arkrud wrote:Melo is Knicks, and Knicks are Melo.
Woody is just an excelent feet with Melo and Dolan. He will do what they want him to do.
All the rest of the roster is a coincedence. Whatever will be out there we will take.
There is no plan and no goals as we aleady get all we want - tickets are selling well, celebs are in the front row, melo to entertaine, JR a little side show. Time to relax and be heappy.

I have been saying this since Ewing days. Knicks never got him a side kick until he was on the last leg of his career. Now I fear the same as always championships were never the goal with this team. I have always felt the Knicks were a money team in the NBA and its business entity that is why Knicks have been known as the destination where bad contracts go to die as a favor to other teams.

Now more than ever I feel that Championship isn't the goal with this team.

knickscity wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

knickscity wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:Woodson had a hands on when constructing this roster..So if it's not that good, what does that say about his moves..When you have a chance to build (or in his case) retool your roster, then you stand to take most of the heat when they fail and most of the credit when they have success. But there are to many posters given him credit for the regular season, then saying in the next sentence, we have a weak roster. A little old yes, weak no..To many battle tested players on this roster to go out in the way we did.

The teams that are currently in the finals, we handle them during the regular season, but no one (outside of knick fans)on earth believe they would make any noise in the playoffs.

They built this team to challenge the HEAT and clearly disregarded the BULLS and PACERS...

This team wasn't constructed by Woodson.

Tyson Melo Amare Shump, JR and Novak were on the roster prior to Woodson being the coach

Kidd, sheed, cope, prigs, kmart, kt, camby , Q, not to mention Both JR and Novak we FA last yr, and he co-signed to bring them back, so yes, he had a lot to do with putting this roster together..

He said first hand that he did not want a young roster like he had in ATLANTA, and constructed a veteran heavy team that crumbled one by one down the strtetch

So basically he brought in the majority of guys he wouldn't even play? What sense does that make?

Camby...no burn, Cope spent various times in the doghouse...Q never played at all. Even Pablo didn't play much because he wouldn't shoot the ball, even Kurt rarely played.

Kenyon Martin was 100% Grunwald, Woodson didn't even wanna cut Sheed to even bring him in.

Kidd was brought in to mentor the player the team let walk.

I guess Ronnie Brewer was hig guy too, the one that went into the doghouse as well.

This isn't his guys, the core was here already, and most of the "vets" Woodson just would not play.

If it made sense people wouldn't be criticizing him. He asked for veteran players that played defense first or do you deny that too?? Then when he had exactly that type of players he couldn't figure out what to do with them.

First you guys whine about the roster being loaded with vets. Then you say Woodson is blameless because the core was already here? WTF??? The core is not old or Injury prone except Amare. The rest of the roster which is the damn vets Woodson wanted were old and injury prone.

loweyecue wrote:

knickscity wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

knickscity wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:Woodson had a hands on when constructing this roster..So if it's not that good, what does that say about his moves..When you have a chance to build (or in his case) retool your roster, then you stand to take most of the heat when they fail and most of the credit when they have success. But there are to many posters given him credit for the regular season, then saying in the next sentence, we have a weak roster. A little old yes, weak no..To many battle tested players on this roster to go out in the way we did.

The teams that are currently in the finals, we handle them during the regular season, but no one (outside of knick fans)on earth believe they would make any noise in the playoffs.

They built this team to challenge the HEAT and clearly disregarded the BULLS and PACERS...

This team wasn't constructed by Woodson.

Tyson Melo Amare Shump, JR and Novak were on the roster prior to Woodson being the coach

Kidd, sheed, cope, prigs, kmart, kt, camby , Q, not to mention Both JR and Novak we FA last yr, and he co-signed to bring them back, so yes, he had a lot to do with putting this roster together..

He said first hand that he did not want a young roster like he had in ATLANTA, and constructed a veteran heavy team that crumbled one by one down the strtetch

So basically he brought in the majority of guys he wouldn't even play? What sense does that make?

Camby...no burn, Cope spent various times in the doghouse...Q never played at all. Even Pablo didn't play much because he wouldn't shoot the ball, even Kurt rarely played.

Kenyon Martin was 100% Grunwald, Woodson didn't even wanna cut Sheed to even bring him in.

Kidd was brought in to mentor the player the team let walk.

I guess Ronnie Brewer was hig guy too, the one that went into the doghouse as well.

This isn't his guys, the core was here already, and most of the "vets" Woodson just would not play.

If it made sense people wouldn't be criticizing him. He asked for veteran players that played defense first or do you deny that too?? Then when he had exactly that type of players he couldn't figure out what to do with them.

