BRIGGS wrote:He's a great player scorer but when we gave so many young players and picks when we could've waited and signed for nothing outright was a killer. Also why does Houston get picks from us in every trade and we get nothing for Lin. And lee for amare is a bust

corrected

Hersports85 wrote:

smackeddog wrote:Wilson Chandler is permanently injured. We got Felton back. Only players we gave away were Gallo and Mosgov- I don't get this thread at all.

Without signing Amar'e and letting Lee go, Melo and Tyson wouldn't of signed with us (or Kidd or Sheed etc)- that is a fact that they have both stated.

People will ignore this just like they ignore that, despite having a lot of injuries and melo is still playing hurt along with brewer and that amare is working himself back, that we are 1 game behind Miami. These lineups are not close to what we will see down the stretch. This is really weak, we go through a rough stretch and the melo trade is coming back to bite us???

Again only players we lost is an inconsistent gallo, moz, and chandler who haven't seen the court this year! We have our draft pick this year, so we will add another player. Like I said, both of our starting guards are out right now ... I just don't see the big deal.

But I'll make sure to bookmark this for later. Enjoy!

I am all for Melo over all those guys but the issue is that we gave up all flexibility and assets for 1 player and it hurt us in the long run. Better right the ship and win the chip this year because who knows what Dolan will do with this team in 2yrs going foward

Papabear wrote:

sebstar wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:Fair enough but their values greatly diminished under Isiah as GM and coach. Not sure what Walsh could've done when the organization was deadset on getting Lebron

They were devalued. I wont deny that. But why trade zach/jamal so quickly into the regime change, while they were devalued assets? I thought the whole point in hiring dantoni, was to for him to use his funball offense, to pump up the trade value of the current roster. They never got a chance. Thats mismanagement 101, and thats on walsh. And Walsh was just straight humiliated in the lee deal. One of the worst trades in knick history behind the Curry deal its looking like.

Papabear Says

Remember from the forum the word Crawful or Crawfal?? Back then almost this whole forum wanted Zach and Crawford gone even when we had a winning record with them.

Exactly. Knick fans treated them like crap. Always insulting. Obnoxious behavior all the time with this fan base.

sebstar wrote:

Papabear wrote:

sebstar wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:Fair enough but their values greatly diminished under Isiah as GM and coach. Not sure what Walsh could've done when the organization was deadset on getting Lebron

They were devalued. I wont deny that. But why trade zach/jamal so quickly into the regime change, while they were devalued assets? I thought the whole point in hiring dantoni, was to for him to use his funball offense, to pump up the trade value of the current roster. They never got a chance. Thats mismanagement 101, and thats on walsh. And Walsh was just straight humiliated in the lee deal. One of the worst trades in knick history behind the Curry deal its looking like.

Papabear Says

Remember from the forum the word Crawful or Crawfal?? Back then almost this whole forum wanted Zach and Crawford gone even when we had a winning record with them.

Exactly. Knick fans treated them like crap. Always insulting. Obnoxious behavior all the time with this fan base.

Not sure you can blame the fans here. Blame goes to Isiah, Dolan and Walsh. They ran the team

tkf wrote:

sebstar wrote:

franco12 wrote:its not just the Melo trade - its every deal made over the last 5-10 years.

This franchise is essentially over-leveraged like a bank - and they borrow against tomorrow for a mediocre today.

Letting Lin go for nothing is just one more example of mismanagement.

Signing Amar'e when we missed out on Lebron - another move that might have been better played by keeping Lee (possibly at a home team discount?) rather than signing a star just for the sake of making a move.

Great post...to flesh this out, we essentially traded Zach, crawford, lee, and two lottery pics just to have the OPTION of signing lebron james and another big free agent. That strategy failed, and all we had to show for it was Amare, who is broken down.

Thats the reason why we had to rely on older talent...not the melo trade. We gave up mediocre talent for a top 5 player in his prime. Get real. The cupboard was bare when melo was traded her, because of the mismanagement of the previous regime.

we gave up good young talent and future picks and cap space for an overrated scorer... period.. stop trying to mitigate that mess of a trade by knocking what we gave up.. jeez

amare I have no problem with, he didn't cost us any picks or players, he was great when he got here, we took a risk, I liked lee a lot, but we then started compounding errors after the carmelo trade.. had we just been patient, heck we could have used the amnesty on amare and continue to build young with our kids and picks... heck we could have been a player when harden became available...

we have this old team because we wanted to maker sure carmelo was happy and got his shots.. we are now the "old" denver nuggets... smh

All true but history proves that Dolan is impatient when it comes to drafting and developing young players. Isiah and Walsh didn't help matters by striking out on high lottery picks

gunsnewing wrote:

tkf wrote:

sebstar wrote:

franco12 wrote:its not just the Melo trade - its every deal made over the last 5-10 years.

