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Donnie Walsh will be on with Francesa on WFAN at 4:40
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BRIGGS
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2/22/2011  5:56 PM
Knickoftime wrote:So for the record, if Donnie Walsh said he was behind the trade, thinks the deal is a good one and wants to continue the work he's started, will anyone believe him?

Anyone with an ounce of intellect knew he was BS.

RIP Crushalot😞
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BRIGGS
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2/22/2011  5:57 PM
Poor Walsh, he sounded like they had his dogs at gunpoint. Did anyone hear him choke up a few times?
RIP Crushalot😞
Knickoftime
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2/22/2011  6:00 PM
Somebody commented last night now that the trade actually happened, what are KNicks fans going to talk about now.

We've since found out.

People who don't like the trade endlessly trying to convince themselves Donnie Walsh really, secretly agrees with them.

BlueSeats
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2/22/2011  6:02 PM
Knickoftime wrote:I'd ask everyone to watch the video with Walsh and D'Antoni.

People don't send people out in front of the media to say things they might not fully believe or thoughts crafted by someone else without being assured of how they will answer questions. This comes in the form of talking points.

Turn on FOX News, CNN or MSNBC and leave it on for 10 minutes to easily recognize when talking point are and ow they are used.

I don't see any common language or spin from either. They seem to be answering questions in the moment, acknowledging the imperfections, and bringing their own personalities to the responses.

Don't see a hint of preparation or prefabricated answers on their part.

You think Donnie is the kind of guy who needs to be coached on acting a gentleman?

What is it exactly that we are arguing here? Is it your point that Walsh feels no competition from Isiah for Dolan's ear? Or that he feels he has sufficient autonomy over negotiations without meddling from Dolan? Not sure how any of us are supposed to ascertain such distinctions from a press conference. But if all it takes is someone saying "I'm pleased" or "it's overblown" etc, to quell all your doubts, whatever kind of writer you are it's gotta be pretty far removed from PR.

BRIGGS
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2/22/2011  6:03 PM
Knickoftime wrote:Somebody commented last night now that the trade actually happened, what are KNicks fans going to talk about now.

We've since found out.

People who don't like the trade endlessly trying to convince themselves Donnie Walsh really, secretly agrees with them.

I don't think he secretly agrees with them--he blatantly agrees with them--be honest-you heard his voice.

RIP Crushalot😞
Markji
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2/22/2011  6:06 PM    LAST EDITED: 2/22/2011  6:08 PM
Knickoftime wrote:Somebody commented last night now that the trade actually happened, what are KNicks fans going to talk about now.

We've since found out.

People who don't like the trade endlessly trying to convince themselves Donnie Walsh really, secretly agrees with them.


K-O-T - In your opinion, do you think that this trade could have been completed without giving up either Mozgov and/or our 2014 pick if negotiations had been handled better before and during the weekend? (Meaning we give up Curry, Felton, Chandler, AR or trade for 1st round pick, and Gallo and maybe a 2nd round pick or 2??)
The difference between fiction and reality? Fiction has to make sense. Tom Clancy - author
Paladin55
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2/22/2011  6:08 PM
Knickoftime wrote:
Paladin55 wrote:You seem like a smart fellow

Appearances can be deceiving.

Paladin55 wrote:Exactly what someone working for Dolan or Isiah would say.

LOL... BlueSeats isn't happy with me at the moment, but he can vouce I don't work for Isiah.

Isiah is perhaps the worst GM in the history of the NBA and I find him personally unlikeable in a visceral way few human people inspire in me.

Does that convince you? :-)


Exactly the kind of response a "plant" would post on UK.

I've seen this in the movies before- you kill an ally to impress and deceive an enemy.

You've been trained well, but you're not fooling anyone.

No man is happy without a delusion of some kind. Delusions are as necessary to our happiness as realities- C.N. Bovee
Knickoftime
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2/22/2011  6:18 PM
Markji wrote:K-O-T - In your opinion, do you think that this trade could have been completed without giving up either Mozgov and/or our 2014 pick if negotiations had been handled better before and during the weekend? (Meaning we give up Curry, Felton, Chandler, AR or trade for 1st round pick, and Gallo and maybe a 2nd round pick or 2??)

I have ZERO idea. When there are capable people in the room (and I give Walsh that credit) I tend to think things happened as they were going to.

The reason I can't answer the question of "if things were handled better before", is because I don't know they were handled badly at all.

I've seen different versions of this entire process, people are gravitating toward the version they like best.

