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Can Someone Tell Me Who Does Derrick Rose Make Better Besides Himself?
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nykshaknbake
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4/14/2011  8:58 AM
CashMoney wrote:
NYKBocker wrote:
Juice wrote:
BlueSeats wrote:He's Toney Douglas on steroids and cocaine.

What was Stephon on early in his career?

Rose really does remind me a lot of Marbury. A bigger, faster and stronger Marbury. Hopefully, he has a better noggin.

This kid seems to have his head on straight. During the game yesterday Marv said that no one gets yelled at in practice or during games more than Rose. He doesn't take it personally, he takes it as being coached. Seems pretty humble as well....I remember watching him being interviewed at the All Star game and thanking his teammates for getting him there.

I hope this kid good has a long career...he's a special player.

He's a great player with a good attitude. ALot of the guys have the talent but only a few have both. And I thought that if you brought a coach that yells the stars on any team will rebel and tune him out. Maybe he isn't such a good player after all by that logic.

AUTOADVERT
VCoug
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4/14/2011  9:04 AM
Killa4luv wrote:
JrZyHuStLa wrote:The requirements for MVP doesn't call for a player making his teammates better.

Um, they sure did the year Nash won it. Oops, I mean 2 years. ridiculous, Nash has more MVPs than Kobe and Shaq.

I would make the argument that Shaq only deserves the one MVP and Kobe probably doesn't deserve any.

Shaq only won one MVP because that's the only year he started the season in shape and played for most of the season. Nearly every other year since he left Orlando, Shaq has missed about 1/5 of the season. Meanwhile, Kobe wasn't going to win an MVP while Shaq was there, so he couldn't have won until after 03-04. Then, the Lakers were no where nearly good enough for Kobe to win, until they got Gasol in 07-08. The 3 MVP's since then have been Kobe and Lebron twice and I would argue that Kobe didn't deserve MVP that year; he was, at best, third behind Chris Paul and Garnett.

Now the joy of my world is in Zion How beautiful if nothing more Than to wait at Zion's door I've never been in love like this before Now let me pray to keep you from The perils that will surely come
joec32033
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4/14/2011  9:47 AM
Here is the article I mentioned prior, courtesy of ESPN...
Wednesday, March 9, 2011
Updated: March 13, 1:38 PM ET
Man of substance
By Ric Bucher
ESPN The Magazine

This article appears in the March 21 "Style Report" of ESPN The Magazine.

THERE'S THE CASUAL jog as he crosses midcourt into the chaos of a trapping defense, much like the Chicago River meanders into the city's din of rattling boxcars, steaming manholes and express-lane highways. There's the sudden blast to the rim past towering defenders, as when the howling wind slices between Michigan Avenue skyscrapers. There's even that Jazz Age mustache sitting quietly above a mouth that rarely opens and beneath eyes that take in everything. That 'stache and his tattoos, including "Sweet Home Chicago" on his left wrist, are his lone accessories. No iced watches or gold ropes. That would be akin to claiming a gaudy nickname, like the City That Never Sleeps or the City of Angels, rather than, say, the City of Broad Shoulders.

See, Derrick Rose wasn't just born in Chicago and doesn't just live in Chicago and doesn't just play in Chicago.

"He is Chicago," says his Bulls teammate Joakim Noah.

Not wants to be. Or tries to be. Or has become. Is.

The same springboard of big-city aggression and heartland work ethic that launched the first black man to the White House has now catapulted Rose to the highest office in the NBA. "Chicagoans appreciate Midwestern values," President Obama says. "Like hard work, humility and giving back to those around you. Plus, it doesn't hurt if you're playing MVP-quality ball."

The NBA was in dire need of a hometown hero the moment LeBron James announced he was taking his talents to South Beach. It's clear now that the image of a tough and humble kid lifting up poor, mistreated Cleveland was as key to James' nationwide popularity as his unselfish passes, powerful dunks and fun personality. The viciousness of the backlash came from so many people who felt they'd been duped into believing James was something he wasn't and, ultimately, had no desire to be.

