficient, and by inefficient i mean he takes 4-6 too many shots a game that are just bad shots-- then isn't he taking away better shot opportunities from teammates?

i just don't think you get anywhere substantive in the playoffs with a guy taking over 17-18 shots a game.

yes! You nailed it!!!!

Just which teammate is Melo stealing these shots from now????
Bargs? 44%
JR? 35%
Ray 39%
Shump? 39%
Beno? 43%
RonRon? 39%

Now if you can produce vaginametrics that prove everytime Melo takes a shot he's taking it from one of the two guys who shoot well on the team then yea... he's hurting us. Otherwise I would generally say that Melo taking the volume of the shots is a positive.

Lets also ignore that Melo's averaging almost 9 boards a game and for a guy who puts it on the floor so much he doesnt turn it over. Quite a bit less then Lebron and KD.

dk7th wrote:

meloanyk wrote:

fishmike wrote:

dk7th wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

jrodmc wrote:

H1AND1 wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:

jrodmc wrote:

fishmike wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

Uptown wrote:

fishmike wrote:I thought he was pretty awsome last year also. He and MDA didnt work. Once that situation dissolved Melo has been a top 10 player for the Knicks, hands down. Only donkeys and tfk cant see that

Seriously...Dude was top 5 in MVP voting and helped us win the division with 54 wins.

MVP voting is basically by ill-informed casual observers.
Any statistically informed analysis at this point would indicate that Melo is still not a superstar but he is playing at a reasonably high level.

Stats are good for the ill-informed who don't understand the game and grope to quantify. Those who do understand can use their eyes and see what's happening.

Bonn's not a donkey or ill-informed. He's just a FG% lover/sort of closet Melo hater. I don't think Melo killed his dog, ala tkf, but it must be something personal. I'm guessing it's probably the headband, some deep-seated sort of Slick Watts Halloween nightmare thing.

FG% loving is okay, Barkley shot .600 and averaged at or over .500 for his career and never won sheet. FG% is great for Shaq's and Gilmore's who spend huge amounts of time in the paint. Melo loves the perimeter and will shoot first, always. It's the NBA, you only get to shoot high % at the free throw line. Or if you're Lebron or Durant getting superstar calls day in and day out. Which gets you to the line.

well to be accurate Bonn is not in love with fg%. He is more of an advance stat guy. He is the Lt. Chris Sabian of advance stats, imo.

I think what jrod meant was that Bonn was a hater of the FG% lover...

No, what jrod meant is that Bonn is a hater of the Melo lover... If Melo suddenly became authentically 'efficient' (say 51% shooting) things would get very interesting around here for Mr. Advanced Stat. Of course, it's not like that's going to happen, but hey, Bonn already begrudgingly loves the Melo improved rebounding.

You seem to mis-perceive a lot of what I write. I'm definitely happy with the improvement in Melo's turnovers and if it lasts, in his rebounding. There wouldn't be anything interesting or dramatic if Melo had a long-term improvement in his scoring efficiency. I would just declare that I was happy with it - like I've done for the improvement in turnover rate.
Likewise, if there's a long-term deterioration, I won't ignore it or blame his teammates like a few here do.

let me ask you this: if he remains inefficient, and by inefficient i mean he takes 4-6 too many shots a game that are just bad shots-- then isn't he taking away better shot opportunities from teammates?

i just don't think you get anywhere substantive in the playoffs with a guy taking over 17-18 shots a game.

yes! You nailed it!!!!

Just which teammate is Melo stealing these shots from now????
Bargs? 44%
JR? 35%
Ray 39%
Shump? 39%
Beno? 43%
RonRon? 39%

Now if you can produce vaginametrics that prove everytime Melo takes a shot he's taking it from one of the two guys who shoot well on the team then yea... he's hurting us. Otherwise I would generally say that Melo taking the volume of the shots is a positive.