First you guys whine about the roster being loaded with vets. Then you say Woodson is blameless because the core was already here? WTF??? The core is not old or Injury prone except Amare. The rest of the roster which is the damn vets Woodson wanted were old and injury prone.

The team lost because the core aint that good....Woodson overachieved with this group.

loweyecue wrote:

knickscity wrote:

loweyecue wrote:

knickscity wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

knickscity wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:Woodson had a hands on when constructing this roster..So if it's not that good, what does that say about his moves..When you have a chance to build (or in his case) retool your roster, then you stand to take most of the heat when they fail and most of the credit when they have success. But there are to many posters given him credit for the regular season, then saying in the next sentence, we have a weak roster. A little old yes, weak no..To many battle tested players on this roster to go out in the way we did.

The teams that are currently in the finals, we handle them during the regular season, but no one (outside of knick fans)on earth believe they would make any noise in the playoffs.

They built this team to challenge the HEAT and clearly disregarded the BULLS and PACERS...

This team wasn't constructed by Woodson.

Tyson Melo Amare Shump, JR and Novak were on the roster prior to Woodson being the coach

Kidd, sheed, cope, prigs, kmart, kt, camby , Q, not to mention Both JR and Novak we FA last yr, and he co-signed to bring them back, so yes, he had a lot to do with putting this roster together..

He said first hand that he did not want a young roster like he had in ATLANTA, and constructed a veteran heavy team that crumbled one by one down the strtetch

So basically he brought in the majority of guys he wouldn't even play? What sense does that make?

Camby...no burn, Cope spent various times in the doghouse...Q never played at all. Even Pablo didn't play much because he wouldn't shoot the ball, even Kurt rarely played.

Kenyon Martin was 100% Grunwald, Woodson didn't even wanna cut Sheed to even bring him in.

Kidd was brought in to mentor the player the team let walk.

I guess Ronnie Brewer was hig guy too, the one that went into the doghouse as well.

This isn't his guys, the core was here already, and most of the "vets" Woodson just would not play.

If it made sense people wouldn't be criticizing him. He asked for veteran players that played defense first or do you deny that too?? Then when he had exactly that type of players he couldn't figure out what to do with them.

First you guys whine about the roster being loaded with vets. Then you say Woodson is blameless because the core was already here? WTF??? The core is not old or Injury prone except Amare. The rest of the roster which is the damn vets Woodson wanted were old and injury prone.

You wont find one post where i blamed Woodson for the teams failure, and he didn't play the old dudes that much and they still got hurt.

The team lost because the core aint that good....Woodson overachieved with this group.

I said you blamed the roster. I am the one blaming Woodson here. Try to keep up with the conversation please. The part of the roster that everyone blames as old and injury prone were exactly the types of guys Woodson wanted. Woodson himself said the core was a championship caliber team. And he talked about accountability all offseason. When you talk the talk you need to back it up. He failed spectacularly.

And for the record, the convo you jumped on isn't about Woodson, it's about the roster being of his choice...it wasn't, it was already there.

loweyecue wrote:

knickscity wrote:

loweyecue wrote:

knickscity wrote:

loweyecue wrote:

knickscity wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

knickscity wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:Woodson had a hands on when constructing this roster..So if it's not that good, what does that say about his moves..When you have a chance to build (or in his case) retool your roster, then you stand to take most of the heat when they fail and most of the credit when they have success. But there are to many posters given him credit for the regular season, then saying in the next sentence, we have a weak roster. A little old yes, weak no..To many battle tested players on this roster to go out in the way we did.

The teams that are currently in the finals, we handle them during the regular season, but no one (outside of knick fans)on earth believe they would make any noise in the playoffs.

They built this team to challenge the HEAT and clearly disregarded the BULLS and PACERS...

This team wasn't constructed by Woodson.

Tyson Melo Amare Shump, JR and Novak were on the roster prior to Woodson being the coach

Kidd, sheed, cope, prigs, kmart, kt, camby , Q, not to mention Both JR and Novak we FA last yr, and he co-signed to bring them back, so yes, he had a lot to do with putting this roster together..

He said first hand that he did not want a young roster like he had in ATLANTA, and constructed a veteran heavy team that crumbled one by one down the strtetch

So basically he brought in the majority of guys he wouldn't even play? What sense does that make?

Camby...no burn, Cope spent various times in the doghouse...Q never played at all. Even Pablo didn't play much because he wouldn't shoot the ball, even Kurt rarely played.

Kenyon Martin was 100% Grunwald, Woodson didn't even wanna cut Sheed to even bring him in.

Kidd was brought in to mentor the player the team let walk.

I guess Ronnie Brewer was hig guy too, the one that went into the doghouse as well.

This isn't his guys, the core was here already, and most of the "vets" Woodson just would not play.