Chicago, of course, hasn't suffered as a city like Cleveland has, but Rose's goal of restoring his hometown's luster may be even more daunting. After all, no player in NBA history has shouldered a town like Michael Jordan. How could anyone do it again? The bar for success in Chicago is so high that most stars -- from Grant Hill to Tim Duncan to LeBron -- have passed on trying, knowing that taking on MJ's legacy is a losing proposition. "Derrick made no bones about wanting to be here," says Bulls executive John Paxson. "That tells you something about him right there."

Where some see a shadow, Rose sees an opening. "The way I look at it is, What would happen if you could pass him? How big could you be?" Rose says. "It would be crazy. It would be amazing if you could just get close."

Interestingly, Rose doesn't display that fearlessness with a flexed pose or postdunk primal roar. It simply radiates off him. It's why an East All-Star squad that included LeBron, Dwyane Wade, Kevin Garnett, Paul Pierce, Ray Allen, Amar'e Stoudemire and Dwight Howard voted Rose as its captain. And why, despite a quiet 11 points and five assists in an East squad loss, he alone heard chants of "M-V-P!" from an LA crowd as he stood at the free throw line. And maybe even why his first signature shoe outsold LeBron's.

Mostly, Rose's tenacity is why, for all that he has already done in less than three seasons -- dragged two vastly different but equally modest squads into the playoffs, added skills as if they were Post-it notes and taken the pole position in this year's MVP race -- teammates talk matter-of-factly about the future. Specifically, about Rose's winning multiple titles and being in the Hall of Fame's upper echelon as if it had already been scripted. "He'll be the greatest I've ever played with," says Bulls forward Brian Scalabrine, whose former teammates include Garnett, Pierce, Allen, Rajon Rondo, Jason Kidd and Vince Carter. "It will come down to how many championships he wins. I can see him stringing them together, one after another."

Says Noah: "A 22-year-old point guard, already the best at his position and probably the best finisher in the league? I can't even act like Derrick wasn't one of the biggest reasons I wanted to stay here." Paxson, who played eight seasons next to Jordan, sees in Rose the same single-minded focus on getting better and winning. Every time. At everything. "Young guys don't see the big picture, but he does," Paxson says. "We're so lucky, and we know it. That's why we smile a lot around here. As spectacular as he is, fans see a kid just playing hard. Our town is pretty humble, it's not a lot of flash. That's what they see in him."

Of course, it takes more than just being from a place to embody it. The lessons of bitter cold and brutal streets were driven home by three brothers -- Dwayne, Reggie and Allan -- who were all at least six years older and took great delight in endlessly dunking on, shooting over and dribbling around their little brother at Murray Park, an outdoor court two blocks from their house in the beyond-rough neighborhood of Englewood. "We'd dog him out, but we didn't know what we were doing," says Reggie. "We just knew if you couldn't play or you were soft, they wouldn't let you on the court."

Brenda Rose, a single mom raising four boys, didn't exactly baby him either. When Derrick dislocated a finger -- which he remembers doing at least three times -- she would grab the stick from a Popsicle, tape it to his finger and tell him to stop crying. When he got undercut going for a rebound on that outdoor court as a sixth-grader, it took him several days of complaining before she finally took him to the hospital. The doctors confirmed what Derrick already knew: He'd broken his right arm.

But Brenda knew her sons had to be tough to escape Englewood, a section of Chicago that included four neighborhoods listed among the nation's 25 most dangerous for 2010. Ask Derrick the worst thing he saw growing up and a tiny muscle twitches beneath his right eye, as if he were seeing it all over again: one of Allan's best friends, dying in the street from a gunshot to the neck.

So Brenda made sure they had chores to keep them busy, and food, clothes and a high school diploma to keep them from being needy. She knew where to draw the line, allowing tattoos but insisting they not be on her boys' neck or face. The message: Be from Englewood, not of Englewood.

It's Brenda to whom Rose blows a kiss just prior to tip-off at every home game. Before Rose's rookie season, when an Adidas executive asked a group of new signees what they hoped to accomplish their first year, most spoke of statistics or awards. Rose said: "Make my mama happy and my city proud."

Rose owes Chicago for making him the player he is: short on flash, long on dash. Credit Robert Lueder, John Cifelli, Giulio Narcisi and Charles Panici. In fact, they just might be responsible for every Chi-Town point guard -- Isiah Thomas and Tim Hardaway included -- who has made his mark on the NBA in the past few decades. That's because in 1968 those four men met south of the city in Chicago Heights and founded Small Fry, a basketball league limited to preteen kids 5-foot-1 or shorter. The program has since gone nationwide, but its roots remain strongest locally. The result: a constant supply of small, quick guards.

