Knixkik wrote:

unstopaball12 wrote:We have more dimensions to our offense right now and have become younger at the same time, while having a smarter Shumpert and a hungrier Carmelo.

Line up should be

C:Chandler/Kmart
Pf:Bargs/Amare
SF:Melo/Metta/leslie
SG:Shumpert/Smith/Hardaway
PG: Felton/Prigioni

Jennings,Tyler,Murry,Sims,Jordan and some random training camp invite should round out the last 3 spots.

The roster is really starting to take shape. Looks like it could potentially be:

C Chandler/Martin/Tyler
PF Bargnani/Stoudemire
SF Anthony/MWP/Leslie
SG Shumpert/Smith/Hardaway jr.
PG Felton/Prigioni/Bobby Brown?

15th spot could be left open for impressive training camp invite or late free agent that fell thru the cracks (similar to how we got Brewer.)

Still need to shore up some of these moves, but i like the way this roster is shaping up if some of the above anticipated signings get done. We got a lot younger and will have a nice mix of veterans and young prospects, something we really lacked last season.

I know he is going to be dogged and ponyed out there for show, but when I see Melo, Bargs, Artest, and Kmart on the roster(mostly likely anyway) I see four guys who play Amare's roll as a 4.

My guess would be with everybody back:
C Chandler/Martin/Stoudemire
PF Bargnani/MWP/Stoudemire
SF Anthony/Smith
SG Shumpert/Prigioni
PG Felton//Bobby Brown

Bench:
Hardaway jr./Tyler/Maybe Murry
DLeague:
C.J. Leslie

RonRon wrote:

nixluva wrote:

Vmart wrote:There is no way this team is better than next year. They already said that they are playing for playoffs and not pushing it to win the division like last year.

They can say that, but really until they hit the floor you don't know how this improved roster will perform. They likely won't have to push the pedal to the metal with a deeper and younger roster. We've got to remember that the Knicks are a talented team and only the top tier teams are equally talented or more talented. The Knicks are going to win games simply by virtue of being a superior team to most of the league. That hasn't changed from last year IMO.

This team is likely to go into this season much stronger than last season but returning most of the core that did so well last year. They will likely be stronger in the playoffs than they were this year when they wore down. That is being underestimated IMO.

What do you think about our coaching, our coaching philosophy on both OFFENSE and DEFENSE, our rotations, the way Woodson utilized his players/favors certain players/ and does not utilize players that show the ability to contribute?

It sure helps when we add the talent that is needed to contribute in a high level but if Woodson continues his stubborn rotations, allows too much ISO, and favors veterans over talent, I just do not see us improving when it counts MOST, in the play offs

Woodson does not see Melo and JR taking 30 shots a night and hitting 30% of it as a problem, he needs to come up with a much more efficient game plan to utilizes all players on the floor as options
He cannot talk about playing quality DEF, while playing Amare, Pablo, Barg's, and players that cannot DEFEND their positions like Felton *when he cannot defend PG's or SGs*, Chandler *when Hibbert abused him*, Iman *when he plays SF*, Melo when he plays *PF*, and Kmart when he plays C vs Bulls, Pacers, and Nets

He needs to realize that he has holes and weakness's in his players, more importantly holes in his philosophies on both OFF and WEAKNESS
He needs to realize that he is too stubborn and needs to develop the younger players's confidence and skills, while giving them the chance to make mistakes and correcting them
He needs to add a different element when the playoff begins, not rely on ISO play, like with Vogul, he hid Hibbert's ability to post up and utilized it much more in the playoffs
Vogul maximized his philosophy and strength's of the Pacer's

1- Size
2- Athleticism
3- Post up abilities of Hibbert, West, George
4- Penetration ability of Lance, George, and their PG, while having great spacing to use each other's ability as a threat at all times
5- By taking quality shot's, they were able to anticipate and utilize the physical size/athleticism and score on OFFENSIVE BOARDS
6- Now with Copeland and a healthy Granger, I can guarantee you that they will now use 4 shooters to spread the floor with Hibbert's ability to post up 1v1, and not have a EGO issue for the benefit of the team

On DEFENSE, NO ONE CHEATED, outside of Hibbert, and they were all very solid 1v1 DEFENDERS

