CrushAlot wrote:

dk7th wrote:

EnySpree wrote:

tkf wrote:

EnySpree wrote:

dk7th wrote:

EnySpree wrote:Teams have to find the right mix in order to keep continuity. Melo has been here 3 seasons...amare has been hurt and we've lacked a lot of things as a team. It is the teams duty to figure out what works, not sit on mediocre players hoping they eventually win.

Duncan has been in the league a long time. How many players has he played with? A **** load. There always will be players in and out of the equation. When guys fit, they stay until the knicks find that perfect mix. It could be found in the draft or free agency. It won't be found doing nothing.

you sound like you are equating melo with duncan.

Yes that is what I'm doing.

Melo is our centerpiece. Every move we make should be centered around him.

not if you are trying to win a ring enyspree..

So the solution is?

start by taking off the melo-colored glasses... unload him and get back to the task of building a team the right way. ignore the people who complain that it is walsh's fault and stoudemire's fault-- that is irrelevant. you cannot succeed with melo as the main piece so even a healthy stoudemire distracts from this most core of core issues.

anything short of that and we will remain in lombo with shiny regular-season records that put us somewhere between 6th and 10th best team in the nba.

Ignore Stats 22 million dollar cap hold, the assets that were moved and not resigned to get the cap space so that he could be signed? That is irrelevant? The second best player on the team last year only made a little over 2 million and was an 8 year vet. How many other teams that went to the second round have to rely on a player like that? The Knicks also had a starter that made the vet mini and two rotation players that were making the rookie free agent minimum. The reason for that is because the cap space that would be used on other players(or the picks and guys let go and moved to create cap space) was replaced by a one player that can't play. The blame is on the gm because the guys knee was so bad his contract couldn't be insured and doctors said his career would be over before the end of the contract.

if I could trade amare tomorrow I would... happy? but even if he is healthy he doesn't solve the problem, it doesn't make carmelo and efficient player or a good defender.. if amare being healthy could turn carmelo into a well rounded player instead of a bloated overpaid chucker, then I could understand your point... we didn't make trades to clear cap room for amare, we did so for lebron.. he didn't come here. we signed amare, everyone was happy, including you I am sure, or should I go pull up old threads?

amare wasn't a great move, but we compounded it x10 by gutting the team for carmelo... it is just that simple bro....

knickstorrents wrote:There was a model for (moderate) success with Melo. The 2008-2009 Denver nuggets where they got out of the 2nd round.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/DEN/2009.html

You need an actual leader (Billups)
They did NOT have another high usage low efficiency scorer (Iverson played 3 games for them, JR Smith almost shot 45% for them that year)
Plenty of high efficiency, excellent rebounders - Nene Hilario 7.8 Reb/G 60%FG, Chris Anderson 6.2 Reb/G 55%FG, Kenyon Martin 6 Reb/G 49%FG

So, as constructed the Knicks are missing a leader and 2 rebounders. It's NOT MISSING SCORING.

BTW, Leaders don't grow on trees. Most teams don't have any, including the Knicks.

I agree that we could use a floor leader, but they most certainly missed scoring in the playoffs. They were one of the worst teams at scoring in the playoffs and they actually did a good job defensively, but just couldn't score worth a darn. We were near the bottom in the playoffs at 88.6 ppg, right ahead of the Bucks 85.3 ppg, Lakers 85.3 ppg, and Boston 82 ppg. Meanwhile the Knicks were #1 in points allowed at only 85.9 ppg.

Yes we didn't rebound well, but really what killed us most was a lack of scoring. We need more diversity on offense. We can't keep living and dying by Melo and JR. Adding a rebounder will only make a small dent in solving the biggest problem which is putting the ball in the basket efficiently.

knickstorrents wrote:The problem is adding a scorer is not going to help us score because our offense is centered around someone who doesn't move the ball. What is the point of adding a scorer if he never gets the rock?

The scoring issues are really ball movement issues, they aren't due to lack of scorers. We don't have a good way to get high percentage shots. That's why tip back rebounders are so good with high usage low efficiency scorers like Melo. They help fix Melo's shortcomings and give us high efficiency scoring, and reduce Melo's turnover effect (a missed shot is a turnover basically)

Thats a flawed answer...

The knicks played their best basketball when the ball moved. Problem is when the defense clamped down and Trans were keying in on us in the playoffs our players crumbled.

Smith choked, kid choked.....Felton choked in the Indiana series. Shumpert was the only guy not afraid to shoot and he is a limited basketball player in Huss young career.

The knicks don't need a scorer....they need better offensive players all around. Novak its dead unless he us wide open and if he isn't hitting his shot he's worthless to us because we aren't that talented around him to have such a one dimensional player.

Trading Tyson could get us two players, the draft maybe one, summer league maybe oone. Knicks have to get betterne, free agency maybe one.

knickstorrents wrote:Think of it this way

Is it better to get 5 people who can get their own shot (5 Melo type players)

OR

Is it better to play team basketball and move the ball against teams with clamp down defense.

I know what I'd rather have....

Makes no sense...5 melos on one team and we win every game we play. Its 2013 not 2004

CrushAlot wrote:

dk7th wrote:

EnySpree wrote:

tkf wrote:

EnySpree wrote:

dk7th wrote:

EnySpree wrote:Teams have to find the right mix in order to keep continuity. Melo has been here 3 seasons...amare has been hurt and we've lacked a lot of things as a team. It is the teams duty to figure out what works, not sit on mediocre players hoping they eventually win.

Duncan has been in the league a long time. How many players has he played with? A **** load. There always will be players in and out of the equation. When guys fit, they stay until the knicks find that perfect mix. It could be found in the draft or free agency. It won't be found doing nothing.

you sound like you are equating melo with duncan.

Yes that is what I'm doing.

Melo is our centerpiece. Every move we make should be centered around him.

not if you are trying to win a ring enyspree..

So the solution is?

start by taking off the melo-colored glasses... unload him and get back to the task of building a team the right way. ignore the people who complain that it is walsh's fault and stoudemire's fault-- that is irrelevant. you cannot succeed with melo as the main piece so even a healthy stoudemire distracts from this most core of core issues.

anything short of that and we will remain in lombo with shiny regular-season records that put us somewhere between 6th and 10th best team in the nba.

Ignore Stats 22 million dollar cap hold, the assets that were moved and not resigned to get the cap space so that he could be signed? That is irrelevant? The second best player on the team last year only made a little over 2 million and was an 8 year vet. How many other teams that went to the second round have to rely on a player like that? The Knicks also had a starter that made the vet mini and two rotation players that were making the rookie free agent minimum. The reason for that is because the cap space that would be used on other players(or the picks and guys let go and moved to create cap space) was replaced by a one player that can't play. The blame is on the gm because the guys knee was so bad his contract couldn't be insured and doctors said his career would be over before the end of the contract.

so what you are saying is that walsh should have done the brave and prudent thing and not have ever signed stoudemire. okay i would have been fine with that since i am not into acquiring "stars." so what would the team look like today had we foregone that route?

EnySpree wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

EnySpree wrote:

knickstorrents wrote:Think of it this way

Is it better to get 5 people who can get their own shot (5 Melo type players)

OR

Is it better to play team basketball and move the ball against teams with clamp down defense.

I know what I'd rather have....

Makes no sense...5 melos on one team and we win every game we play. Its 2013 not 2004

5 Melos on one team and we'd average about 6 assists a game as a team

Even if you believe that the team would still average 110 points potter game and still play decent defense