KNICKSBIGCATS wrote:This system svcks, I hate SSOL.
Mediocre teams are owning us.
I do not believe that playing in this system can lead to a championship.
Nobody can convince me otherwise.
We need a new coach.
I wish that JVG would come back....I don't want that prima donna Phil Jax.

1st of all the Knicks aren't playing SSOL. SSOL was the fastbreak offense that the Suns played. We haven't run SSOL since MDA has been here!!!

2nd, this team was 2nd leading scoring team in the league last year!!! WTF have you been watching? the problem with this team has always been the defense. That's the reason why I keep saying that there's nothing wrong with the system.

There really aren't a lot of different defensive schemes that pro teams run. It's about execution and effort on D. Also you need defensive talent too. Right now our best defender is Shumpert, a rookie!!!

The team needs a TON of work on the defensive end, but we are talking about a team that has never been good defensively so it's just gonna take some more work. I think we need STAT in particular to play with better concentration on defense. He's constantly making bad defensive plays. It should help to get Jared back in the mix, cuz he's a very solid TEAM defender, which we need more of.

nixluva wrote:

KNICKSBIGCATS wrote:This system svcks, I hate SSOL.
Mediocre teams are owning us.
I do not believe that playing in this system can lead to a championship.
Nobody can convince me otherwise.
We need a new coach.
I wish that JVG would come back....I don't want that prima donna Phil Jax.

1st of all the Knicks aren't playing SSOL. SSOL was the fastbreak offense that the Suns played. We haven't run SSOL since MDA has been here!!!

2nd, this team was 2nd leading scoring team in the league last year!!! WTF have you been watching? the problem with this team has always been the defense. That's the reason why I keep saying that there's nothing wrong with the system.

There really aren't a lot of different defensive schemes that pro teams run. It's about execution and effort on D. Also you need defensive talent too. Right now our best defender is Shumpert, a rookie!!!

The team needs a TON of work on the defensive end, but we are talking about a team that has never been good defensively so it's just gonna take some more work. I think we need STAT in particular to play with better concentration on defense. He's constantly making bad defensive plays. It should help to get Jared back in the mix, cuz he's a very solid TEAM defender, which we need more of.

Your posts are actually comical because you think that there's nothing wrong with the system.
For one thing, where is the rebounding after the three point shots are attempted?
What's our record since we acquired Melo? Something like 16-22? Not good. It's the system, man.
D'Antoni is the wrong coach with the wrong system for this team as constructed. Period.

We are one injury away to Melo or Chandler to this getting coyote UGLY in a hurry....did you even hear the BOO BIRDS tonight?
And, please don't try to tell me that we're not playing a form of SSOL! How many threes have we shot in the past few games? LOL....carry on with your unjustified man love for .

Mark my words, IF he is still the head coach for the rest of the season, it'll be a miracle.
Personally, I don't think he lasts the season. He's headed to Toronto next year (:thank goodness:). Then MAYBE somebody like JVG can actually implement a REAL system here(cause there ain't one here now).

gunsnewing wrote:JVG is not coming back to coach the Knicks. He will never work for Dolan again. He quit remember? Right now I'm wishing we had hired Mark Jackson, Tom Tihbideau or Doc Rivers when we had the chance

Never say never.
Stranger things have happened.

nykshaknbake wrote:Well frankly it's confusing. If anyone says anything bad about the coaching it's who cares what happened a few weeks ago we just won 2 in a row, that's all in the past! Praise and glory be to MDA! Then when we are losing it's look what Steve Nash did half a decade ago! That's proof that the coach is great! It hurts your credibility because there does not exist a scenario where MDA is not thee best. If you were consistent in your arguments it might help them.

You are a real piece of work! I've never said that the coach is great or that he's "thee Best". I have not been changing my stance. I've been very consistent. I provide facts to back up my statements. It's not just my opinion.

65 different players in 3 years is an unmatched disruptive situation. Do you think Jax or Adelman or any other top coach would succeed under such a situation?

The coach usually needs a coach on the floor and we've had nothing but change at the PG spot, not to mention not having a passing PG to begin with. This year TD is a major downgrade and it's hurting the team. There's no one to actually run the plays effectively. Still this team needs some continuity and time to gel. The team started off slow last year and then settled down. I would think that will happen this year too.

nixluva wrote:

nykshaknbake wrote:Well frankly it's confusing. If anyone says anything bad about the coaching it's who cares what happened a few weeks ago we just won 2 in a row, that's all in the past! Praise and glory be to MDA! Then when we are losing it's look what Steve Nash did half a decade ago! That's proof that the coach is great! It hurts your credibility because there does not exist a scenario where MDA is not thee best. If you were consistent in your arguments it might help them.