Woodson must first understand his flaws, then tweak his system, , and I think we need a new assistant coach or maybe even 2, that would maximize the players we have on the court as option
We added Barg's for a reason and even though he has flaws with REB/DEF, he should make the other 4 players maximize their DEF, SIZE, REB, and ALL ROUND SKILLS, as Barg's will either get a wide open shot at C or open the lane for players to cut, penetrate, and/or post up

We cannot live and die on watching Melo go 1v1 with no efficiency, JR must utilize his ability to penetrate/finish/facilitate and not settle on that jumpshot
Had JR played more with Copeland, I believe he would have been able to do it, instead Woodson opted to go with Chandler who struggled throughout the series on BOTH ENDS

After stepping away for a while, I think I have a more nuanced look at Woody's coaching last year. I think the roster was being used perfectly at the start and at the end of the regular season. However, Kidd wore down and Woody failed to address that by giving more minutes to his other guards like Prigs and Shump. There were other similar issues. But I think this year Woody will have so much more flexibility with his roster and more meaningful depth. Literally none of the Knicks this year will be Dead Weight as we saw last year. Almost anyone Woody puts in there will be capable of giving meaningful minutes.

Woody won't have to rely so much on Melo and JR this year. We have different options which we didn't have last year. Teams will not see the same weaknesses this year offensively. To that extent i'm not really worried about Woody at this time. Put together a roster that makes sense and it makes the job easier for the coach.

foosballnick wrote:

RonRon wrote:

nixluva wrote:

Vmart wrote:There is no way this team is better than next year. They already said that they are playing for playoffs and not pushing it to win the division like last year.

They can say that, but really until they hit the floor you don't know how this improved roster will perform. They likely won't have to push the pedal to the metal with a deeper and younger roster. We've got to remember that the Knicks are a talented team and only the top tier teams are equally talented or more talented. The Knicks are going to win games simply by virtue of being a superior team to most of the league. That hasn't changed from last year IMO.

This team is likely to go into this season much stronger than last season but returning most of the core that did so well last year. They will likely be stronger in the playoffs than they were this year when they wore down. That is being underestimated IMO.

What do you think about our coaching, our coaching philosophy on both OFFENSE and DEFENSE, our rotations, the way Woodson utilized his players/favors certain players/ and does not utilize players that show the ability to contribute?

It sure helps when we add the talent that is needed to contribute in a high level but if Woodson continues his stubborn rotations, allows too much ISO, and favors veterans over talent, I just do not see us improving when it counts MOST, in the play offs

Woodson does not see Melo and JR taking 30 shots a night and hitting 30% of it as a problem, he needs to come up with a much more efficient game plan to utilizes all players on the floor as options
He cannot talk about playing quality DEF, while playing Amare, Pablo, Barg's, and players that cannot DEFEND their positions like Felton *when he cannot defend PG's or SGs*, Chandler *when Hibbert abused him*, Iman *when he plays SF*, Melo when he plays *PF*, and Kmart when he plays C vs Bulls, Pacers, and Nets

He needs to realize that he has holes and weakness's in his players, more importantly holes in his philosophies on both OFF and WEAKNESS
He needs to realize that he is too stubborn and needs to develop the younger players's confidence and skills, while giving them the chance to make mistakes and correcting them
He needs to add a different element when the playoff begins, not rely on ISO play, like with Vogul, he hid Hibbert's ability to post up and utilized it much more in the playoffs
Vogul maximized his philosophy and strength's of the Pacer's

1- Size
2- Athleticism
3- Post up abilities of Hibbert, West, George
4- Penetration ability of Lance, George, and their PG, while having great spacing to use each other's ability as a threat at all times
5- By taking quality shot's, they were able to anticipate and utilize the physical size/athleticism and score on OFFENSIVE BOARDS
6- Now with Copeland and a healthy Granger, I can guarantee you that they will now use 4 shooters to spread the floor with Hibbert's ability to post up 1v1, and not have a EGO issue for the benefit of the team

On DEFENSE, NO ONE CHEATED, outside of Hibbert, and they were all very solid 1v1 DEFENDERS

Woodson must first understand his flaws, then tweak his system, , and I think we need a new assistant coach or maybe even 2, that would maximize the players we have on the court as option
We added Barg's for a reason and even though he has flaws with REB/DEF, he should make the other 4 players maximize their DEF, SIZE, REB, and ALL ROUND SKILLS, as Barg's will either get a wide open shot at C or open the lane for players to cut, penetrate, and/or post up