With mostly little people on a court, pick-and-rolling doesn't make much sense. It becomes all about getting a step, protecting the rock like a football and getting to the rim. A fancy dribble will likely get swiped by one of those mighty mites. So while New York point guards are known for mesmerizing dribbling and LA's 1's for dazzling passing, Chicago point guards simply put you in the rearview mirror. "Derrick grew up playing against those little guys," says former Bulls guard B.J. Armstrong. "That's why he plays just like them. He just grew to be 6-3."

Armstrong and Arn Tellem are Rose's agents, and they want to make sure that as their client's profile grows, it doesn't turn the way James' has. Tellem had Kobe Bryant early in the Laker's career, and Armstrong played alongside Jordan; they understand that it doesn't take much to damage an image. So far, an admissions scandal at Rose's alma mater, Memphis, and a photo on the Internet of Rose allegedly throwing gang signs haven't stuck to him. But Armstrong doesn't want to risk anything else's distracting the world from seeing what he and Paxson see: the heir to Jordan and Kobe as the NBA's ultimate competitor. So when, during The Magazine's photo shoot, someone asks if Rose knows how to dance the Dougie, Rose says he doesn't. And before he can be goaded into trying, Armstrong says, "We don't know nothing about the Dougie. We don't do dancing. That's for entertainers. This is about sports. That's all we know."

But this is actually about more than sports. It's about this sport and this city and this young man being welded into one. Who will help Bulls fans stop pining for Michael? Who will help the NBA stop mourning the plight of LeBron? Tough questions, for sure, with answers made for broad shoulders. Once again, Rose perfectly reps a city whose official motto is: I will.

~You can't run from who you are.~
Marv
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4/14/2011  9:52 AM
for me the ascension of derrick rose will forever be a testament to the genius that is nyk4ever.
tkf
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4/14/2011  10:11 AM
Juice wrote:
tkf wrote:
CashMoney wrote:
Killa4luv wrote:Thibideau is coach of the year. But rose is not MVP.

25.1 PPG 7.8 APG 1.1 SPG and 4.1 RPG and who has led his team to 61 wins and whose team has been banged up for most of the year is an easy call.

lebron 26/7/8 is absolutely ridiculous.. why not MVP for bron?

Well the standards change every year for MVP.....


One season it's let's give it to the guy who improves all his teammates numbers

One season it's let's give it to the guy who is a stat stuffer

One season it's let's give it to the guy we looked over last year probably doesn't deserve it this year but we gotta make good on it

One season it's let's give it to the guy who's team relies on everything he does and runs the whole system through and around him

One season it's let's give it to the guy who helped improve his team's overall record from the previous season by the largest margin

One season it's let's give it to the guy who did the most with the least

One season it's let's give it to the guy who kept his team well above waters amid untimely injuries

One season it's let's give it to the guy on the team with the best record

One season it's let's give it to the guy who says he wants to be the league MVP

EFF the MVP

EFF TNT and the CREW

EFF NBATV and the CREW

EFF NBA ANALYST

EFF LEBRON

EFF D-ROSE

EFF KOBE

EFF LAKERS

EFF BULLS

EFF HEAT

EFF LMLR MARKETING

EFF NIKE

EFF ADIDAS

EFF ROSE POWER DUNKS

EFF LEBRON COACK BACK DUNKS

EFF DURANT

EFF THE LOGO

EFF THE TALENT IN SOUTH BEACH

EFF THE TRADE DEADLINE

EFF DAVID STERN

EFF THE MEDIA

EFF TWITTER

EFF NBA.com


ROFL.. you went all in bro...... haha, I can't say I dissagree....

Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
Killa4luv
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4/14/2011  10:43 AM
fishmike wrote:
CashMoney wrote:
holfresh wrote:
fishmike wrote:
holfresh wrote:
fishmike wrote:
holfresh wrote:This will be interesting...Was having a conversation with my brother about Rose...I was telling him players like Rose tend to get hated and blamed if their teams don't succeed..See Marbury and Iverson...Because he plays to point, he is expected to be a pass first point...It's all exciting now like it was with Iverson but if he doesn't win, well we will see...

the best player on the team ALWAYS does. Thats the burden of stardom. Look at Ewing. He took a painfully average cast of characters to the 2nd round of the playoffs for 10 straight years. TEN FREAKIN YEARS and people always talked about he cant hit the big shot, isnt as good as MJ, Shaq, Hakeem, etc etc other stars of the era

It just comes with the territory.