This franchise is essentially over-leveraged like a bank - and they borrow against tomorrow for a mediocre today.

Letting Lin go for nothing is just one more example of mismanagement.

Signing Amar'e when we missed out on Lebron - another move that might have been better played by keeping Lee (possibly at a home team discount?) rather than signing a star just for the sake of making a move.

Great post...to flesh this out, we essentially traded Zach, crawford, lee, and two lottery pics just to have the OPTION of signing lebron james and another big free agent. That strategy failed, and all we had to show for it was Amare, who is broken down.

Thats the reason why we had to rely on older talent...not the melo trade. We gave up mediocre talent for a top 5 player in his prime. Get real. The cupboard was bare when melo was traded her, because of the mismanagement of the previous regime.

we gave up good young talent and future picks and cap space for an overrated scorer... period.. stop trying to mitigate that mess of a trade by knocking what we gave up.. jeez

amare I have no problem with, he didn't cost us any picks or players, he was great when he got here, we took a risk, I liked lee a lot, but we then started compounding errors after the carmelo trade.. had we just been patient, heck we could have used the amnesty on amare and continue to build young with our kids and picks... heck we could have been a player when harden became available...

we have this old team because we wanted to maker sure carmelo was happy and got his shots.. we are now the "old" denver nuggets... smh

All true but history proves that Dolan is impatient when it comes to drafting and developing young players. Isiah and Walsh didn't help matters by striking out on high lottery picks

not every team hits homers with their draft picks but they don't compound mistakes that last years to come...

tkf wrote:

sebstar wrote:

franco12 wrote:its not just the Melo trade - its every deal made over the last 5-10 years.

This franchise is essentially over-leveraged like a bank - and they borrow against tomorrow for a mediocre today.

Letting Lin go for nothing is just one more example of mismanagement.

Signing Amar'e when we missed out on Lebron - another move that might have been better played by keeping Lee (possibly at a home team discount?) rather than signing a star just for the sake of making a move.

Great post...to flesh this out, we essentially traded Zach, crawford, lee, and two lottery pics just to have the OPTION of signing lebron james and another big free agent. That strategy failed, and all we had to show for it was Amare, who is broken down.

Thats the reason why we had to rely on older talent...not the melo trade. We gave up mediocre talent for a top 5 player in his prime. Get real. The cupboard was bare when melo was traded her, because of the mismanagement of the previous regime.

we gave up good young talent and future picks and cap space for an overrated scorer... period.. stop trying to mitigate that mess of a trade by knocking what we gave up.. jeez

amare I have no problem with, he didn't cost us any picks or players, he was great when he got here, we took a risk, I liked lee a lot, but we then started compounding errors after the carmelo trade.. had we just been patient, heck we could have used the amnesty on amare and continue to build young with our kids and picks... heck we could have been a player when harden became available...

we have this old team because we wanted to maker sure carmelo was happy and got his shots.. we are now the "old" denver nuggets... smh

Gallo. Moz. and wilson resemble your posts. They suck. You guys all belong together.

Im good with my top 5 player

Denver forums are >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that way, friend.

While over there you guys can try to figure out strategies in how you are going to compete for an 8th seed, and try to answer how you can become contenders with a bunch of veteran role players. Denver is officially on the 6-9th seed nba treadmill with no end in sight

Papabear wrote:

earthmansurfer wrote:Even though the players we sent over for Melo are not playing as well as they did here, the thing we can't forget is that many players play better in NY (and some can't handle it).
What did the pick we lost to Denver turn into? Was that Faried, I forget.

Trading Lee for Amare was a head scratcher and now it clearly looks like a bad trade. At the time, it did appear that Amare helped us to attract talent. The knees were and issue and now we are seeing what Phoenix was worried about.

I am not so broken up about the Melo trade now. Like many of you though, the Lin debacle was just that. You don't let talent like that walk. I can't believe he is only making 5 mill this year (5+5+15 = I take that).