He has the realize that our opponents PG's are easily getting in the paint with our G's unable to stay in front of them and defend them
When they stepped back to defend the drive, they easily took an uncontested wide open 3pter

We cannot live and die on watching Melo go 1v1 with no efficiency, JR must utilize his ability to penetrate/finish/facilitate and not settle on that jumpshot
Had JR played more with Copeland, I believe he would have been able to do it, instead Woodson opted to go with Chandler who struggled throughout the series on BOTH ENDS
JR needs to play with more talented players and allow him to be a facilitator and scorer, not with less talent that will rely on his step back jumper
I believe he played his best ball with Copeland/Kmart at PF/C because of their mobility and ability to spread the floor
He struggled with Tyson because Hibbert was able to defend Tyson and defend the paint, and he had a tough defender in either Lance or George on him

Melo has to learn how to play OFF the ball and concentrate less on always trying to get the ball, rather focusing on other things like REBOUNDS, DEFENSE, FIGHTING FOR POSITION, bringing an element of deception, and hopefully his lessons with Hakeem will allow him to be a much more complete leader/bball player

He needs to make his moves quicker or/and trust in his team mates,
Running plays and with better court spacing, either put himself in a high % consistent shot or creating for his team, and putting him in a position to either score or pass out to someone as an option with mall player movement/picks on and off the ball

I must admit that the moment I saw this post, the first thing I did was to immediately skim it to try and find all the Copeland references.

Let me just focus on one complaint that some Knick fans seem to be obsessing on about Woodson as head coach. Not playing younger players. What they really are referring to is......"not playing Copeland enough". The reason for this is that Cope has almost reached Folk Hero status to the point that some Knick fans now think he will become the face of the Pacers, leading them to the promised land.

Let's get some facts straight about Woodson, Cope and Younger players. Cope as a 29 year old rookie.....is hardly young by NBA standards. Last year the Knicks only had 2 younger players if you include Cope. I seem to recall that Woodson played Shump when he came back from injury. The year prior, Woodson relied on rookies Lin and Shumpert.

During his time as HC in Atlanta, the following players saw significant minutes and roles as Rookies and Younger players (think 23 and under)......

Childress
Josh Smith
Al Horford
Pachulia
Marvin Williams

You may love Copeland, but it is just not true that Woodson avoids younger players.

It has nothing to do with Cope reaching folklore status. If you look at what cope was giving for the last 5 games of regular season you would have thought that Cope would earn some playoff PT. if you saw what Cope,was giving for the year you would have saw 48% FG and 42% three point PG. When you top two scoring options are struggling you would have played Cope more. Woody's dog house mentality is troublesome it has to stop the favoritism has to stop. If JR is hurt why not reduce his minutes and move Shump to SG and let Cope play PF or Sf this would have spread the floor. Lets see what happens withe he Knicks I'm expecting playoffs but that's it I think the team takes a step back, 1st round exit.

Vmart wrote:

foosballnick wrote:

RonRon wrote:

nixluva wrote:

Vmart wrote:There is no way this team is better than next year. They already said that they are playing for playoffs and not pushing it to win the division like last year.

They can say that, but really until they hit the floor you don't know how this improved roster will perform. They likely won't have to push the pedal to the metal with a deeper and younger roster. We've got to remember that the Knicks are a talented team and only the top tier teams are equally talented or more talented. The Knicks are going to win games simply by virtue of being a superior team to most of the league. That hasn't changed from last year IMO.

This team is likely to go into this season much stronger than last season but returning most of the core that did so well last year. They will likely be stronger in the playoffs than they were this year when they wore down. That is being underestimated IMO.

What do you think about our coaching, our coaching philosophy on both OFFENSE and DEFENSE, our rotations, the way Woodson utilized his players/favors certain players/ and does not utilize players that show the ability to contribute?