Lets also ignore that Melo's averaging almost 9 boards a game and for a guy who puts it on the floor so much he doesnt turn it over. Quite a bit less then Lebron and KD.

Exactly. Melo surrounded by offensive mediocrity and complainers complain. Melo certainly guilty of occasionally taking some very questionable shots like many scorers but he's a star who has busted his sss and not acted like a diva. Scores in and out, boards and competes defensively and is a likewable teammate. Could he be more efficient ? Put some opffensive talent around him and find out.NYK is fortunate to have him, be a terrible team without

stop complaining about his "help" and "supporting cast." it's a lame-assed excuse you are making for a guy who overvalued himself so much that he ruined the team he wanted to come to. he could have had a better team if he weren't a greedy selfish douche!

dk7th wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

dk7th wrote:

meloanyk wrote:

fishmike wrote:

dk7th wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

jrodmc wrote:

H1AND1 wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:

jrodmc wrote:

fishmike wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

Uptown wrote:

fishmike wrote:I thought he was pretty awsome last year also. He and MDA didnt work. Once that situation dissolved Melo has been a top 10 player for the Knicks, hands down. Only donkeys and tfk cant see that

Seriously...Dude was top 5 in MVP voting and helped us win the division with 54 wins.

MVP voting is basically by ill-informed casual observers.
Any statistically informed analysis at this point would indicate that Melo is still not a superstar but he is playing at a reasonably high level.

Stats are good for the ill-informed who don't understand the game and grope to quantify. Those who do understand can use their eyes and see what's happening.

Bonn's not a donkey or ill-informed. He's just a FG% lover/sort of closet Melo hater. I don't think Melo killed his dog, ala tkf, but it must be something personal. I'm guessing it's probably the headband, some deep-seated sort of Slick Watts Halloween nightmare thing.

FG% loving is okay, Barkley shot .600 and averaged at or over .500 for his career and never won sheet. FG% is great for Shaq's and Gilmore's who spend huge amounts of time in the paint. Melo loves the perimeter and will shoot first, always. It's the NBA, you only get to shoot high % at the free throw line. Or if you're Lebron or Durant getting superstar calls day in and day out. Which gets you to the line.

well to be accurate Bonn is not in love with fg%. He is more of an advance stat guy. He is the Lt. Chris Sabian of advance stats, imo.

I think what jrod meant was that Bonn was a hater of the FG% lover...

No, what jrod meant is that Bonn is a hater of the Melo lover... If Melo suddenly became authentically 'efficient' (say 51% shooting) things would get very interesting around here for Mr. Advanced Stat. Of course, it's not like that's going to happen, but hey, Bonn already begrudgingly loves the Melo improved rebounding.

You seem to mis-perceive a lot of what I write. I'm definitely happy with the improvement in Melo's turnovers and if it lasts, in his rebounding. There wouldn't be anything interesting or dramatic if Melo had a long-term improvement in his scoring efficiency. I would just declare that I was happy with it - like I've done for the improvement in turnover rate.
Likewise, if there's a long-term deterioration, I won't ignore it or blame his teammates like a few here do.

let me ask you this: if he remains inefficient, and by inefficient i mean he takes 4-6 too many shots a game that are just bad shots-- then isn't he taking away better shot opportunities from teammates?

i just don't think you get anywhere substantive in the playoffs with a guy taking over 17-18 shots a game.

yes! You nailed it!!!!

Just which teammate is Melo stealing these shots from now????
Bargs? 44%
JR? 35%
Ray 39%
Shump? 39%
Beno? 43%
RonRon? 39%

Now if you can produce vaginametrics that prove everytime Melo takes a shot he's taking it from one of the two guys who shoot well on the team then yea... he's hurting us. Otherwise I would generally say that Melo taking the volume of the shots is a positive.

Lets also ignore that Melo's averaging almost 9 boards a game and for a guy who puts it on the floor so much he doesnt turn it over. Quite a bit less then Lebron and KD.

