Vmart wrote:very good elite player in Melo.

Stacked teams? If your patient w/ our young players Knicks could HAVE a stacked team in a year or two. Or we could trade them all for Melo as the Nets are doing and lose in round 2 every year to stacked teams and wonder why

Vmart wrote:

martin wrote:

Vmart wrote:You hate Melo with a passion. You know and I know these awards are given out like candy. Everyone knows that Micheal Jordan was MVP of the league year in and year out and they still found ways to give out awards to other players what the F is that.

awards aside, do you really qualify Melo as the same type of 2-way player as Kobe, LeBron, Wade?

I think your perception of defense is all wrong. You put Wade in there? I have seen Wade get abused by players do you remember when Crawford went off on him cracking his ankles, I have seen Melo himself drop point after point on LeBron, I have seen Pierce go tooth and nail vs LeBron what defense are you talking about. This is all perception, they give out these popularity awards and you guys buy into it like it is, there are only a hand full of exceptional defensive players in the league. Your talking Ben Wallace in his prime, Camby, Artest, Bowen now retired, Prince, Duncan they play great defense not LeBron, Wade they play decent defense and Melo is in their category as far as defense is concerned. I have said LeBron is in his own class as he an all around player. Don't give me Wade is better than Melo that BS they are in the same category of players. I'm even gonna throw Kobe in the Wade, Melo mix, only difference is Kobe had the luxury of playing with a stacked team. Same with Wade he had the luxury of catching Shaq just before he mailed it in. Melo never had this kind of luxury to tag along an elite an all time player like Shaq. Now Kobe has Gasol to work with. Paul Pierce was the same this guy had the same fate in store as Melo until KG and Allen came along. Give Melo Amar'e then you will see his value. You guys a short changing a very good elite player in Melo. I don't want to forget Howard as a great defensive player.

This is all kind of just conjecture without the #s to compare players. Hard to say whether Melo is a better or worse defender than so and so and have it hold any weight without something more to back it up.

Your teammates, your coach, the system. All of these affect how a players looks on defense.

If you watch an entire Denver game and try to pay special attention to Melo on defense, in the past, sometimes it looks like he really don't give a fck.

fishmike wrote:

Vmart wrote:very good elite player in Melo.

oh man... I guess if I'm trading all my young guns I'm holding out for super good elite...

Stacked teams? If your patient w/ our young players Knicks could HAVE a stacked team in a year or two. Or we could trade them all for Melo as the Nets are doing and lose in round 2 every year to stacked teams and wonder why

Your going to be waiting for LeBron once his contract expires with the Heat and thats no guarantee you will land him then too. I'll take my chances with Melo and you don't know what the deal will be no one knows if any deal will go down or if it does who will be in it.

Killa4luv wrote:

OldFan wrote:

MSG3 wrote:LeBron hasn't won ****. Carmelo carried a Syracuse team to a title. Not saying Melo is better but he's had more success in his career than LeBron. Melo belongs in the discussion with all the players mentioned above, save for Kobe who is a cut above the rest.

Carmelo is a top 10 player in this league. Put him with Amare and Felton you have a contender. Add a big man and you might have a favorite.

I have to disagree on both counts. LeBron and Wade are both much better then Melo. They're better offensively and defensively it isn't even close. I'd even debate that Carmelo is a top 10 player but at least that one's debatable.

If it's debatable then name 10 players better than him.
Kobe
Lebron
Wade - this is debatable as far as I'm concerned
???

Durant,
Howard,
Dirk,
Griffin
Gasol
Deron Williams
Chris Paul
Rose
Amare

Vmart wrote:

fishmike wrote:

Vmart wrote:very good elite player in Melo.

oh man... I guess if I'm trading all my young guns I'm holding out for super good elite...

Stacked teams? If your patient w/ our young players Knicks could HAVE a stacked team in a year or two. Or we could trade them all for Melo as the Nets are doing and lose in round 2 every year to stacked teams and wonder why

Your going to be waiting for LeBron once his contract expires with the Heat and thats no guarantee you will land him then too. I'll take my chances with Melo and you don't know what the deal will be no one knows if any deal will go down or if it does who will be in it.

I'm just as willing to take my chances on Walsh BUILDING an elite team

GoNyGoNyGo wrote:

tkf wrote:melo won't have to be the alpha male here.. amare has taken on that role, but melo can be a great sidekick and in the playoffs, not lebron, kobe or wade can stop this cat from scoring... nice option to have... teams will have to gameplan for melo.. believe that..

I second this. This is Amare's team. He is the unquestioned leader. Melo will fit in nicely with them. I think he will be a Knick and the Knicks will not give up too much for him off of the regular rotation, if at all.

thirded.

TMS wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:

SupremeCommander wrote:

bernard wrote:For some reason, these arguments continue to be interesting even though not too much new is being said. To me ... and I think to most of the people on this forum ... the key question is what we'd have to give up to get Melo.

Some are saying Curry, AR (or the 1st he can become) and Gallo or Chandler. Sign me up for that trade. No brainer, imo.

Others are saying Curry, Chandler, Gallo and Fields. I'm definitely not making that trade.

If it's Curry plus 2 of Gallo, Chandler and Fields, I'm in a quandry -- I really think that's a tough call, but I probably pass hoping Melo falls to us as a FA and hoping that if he doesn't, we can get an upgrade at the 5 without giving up so much or killing our cap. A very good 5, even if he isn't as good a player as Melo, fills our needs better and may therefore help almost as much, so I wouldn't give up 2 of our 3 young starters plus a huge contract that limits our ability to fill in the gap.

Good post. It really boils down to value. The team doesn't have enough depth to afford to trade all the most tradeable assets, because the team won't have the depth to beat the Celtics/Bulls/Magic or be able to match Miami's stars. If the right balance is struck the deal has to be made. Multiple All NBA team guys don't hit the market often

I do think the closer to the deadline it gets, the more value the Knicks will get. The fans are booing Melo. The Nuggets appear determined to not lose him for nothing.

I agree. It all depends on the deal.

obviously it all depends on what we'd have to give up... a couple guys here think we're not getting him without having to give up all 4 of our young guys & multiple picks, which in my mind is ridiculous... DW has made it clear he's not gonna gut the team to get Melo here, but they can't seem to wrap their minds around this simple fact... we're not trying to match NJ's offer of talent... we're waiting for Melo to refuse the Nets deal so we can engage the Nuggets in trade talks w/o having to match the NJ offer.

right. the ideal situation is the Nuggets have five minutes to decide whether or not to take our fire sale offer, or have him come and sign with us in the offseason anyway