I think 'Melo really might have went to NJ.

I think sometime as close to very recently, Denver would have really liked to have held onto Anthony.

I know if the names that we know had SOME involvement Walsh is probably the most astute, experienced and professional.

None of that is definitive, but at the end of the day my faith in Walsh isn't limited to the first time he's involved in something I'm thrilled with (which btw, I'm not. I would like liked to held into Mozgoz too). I'm not a "yeah-but-what-have-you-done-for-me-lately" sort of person.

i think just after the job he's done, buying into the Dolan-Isiah Thomas narrative is just a little too convenient for my tastes.

My respect for Walsh extends to not assuming he's sitting there selling himself out.

Your mileage may vary.

BRIGGS
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2/22/2011  6:24 PM
Knickoftime wrote:
Markji wrote:K-O-T - In your opinion, do you think that this trade could have been completed without giving up either Mozgov and/or our 2014 pick if negotiations had been handled better before and during the weekend? (Meaning we give up Curry, Felton, Chandler, AR or trade for 1st round pick, and Gallo and maybe a 2nd round pick or 2??)

I have ZERO idea. When there are capable people in the room (and I give Walsh that credit) I tend to think things happened as they were going to.

The reason I can't answer the question of "if things were handled better before", is because I don't know they were handled badly at all.

I've seen different versions of this entire process, people are gravitating toward the version they like best.

I think 'Melo really might have went to NJ.

I think sometime as close to very recently, Denver would have really liked to have held onto Anthony.

I know if the names that we know had SOME involvement Walsh is probably the most astute, experienced and professional.

None of that is definitive, but at the end of the day my faith in Walsh isn't limited to the first time he's involved in something I'm thrilled with (which btw, I'm not. I would like liked to held into Mozgoz too). I'm not a "yeah-but-what-have-you-done-for-me-lately" sort of person.

i think just after the job he's done, buying into the Dolan-Isiah Thomas narrative is just a little too convenient for my tastes.

My respect for Walsh extends to not assuming he's sitting there selling himself out.

Your mileage may vary.

Go home dude--you're not fooling anyone--makes Dolan look worse that he planted stooges on a message board. Every last person here knows that Walsh did not want to do this deal--so please save it. You signed up about a month ago prepared for this sch-meal--so don't insult people's intelligence--it makes the Knicks look even dumber that they felt the need to plant stooges on a message board. Go tell Dolan to buy 2 million shares of IGOI and hold on to them for 5 years and I will gladly say he thought of it when it nets him 100mm $.

RIP Crushalot😞
Knickoftime
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2/22/2011  6:25 PM
BlueSeats wrote:You think Donnie is the kind of guy who needs to be coached on acting a gentleman?

First words outta his mouth, unsolicited mind you, was he is "very happy" with trade.

Sorry, but I still see arguing the Donnie Walsh is being less than genuine is fairly disrespectful of the man, not sympathetic to him. I don't see any way around that.

He's earned my trust. I me

What is it exactly that we are arguing here?

That a distinct possibility is at the end of the day, one of the reasons the trade was made was because Donnie Walsh agreed it should be made.

BlueSeats
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2/22/2011  6:29 PM
Knickoftime wrote:
BlueSeats wrote:You think Donnie is the kind of guy who needs to be coached on acting a gentleman?

First words outta his mouth, unsolicited mind you, was he is "very happy" with trade.

Sorry, but I still see arguing the Donnie Walsh is being less than genuine is fairly disrespectful of the man, not sympathetic to him. I don't see any way around that.

He's earned my trust. I me

What is it exactly that we are arguing here?

That a distinct possibility is at the end of the day, one of the reasons the trade was made was because Donnie Walsh agreed it should be made.

And if he would have preferred to hold out another player or two and played chicken till Thursday, or let it go to free agency, do you think you'd know that from today's press conference?

Knickoftime
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2/22/2011  6:31 PM
Paladin55 wrote:Exactly the kind of response a "plant" would post on UK.

If I were a plant, wouldn't I be posting on RealGM, which, you know... has a LOT more users than UltimateKnicks.com...

Wait, I know, I know...

That's exactly what a plant would say!!

You guys are sharp!

Assimilation is going to be tougher than I originally calculated.

Markji
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2/22/2011  6:33 PM
Knickoftime wrote:
Markji wrote:K-O-T - In your opinion, do you think that this trade could have been completed without giving up either Mozgov and/or our 2014 pick if negotiations had been handled better before and during the weekend? (Meaning we give up Curry, Felton, Chandler, AR or trade for 1st round pick, and Gallo and maybe a 2nd round pick or 2??)