You are a real piece of work! I've never said that the coach is great or that he's "thee Best". I have not been changing my stance. I've been very consistent. I provide facts to back up my statements. It's not just my opinion.

65 different players in 3 years is an unmatched disruptive situation. Do you think Jax or Adelman or any other top coach would succeed under such a situation?

The coach usually needs a coach on the floor and we've had nothing but change at the PG spot, not to mention not having a passing PG to begin with. This year TD is a major downgrade and it's hurting the team. There's no one to actually run the plays effectively. Still this team needs some continuity and time to gel. The team started off slow last year and then settled down. I would think that will happen this year too.

nixluva wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:How many of those 65 were banished and never really a part of things in NY. D'Antoni had the same rotation of players from the 12th game of his first season in NY until the trading deadline in the 09-10 season. That was around 130 games. The only change from his first year was Walsh traded Q for Darko.

Once again here you go with your overly simplified arguments. The truth is in the details. There was talent but guys had to buy in and unfortunately many of the guys in 08-09 were just playing for new contracts. Then 09-10 was not a team built to win. It was a team built to tear down. Your point is weak.

2008-09                       2009-10
Roster         Age  Games     Roster         Age  Games
W. Chandler    21   82        D. Lee         26   81
D. Lee         25   81        D. Gallinari   21   81 
C. Duhon       26   79        A. Harrington  29   72
N. Robinson    24   74        C. Duhon       27   67
Q. Richardson  28   72        W. Chandler    22   65
A. Harrington  28   68        T. Douglas     23   56
J. Jeffries    27   56        J. Jeffries    28   52
T. Thomas      31   36        L. Hughes      31   31
D. Gallinari   20   28        N. Robinson    25   30
L. Hughes      30   25        B. Walker      22   27
C. Wilcox      26   25        S. Rodriguez   23   27
A. Roberson    25   23        J. Bender      29   25
M. Rose        34   18        T. McGrady     30   24
Z. Randolph    27   11        J. Hill        22   24
J. Crawford    28   11        E. House       31   18
M. Collins     24    9        M. Landry      24   17
E. Curry       26    3        J. Giddens     24   11
J. Crawford    22    2        D. Milicic     24    8
J. James       33    2        E. Barron      28    7
D. Nichols     24    2        E. Curry       27    7
C. Samb        24    2        11 Different Players and 8 returning players, tho Curry doesn't count.
C. Sims        25    1        It's also important to note the games played by each player.
M. Sene        22    1

Honestly, I think you made my point. The 7 of the top 9 guys in on 08-09 were najor rotation guys in 09-10 up until the trade deadline. Douglas was not a part of the rotation until March so though he is down as playing 52 games the vast majority of his minutes came in the final 20 games of the season. Also including the d-league guys that walsh brought in brings your number up quite a bit since most of them played under 10 games. I counted 34 guys on your list. I may have made a mistake but were there 31 new players added last year?

Jax or Adelman would have had this thing humming like a new car. We would not have even gotten to 65 players.

nixluva wrote:

nykshaknbake wrote:Well frankly it's confusing. If anyone says anything bad about the coaching it's who cares what happened a few weeks ago we just won 2 in a row, that's all in the past! Praise and glory be to MDA! Then when we are losing it's look what Steve Nash did half a decade ago! That's proof that the coach is great! It hurts your credibility because there does not exist a scenario where MDA is not thee best. If you were consistent in your arguments it might help them.

You are a real piece of work! I've never said that the coach is great or that he's "thee Best". I have not been changing my stance. I've been very consistent. I provide facts to back up my statements. It's not just my opinion.

65 different players in 3 years is an unmatched disruptive situation. Do you think Jax or Adelman or any other top coach would succeed under such a situation?

The coach usually needs a coach on the floor and we've had nothing but change at the PG spot, not to mention not having a passing PG to begin with. This year TD is a major downgrade and it's hurting the team. There's no one to actually run the plays effectively. Still this team needs some continuity and time to gel. The team started off slow last year and then settled down. I would think that will happen this year too.

nixluva wrote:

nykshaknbake wrote:Do you read? You do exactly what I've said. Which is you use one standard which is past doesn't matter to gloss over the bad play we've had. And then you bring up things up to half a decade ago to support your arguments. You can't summarily dismiss facts that don't support your view and expect anyone to take you seriously. I'm actually trying to help you out here.