Papabear Says

As much as I Like Melo the Lin project would not have worked with Melo and Lin on the same team. Melo would not like the idea that someone on the team like Lin would be more popular than him. This is a fact. That's why Lin really is gone besides Dolan getting mad and Woody would take sides with Melo than Lin. I doubt if Lin would have started. If Dolan really wanted to get even with Lin he should have signed Lin to the 25 million and then shut him down and by the 3rd year do a buy out and lin would have been a thing of the past. Lin new it wouldn't work in New York. New York believe in hype and would have made it impossible for lin and Melo to play together. There could be only on alfa dog in New York and that was Melo.

Careful comments like that about Melo get you in trouble eventhough it may be true

Papabear wrote:

sebstar wrote:

smackeddog wrote:

sebstar wrote:

franco12 wrote:its not just the Melo trade - its every deal made over the last 5-10 years.

This franchise is essentially over-leveraged like a bank - and they borrow against tomorrow for a mediocre today.

Letting Lin go for nothing is just one more example of mismanagement.

Signing Amar'e when we missed out on Lebron - another move that might have been better played by keeping Lee (possibly at a home team discount?) rather than signing a star just for the sake of making a move.

Great post...to flesh this out, we essentially traded Zach, crawford, lee, and two lottery pics just to have the OPTION of signing lebron james and another big free agent. That strategy failed, and all we had to show for it was Amare, who is broken down.

Thats the reason why we had to rely on older talent...not the melo trade. We gave up mediocre talent for a top 5 player in his prime. Get real. The cupboard was bare when melo was traded her, because of the mismanagement of the previous regime.

We got Amar'e, who got Felton and Melo, who got JR and Tyson, who got Kidd, Camby and Sheed. Fair or not, Zach Randolph and Crawford were not draws to other players.

And I get so sick of this blazing hypocrisy and revisionist history. People HATED Zach for his lack of defense. They spent Jamal Crawford's entire stint here blasting him for shot selection and poor defense. People wined none stop about 'Avid Lee' and his complete lack of D. Now they are gods, while people blast the players we do have. Its the same c*** over and over! AAAAARRRRRGGGGGGGHHHHHHHH!!!

Thats because NY sucks as a sports city, and is hyper-critical of its own players, and wants 'em run out of town after a two game losing streak. Look how people around here talk about woody, felton, and melo --- and melo is a top 5 player. Look the at the way we treated Ewing and other great stars. Ny'ers are entitled idiots with agendas.

Dont put me in that category. I always knew Zach, Jamal, and lee could ball. They were just in the wrong environment, team wise. We gave them up for peanuts. In a vacuum, that has had a negative effect on our current roster. We should have at least received decent talent in return. Is anyone we traded them for still on the roster? And they were players in their prime.

Papabear Says

I agree this is not Melo's fault. If you want to hate someone hate LeBron who played us like a 2 string guitar. Wearing NY hats and winking his eyes like he was coming. We were suckered into thinking we had a chance with Lebron. But LeBron was smart not to come to New York because we would have chased him out of town. Do you really think that Lebron's numbers would be the same as they are in Miami? I doubt it. Half of the people on this form like TKF would be hating and complaining. We would still have Trolls running here complaining. When we gave up Crawford, Zach Randolph , and Lee, when we had a winning record, that was the begining of the end for us. We got nothing back in hopes of getting Lebron. We also was looking over our sholder at the Nets with a new Statium so we had to do something so we got Amare who did a good job till he broke down.

YEP PAPA.

Shocking that during a rough stretch that people on this board overreact and start pining for players that have long since departed and start dreaming of BS scenarios where we could have a Knicks fans dream team.

I'm out until we start a new winning streak and people start complaining that we aren't winning pretty enough!

Papabear Says

As much as I Like Melo the Lin project would not have worked with Melo and Lin on the same team. Melo would not like the idea that someone on the team like Lin would be more popular than him. This is a fact. That's why Lin really is gone besides Dolan getting mad and Woody would take sides with Melo than Lin. I doubt if Lin would have started. If Dolan really wanted to get even with Lin he should have signed Lin to the 25 million and then shut him down and by the 3rd year do a buy out and lin would have been a thing of the past. Lin new it wouldn't work in New York. New York believe in hype and would have made it impossible for lin and Melo to play together. There could be only on alfa dog in New York and that was Melo.

I wouldnt like an average player being treated as a deity either. You just know that Lin's struggles would be blamed on melo, like his departure and everything else in between. Who needs those headaches for a turnover machine who barely averages 11 pts? Im glad hes gone. Felton's better and for half the price.