BRIGGS wrote:Im changing my top 24 pick to Ricky Ledo. More and more I think that he might be the best SG in this draft and certainly would be BPA at 24.(Put it this way--hes not going to be in round 2 unless there is evidence hes a drug guy or something)He probably has the best combination of size athletic ability ballhandling and shooting package with the defense from that position. For example Ben Mclemore is suppose to go number 1. Hes 1.5 inches shorter and 9 pounds lighter and if anyone has seen Kansas knows he has no handle.

Measuring 5-11 Shane larkin to me moves down to round 2. Im still on board with Nate Wolters and Erick Greene

Also keep in mind Chad Ford said a team in the mid 20's gave Giannis Adetokoubo a promise. The Knicks are known to do this--and we know IT is still running it.

Wolters measured 6'3.5 barefoot and nearly 6'5 in shoes. Also close to 200 lbs. I expect him to climb up the boards fast and hope he is still around when we pick.

callmened wrote:not too sure about schroeder...when i watched him play he reminds me of a collison/beverly type..SPEED but no shooting or creating ability...seemed outta control

Apparently Schroeder has a promise from a team in the first round. He didnt participate in drills because of a tooth ache.

Oh well I can always hope that team is the Knicks.

BTW, If he didnt need work he wouldnt be available at 24. Knicks need cheap talent. We stil have Melo. We just need cheap talent that can contribute. I think Schroeder could earn minutes his rookie year with his defense.

BRIGGS wrote:Branden Davies measured big for a PF. 6-10 242 with huge hands and a 7-2 wingspan. In a draft where the 4's are thin--he could climb.

I like him a lot. Outside of a healthy Amar'e (and sans Melo who basically operates in the mid-range mostly anyway), we're completely devoid of an interior offense...That's gotta change for next year. You need guys that can put the ball in the hole, bottom line..Adding some post offense has got to be on our list of needs for next year and this kid definitely fits the bill. Davies would add a lot of offensive punch down on the block. MVP of the PIT... I'd be a homerun if we could somehow pick up a 2nd deep pick and grab this dude. If we only wind up going one-and-done by using pick 24 for backcourt help, I honestly believe these bargin-bin 2nd choice bigs could also help us:

7' C Marcus Cousin
6'10" PF JaJuan Johnson
6'10" PF Jordan Williams
6'10" SF/PF Craig Brackins

There's a lot of size, skill and ability for the price with these 4. Johnson and Brackins underperformed in the DL this year for whatever reason (JJ was traded a few times I believe and never seemed to get a good deal of playing time despite being the #1 overall pick in the last DL draft), but to me they both pass the eye test. Like Davies, both guys have very capable offensive games and would really improve and lengthen our roster. Cousin as well, a real nice well-rounded big I feel could be a quality backup C in the NBA, maybe even an NBA starter (again, passes the eye test with flying colors). Even Jordan Williams, known more for his rebounding, has some nice skill inside on the offensive end....Ideally, at a minimum I'd like to add a guard (Erick Green would be perfect), Davies + one or 2 of the above big men. And if nothing else materializes, I'd actually continue to go the bargin-bin route to fill other needs (Jeramine Taylor's scoring &/or Jamelle Horne's underrated play on both ends of the court could more than make up for JR Smith's inconsistency for example). I wanna see our Summer League team stacked with good possibilities that could legitimately fill needs; not the usually fodder that has no business even being there.

Definitely agree with you and a few other posters on some other points -- dangle Chandler to see what he could fetch (tremendously overrated in my eyes -- you take away the 5 back-taps a game, this guy's a 5 rpg 7-footer with no offensive game and minimal shot-blocking--talks one hell of a game though); same with Novak; resign Copeland to a reasonable contract to assume the Novak role, etc.

- j.johnson = ive been following his career since he was a freshmen at purdue. i hear what youre saying but dude needs to bulk up (see hakim warrick)
- jordan williams - he rebounds great...i was referring to his laziness on defense. i remember i was high on him when he came out of UMD but he just seemed slow on rotations and just slow overall.
- brackins = i like and ive been surprised that he hasnt made it. he has skill and the body.

i understand our cap situation and the NEED to be creative
we need: younger big men and quicker PGS (who are CHEAP)
heres my short list
-dante cunningham (PF)
-pendergraph (PF)
-jeremy tyler (C)
-AJ Price (PG)
-b.rush (SF)

callmened wrote:
j. johnson = skinny PowerLESS fwd who cant shoot
jordan williams = lazy
Brackins had potential but he falls into the jajuan category as well

All of these guys earned a way off an NBA roster. I think this assessment is pretty good. Johsnon and Brackins are aloof PF who stand out on the perimeter and Jordan Williams(probably the best of the three) has not worked hard enough.
Guys like Copeland and Lin earned their way on. If these guys have something an NBA team will take them. Dvies is a different type of PF than Brackins and Johnson because he is strictly an interior player--thats more attractive.