Exactly. Melo surrounded by offensive mediocrity and complainers complain. Melo certainly guilty of occasionally taking some very questionable shots like many scorers but he's a star who has busted his sss and not acted like a diva. Scores in and out, boards and competes defensively and is a likewable teammate. Could he be more efficient ? Put some opffensive talent around him and find out.NYK is fortunate to have him, be a terrible team without

stop complaining about his "help" and "supporting cast." it's a lame-assed excuse you are making for a guy who overvalued himself so much that he ruined the team he wanted to come to. he could have had a better team if he weren't a greedy selfish douche!

Quick question. Some posters said they weren't watching games because the season was going so bad. Thought you were in that group. Are you watching games?

i will not invest myself in watching knick games fully and consistently-- something i did last season-- until they reach .500. the team is guilty until proven innocent and they have to earn my respect as a student of the game. i put my time in last season and they proved to be a fool's gold squad... as i had warned all regular season long. sometimes being a fan and being a student of the game are going to be congruent and sometimes not. right now they're not.

i am a native new yorker, i love good basketball, and the frazier-led 1973 team as well as my personal training and coaching in the sport is part of my basketball dna and my outlook, informing absolutely everything i see. my BBIQ and my eye-test eyes are better than most and my appreciation for advanced stats support these attributes. and, unlike most spectators, i put a premium on alchemy and synergy.

since i know where you are going with this, i will say that i don't give a rat's ass what you or anybody else thinks about whether i watch the games. the knicks need to earn my respect and reaching .500 is a start.

fishmike wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

dk7th wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

dk7th wrote:

meloanyk wrote:

fishmike wrote:

dk7th wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

jrodmc wrote:

H1AND1 wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:

jrodmc wrote:

fishmike wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

Uptown wrote:

fishmike wrote:I thought he was pretty awsome last year also. He and MDA didnt work. Once that situation dissolved Melo has been a top 10 player for the Knicks, hands down. Only donkeys and tfk cant see that

Seriously...Dude was top 5 in MVP voting and helped us win the division with 54 wins.

MVP voting is basically by ill-informed casual observers.
Any statistically informed analysis at this point would indicate that Melo is still not a superstar but he is playing at a reasonably high level.

Stats are good for the ill-informed who don't understand the game and grope to quantify. Those who do understand can use their eyes and see what's happening.

Bonn's not a donkey or ill-informed. He's just a FG% lover/sort of closet Melo hater. I don't think Melo killed his dog, ala tkf, but it must be something personal. I'm guessing it's probably the headband, some deep-seated sort of Slick Watts Halloween nightmare thing.

FG% loving is okay, Barkley shot .600 and averaged at or over .500 for his career and never won sheet. FG% is great for Shaq's and Gilmore's who spend huge amounts of time in the paint. Melo loves the perimeter and will shoot first, always. It's the NBA, you only get to shoot high % at the free throw line. Or if you're Lebron or Durant getting superstar calls day in and day out. Which gets you to the line.

well to be accurate Bonn is not in love with fg%. He is more of an advance stat guy. He is the Lt. Chris Sabian of advance stats, imo.

I think what jrod meant was that Bonn was a hater of the FG% lover...

No, what jrod meant is that Bonn is a hater of the Melo lover... If Melo suddenly became authentically 'efficient' (say 51% shooting) things would get very interesting around here for Mr. Advanced Stat. Of course, it's not like that's going to happen, but hey, Bonn already begrudgingly loves the Melo improved rebounding.

You seem to mis-perceive a lot of what I write. I'm definitely happy with the improvement in Melo's turnovers and if it lasts, in his rebounding. There wouldn't be anything interesting or dramatic if Melo had a long-term improvement in his scoring efficiency. I would just declare that I was happy with it - like I've done for the improvement in turnover rate.
Likewise, if there's a long-term deterioration, I won't ignore it or blame his teammates like a few here do.

let me ask you this: if he remains inefficient, and by inefficient i mean he takes 4-6 too many shots a game that are just bad shots-- then isn't he taking away better shot opportunities from teammates?

i just don't think you get anywhere substantive in the playoffs with a guy taking over 17-18 shots a game.

yes! You nailed it!!!!

