holfresh wrote:

Dagger wrote:

Papabear wrote:

Dagger wrote:

Papabear wrote:

Dagger wrote:

Finestrg wrote:This stuff kills me....Why say something like that -- something that will obviously rub a lot of people the wrong way???? Just like JR saying he wasn't gonna tell anyone the full extent of his knee injury until after he signed a deal with someone. Huh? WTF bro -- WHY SAY THAT?!?!?!? If Melo feels that way, great--it's his right that he's earned, just keep it to yourself. I don't wanna hear stuff like this, not this close to the start of the season... All I want to hear outta these jokers is talk about winning, winning the Atlantic, winning a friggin' title. NOTHING ELSE!! Shit man, and I love Melo. Why throw out a bad vibe like that, that you're contemplating leaving, could possibly leave?? I know that's not technically what he said but still man. Come on -- this close to the start of the season??? Nobody -- from the fans, to Knicks mgmt. wants to hear that right now. I'd like to see some of these guys resist whatever a guy like Marc Berman tries to stir up when he sticks a tape recorder in their face. The correct answer here: "I'll cross that bridge when I get to it. Right now, I'm committed to the NY Knicks and to winning."

To answer your question, there are two reasons someone says this. 1) The player is stupid or not well-rehearsed in media relations 2) the player cares more about money than winning

My biggest fear in all of this is not that we lose Melo,it's that I know when the times comes Knicks management won't have the balls to take a hard stance and say 17 mil/year or you're out of here.

Papabear Says

No I disagree with your comment. If Melo want to win a championship or come close to winning one. Now one will have to ask him he will just be willing to do that. Something you must understand though. Leborn have many endorsements. I LeBron gave up his whole salary he would still be making crazy money. Thats not the same for Melo. No if the right piece comes available Melo might jump. I don't think that Melo is very happy with this team and because of Amare's injury and the money Amare is taking we could have gotten 2 very good players with Amares money. I don't think Melo will see crazy money offers from teams who have a big payroll. It will be from team who don't have a chance to win anyway.

Why do you think Lebron makes so much money in endorsements? Because he's better at basketball than Melo. If Melo were that good then he would be raking in that much money in endorsement deals as well. This isn't some rigged system where everything is stacked against melo like it seems to be in your head, if Melo were better he'd have more endorsements, but he's not the best player in the league so he doesn't get the same draw. Besides the dude is a top level ambassador of the Jordan brand anyway, it's not like sponsors are ignoring him. Melo is not some average income dude that needs the money to feed his kids, no family I know can't be fed on a budget of 17 MILLION DOLLARS. With the enormous wealth Melo has acquired in his career he's very well off, he has nothing to worry about financially. He can take 17mil and play for us, or he can play for the bobcats for the max he can get and be labeled as a greedy loser.

Papabear Says

You answered your on question or this boards discussion. Yes LeBron is making more money because he is a better player and he has many endorsements. So why should Melo give up his money if thats all he is going to make? Don't you think he should get what he can just like everyone else?

You're missing the point, what do you mean all he is going to make? He doesn't deserve to make more because he's not good enough to warrant getting more money. The dude is filthy rich, I couldn't care less how much money he makes, if you care about winning in Melo's position you don't take 29 million a year. Do you know how much the salary cap in the NBA is? If you did know you'd realize how crippling 30 million to ONE PLAYER is. The Knicks already made a big sacrifice to ensure Melo gets all his money via the trade, or did you forget? If he can't even get us to the ECF why on earth does he deserve the opportunity to demand an even higher max contract again in his older years? I've said it a million times about Amar'e and I'll say it about Melo, we don't owe him anything! Patrick Ewing, Clyde Frazier, Willis Reed those are the players that you owe as an organization, the ones that shape team history. Melo gets to the ECF or Finals and makes things competitive then well see about his pay raise.

Making more money is winning...

Yes, if you're a greedy player that doesn't care about team success that is true.

Clean wrote:Melo is an easy nut to crack. To know what his actions will be in the future just ask yourself 1 question. What will make him the most money? Every decision in his NBA career was done for max money. I said this last season and it still holds true today. Different players have different motivations. Melo's motivation is money. I am not angry at that fact , that is his decision to make. I just ask you not to be surprised when that is the direction he goes in.

No sane person is going to blame Melo. This is on the Knicks to make the right decision for the next 7years. And history proves the Knicks won't do the right thing. Especially with Mills back in the fold. Grunwald would've probably tried to convince Dolan to trade Melo but then he would be fired immediately. Oh wait he was fired

Dagger wrote:

smackeddog wrote:

Dagger wrote:

To answer your question, there are two reasons someone says this. 1) The player is stupid or not well-rehearsed in media relations 2) the player cares more about money than winning

Actually its:

3) the players agent is using a negotiating ploy.

Melo's not really doing anything wrong here, or anything different from most players. Even the beloved Paul George pretended he was going to sign with the Lakers when he became a FA, in order to push the Pacers along in negotiations for an extension now.

Has no one who's having a nervous breakdown about this ever negotiated in their life? If at work you could get paid say $15mil a year, but if you pretended you were leaving to join another employer, your current employer would pay you $25mil to do the same job- are you honestly telling me you wouldn't do it?!

The problem is Dolan- he is the world worst negotiator. CAA know his history and they know after all the money he's spent on the MSG refurb, he can't afford to not have a 'star' player, especially at the current ticket prices.