If it made sense people wouldn't be criticizing him. He asked for veteran players that played defense first or do you deny that too?? Then when he had exactly that type of players he couldn't figure out what to do with them.

First you guys whine about the roster being loaded with vets. Then you say Woodson is blameless because the core was already here? WTF??? The core is not old or Injury prone except Amare. The rest of the roster which is the damn vets Woodson wanted were old and injury prone.

You wont find one post where i blamed Woodson for the teams failure, and he didn't play the old dudes that much and they still got hurt.

The team lost because the core aint that good....Woodson overachieved with this group.

I said you blamed the roster. I am the one blaming Woodson here. Try to keep up with the conversation please. The part of the roster that everyone blames as old and injury prone were exactly the types of guys Woodson wanted. Woodson himself said the core was a championship caliber team. And he talked about accountability all offseason. When you talk the talk you need to back it up. He failed spectacularly.

What you think the coach was gonna say? His best players aren't good enough? If anything then he put his own judgement aside and put the guys who got him there a chance to prove themselves and all of them wet the bed.

And for the record, the convo you jumped on isn't about Woodson, it's about the roster being of his choice...it wasn't, it was already there.

How many coaches in the league say they think they are playing for a championship when it's clear to them that their core can't do it? Why is it so ridiculous that this guy be held accountable to the standard he set for himself? Especially given the fact the GM went out of his way to fill out the roster with the type of players Woody wanted??

So you really believe this a championship team and the coach held them back? You wont win woithout defense and the Knicks dont believe in that, and someone has to be an efficient scorer and nobody on the Knicks does that.

The team isn't winning a title because the talent isnt as good.

i thought folks would figure that out just looking at the rounds after the Knicks lost.

All coaches make mistakes, Pop putting Splitter and Diaw was an insult to a hof'er and he lit their ass for it.

Phil couldn't coach this team to a title....it aint that good.

the fact that the roster is profoundly flawed or "clumsy" is purely secondary.

the team underachieved because woodson was not in a position of true power. the knicks are a classic case of dysfunction and i find the whole situation sickening.

loweyecue wrote:

knickscity wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

knickscity wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:Woodson had a hands on when constructing this roster..So if it's not that good, what does that say about his moves..When you have a chance to build (or in his case) retool your roster, then you stand to take most of the heat when they fail and most of the credit when they have success. But there are to many posters given him credit for the regular season, then saying in the next sentence, we have a weak roster. A little old yes, weak no..To many battle tested players on this roster to go out in the way we did.

The teams that are currently in the finals, we handle them during the regular season, but no one (outside of knick fans)on earth believe they would make any noise in the playoffs.

They built this team to challenge the HEAT and clearly disregarded the BULLS and PACERS...

This team wasn't constructed by Woodson.

Tyson Melo Amare Shump, JR and Novak were on the roster prior to Woodson being the coach

Kidd, sheed, cope, prigs, kmart, kt, camby , Q, not to mention Both JR and Novak we FA last yr, and he co-signed to bring them back, so yes, he had a lot to do with putting this roster together..

He said first hand that he did not want a young roster like he had in ATLANTA, and constructed a veteran heavy team that crumbled one by one down the strtetch

So basically he brought in the majority of guys he wouldn't even play? What sense does that make?

Camby...no burn, Cope spent various times in the doghouse...Q never played at all. Even Pablo didn't play much because he wouldn't shoot the ball, even Kurt rarely played.

Kenyon Martin was 100% Grunwald, Woodson didn't even wanna cut Sheed to even bring him in.

Kidd was brought in to mentor the player the team let walk.

I guess Ronnie Brewer was hig guy too, the one that went into the doghouse as well.

This isn't his guys, the core was here already, and most of the "vets" Woodson just would not play.

If it made sense people wouldn't be criticizing him. He asked for veteran players that played defense first or do you deny that too?? Then when he had exactly that type of players he couldn't figure out what to do with them.

First you guys whine about the roster being loaded with vets. Then you say Woodson is blameless because the core was already here? WTF??? The core is not old or Injury prone except Amare. The rest of the roster which is the damn vets Woodson wanted were old and injury prone.

VCoug wrote:

nykshaknbake wrote:

loweyecue wrote:

knickscity wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

knickscity wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:Woodson had a hands on when constructing this roster..So if it's not that good, what does that say about his moves..When you have a chance to build (or in his case) retool your roster, then you stand to take most of the heat when they fail and most of the credit when they have success. But there are to many posters given him credit for the regular season, then saying in the next sentence, we have a weak roster. A little old yes, weak no..To many battle tested players on this roster to go out in the way we did.

The teams that are currently in the finals, we handle them during the regular season, but no one (outside of knick fans)on earth believe they would make any noise in the playoffs.