It sure helps when we add the talent that is needed to contribute in a high level but if Woodson continues his stubborn rotations, allows too much ISO, and favors veterans over talent, I just do not see us improving when it counts MOST, in the play offs

Woodson does not see Melo and JR taking 30 shots a night and hitting 30% of it as a problem, he needs to come up with a much more efficient game plan to utilizes all players on the floor as options
He cannot talk about playing quality DEF, while playing Amare, Pablo, Barg's, and players that cannot DEFEND their positions like Felton *when he cannot defend PG's or SGs*, Chandler *when Hibbert abused him*, Iman *when he plays SF*, Melo when he plays *PF*, and Kmart when he plays C vs Bulls, Pacers, and Nets

He needs to realize that he has holes and weakness's in his players, more importantly holes in his philosophies on both OFF and WEAKNESS
He needs to realize that he is too stubborn and needs to develop the younger players's confidence and skills, while giving them the chance to make mistakes and correcting them
He needs to add a different element when the playoff begins, not rely on ISO play, like with Vogul, he hid Hibbert's ability to post up and utilized it much more in the playoffs
Vogul maximized his philosophy and strength's of the Pacer's

1- Size
2- Athleticism
3- Post up abilities of Hibbert, West, George
4- Penetration ability of Lance, George, and their PG, while having great spacing to use each other's ability as a threat at all times
5- By taking quality shot's, they were able to anticipate and utilize the physical size/athleticism and score on OFFENSIVE BOARDS
6- Now with Copeland and a healthy Granger, I can guarantee you that they will now use 4 shooters to spread the floor with Hibbert's ability to post up 1v1, and not have a EGO issue for the benefit of the team

On DEFENSE, NO ONE CHEATED, outside of Hibbert, and they were all very solid 1v1 DEFENDERS

Woodson must first understand his flaws, then tweak his system, , and I think we need a new assistant coach or maybe even 2, that would maximize the players we have on the court as option
We added Barg's for a reason and even though he has flaws with REB/DEF, he should make the other 4 players maximize their DEF, SIZE, REB, and ALL ROUND SKILLS, as Barg's will either get a wide open shot at C or open the lane for players to cut, penetrate, and/or post up

He has the realize that our opponents PG's are easily getting in the paint with our G's unable to stay in front of them and defend them
When they stepped back to defend the drive, they easily took an uncontested wide open 3pter

We cannot live and die on watching Melo go 1v1 with no efficiency, JR must utilize his ability to penetrate/finish/facilitate and not settle on that jumpshot
Had JR played more with Copeland, I believe he would have been able to do it, instead Woodson opted to go with Chandler who struggled throughout the series on BOTH ENDS
JR needs to play with more talented players and allow him to be a facilitator and scorer, not with less talent that will rely on his step back jumper
I believe he played his best ball with Copeland/Kmart at PF/C because of their mobility and ability to spread the floor
He struggled with Tyson because Hibbert was able to defend Tyson and defend the paint, and he had a tough defender in either Lance or George on him

Melo has to learn how to play OFF the ball and concentrate less on always trying to get the ball, rather focusing on other things like REBOUNDS, DEFENSE, FIGHTING FOR POSITION, bringing an element of deception, and hopefully his lessons with Hakeem will allow him to be a much more complete leader/bball player

He needs to make his moves quicker or/and trust in his team mates,
Running plays and with better court spacing, either put himself in a high % consistent shot or creating for his team, and putting him in a position to either score or pass out to someone as an option with mall player movement/picks on and off the ball

I must admit that the moment I saw this post, the first thing I did was to immediately skim it to try and find all the Copeland references.

Let me just focus on one complaint that some Knick fans seem to be obsessing on about Woodson as head coach. Not playing younger players. What they really are referring to is......"not playing Copeland enough". The reason for this is that Cope has almost reached Folk Hero status to the point that some Knick fans now think he will become the face of the Pacers, leading them to the promised land.

Let's get some facts straight about Woodson, Cope and Younger players. Cope as a 29 year old rookie.....is hardly young by NBA standards. Last year the Knicks only had 2 younger players if you include Cope. I seem to recall that Woodson played Shump when he came back from injury. The year prior, Woodson relied on rookies Lin and Shumpert.

During his time as HC in Atlanta, the following players saw significant minutes and roles as Rookies and Younger players (think 23 and under)......

Childress
Josh Smith
Al Horford
Pachulia
Marvin Williams

You may love Copeland, but it is just not true that Woodson avoids younger players.

