martin wrote:

Marv wrote:

cheers wrote:

martin wrote:

Marv wrote:

martin wrote:

cheers wrote:

Marv wrote:when isiah had chaney thrown out of the building i said i didn’t give a s**t as long as the man wins. when he showed that he knew less than nothing about building a basketball team i jumped down his throat for every little thing he said and did.

same way for me with mda. the coach of my team can be the biggest pr**k in the world and it's all right with me if he's leading us to victories. if i want a role model i turn on tnt and watch sir charles.

isiah got good players for the cards he had at the time, he just didnt have anything to tie it all together. plus though the fans were behind isiah in the beginning. most ny sports press hated on isiah from day one. brought up everything from the continental basketball association to some quote about larry bird that he agreed with.

OMG

OMG II

OMG Send Closk

so i take it when isiah signed marbury you and marv were against the signing

totally for it. and after the larry brown year when all 3 showed what little pricks they were i thought all 3 should be removed from the franchise. look which 2 stayed. how did that work out for the franchise?

Dare I mention the name Jerome James, does that influence your current thinking on the subject at hand?

ok so i take that as a yes you were on board with the marbury signing, as most fans were. did you remember that the ny press would not even credit isiah? but gave credit to layden saying it was a old plan laying on his desk. pfft.

martin wrote:

Marv wrote:

cheers wrote:

martin wrote:

Marv wrote:

martin wrote:

cheers wrote:

Marv wrote:when isiah had chaney thrown out of the building i said i didn’t give a s**t as long as the man wins. when he showed that he knew less than nothing about building a basketball team i jumped down his throat for every little thing he said and did.

same way for me with mda. the coach of my team can be the biggest pr**k in the world and it's all right with me if he's leading us to victories. if i want a role model i turn on tnt and watch sir charles.

isiah got good players for the cards he had at the time, he just didnt have anything to tie it all together. plus though the fans were behind isiah in the beginning. most ny sports press hated on isiah from day one. brought up everything from the continental basketball association to some quote about larry bird that he agreed with.

OMG

OMG II

OMG Send Closk

so i take it when isiah signed marbury you and marv were against the signing

totally for it. and after the larry brown year when all 3 showed what little pricks they were i thought all 3 should be removed from the franchise. look which 2 stayed. how did that work out for the franchise?

Dare I mention the name Jerome James, does that influence your current thinking on the subject at hand?

point #1. off-the-court intangibles. think of ronny turiaf - WITH a preacher's certification!
point #2 injuries from the all-out manner that he played the game.
point #3. COOKIES!!

cheers wrote:

martin wrote:

Marv wrote:

cheers wrote:

martin wrote:

Marv wrote:

martin wrote:

cheers wrote:

Marv wrote:when isiah had chaney thrown out of the building i said i didn’t give a s**t as long as the man wins. when he showed that he knew less than nothing about building a basketball team i jumped down his throat for every little thing he said and did.

same way for me with mda. the coach of my team can be the biggest pr**k in the world and it's all right with me if he's leading us to victories. if i want a role model i turn on tnt and watch sir charles.

isiah got good players for the cards he had at the time, he just didnt have anything to tie it all together. plus though the fans were behind isiah in the beginning. most ny sports press hated on isiah from day one. brought up everything from the continental basketball association to some quote about larry bird that he agreed with.

OMG

OMG II

OMG Send Closk

so i take it when isiah signed marbury you and marv were against the signing

totally for it. and after the larry brown year when all 3 showed what little pricks they were i thought all 3 should be removed from the franchise. look which 2 stayed. how did that work out for the franchise?

Dare I mention the name Jerome James, does that influence your current thinking on the subject at hand?

ok so i take that as a yes you were on board with the marbury signing, as most fans were. did you remember that the ny press would not even credit isiah? but gave credit to layden saying it was a old plan laying on his desk. pfft.

I think it was well documented that Layden had been working with PHO on a trade for Marbury before he was dumped for Isiah. I really have no clue were I was on the trade 10 years ago but I would have to say I was probably happy about the talent that was brought in - both Marbury and Penny.

But back then we as fans also did not have any insight to the full details of the trade and its downwind impact - salary cap, first round picks, injury report on Penny, etc. I think it's pretty safe to say that if that type of trade happened to day (and with full consideration of hindsight no doubt), we would all be hedging mightily.

And then the whole Isiah and Marbury thing unfolded and it's hard to find anyone that would be insane enough to want to defend either of them... until now of course.

jimimou wrote:

TMS wrote:

jimimou wrote:

TMS wrote:no one said he shouldn't sit.

as for MDA being as ass, if u wanna defend his right to be an ass & embarass a bench warmer then would u also be defending him if he made some unnecessary crack about a player that was actually producing on the floor? is the coach always right no matter what? i don't think that's fair... when a player acts like a pro & the coach acts like a douche, i don't see why it's objectionable to disagree w/it.

you didnt see the interview did you? i didnt either. that's why i didnt comment on 'how' he meant what he said. so until someone can post it to see exactly how d'antoni said what he said, then your opinion is based solely on how you feel about d'antoni, not the situation at hand.

if u read my comments i accounted for the fact that Berman has been known to stretch the truth to create controversy so this article has to be taken w/a grain of salt... the article could be true, or it could be a twisted version of it... there's no way for you to know it to be anything but the way it was presented either since neither of us saw the interview... yet you suggested that we shouldn't care what kind of context it was meant in, whether he meant it as a diss or not, & you even somewhat applauded MDA's response because you had interpreted it to be a sarcastic response in your original post, & that i can't agree with... i found absolutely nothing wrong w/what Mason said, he came across as a professional & didn't bash the coach or the franchise in any way... not sure how that deserves scorn from anyone, particularly from his own head coach, if indeed that's how MDA's comment was intended.