I have ZERO idea. When there are capable people in the room (and I give Walsh that credit) I tend to think things happened as they were going to.

The reason I can't answer the question of "if things were handled better before", is because I don't know they were handled badly at all.

I've seen different versions of this entire process, people are gravitating toward the version they like best.

I think 'Melo really might have went to NJ.

I think sometime as close to very recently, Denver would have really liked to have held onto Anthony.

I know if the names that we know had SOME involvement Walsh is probably the most astute, experienced and professional.

None of that is definitive, but at the end of the day my faith in Walsh isn't limited to the first time he's involved in something I'm thrilled with (which btw, I'm not. I would like liked to held into Mozgoz too). I'm not a "yeah-but-what-have-you-done-for-me-lately" sort of person.

i think just after the job he's done, buying into the Dolan-Isiah Thomas narrative is just a little too convenient for my tastes.

My respect for Walsh extends to not assuming he's sitting there selling himself out.

Your mileage may vary.


"I have ZERO idea". KOT

I'll take that as a "maybe" because you have a strong opinion on everything that has gone down and that has been posted about this trade. You are a good debater, and are not wanting to create any doubt of the correctness of this trade because that is your position.

To explain how "NO" can really mean "Maybe" do you know the old joke of how a Lady and a Diplomat are similar but opposite?

The difference between fiction and reality? Fiction has to make sense. Tom Clancy - author
Knickoftime
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2/22/2011  6:33 PM
BlueSeats wrote:And if he would have preferred to hold out another player or two and played chicken till Thursday, or let it go to free agency, do you think you'd know that from today's press conference?

Absolutely not.

I'm always going to lose when asked to disprove wholesale speculation and assumption.

BlueSeats
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2/22/2011  6:35 PM
Knickoftime wrote:
BlueSeats wrote:And if he would have preferred to hold out another player or two and played chicken till Thursday, or let it go to free agency, do you think you'd know that from today's press conference?

Absolutely not.

I'm always going to lose when asked to disprove wholesale speculation and assumption.

You can't really "prove" trust either so this whole debate is a waste of words, the exact number of which I have not counted. Have you?

Knickoftime
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2/22/2011  6:44 PM
Markji wrote:I'll take that as a "maybe" because you have a strong opinion on everything that has gone down and that has been posted about this trade. You are a good debater, and are not wanting to create any doubt of the correctness of this trade because that is your position.

Let me be clear. I absolutely acknowledge that it's entirely possible that another version of this trade may have ultimately been an option. I don't deal in absolute assumptions.

But I also know that wanting a better version of trades is universal phenomena among sports fans.

Is anyone here going to argue that fans often post awful trades in favor of their favorite team, utterly convinced they're being fair and reasonable?

That's why fans do.

i can say this.

For months I've seen fans convinced 'melo would go to free agency so the KNicks could maintain their rosters.

A lot of the same fans remained convinced that 'Melo would never, ever, to to NJ, even if that meant risking the new CBA.

Neither of which were ever really credible in my opinion but certainly informing their version of what trade denver would agree to would be.

Knickoftime
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2/22/2011  6:45 PM
BlueSeats wrote:You can't really "prove" trust either so this whole debate is a waste of words, the exact number of which I have not counted. Have you?

15,171.

Markji
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2/22/2011  6:51 PM
Knickoftime - Let me be clear. I absolutely acknowledge that it's entirely possible that another version of this trade may have ultimately been an option.

Thank You!
You've just made me very happy.
Going out....see you guys later.
The difference between fiction and reality? Fiction has to make sense. Tom Clancy - author
BlueSeats
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2/22/2011  6:56 PM
Knickoftime wrote:
BlueSeats wrote:You can't really "prove" trust either so this whole debate is a waste of words, the exact number of which I have not counted. Have you?

15,171.

I'm waiting on verification from basketballjones.

Childs2Dudley
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2/22/2011  8:35 PM
I like Walsh but I think he is trying to save face for Dolan. It's not in him to publicly trash anyone and he's not going to out Dolan while working for him.

I respect what he said and I appreciate his classiness but I cannot believe for one second that he was the driving force behind the trade and that he had final say on it.

"Our attitude toward life determines life's attitude towards us." - Earl Nightingale
Donnie Walsh will be on with Francesa on WFAN at 4:40

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