It has nothing to do with Cope reaching folklore status. If you look at what cope was giving for the last 5 games of regular season you would have thought that Cope would earn some playoff PT. if you saw what Cope,was giving for the year you would have saw 48% FG and 42% three point PG. When you top two scoring options are struggling you would have played Cope more. Woody's dog house mentality is troublesome it has to stop the favoritism has to stop. If JR is hurt why not reduce his minutes and move Shump to SG and let Cope play PF or Sf this would have spread the floor. Lets see what happens withe he Knicks I'm expecting playoffs but that's it I think the team takes a step back, 1st round exit.

exactly, he was not utilized when it counted most
Amare played before him after NOT playing for 3 months
Copeland on the other hand was very efficient and showed improvement in all his weakness's, and was always a good scorer
With Melo/Jr struggling, wouldn't it make sense to utilize Copeland who did great vs The Pacer's in the regular season

I just think it isn't about players, we need changes in our coaching as well, with at least new assistant coach changes that would give input on both OFFENSE and DEFENSE because Woody plays too much favoritism with certain players and is way too stubborn to make changes

nixluva wrote:

RonRon wrote:

nixluva wrote:

Vmart wrote:There is no way this team is better than next year. They already said that they are playing for playoffs and not pushing it to win the division like last year.

They can say that, but really until they hit the floor you don't know how this improved roster will perform. They likely won't have to push the pedal to the metal with a deeper and younger roster. We've got to remember that the Knicks are a talented team and only the top tier teams are equally talented or more talented. The Knicks are going to win games simply by virtue of being a superior team to most of the league. That hasn't changed from last year IMO.

This team is likely to go into this season much stronger than last season but returning most of the core that did so well last year. They will likely be stronger in the playoffs than they were this year when they wore down. That is being underestimated IMO.

What do you think about our coaching, our coaching philosophy on both OFFENSE and DEFENSE, our rotations, the way Woodson utilized his players/favors certain players/ and does not utilize players that show the ability to contribute?

It sure helps when we add the talent that is needed to contribute in a high level but if Woodson continues his stubborn rotations, allows too much ISO, and favors veterans over talent, I just do not see us improving when it counts MOST, in the play offs

Woodson does not see Melo and JR taking 30 shots a night and hitting 30% of it as a problem, he needs to come up with a much more efficient game plan to utilizes all players on the floor as options
He cannot talk about playing quality DEF, while playing Amare, Pablo, Barg's, and players that cannot DEFEND their positions like Felton *when he cannot defend PG's or SGs*, Chandler *when Hibbert abused him*, Iman *when he plays SF*, Melo when he plays *PF*, and Kmart when he plays C vs Bulls, Pacers, and Nets

He needs to realize that he has holes and weakness's in his players, more importantly holes in his philosophies on both OFF and WEAKNESS
He needs to realize that he is too stubborn and needs to develop the younger players's confidence and skills, while giving them the chance to make mistakes and correcting them
He needs to add a different element when the playoff begins, not rely on ISO play, like with Vogul, he hid Hibbert's ability to post up and utilized it much more in the playoffs
Vogul maximized his philosophy and strength's of the Pacer's

1- Size
2- Athleticism
3- Post up abilities of Hibbert, West, George
4- Penetration ability of Lance, George, and their PG, while having great spacing to use each other's ability as a threat at all times
5- By taking quality shot's, they were able to anticipate and utilize the physical size/athleticism and score on OFFENSIVE BOARDS
6- Now with Copeland and a healthy Granger, I can guarantee you that they will now use 4 shooters to spread the floor with Hibbert's ability to post up 1v1, and not have a EGO issue for the benefit of the team

On DEFENSE, NO ONE CHEATED, outside of Hibbert, and they were all very solid 1v1 DEFENDERS

Woodson must first understand his flaws, then tweak his system, , and I think we need a new assistant coach or maybe even 2, that would maximize the players we have on the court as option
We added Barg's for a reason and even though he has flaws with REB/DEF, he should make the other 4 players maximize their DEF, SIZE, REB, and ALL ROUND SKILLS, as Barg's will either get a wide open shot at C or open the lane for players to cut, penetrate, and/or post up

We cannot live and die on watching Melo go 1v1 with no efficiency, JR must utilize his ability to penetrate/finish/facilitate and not settle on that jumpshot
Had JR played more with Copeland, I believe he would have been able to do it, instead Woodson opted to go with Chandler who struggled throughout the series on BOTH ENDS

After stepping away for a while, I think I have a more nuanced look at Woody's coaching last year. I think the roster was being used perfectly at the start and at the end of the regular season. However, Kidd wore down and Woody failed to address that by giving more minutes to his other guards like Prigs and Shump. There were other similar issues. But I think this year Woody will have so much more flexibility with his roster and more meaningful depth. Literally none of the Knicks this year will be Dead Weight as we saw last year. Almost anyone Woody puts in there will be capable of giving meaningful minutes.