Jax or Adelman would have had this thing humming like a new car. We would not have even gotten to 65 players.

1. There have been 65 different players that this coach has had during his tenture. The reason we've had 65 diferent players is not because of MDA's coaching. It's been driven by managment's desire to build a title contender. I use the stat's from MDA's time in PHX, cuz it represents a more stable situation to gauge. You can't gauge a 3 year period in which you've had 65 different players!!! No one's ever done that before.

2. NO Jax or Adelman wouldn't have just skated thru this last 3 years. Jax wouldn't have even taken the job!!! If he did, he would've QUIT! Adelman hasn't been able to stick on the teams he's been coaching and they've won games. What makes you think he'd be able to cut it in NY the last 3 years? Both Jax and Adelman are great coaches, but they still need good circumstances to succeed.

3. MDA was brought here to coach the team we have now, but it's been a tough road getting here. We still don't have a floor leader, which is a major problem. I can assure you they never intended to end up at this point with no PG in place. They're hoping Davis can recover and be that PG.

4. MDA has a new defensive assistant in Woodson, but it's gonna take some time to get everyone on the same page. If they still aren't defending a month from now then I suspect there will be a change. IMO I think things will settle down and they'll start to gel.

Wow - you sure are feisty about him. It reminds me of a political debate when one steadfastly defends their position even when its weak because that is the side they are on. After a while it becomes less about facts and true belief and more about defending a position.

mrKnickShot wrote:

nixluva wrote:

nykshaknbake wrote:Do you read? You do exactly what I've said. Which is you use one standard which is past doesn't matter to gloss over the bad play we've had. And then you bring up things up to half a decade ago to support your arguments. You can't summarily dismiss facts that don't support your view and expect anyone to take you seriously. I'm actually trying to help you out here.

Jax or Adelman would have had this thing humming like a new car. We would not have even gotten to 65 players.

1. There have been 65 different players that this coach has had during his tenture. The reason we've had 65 diferent players is not because of MDA's coaching. It's been driven by managment's desire to build a title contender. I use the stat's from MDA's time in PHX, cuz it represents a more stable situation to gauge. You can't gauge a 3 year period in which you've had 65 different players!!! No one's ever done that before.

2. NO Jax or Adelman wouldn't have just skated thru this last 3 years. Jax wouldn't have even taken the job!!! If he did, he would've QUIT! Adelman hasn't been able to stick on the teams he's been coaching and they've won games. What makes you think he'd be able to cut it in NY the last 3 years? Both Jax and Adelman are great coaches, but they still need good circumstances to succeed.

3. MDA was brought here to coach the team we have now, but it's been a tough road getting here. We still don't have a floor leader, which is a major problem. I can assure you they never intended to end up at this point with no PG in place. They're hoping Davis can recover and be that PG.

4. MDA has a new defensive assistant in Woodson, but it's gonna take some time to get everyone on the same page. If they still aren't defending a month from now then I suspect there will be a change. IMO I think things will settle down and they'll start to gel.

Wow - you sure are feisty about him. It reminds me of a political debate when one steadfastly defends their position even when its weak because that is the side they are on. After a while it becomes less about facts and true belief and more about defending a position.

I don't know who you are, but you haven't been paying attention, cuz i've been presenting PLENTY of facts. I'm not just defending a position, unlike you who is just parroting what everyone else is saying right now, cuz the team has not looked good early. I have a mind of my own and i've made observations based on real things.

It was just LAST YEAR that this team was the 2nd highest scoring and 5 most efficient offense in the league. We did this with Felton as the PG, who isn't an All Star. This is why I've said that the there is nothing wrong with the system. If we had Felton instead of TD, things would look a lot different.

Now we have to hope that Davis can get back on the court sooner than expected. Otherwise we are stuck with TD and hoping Shump or Lin can help the team get by offensively. IMO things will improve defensively with more time to develop chemistry and I think getting Jared back will also help the defense.

nixluva wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

nixluva wrote:

nykshaknbake wrote:Do you read? You do exactly what I've said. Which is you use one standard which is past doesn't matter to gloss over the bad play we've had. And then you bring up things up to half a decade ago to support your arguments. You can't summarily dismiss facts that don't support your view and expect anyone to take you seriously. I'm actually trying to help you out here.

Jax or Adelman would have had this thing humming like a new car. We would not have even gotten to 65 players.