BRIGGS wrote:

callmened wrote:
j. johnson = skinny PowerLESS fwd who cant shoot
jordan williams = lazy
Brackins had potential but he falls into the jajuan category as well

All of these guys earned a way off an NBA roster. I think this assessment is pretty good. Johsnon and Brackins are aloof PF who stand out on the perimeter and Jordan Williams(probably the best of the three) has not worked hard enough.
Guys like Copeland and Lin earned their way on. If these guys have something an NBA team will take them. Dvies is a different type of PF than Brackins and Johnson because he is strictly an interior player--thats more attractive.

Briggs -- I see what you're saying and it's tough to argue -- if these guys were any good, they'd have stuck in the NBA by now. However (1) I'd argue they were victims of the numbers game on those teams more than the fact that they can't play (I think the talent and the fit for us is definitely there) and (2) by your above logic, did Lin originally stick in GS or in Houston before the Knicks picked him up? He had 2 cracks at the NBA with both of those teams & didn't earn his way onto either roster, right? Did Cope even make an NBA team after going undrafted in '06? Nope - he went to the DL first I believe, underperformed/didn't turn any heads, then went to Europe before finally getting a chance with us 6 years later...See where I'm going -- these 2 had a very hard journey to the NBA, Cope even harder than Lin. Yet they finally made it -- Lin just earned himself a tremendous payday and Cope just helped us win a crucial playoff game and very well may have turned our season around.

I'm not ready to throw the towel in on these players and say there's no way they could make an NBA roster (our roster). As of right now the price is right, they all definitely pass the eye test (to me at least) and most importantly--like Lin and Copeland at the time--they all fit immediate needs for us -- JJ/Brackins could definitely add some scoring punch along the frontline and Jordan Williams could definitely help with the rebounding if we decide that upgrading our rebounding is a primary need for next year....Regarding Brandon Davies vs. Brackins/Johnson -- true Davies probably plays closer to the basket (although Davies can knock down 15-17' footers too, I've seen him do it-it's part of his game---and I love the fact that he measured out bigger than expected btw) and I agree with you--Davies is very attractive for us -- but so are these 2. I'm definitely feeling both guys -- JJ still has some real nice potential as a scoring 4/weakside rim protector and Brackins has ability to score the ball from anywhere on the court basically--post up/back to the basket, face up, mid-range out to the NBA 3 line. And he can put it on the floor too...Reflecting back on his play in college, he really reminds me of a lesser version of Kevin Durant..There's a ton of value here if you ask me...Remember Brackins' 42 point game against Kansas his sophomore year? I believe he did that against a Kansas club that featured the Morris brothers and Thomas Robinson...Brackins to me is super attractive, esp. considering how cheap we could get him now. Lack of scoring on this team is an issue. We need to get Melo some help moving forward. Here's hoping Grunwald leaves no stone unturned when looking to fill team needs.

Finestrg wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

callmened wrote:
j. johnson = skinny PowerLESS fwd who cant shoot
jordan williams = lazy
Brackins had potential but he falls into the jajuan category as well

All of these guys earned a way off an NBA roster. I think this assessment is pretty good. Johsnon and Brackins are aloof PF who stand out on the perimeter and Jordan Williams(probably the best of the three) has not worked hard enough.
Guys like Copeland and Lin earned their way on. If these guys have something an NBA team will take them. Dvies is a different type of PF than Brackins and Johnson because he is strictly an interior player--thats more attractive.

Briggs -- I see what you're saying and it's tough to argue -- if these guys were any good, they'd have stuck in the NBA by now. However (1) I'd argue they were victims of the numbers game on those teams more than the fact that they can't play (I think the talent and the fit for us is definitely there) and (2) by your above logic, did Lin originally stick in GS or in Houston before the Knicks picked him up? He had 2 cracks at the NBA with both of those teams & didn't earn his way onto either roster, right? Did Cope even make an NBA team after going undrafted in '06? Nope - he went to the DL first I believe, underperformed/didn't turn any heads, then went to Europe before finally getting a chance with us 6 years later...See where I'm going -- these 2 had a very hard journey to the NBA, Cope even harder than Lin. Yet they finally made it -- Lin just earned himself a tremendous payday and Cope just helped us win a crucial playoff game and very well may have turned our season around.