Just which teammate is Melo stealing these shots from now????
Bargs? 44%
JR? 35%
Ray 39%
Shump? 39%
Beno? 43%
RonRon? 39%

Now if you can produce vaginametrics that prove everytime Melo takes a shot he's taking it from one of the two guys who shoot well on the team then yea... he's hurting us. Otherwise I would generally say that Melo taking the volume of the shots is a positive.

Lets also ignore that Melo's averaging almost 9 boards a game and for a guy who puts it on the floor so much he doesnt turn it over. Quite a bit less then Lebron and KD.

Exactly. Melo surrounded by offensive mediocrity and complainers complain. Melo certainly guilty of occasionally taking some very questionable shots like many scorers but he's a star who has busted his sss and not acted like a diva. Scores in and out, boards and competes defensively and is a likewable teammate. Could he be more efficient ? Put some opffensive talent around him and find out.NYK is fortunate to have him, be a terrible team without

stop complaining about his "help" and "supporting cast." it's a lame-assed excuse you are making for a guy who overvalued himself so much that he ruined the team he wanted to come to. he could have had a better team if he weren't a greedy selfish douche!

Quick question. Some posters said they weren't watching games because the season was going so bad. Thought you were in that group. Are you watching games?

i will not invest myself in watching knick games fully and consistently-- something i did last season-- until they reach .500. the team is guilty until proven innocent and they have to earn my respect as a student of the game. i put my time in last season and they proved to be a fool's gold squad... as i had warned all regular season long. sometimes being a fan and being a student of the game are going to be congruent and sometimes not. right now they're not.

i am a native new yorker, i love good basketball, and the frazier-led 1973 team as well as my personal training and coaching in the sport is part of my basketball dna and my outlook, informing absolutely everything i see. my BBIQ and my eye-test eyes are better than most and my appreciation for advanced stats support these attributes. and, unlike most spectators, i put a premium on alchemy and synergy.

since i know where you are going with this, i will say that i don't give a rat's ass what you or anybody else thinks about whether i watch the games. the knicks need to earn my respect and reaching .500 is a start.

Cool. Just wanted to know if you missed Amare's missed dunk, Bargs wide open mid range shot, shumps wide open jumper etc when you were criticizing the guy you hate. It gives a lot of insight into a very flawed perspective. I think you are missing a lot of good team basketball (alchemy and synergy). I have heard about your eyes and how they can diagnose the impact of torn labrums and rotator cuffs on a players shot but if I am correct your eyes are currently focused in on box scores and not games. Would love to hear more about your coaching and what hospital you were born in since that is an important part of your resume as a basketball expert.

you could have saved yourself 3 minutes of typing and just called him a donkey

ahhh, it's okay. He can't hold tkf's jock when it comes to donkeyisms.

This, however is priceless:

gunsnewing wrote:Melo heard the crictism from print media, radio, espn and fans. He heard that the Knicks were considering trading him for Blake. He heard all the talk about how the Knicks are going nowhere riding him alone. He is on a mission to prove everyone wrong.
This is the reason why it is so important to hold others accountable and not allow them to get comfortable and settle on losing.

I know being critical is hard for some but if an athletics doesn't have tough skin then he doesn't belongs in New York.

Fans should not get upset when others are critical. Just be grateful that someone is actually seeing what is really happening on and off the court. Knicks will be better for it

We now have a poster who goes beyond having just a true hold on "actual" reality. We have a poster who is omnicient, who reads Melo's thoughts and hears what Melo actually hears. And uses this omniscience to validate his own worldview by taking credit for success. For Melo performing, for the sun rising.

This is true genius.