Rose is an awesome talent. Everything you want from the top pick. Rose is the player the Bulls dreamed Jay Williams would be 10 years ago.

If you have Rose on your team your gaga about your future.

So he's a not a great play maker (yet). He's got time to improve. Dude oozes talent and runs a 60 win team. Not sure how much criticism there really is to dish out here


Ewing wasn't hated or blamed for the Knicks not getting to the next level...No one ever thought that Ewing being a flawed player as the reason his team didn't succeed...Scoring PG's are held to a different standard because they dominate the ball so much...I don't think it has anything to do with being a star...It's more to do with the position he plays and his scoring ability...

The same thing you are saying about the future of the Bulls and Rose could have been said about Iverson and the Sixers...

really? Did you not read papers or listen to talk radio during the 90s? Ewing was 100% targeted as the reason the KNicks didnt advance. He wasnt as good as MJ, he wasnt as good as Hakeem, his missed big shots when the chances where there, etc etc etc

You dont remember fans throwing the posters on the floor? You dont remember fans thinking we were better without him when we got hurt and Camby moved to center full time?

Ewing was the best college player and the #1 pick in the draft and a guy who was supposed to deliver titles to NY. So much so people cried the draft was rigged!

As time has gone by people realize how good he was and how much he brought but during the 90s he was 100% blamed for that stuff

You are talking about the end of his career with Camby..The public always knew the issue was not being able to get a second star next to Ewing...It's the reason we brought in Ro Blackman, Kiki, Charles Smith, LJ, Houston...Sure he took some heat, but not the blame for the Knicks not getting to the next level...You are overblwoing how things went down...Did I remember, I lived it....No one today is blaming Ewing, I can't ever remember people blaming Ewing for not winning it all, which is a lot different from taking heat...

The public didn't care about Ewing get a second star....he was supposed to deliver. Ewing had a tough relationship with the fans in New York....he even said so during his number retirement ceremony. He was my favorite player and I was always defending the guy. My best friend even asked how could a guy be my favortite player when he's never won anything and couldn't hit the big shot or carry is team. Remember how brutal fans and the media were when he missied the finger roll?

Many people didn't appreciate Ewing until he was gone. It's funny what people rememeber........

yes... holfresh has a very selective memory. Hell I remember fans saying Ewing wasnt worth the money right before he signed a big extension in the prime of his career.

Ewing was supposed to do what Hakeem did, bla bla bla


Ewing probably had the worst media scrutiny of any star player in NY. Id say his era really set the stage for the hyper scrutiny and overly negative criticizing that NY media and fans are now known for.
Although in hindsight I think most of the haters realize they really took for granted how great he was.

Ewing was the most under appreciated star in basketball. Look at those freaking teams. Ewing and the D-leaguers vs. the rest of the league. I'm still so bitter that our front office mismanaged things so poorly for 14 seasons and only managed to get it right towards the very end of his career.

Killa4luv
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4/14/2011  10:44 AM
VCoug wrote:
Killa4luv wrote:
JrZyHuStLa wrote:The requirements for MVP doesn't call for a player making his teammates better.

Um, they sure did the year Nash won it. Oops, I mean 2 years. ridiculous, Nash has more MVPs than Kobe and Shaq.

I would make the argument that Shaq only deserves the one MVP and Kobe probably doesn't deserve any.

Shaq only won one MVP because that's the only year he started the season in shape and played for most of the season. Nearly every other year since he left Orlando, Shaq has missed about 1/5 of the season. Meanwhile, Kobe wasn't going to win an MVP while Shaq was there, so he couldn't have won until after 03-04. Then, the Lakers were no where nearly good enough for Kobe to win, until they got Gasol in 07-08. The 3 MVP's since then have been Kobe and Lebron twice and I would argue that Kobe didn't deserve MVP that year; he was, at best, third behind Chris Paul and Garnett.

