SupremeCommander wrote:

nyk4ever wrote:

orangeblobman wrote:Look, I can't be a blind optimist. I can't just say "oh, everything is great, look at the 5 wins".

My mind delves deeper, it is the burden of my intellect.

Melo has enough talent that, when he is hot, many of his defects are masked. But the true test is when he comes back down to his norm. Then it is all exposed again and that team, the true team, the team that will surely be evident once this fool's gold runs dry, that team is still flawed and full of problems.

The trade left us with a gutted team, a skeleton, in fact, I can't even call it a team.

So let's ride this happy wave, and I will act happy. But deep down, I know the deal. And it's not looking good.

we can replace everything we lost. i love gallo, he's my favorite player in the league, but to get a player like melo, you gotta give something to get something. melo is playing outstanding basketball right now and literally carrying this team on his back. he's not only scoring a ton, but he's rebounding very well, he's playing good defense now and he's cut down on the crap shots. melo is playing like a top10 player in this league and this is what he's capable of and GIVING us every single night right now.

Right. And I know that the Knicks sacrificies a lot of pawns but they definitely traded those pieces up.

Reach out your hand if your cup be empty,
If your cup is full may it be again

Those were quality parts, but replaceable. Again, how else do the Knicks procure a player of Carmelo Anthony's calibur? How else do the Knicks make Chris Paul's wedding toast a reality?

Awesome. I think that's the first time I've seen a Dead lyric quoted in this context. Well done.

I've been impressed by him - and for all the guff that D'Antoni's offensive schemes get, it seems like his schemes are getting Melo some easier looks than he is used to and Melo is buying in a little more.

Earl, with a nod to you - Carmelo Anthony is The Most Interesting Man in the World.

orangeblobman wrote:My mind delves deeper, it is the burden of my intellect.

Good. So let's delve deeper.

The trade left us with a gutted team, a skeleton, in fact, I can't even call it a team.

Intellectually, can you explain this assertion?

Billups, has missed time due to injury and the injury clearly affected his performance on his initial return, but when healthy he's been solid and clearly playing no worse than Felton was, who really wasn't playing good at all since mid-December, and that trend really hasn't reversed itself in Denver.

Sheldon Williams is in fact outproducing Mozgov since the trade.

Williams: 4.3pts on .533 shooting, 3.4rbs in 12.3m as a Knick.

Mozgov: 4pts on .462 shooting, 3.1rbs in 13.5m as a Knick.

Only think Williams gives up against Mozgov is 3-4 inches.

Anthony Randolph was not a part of the Knicks rotation.

Anthony Carter has delivered some decent minutes (16.4) from a area of need, the back-up PG position, in the 16 games he's played.

This production simply didn't exist on the Knicks prior to the trade.

The trade also opened up a roster spot for Jefferies. While his contribution is certainly not great and debatable whether it's been positive or negative, he is also playing minutes that didn't exist before the trade.

So to this point, at WORST I have the before/after effect as even and I think a strong case can be made the Knicks are deeper and have gotten more production from the respective pieces post-trade. It is NOT arguable the most trade pieces have played in more games and logged more minutes than the pre-trade pieces.

That brings it down to the main cogs - Anthony, Gallinari and Chandler.

Two-for-1 for sure, but with Anthony clearly being the best player of the 3.

So with this all cited, explain to me where the "gutted", "skeletal" effect is?

The total net loss of Chandler is how you define "gutted"? Knicks went from deep to a skeleton because they lost Wilson Chandler?

Knickoftime wrote:

orangeblobman wrote:My mind delves deeper, it is the burden of my intellect.

Good. So let's delve deeper.

The trade left us with a gutted team, a skeleton, in fact, I can't even call it a team.

Intellectually, can you explain this assertion?

Billups, has missed time due to injury and the injury clearly affected his performance on his initial return, but when healthy he's been solid and clearly playing no worse than Felton was, who really wasn't playing good at all since mid-December, and that trend really hasn't reversed itself in Denver.

Sheldon Williams is in fact outproducing Mozgov since the trade.

Williams: 4.3pts on .533 shooting, 3.4rbs in 12.3m as a Knick.

Mozgov: 4pts on .462 shooting, 3.1rbs in 13.5m as a Knick.