It's not the announcemenment itself I was criticizing, it's the timing. There is no advantage to saying this right before the start of the season, you wait till the appropriate time comes and then you say this stuff. At this point in time it only serves as a distraction for the organization.

Besides, your answer falls in line with reason #2 quite nicely, in that he's only looking out for the money.

And how many nba players aren't? Why are people making out that Melo is the only player to try and get the most money he can? Did everyone forget that the beloved Roy Hibbert signed an offer sheet with the Blazers and asked the pacers not to match. Then when they did, said that it had just been a negotiating thing. Is he a greedy monster like Melo? Sheesh.

fishmike wrote:

nyk4ever wrote:i'm not mad at melo for opting out or for getting the most money he can get - if anyone of us was in that position we'd do the same thing. personally i don't see him leaving 30million on the table and going elsewhere but i'm fine with calling his bluff and letting him explore other opportunities. if he ends up signing somewhere else, so be it, it'll open a boatload of money for us to sign some other guys.

realy? Cause I just took some less money to be in a better workplace, better culture, better quality of life. Some other players have done that as well. Lebron, Duncan, Wade all come to mind..

Melo leaving would help the Knicks. Then they can gut and clean up after next year. Get a good pick, build up the roster and have enough to sign 2 max guys in one shot.

OR

We could could pay Melo like Kobe and watch him lead us to 45-55 wins each year and shoot us right out of the playoffs when he has his usual 10-35 shooting games in the playoffs, BUT he will average 30ppg and say he cant do it all himself. Doesnt really strike me as terribly exciting.

i get what you're saying fish - i've sacrificed a few thousand dollars myself for better peace of mind at work and lifestyle, but i don't think many of us here turned down an extra 30mil. it's apples and oranges though i know, but i get what you're saying.

i absolutely agree with your post though, thats why i have no problem calling his bluff. if he leaves, he leaves, we'll find someone else. and i like melo - i just dont think him taking up EVEN MORE of our cap is going to help us win anything, infact it's going to deter us from winning anything. so you know what, go ahead, go play somewhere else for less money. if he's willing to take a smaller contract elsewhere he should be willing to do the same thing here to help his "hometown" team win.

holfresh wrote:

Also they praise Bron and Wade for taking less money...They shaved 1 to 2 mil per year off their salaries knowing that when they win Championships, their endorsement deals ratchets up higher, in a way their NBA salaries could never do..It now cost a fortune to sign these guys to endorsement deals..But they don't care about the money, they care about winning, they took less to play together, one love...

I think it's wonderful to have found a forum in which only selfless monks post- it seems like most of the people up in arms on this thread are uninterested in material wealth. If they were offered $30million or so, they would refuse it in order to be loyal. If all they had to do was pretend they were leaving their current job and they would get a significant pay rise, they would all refuse and would instead work for less in order to make a stand against greed.

It's really heart warming stuff.

toad wrote:I don't have a problem with Melo looking for top dollar. The problem is that we have a front office that is more concerned about keeping CAA and Melo happy than producing a championship basketball team. Trying to build around a maxed out Melo is not going to get us far.

this stance and the others like it on this thread seem pretty reasonable.

makes sense for Melo to look for the biggest payday he can. this is gonna be his last big contract.

may not make the most sense to basically repeat the same mistakes the Yankees did with ARod. blech. Dolan is sucking the life out of my love for the Knicks.

smackeddog wrote:

Dagger wrote:

The only people that love Hibbert are Pacer homers, and yes his contract is inflated and is hurting the Pacers. It's not about what is expected of melo, I know he won't sit there and say I want 20 mil a year instead of 29. It's on the Knicks management to take a hard stance with him and say it's 20 mil or you pack your bags. If we lose Melo then we lose him, but any salary cap sport is about getting bang for your buck and you're not getting that with 34 year old melo at 30m. Do I expect melo to take a paycut? Absolutely not. Do I think if he truly cared about winning he would accept a little less money when told by management that was his only chance to stay a Knick? Yes, but he doesn't, so we'll be better off just letting him walk. You say the players you mentioned only took less money because they could make more money in endorsements if they win the championship. Well guess what, if Melo took less money he could win a championship and make the same money in endorsements as a result. After all, it's legacies and winning that build up endorsements in reality, so it would be nice if melo could realize that a sacrifice he makes in the short-run would be a win-win in the long run,with more money and a stronger legacy when he retires as a result (and elevated status, we all know melo loves his celebrity status). If Melo really puts on a show this year, such as a STRONG performance in a long ECF or Finals then I'm alright with him getting all this money. But until he proves we can have real success with him as the best player on the team I don't think that commitment is wise.

I pretty much agree with everything you've said here. I see the value in Melo, but I don't want to be paying him $30mil a year when he's 34, 35 (or even 31!). This new CBA is brutal, and we're coming up for a new one in few years- who knows if that will be even worse (hello hard cap!). I don't think Melo is evil for trying to maximize his earnings, but I do hope he is willing to take a bit less to increase our ability to sign other players.

A hard cap would be devastating for the Knicks, just awful to the point where we wouldn't be able to field a good team until Dolan left. Hard caps require very shrewd personnel decisions to deal with successfully and there's no way we would be able to thrive in that situation with Jimmy breathing down everyone's neck every time a decision is made. If the league implements a hard cap I really hope they raise the cap limit substantially for our sake.