All of that may be true and I can still give you 3 to 5 more people more deserving of the MVP than Steve Nash.

fishmike
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4/14/2011  10:58 AM
Killa4luv wrote:Ewing probably had the worst media scrutiny of any star player in NY. Id say his era really set the stage for the hyper scrutiny and overly negative criticizing that NY media and fans are now known for.
Although in hindsight I think most of the haters realize they really took for granted how great he was.

Ewing was the most under appreciated star in basketball. Look at those freaking teams. Ewing and the D-leaguers vs. the rest of the league. I'm still so bitter that our front office mismanaged things so poorly for 14 seasons and only managed to get it right towards the very end of his career.

your right-o
media really killed him
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
Killa4luv
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4/14/2011  11:03 AM
fishmike wrote:
Killa4luv wrote:Ewing probably had the worst media scrutiny of any star player in NY. Id say his era really set the stage for the hyper scrutiny and overly negative criticizing that NY media and fans are now known for.
Although in hindsight I think most of the haters realize they really took for granted how great he was.

Ewing was the most under appreciated star in basketball. Look at those freaking teams. Ewing and the D-leaguers vs. the rest of the league. I'm still so bitter that our front office mismanaged things so poorly for 14 seasons and only managed to get it right towards the very end of his career.

your right-o
media really killed him

And its part of the reason stars don't want to be here. Lebron didn't want these lights shined on him, and he had lights on him already as the best player in the league. But he didn't want to deal with this and can you blame him? Even the NBA on TNT has a former player, Charles Barkley trashing the Knicks every chance he gets. For no reason.

ESPN basically hates the Knicks.

One of the reasons I like Melo is because knowing all of this he still wanted to be here. He wasn't afraid.

Juice
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4/14/2011  11:04 AM
tkf wrote:ROFL.. you went all in bro...... haha, I can't say I dissagree....

Yo did you make a decision yet on the technology. I got something I'll float at you later. Check your you know what later

But honestly you know how you have your beefs with manufactured superstars which I do agree with.....this is a prime example of part of the workings to manufacture them. By handing them out all these accolades/awards over the course of their career building up their portfolio based on a hypocritical double standard.

fishmike
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4/14/2011  11:08 AM
Killa4luv wrote:
VCoug wrote:
Killa4luv wrote:
JrZyHuStLa wrote:The requirements for MVP doesn't call for a player making his teammates better.

Um, they sure did the year Nash won it. Oops, I mean 2 years. ridiculous, Nash has more MVPs than Kobe and Shaq.

I would make the argument that Shaq only deserves the one MVP and Kobe probably doesn't deserve any.

Shaq only won one MVP because that's the only year he started the season in shape and played for most of the season. Nearly every other year since he left Orlando, Shaq has missed about 1/5 of the season. Meanwhile, Kobe wasn't going to win an MVP while Shaq was there, so he couldn't have won until after 03-04. Then, the Lakers were no where nearly good enough for Kobe to win, until they got Gasol in 07-08. The 3 MVP's since then have been Kobe and Lebron twice and I would argue that Kobe didn't deserve MVP that year; he was, at best, third behind Chris Paul and Garnett.

All of that may be true and I can still give you 3 to 5 more people more deserving of the MVP than Steve Nash.

MVP is not best player. ITs not most talented player. Its not most productive player. Its most valuable player. Nash was certainly a top 5 player and the heart and soul of a team who 50-60 games year after year. When Amare missed a whole year they won 50+ with Boris Diaw playing center in the very tough and very big western conf.

Just like JVG's career was made when Houston's floater dropped in Nash and MDA's careers or legacy or whatever you want to call it took an equal hit when Horry took a cheap shot at Nash and drilled him into the scorers table. I believe they were up in that series en route to the NBA finals and a matchup vs. Nets? (how's my history here?)

"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
Nalod
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4/14/2011  12:39 PM
fishmike wrote:
Killa4luv wrote:
VCoug wrote:
Killa4luv wrote:
JrZyHuStLa wrote:The requirements for MVP doesn't call for a player making his teammates better.

Um, they sure did the year Nash won it. Oops, I mean 2 years. ridiculous, Nash has more MVPs than Kobe and Shaq.

I would make the argument that Shaq only deserves the one MVP and Kobe probably doesn't deserve any.