They built this team to challenge the HEAT and clearly disregarded the BULLS and PACERS...

This team wasn't constructed by Woodson.

Tyson Melo Amare Shump, JR and Novak were on the roster prior to Woodson being the coach

Kidd, sheed, cope, prigs, kmart, kt, camby , Q, not to mention Both JR and Novak we FA last yr, and he co-signed to bring them back, so yes, he had a lot to do with putting this roster together..

He said first hand that he did not want a young roster like he had in ATLANTA, and constructed a veteran heavy team that crumbled one by one down the strtetch

So basically he brought in the majority of guys he wouldn't even play? What sense does that make?

Camby...no burn, Cope spent various times in the doghouse...Q never played at all. Even Pablo didn't play much because he wouldn't shoot the ball, even Kurt rarely played.

Kenyon Martin was 100% Grunwald, Woodson didn't even wanna cut Sheed to even bring him in.

Kidd was brought in to mentor the player the team let walk.

I guess Ronnie Brewer was hig guy too, the one that went into the doghouse as well.

This isn't his guys, the core was here already, and most of the "vets" Woodson just would not play.

If it made sense people wouldn't be criticizing him. He asked for veteran players that played defense first or do you deny that too?? Then when he had exactly that type of players he couldn't figure out what to do with them.

First you guys whine about the roster being loaded with vets. Then you say Woodson is blameless because the core was already here? WTF??? The core is not old or Injury prone except Amare. The rest of the roster which is the damn vets Woodson wanted were old and injury prone.

What defense first players did we have on the guard spots? I think most of those vets that broke down were signed as plan B. It was what was available. Anyway its inane to blame the coach for personnel moves. That's the GMs job.

You don't think that Woodson had any say on personnel? Hell, we wasted a roster spot on Sheed all year specifically because Woodson, and only Woodson, wanted him here.

It's like talking to teenagers - there's a very intersteing analogy describing the inner workings of the brains of teenagers. Think of the adult brain as a room full of various objects interconnected to each other and all functioning in harmony. In the teenage brain there are two boxes and the rest of the brain is completely empty. The first box says take one of the two positions: This sucks or this is awesome. Second box says Defend position at all costs. That is the maximum level of complexity the teenage brain can handle.

holfresh wrote:I'm sorry the Woodson is 72-46 since taking over from MDA...Numbers that haven't been seen in god knows how long...Why is Woodson catching shet from all angles again???..Why was the same people shoveling shet McHale's way again???..Same folks handing out congrads to Karl on a brilliant year after he got bounced in the first round...

Lots of bad coaches can get carried to 50 wins; lots of bad coaches can make it to the 2nd round and even further. Throughout the season, and especially in the playoffs, he showed an inability to gameplan, doesn't really put our players in the best position to succeed, and has an overreliance on "his guys" even when they aren't performing at all.

the better coaches wont leave their situations for this team and everyone knows.

VCoug wrote:

holfresh wrote:I'm sorry the Woodson is 72-46 since taking over from MDA...Numbers that haven't been seen in god knows how long...Why is Woodson catching shet from all angles again???..Why was the same people shoveling shet McHale's way again???..Same folks handing out congrads to Karl on a brilliant year after he got bounced in the first round...

Lots of bad coaches can get carried to 50 wins; lots of bad coaches can make it to the 2nd round and even further. Throughout the season, and especially in the playoffs, he showed an inability to gameplan, doesn't really put our players in the best position to succeed, and has an overreliance on "his guys" even when they aren't performing at all.

What are u and the other whiners talking about..What evidence do u have other than pouting at everything that doesn't satisfy your own demands..Lin isn't here so everything is bad...Gallo isn't here so Melo is a thug..The coach that gave Lin his shot got bounced so now we are mad at the world..Be honest, man up..I work and live in a results oriented world..I don't understand the nuances of losing provided by the previous coach that was so pleasing to most here...Help me to understand....We were losing to Charlottes and Sacramentos of the world twice a year and now we are not losing to those crappy teams anymore...What am I missing???...We lost to a better team in the second round that was deeper and had better balance..They played better defense...What could Phil Jackson or Riles have done..Answer, play Camby and Copeland...My good lord...Truly, truly amazing...

Please good lord, bless us with a "bad coach" that can lead us to a Championship and I promise I won't complain..My com-padres love the great coaches who can't make it to the playoffs or gets bounced in the first round...I know they are dying to tell me Karl is great, MDA is great..Only thing is the evidence don't support their argument...They think we have arrived two games over .500...54 wins with a broken down squad injured most of the season with one guy carrying you...Oh yeah, they hate him too...hahahahahahahahaha...Twighlight Zone baby!!!..Can't make this shet up, people won't believe you!!!!