I'm not ready to throw the towel in on these players and say there's no way they could make an NBA roster (our roster). As of right now the price is right, they all definitely pass the eye test (to me at least) and most importantly--like Lin and Copeland at the time--they all fit immediate needs for us -- JJ/Brackins could definitely add some scoring punch along the frontline and Jordan Williams could definitely help with the rebounding if we decide that upgrading our rebounding is a primary need for next year....Regarding Brandon Davies vs. Brackins/Johnson -- true Davies probably plays closer to the basket (although Davies can knock down 15-17' footers too, I've seen him do it-it's part of his game---and I love the fact that he measured out bigger than expected btw) and I agree with you--Davies is very attractive for us -- but so are these 2. I'm definitely feeling both guys -- JJ still has some real nice potential as a scoring 4/weakside rim protector and Brackins has ability to score the ball from anywhere on the court basically--post up/back to the basket, face up, mid-range out to the NBA 3 line. And he can put it on the floor too...Reflecting back on his play in college, he really reminds me of a lesser version of Kevin Durant..There's a ton of value here if you ask me...Remember Brackins' 42 point game against Kansas his sophomore year? I believe he did that against a Kansas club that featured the Morris brothers and Thomas Robinson...Brackins to me is super attractive, esp. considering how cheap we could get him now. Lack of scoring on this team is an issue. We need to get Melo some help moving forward. Here's hoping Grunwald leaves no stone unturned when looking to fill team needs.

Youre right fine--their all good enough to make the nBA in the right situation if they work hard. Copeland is probably a product of some Euro league interjected into his game. Maybe these guys need some hard knockls like Cope and they can get theirs.

BRIGGS wrote:

AnubisADL wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:larkin with a max vert of 44" and standing vert of 34".

Cody Zeller also jumped well. 37.5 max vert, tying Noah, and a 34 standing vert

Someone good will fall. I rather the Knicks not reach on a suspect big. I prefer and undersized guard with actual skills.

Shane Larkin has average wingspan but that 44" vertical could make him a dynamic backup PG.

That was pretty sick. I think the ikkkoggest surprise was Cody Zeller---I watched him many times--he did not seem like the athlete he tested out as.

I learned to take the combine results with a grain of salt. OJ Mayo tested very good and he has yet to play like that type of athlete.

callmened wrote:@finestrg - dont get me wrong, i have nothing against those three players you mentioned (i like brackins the most). Im just saying Id rather focus on the draft first, NBA free agents 2nd and then DLeague talent. Overall, Im for acquiring younger front line talent

I feel ya Ned -- perfect world, that should be the order -- draft, major FAs, then DL/Euro signings, etc..

Again though -- capped out team, only one draft pick at 24 that we will, no doubt, take serious (but no 2nd rounder, no 1st rounder next year), not a lot of resources to include in a trade, etc.. As Briggs pointed out on another thread -- it's gonna be hard to reload under these conditions. That's the only reason I mention bargin-bin talent. Bargin-bin specials usually have a funny way of almost always working out too, provided you bring in that type of talent to use and not just sit on the bench. Moves for these types of players involve a leap of faith by both GM and head coach...I personally feel there's a TON of these Chris Copeland-types out there just waiting for a chance. We'll see what happens...A good start would be to stack our Vegas SL squad with some talented possibilities, then go from there. Be ready to pounce on the best undrafted talent still left on the board after the 60th name is called. That type of thing...Have a good plan in place to max out possibilities..Be smart about it and take the process serious. Shoot for the stars -- invite Craig Brackins and JaJuan Johnson to SL instead of Kenny Adeleke; if JR bolts on us--invite Dominique Jones, Jermaine Taylor or Jamelle Horne instead of Anthony Roberson...Target the best possible talent of this type out there. I believe there actually are different tiers of bargin-bin talent -- sift through the rubble and bring in the best of the lot and don't both wasting time with the rest. Hopefully Grunwald has at least one guy assigned to breaking down/evaluating even the bargin-bin talent that's out there.