Shaq only won one MVP because that's the only year he started the season in shape and played for most of the season. Nearly every other year since he left Orlando, Shaq has missed about 1/5 of the season. Meanwhile, Kobe wasn't going to win an MVP while Shaq was there, so he couldn't have won until after 03-04. Then, the Lakers were no where nearly good enough for Kobe to win, until they got Gasol in 07-08. The 3 MVP's since then have been Kobe and Lebron twice and I would argue that Kobe didn't deserve MVP that year; he was, at best, third behind Chris Paul and Garnett.

All of that may be true and I can still give you 3 to 5 more people more deserving of the MVP than Steve Nash.

MVP is not best player. ITs not most talented player. Its not most productive player. Its most valuable player. Nash was certainly a top 5 player and the heart and soul of a team who 50-60 games year after year. When Amare missed a whole year they won 50+ with Boris Diaw playing center in the very tough and very big western conf.

Just like JVG's career was made when Houston's floater dropped in Nash and MDA's careers or legacy or whatever you want to call it took an equal hit when Horry took a cheap shot at Nash and drilled him into the scorers table. I believe they were up in that series en route to the NBA finals and a matchup vs. Nets? (how's my history here?)


I think your on par. Those were the two best teams that year.

Kudo's to Spurs for bringing the down and dirty and doing what you need to get the job done. PHX just was not mentally as tough to handle that. THey were a finesse team and Spurs had already won a few chips. They were less talented but more experienced.

I loved watching those suns but were not emotionally tied to them.

Coaches have to learn by doing. Im sure MDA will never forget that play and what it meant.

Good coaches gain from experience both good and bad. Even Phil Jax learned the starphuch of Gary Payton and Karl Malone does not put you over the top.

Juice
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4/14/2011  1:04 PM    LAST EDITED: 4/14/2011  1:04 PM
Nalod wrote:
fishmike wrote:
Killa4luv wrote:
VCoug wrote:
Killa4luv wrote:
JrZyHuStLa wrote:The requirements for MVP doesn't call for a player making his teammates better.

Um, they sure did the year Nash won it. Oops, I mean 2 years. ridiculous, Nash has more MVPs than Kobe and Shaq.

I would make the argument that Shaq only deserves the one MVP and Kobe probably doesn't deserve any.

Shaq only won one MVP because that's the only year he started the season in shape and played for most of the season. Nearly every other year since he left Orlando, Shaq has missed about 1/5 of the season. Meanwhile, Kobe wasn't going to win an MVP while Shaq was there, so he couldn't have won until after 03-04. Then, the Lakers were no where nearly good enough for Kobe to win, until they got Gasol in 07-08. The 3 MVP's since then have been Kobe and Lebron twice and I would argue that Kobe didn't deserve MVP that year; he was, at best, third behind Chris Paul and Garnett.

All of that may be true and I can still give you 3 to 5 more people more deserving of the MVP than Steve Nash.

MVP is not best player. ITs not most talented player. Its not most productive player. Its most valuable player. Nash was certainly a top 5 player and the heart and soul of a team who 50-60 games year after year. When Amare missed a whole year they won 50+ with Boris Diaw playing center in the very tough and very big western conf.

Just like JVG's career was made when Houston's floater dropped in Nash and MDA's careers or legacy or whatever you want to call it took an equal hit when Horry took a cheap shot at Nash and drilled him into the scorers table. I believe they were up in that series en route to the NBA finals and a matchup vs. Nets? (how's my history here?)


I think your on par. Those were the two best teams that year.

Kudo's to Spurs for bringing the down and dirty and doing what you need to get the job done. PHX just was not mentally as tough to handle that. THey were a finesse team and Spurs had already won a few chips. They were less talented but more experienced.

I loved watching those suns but were not emotionally tied to them.

Coaches have to learn by doing. Im sure MDA will never forget that play and what it meant.

Good coaches gain from experience both good and bad. Even Phil Jax learned the starphuch of Gary Payton and Karl Malone does not put you over the top.


Phil/Shaq/Kobe's impending contract situations is what derailed that team...not a starphuching. Karl and Gary were 34 and 37 respectively so really how much starphuching were they doing? Even then they got to the Finals doing it too fighting/bickering/pouting the whole way.