Only think Williams gives up against Mozgov is 3-4 inches.

Anthony Randolph was not a part of the Knicks rotation.

Anthony Carter has delivered some decent minutes (16.4) from a area of need, the back-up PG position, in the 16 games he's played.

This production simply didn't exist on the Knicks prior to the trade.

The trade also opened up a roster spot for Jefferies. While his contribution is certainly not great and debatable whether it's been positive or negative, he is also playing minutes that didn't exist before the trade.

So to this point, at WORST I have the before/after effect as even and I think a strong case can be made the Knicks are deeper and have gotten more production from the respective pieces post-trade. It is NOT arguable the most trade pieces have played in more games and logged more minutes than the pre-trade pieces.

That brings it down to the main cogs - Anthony, Gallinari and Chandler.

Two-for-1 for sure, but with Anthony clearly being the best player of the 3.

So with this all cited, explain to me where the "gutted", "skeletal" effect is?

The total net loss of Chandler is how you define "gutted"? Knicks went from deep to a skeleton because they lost Wilson Chandler?

"Delve on til the break of dawn!"

nyk4ever wrote:

orangeblobman wrote:Look, I can't be a blind optimist. I can't just say "oh, everything is great, look at the 5 wins".

My mind delves deeper, it is the burden of my intellect.

Melo has enough talent that, when he is hot, many of his defects are masked. But the true test is when he comes back down to his norm. Then it is all exposed again and that team, the true team, the team that will surely be evident once this fool's gold runs dry, that team is still flawed and full of problems.

The trade left us with a gutted team, a skeleton, in fact, I can't even call it a team.

So let's ride this happy wave, and I will act happy. But deep down, I know the deal. And it's not looking good.

we can replace everything we lost. i love gallo, he's my favorite player in the league, but to get a player like melo, you gotta give something to get something. melo is playing outstanding basketball right now and literally carrying this team on his back. he's not only scoring a ton, but he's rebounding very well, he's playing good defense now and he's cut down on the crap shots. melo is playing like a top10 player in this league and this is what he's capable of and GIVING us every single night right now.

i'd even say this - name one player in the league who's been better than melo for the last couple of weeks. particularly in terms of leading a team to w's when they’ve most needed it and delivering as the go-to guy on the team.

orangeblobman wrote:Look, I can't be a blind optimist. I can't just say "oh, everything is great, look at the 5 wins".

My mind delves deeper, it is the burden of my intellect.

Melo has enough talent that, when he is hot, many of his defects are masked. But the true test is when he comes back down to his norm. Then it is all exposed again and that team, the true team, the team that will surely be evident once this fool's gold runs dry, that team is still flawed and full of problems.

The trade left us with a gutted team, a skeleton, in fact, I can't even call it a team.

So let's ride this happy wave, and I will act happy. But deep down, I know the deal. And it's not looking good.

Now that Gallo is gone you cant be a blind optimist? LOL, when Gallo was here, we would be in the middle of a 3-4 game losing stresk and you was still posting stuff like "The Knicks are stupid-fresh.." and nonsense like that. Now that Melo is here, all of a sudden you dont want to be a blind optimist? If you are acting happy, you are doing a poor job. It seems to me that you are more a fan of the players (Gallo) than you are of the team.

babyKnicks wrote:

Knickoftime wrote:

orangeblobman wrote:My mind delves deeper, it is the burden of my intellect.

Good. So let's delve deeper.

The trade left us with a gutted team, a skeleton, in fact, I can't even call it a team.

Intellectually, can you explain this assertion?

Billups, has missed time due to injury and the injury clearly affected his performance on his initial return, but when healthy he's been solid and clearly playing no worse than Felton was, who really wasn't playing good at all since mid-December, and that trend really hasn't reversed itself in Denver.

Sheldon Williams is in fact outproducing Mozgov since the trade.

Williams: 4.3pts on .533 shooting, 3.4rbs in 12.3m as a Knick.

Mozgov: 4pts on .462 shooting, 3.1rbs in 13.5m as a Knick.

Only think Williams gives up against Mozgov is 3-4 inches.

Anthony Randolph was not a part of the Knicks rotation.