1. There have been 65 different players that this coach has had during his tenture. The reason we've had 65 diferent players is not because of MDA's coaching. It's been driven by managment's desire to build a title contender. I use the stat's from MDA's time in PHX, cuz it represents a more stable situation to gauge. You can't gauge a 3 year period in which you've had 65 different players!!! No one's ever done that before.

2. NO Jax or Adelman wouldn't have just skated thru this last 3 years. Jax wouldn't have even taken the job!!! If he did, he would've QUIT! Adelman hasn't been able to stick on the teams he's been coaching and they've won games. What makes you think he'd be able to cut it in NY the last 3 years? Both Jax and Adelman are great coaches, but they still need good circumstances to succeed.

3. MDA was brought here to coach the team we have now, but it's been a tough road getting here. We still don't have a floor leader, which is a major problem. I can assure you they never intended to end up at this point with no PG in place. They're hoping Davis can recover and be that PG.

4. MDA has a new defensive assistant in Woodson, but it's gonna take some time to get everyone on the same page. If they still aren't defending a month from now then I suspect there will be a change. IMO I think things will settle down and they'll start to gel.

Wow - you sure are feisty about him. It reminds me of a political debate when one steadfastly defends their position even when its weak because that is the side they are on. After a while it becomes less about facts and true belief and more about defending a position.

I don't know who you are, but you haven't been paying attention, cuz i've been presenting PLENTY of facts. I'm not just defending a position, unlike you who is just parroting what everyone else is saying right now, cuz the team has not looked good early. I have a mind of my own and i've made observations based on real things.

It was just LAST YEAR that this team was the 2nd highest scoring and 5 most efficient offense in the league. We did this with Felton as the PG, who isn't an All Star. This is why I've said that the there is nothing wrong with the system. If we had Felton instead of TD, things would look a lot different.

Now we have to hope that Davis can get back on the court sooner than expected. Otherwise we are stuck with TD and hoping Shump or Lin can help the team get by offensively. IMO things will improve defensively with more time to develop chemistry and I think getting Jared back will also help the defense.

Parroting? Eh Whatever. I too have a mind of my own even if it means disagreeing with you (respecfully).

It's pointless if he is a good coach or not. I personally feel that he is not. But he does not have an open ended invitation. Fault or not, he might need to pay the price. Like I said, blame the GM('s), players, owner ...

The coach is always the fall guy. Nobody wants to hear excuses. And, putting it all on BD is scary. If his back goes out then you can just say. "Look MDA just does not have a PG"

Like I said in another post. Wasn't Westphal a great coach in PHX? BUT HE SUX NOW!! But he had a ****ty team in SAC - so what, no one cares.

mrKnickShot wrote:

nixluva wrote:

nykshaknbake wrote:Do you read? You do exactly what I've said. Which is you use one standard which is past doesn't matter to gloss over the bad play we've had. And then you bring up things up to half a decade ago to support your arguments. You can't summarily dismiss facts that don't support your view and expect anyone to take you seriously. I'm actually trying to help you out here.

Jax or Adelman would have had this thing humming like a new car. We would not have even gotten to 65 players.

1. There have been 65 different players that this coach has had during his tenture. The reason we've had 65 diferent players is not because of MDA's coaching. It's been driven by managment's desire to build a title contender. I use the stat's from MDA's time in PHX, cuz it represents a more stable situation to gauge. You can't gauge a 3 year period in which you've had 65 different players!!! No one's ever done that before.

2. NO Jax or Adelman wouldn't have just skated thru this last 3 years. Jax wouldn't have even taken the job!!! If he did, he would've QUIT! Adelman hasn't been able to stick on the teams he's been coaching and they've won games. What makes you think he'd be able to cut it in NY the last 3 years? Both Jax and Adelman are great coaches, but they still need good circumstances to succeed.

3. MDA was brought here to coach the team we have now, but it's been a tough road getting here. We still don't have a floor leader, which is a major problem. I can assure you they never intended to end up at this point with no PG in place. They're hoping Davis can recover and be that PG.

4. MDA has a new defensive assistant in Woodson, but it's gonna take some time to get everyone on the same page. If they still aren't defending a month from now then I suspect there will be a change. IMO I think things will settle down and they'll start to gel.

Wow - you sure are feisty about him. It reminds me of a political debate when one steadfastly defends their position even when its weak because that is the side they are on. After a while it becomes less about facts and true belief and more about defending a position.

Either he is MDA or He has a man crush on MDA.