I think a more appropriate lessen in doing this were the Dallas Mavericks adding....Antoine Walker/Antawn Jamison/NVE to Nash/Dirk/Finley they did not reach the Finals...matter of fact I believe they got knocked off by the Kings in the 1rst round.

Nalod
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4/14/2011  1:48 PM
Juice, I hear you man and those guys just ran out of steam that season and got old real fast.

Lots of ways to win and lose.

Eras are coming to an end. Jax is retiring (see NY rumors every time Knicks hiccup) and Timmy's spurs are quality for sure but im not sure how much longer he and Pop stay together. In the east Boston is closing out soon and who knows what Dwight does to tip the balance in the future. I'd say Miami is the future in the east. Bulls with Booze and Noah just seem fragile anchoring the middle from injury history.

Where do we fit in? Stay tuned!

VCoug
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4/14/2011  2:04 PM
Nalod wrote:
fishmike wrote:
Killa4luv wrote:
VCoug wrote:
Killa4luv wrote:
JrZyHuStLa wrote:The requirements for MVP doesn't call for a player making his teammates better.

Um, they sure did the year Nash won it. Oops, I mean 2 years. ridiculous, Nash has more MVPs than Kobe and Shaq.

I would make the argument that Shaq only deserves the one MVP and Kobe probably doesn't deserve any.

Shaq only won one MVP because that's the only year he started the season in shape and played for most of the season. Nearly every other year since he left Orlando, Shaq has missed about 1/5 of the season. Meanwhile, Kobe wasn't going to win an MVP while Shaq was there, so he couldn't have won until after 03-04. Then, the Lakers were no where nearly good enough for Kobe to win, until they got Gasol in 07-08. The 3 MVP's since then have been Kobe and Lebron twice and I would argue that Kobe didn't deserve MVP that year; he was, at best, third behind Chris Paul and Garnett.

All of that may be true and I can still give you 3 to 5 more people more deserving of the MVP than Steve Nash.

MVP is not best player. ITs not most talented player. Its not most productive player. Its most valuable player. Nash was certainly a top 5 player and the heart and soul of a team who 50-60 games year after year. When Amare missed a whole year they won 50+ with Boris Diaw playing center in the very tough and very big western conf.

Just like JVG's career was made when Houston's floater dropped in Nash and MDA's careers or legacy or whatever you want to call it took an equal hit when Horry took a cheap shot at Nash and drilled him into the scorers table. I believe they were up in that series en route to the NBA finals and a matchup vs. Nets? (how's my history here?)


I think your on par. Those were the two best teams that year.

Kudo's to Spurs for bringing the down and dirty and doing what you need to get the job done. PHX just was not mentally as tough to handle that. THey were a finesse team and Spurs had already won a few chips. They were less talented but more experienced.

I loved watching those suns but were not emotionally tied to them.

Coaches have to learn by doing. Im sure MDA will never forget that play and what it meant.

Good coaches gain from experience both good and bad. Even Phil Jax learned the starphuch of Gary Payton and Karl Malone does not put you over the top.

It was a dirty play by Horry that got several Suns suspended. It wasn't any different then PJ Brown tossing Charlie Ward.

Now the joy of my world is in Zion How beautiful if nothing more Than to wait at Zion's door I've never been in love like this before Now let me pray to keep you from The perils that will surely come
tkf
Posts: 36487
Alba Posts: 6
Joined: 8/13/2001
Member: #87
4/14/2011  6:20 PM
Juice wrote:
tkf wrote:ROFL.. you went all in bro...... haha, I can't say I dissagree....

Yo did you make a decision yet on the technology. I got something I'll float at you later. Check your you know what later

But honestly you know how you have your beefs with manufactured superstars which I do agree with.....this is a prime example of part of the workings to manufacture them. By handing them out all these accolades/awards over the course of their career building up their portfolio based on a hypocritical double standard.

yea, these manufactured NBA stars just kill me... really they do..

as far as my technology issue goes, I have come to a conclusion, I will hit you up later...

Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
loweyecue
Posts: 27468
Alba Posts: 6
Joined: 11/20/2005
Member: #1037

4/14/2011  6:44 PM
THIBS
TKF on Melo ::....he is a punk, a jerk, a self absorbed out of shape, self aggrandizing, unprofessional, volume chucking coach killing playoff loser!!
Can Someone Tell Me Who Does Derrick Rose Make Better Besides Himself?

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