Anthony Carter has delivered some decent minutes (16.4) from a area of need, the back-up PG position, in the 16 games he's played.

This production simply didn't exist on the Knicks prior to the trade.

The trade also opened up a roster spot for Jefferies. While his contribution is certainly not great and debatable whether it's been positive or negative, he is also playing minutes that didn't exist before the trade.

So to this point, at WORST I have the before/after effect as even and I think a strong case can be made the Knicks are deeper and have gotten more production from the respective pieces post-trade. It is NOT arguable the most trade pieces have played in more games and logged more minutes than the pre-trade pieces.

That brings it down to the main cogs - Anthony, Gallinari and Chandler.

Two-for-1 for sure, but with Anthony clearly being the best player of the 3.

So with this all cited, explain to me where the "gutted", "skeletal" effect is?

The total net loss of Chandler is how you define "gutted"? Knicks went from deep to a skeleton because they lost Wilson Chandler?

And of course, no response. The haters are receding to the background!

Did you guys realize they were chanting Me-lo, me-lo in Philly? Chanting Let's go Knicjs in Philly?

The Knicks are back and we havent had an off season to fill holes. Next year is going to be nuts!

babyknicks - the cool part is that no matter what happens the rest of the way in April (or May), the Knicks are back.

Amare led the change of mind in July with a bold statement. By August, Donnie snuck a 7' Russian through customs. In September, Shawne Williams was reclaimed.

By October he beat out Junior for the final roster spot. By November, Landry ("who?") Fields was starting. In December Wilson Chandler started playing consistent basketball.

By January, winning was a habit. In February, everyone was looking over their shoulders and playing like they were being shadowed by the grim reaper. They were right.

By March everyone was wearing a "Hello, My Name Is..." label. Everyone.

By April, Shelden Williams looks (cough) halfway like a basketball player... Jared Jeffries "is who we THOUGHT he was, that's why he took the court,"... Amare discovers his inner Raymond Felton (7 assists last night) and Carmelo discovers a three point stroke he never had... Ronny Turiaf is the best cheerleader ever... Derrick Brown can do defense and do dunks... Toney Douglas discovers the joy of the behind-the-back pass and Chauncey Billups bruises his OTHER quad. It ain't never dull.

Expect the unexpected.

misterearl wrote:
It is difficult for you to accept that such a prodigious talent can come from West Baltimore, where nothing good can derive. People like Carmelo never succeed because of hard work or the sacrifice of perfecting a craft. They get where they are because of "God-given" talent that they can only squander, while they are listening to the latest tunes on their boom boxes, right? Wrong. It's NOT luck, and athletic skill does NOT come in the mail like food stamps...

In your bias, you are totally missing the point, and in the process of this wonderful personal growth, some excellent hoops...

Don't hate Carmelo because he is enjoying himself. Hate that high school coach who convinced you that frowning made you a better athlete.

tkf wrote:I was very upset at the trade. I always had hope we could get melo as a FA and add him to our core of young kids.. but melo is only 26, is playing as well as advertised, and is giving a real effort on defense. I can't hate on him.. the guy is a heck of a player.... But I do hate our owner... what a bafoon... he sabotaged most of Donnie's work on this deal. I am almost sure of that..

I have asked this question before and didn't get much response, so I'll ask it again.

There are some very good financial reason for Dolan to want Melo in NY ASAP and not at all in NJ. The stadium is going under construction, he wants to lock in marketing deals with every client he can in the greater NYC area, he also wants to deplete the Brooklyn project every which way he can.

IMHO those are some very solid reasons to get Melo to NY now without the risk of unknown after CBA comes out and not knowing exactly what Melo would do in off-season.

If as GM Dolan came to you and outlined this to you from an organizational standpoint and told you he wanted to supersede your basketball decision just this one time, would you understand the decision? I mean, he did give Isiah 6 years of free reign and I think he has given Donnie pretty much the same for the first 2, right?

Downside risk of Melo going to NJ/Brooklyn is that he is there for 8+ years as a thorn in the side and he pulls maybe a second star. That's some big ass downside.

babyKnicks wrote:

Hard work.

man, i gotta say it, i love this kid. i'm happy he's ours. i'm also very susceptible to commercials like that.