Woody won't have to rely so much on Melo and JR this year. We have different options which we didn't have last year. Teams will not see the same weaknesses this year offensively. To that extent i'm not really worried about Woody at this time. Put together a roster that makes sense and it makes the job easier for the coach.

u make it sound like woodson can get these morons to change the way they play basketball. he doesn't have the stones to bench players when they play stupid ball. woodson is a craven crony. who's his agent again? oh yeah he fired his agent to get the job and be a well-paid suck-up with a good "i don't believe this" scowl.

options? laughable. it's a team game. options depend on how well the ball gets shared. we have a collection of stupid selfish players who by the way don't adequately defend.

Vmart wrote:

foosballnick wrote:

RonRon wrote:

nixluva wrote:

Vmart wrote:There is no way this team is better than next year. They already said that they are playing for playoffs and not pushing it to win the division like last year.

They can say that, but really until they hit the floor you don't know how this improved roster will perform. They likely won't have to push the pedal to the metal with a deeper and younger roster. We've got to remember that the Knicks are a talented team and only the top tier teams are equally talented or more talented. The Knicks are going to win games simply by virtue of being a superior team to most of the league. That hasn't changed from last year IMO.

This team is likely to go into this season much stronger than last season but returning most of the core that did so well last year. They will likely be stronger in the playoffs than they were this year when they wore down. That is being underestimated IMO.

What do you think about our coaching, our coaching philosophy on both OFFENSE and DEFENSE, our rotations, the way Woodson utilized his players/favors certain players/ and does not utilize players that show the ability to contribute?

It sure helps when we add the talent that is needed to contribute in a high level but if Woodson continues his stubborn rotations, allows too much ISO, and favors veterans over talent, I just do not see us improving when it counts MOST, in the play offs

Woodson does not see Melo and JR taking 30 shots a night and hitting 30% of it as a problem, he needs to come up with a much more efficient game plan to utilizes all players on the floor as options
He cannot talk about playing quality DEF, while playing Amare, Pablo, Barg's, and players that cannot DEFEND their positions like Felton *when he cannot defend PG's or SGs*, Chandler *when Hibbert abused him*, Iman *when he plays SF*, Melo when he plays *PF*, and Kmart when he plays C vs Bulls, Pacers, and Nets

He needs to realize that he has holes and weakness's in his players, more importantly holes in his philosophies on both OFF and WEAKNESS
He needs to realize that he is too stubborn and needs to develop the younger players's confidence and skills, while giving them the chance to make mistakes and correcting them
He needs to add a different element when the playoff begins, not rely on ISO play, like with Vogul, he hid Hibbert's ability to post up and utilized it much more in the playoffs
Vogul maximized his philosophy and strength's of the Pacer's

1- Size
2- Athleticism
3- Post up abilities of Hibbert, West, George
4- Penetration ability of Lance, George, and their PG, while having great spacing to use each other's ability as a threat at all times
5- By taking quality shot's, they were able to anticipate and utilize the physical size/athleticism and score on OFFENSIVE BOARDS
6- Now with Copeland and a healthy Granger, I can guarantee you that they will now use 4 shooters to spread the floor with Hibbert's ability to post up 1v1, and not have a EGO issue for the benefit of the team

On DEFENSE, NO ONE CHEATED, outside of Hibbert, and they were all very solid 1v1 DEFENDERS

Woodson must first understand his flaws, then tweak his system, , and I think we need a new assistant coach or maybe even 2, that would maximize the players we have on the court as option
We added Barg's for a reason and even though he has flaws with REB/DEF, he should make the other 4 players maximize their DEF, SIZE, REB, and ALL ROUND SKILLS, as Barg's will either get a wide open shot at C or open the lane for players to cut, penetrate, and/or post up

He has the realize that our opponents PG's are easily getting in the paint with our G's unable to stay in front of them and defend them
When they stepped back to defend the drive, they easily took an uncontested wide open 3pter

We cannot live and die on watching Melo go 1v1 with no efficiency, JR must utilize his ability to penetrate/finish/facilitate and not settle on that jumpshot
Had JR played more with Copeland, I believe he would have been able to do it, instead Woodson opted to go with Chandler who struggled throughout the series on BOTH ENDS
JR needs to play with more talented players and allow him to be a facilitator and scorer, not with less talent that will rely on his step back jumper
I believe he played his best ball with Copeland/Kmart at PF/C because of their mobility and ability to spread the floor
He struggled with Tyson because Hibbert was able to defend Tyson and defend the paint, and he had a tough defender in either Lance or George on him

Melo has to learn how to play OFF the ball and concentrate less on always trying to get the ball, rather focusing on other things like REBOUNDS, DEFENSE, FIGHTING FOR POSITION, bringing an element of deception, and hopefully his lessons with Hakeem will allow him to be a much more complete leader/bball player

He needs to make his moves quicker or/and trust in his team mates,
Running plays and with better court spacing, either put himself in a high % consistent shot or creating for his team, and putting him in a position to either score or pass out to someone as an option with mall player movement/picks on and off the ball

I must admit that the moment I saw this post, the first thing I did was to immediately skim it to try and find all the Copeland references.

Let me just focus on one complaint that some Knick fans seem to be obsessing on about Woodson as head coach. Not playing younger players. What they really are referring to is......"not playing Copeland enough". The reason for this is that Cope has almost reached Folk Hero status to the point that some Knick fans now think he will become the face of the Pacers, leading them to the promised land.

Let's get some facts straight about Woodson, Cope and Younger players. Cope as a 29 year old rookie.....is hardly young by NBA standards. Last year the Knicks only had 2 younger players if you include Cope. I seem to recall that Woodson played Shump when he came back from injury. The year prior, Woodson relied on rookies Lin and Shumpert.

During his time as HC in Atlanta, the following players saw significant minutes and roles as Rookies and Younger players (think 23 and under)......

Childress
Josh Smith
Al Horford
Pachulia
Marvin Williams

You may love Copeland, but it is just not true that Woodson avoids younger players.

It has nothing to do with Cope reaching folklore status. If you look at what cope was giving for the last 5 games of regular season you would have thought that Cope would earn some playoff PT. if you saw what Cope,was giving for the year you would have saw 48% FG and 42% three point PG. When you top two scoring options are struggling you would have played Cope more. Woody's dog house mentality is troublesome it has to stop the favoritism has to stop. If JR is hurt why not reduce his minutes and move Shump to SG and let Cope play PF or Sf this would have spread the floor. Lets see what happens withe he Knicks I'm expecting playoffs but that's it I think the team takes a step back, 1st round exit.

THIS TEAM MIGHT BE BETTER AND STILL FINISH WITH A WORSE RECORD THAN LAST YEAR WHEN KNICKS OVERACHIEVED ON TWO HOT BALLS STREAKS AND SHOT OUT OF THEIR 80% RANGE, 80% OF THE TIME THEY WON'T WIN OVER 50 GAMES LAST YEAR AND THE HIT THAT SWEET SPOT WHERE THEY SHOT OVER THE MARK,

NOW THIS YEAR THEY ARE BETTER AND BARGS IS A BIG REASON BUT THEY ARE AGAIN NOT A 54 WIN TEAM, THEY ARE NOW A 49 WIN TEAM WHERE LAST YEAR THEY WERE A 45 WIN TEAM

IronWillGiroud wrote:i think they're a better team in a vacuum,

and if this year's team doesn't reach 54 wins it won't be because this year's team is not so good, it will be because last year's team overachieved beyond their normal range, they got the hot balls at the right time,

really i would rate last year's team as a 46 win team and this year's team as a 48 win team

Yeah we had those 2 winning streaks that took up half the seasons games. 34-7 at the start and the end combined. Thats almost a 70 win regular season over the course ,They wont do that again.
Plus the EAST has gotten better. I would be surprised if they got to 50. I see 45-48