yeah, i read your comments......and i didnt agree with them before i posted and i dont agree with them now.

what don't u agree with? so u think a coach has a right to publically embarass his own players regardless if those players act like professional or not? i don't even get your intention here... in your original post you basically applauded MDA for making a sarcastic assholish comment directed at Mason because you felt he had no right to demand playing time, when in fact, he was doing nothing of the sort... now you're saying we have no way of knowing the intention behind MDA's comment, which is a double take on your original point... ur main point was that bench players have no right to demand minutes & that MDA was right to poke fun of Mason's insignificance on his roster... correct me if i'm wrong but that's what i got out of your thread... from the comments that Mason made, i don't see anywhere that he was demanding minutes, thereby making MDA's comment unwarranted & unnecessary.

TMS wrote:i don't see anyone arguing that Mason deserves minutes... not sure why that's even an issue on this thread... the issue is the head coach making unnecessarily ass-holish comments to the press about his own players

That's fair, TMS, and I'm not one to start a lot of threads so sometimes I shoehorn a proposition into an existing one, and it's not always the best fit. None the less, between the various threads that include grumping about who isn't getting enough minutes; who's getting too many; how MDA doesn't like rookies; picks his favorites; has a dog house; is too smug; etc; I felt the need to make a point, and that is that his methods are not uncommon, and I really don't care if he hurts some feelings along the way.

Seriously, if every warrior was as sensitive as our bench guys are assumed to be we wouldn't have standing armies, as no one would survive boot camp.

But that's just me. It was when I found out Marbury was giving speeches about personal sacrifice and then spending practice getting massaged that I knew there was something wrong in the Coach/GM/player power structure. There are certain players who need to be bitch-slapped to force an effect. We may not always see it (Balkman, Darko, etc) but coaches do. They might not get it right every time, but they are entitled (even obliged) to try. It's their job prepare the team for battle, not give every individual a tug job. It's not just about massaging the ego of the individual, but making an example for the rest of the team. And a lot of times when a guy is dogging it the players want to see repercussions too. It's about order, and I see no reason to assume it's all madness without method.

In general I see this team as overachieving, and I really don't get why we have so many sour grapes over it. In the big picture I think MDA is having a great season, who are we to micro-manage it when we have virtually nothing to go on?

jimimou wrote:

TMS wrote:

jimimou wrote:

TMS wrote:

jimimou wrote:

TMS wrote:no one said he shouldn't sit.

as for MDA being as ass, if u wanna defend his right to be an ass & embarass a bench warmer then would u also be defending him if he made some unnecessary crack about a player that was actually producing on the floor? is the coach always right no matter what? i don't think that's fair... when a player acts like a pro & the coach acts like a douche, i don't see why it's objectionable to disagree w/it.

you didnt see the interview did you? i didnt either. that's why i didnt comment on 'how' he meant what he said. so until someone can post it to see exactly how d'antoni said what he said, then your opinion is based solely on how you feel about d'antoni, not the situation at hand.

if u read my comments i accounted for the fact that Berman has been known to stretch the truth to create controversy so this article has to be taken w/a grain of salt... the article could be true, or it could be a twisted version of it... there's no way for you to know it to be anything but the way it was presented either since neither of us saw the interview... yet you suggested that we shouldn't care what kind of context it was meant in, whether he meant it as a diss or not, & you even somewhat applauded MDA's response because you had interpreted it to be a sarcastic response in your original post, & that i can't agree with... i found absolutely nothing wrong w/what Mason said, he came across as a professional & didn't bash the coach or the franchise in any way... not sure how that deserves scorn from anyone, particularly from his own head coach, if indeed that's how MDA's comment was intended.

yeah, i read your comments......and i didnt agree with them before i posted and i dont agree with them now.

what don't u agree with? so u think a coach has a right to publically embarass his own players regardless if those players act like professional or not? i don't even get your intention here... in your original post you basically applauded MDA for making a sarcastic assholish comment directed at Mason because you felt he had no right to demand playing time, when in fact, he was doing nothing of the sort... now you're saying we have no way of knowing the intention behind MDA's comment, which is a double take on your original point... ur main point was that bench players have no right to demand minutes & that MDA was right to poke fun of Mason's insignificance on his roster... correct me if i'm wrong but that's what i got out of your thread... from the comments that Mason made, i don't see anywhere that he was demanding minutes, thereby making MDA's comment unwarranted & unnecessary.

i never said a coach has a right to embarass his players. never, not once.

what i dont agree with is how you like to inject your opinion as its fact and anyone that thinks differently is somehow wrong. get over it, i said what i said and i'm not going back and forth with you on it b/c you dont know how to have a two way convo.

we've hung together alot and i like you, but please dont tell me how to think or what i should be thinking or what i really mean by what im saying.

i have no idea where you're coming from on that, i'm asking u to clarify your stance on the issue, that's it... where did i say my opinion is fact & anyone else's is wrong? i said i disagree w/u same as u said u disagree w/me... i don't know what you disagree with... are you supporting a coach's right to be an ass or aren't u? i don't support it... i think a coach should act like a pro, especially when it comes to a player who has been a pro since he's been here like Mason... i never said he deserved minutes, i never said he had a right to demand minutes & i sure as hell never told u how u should think.

this is what i'm going off of:

This article cracked me up. mason should stfu and show he wants to be here by his play, not his mouth! D'antoni's response was classic:

cheers wrote:

TMS wrote:

cheers wrote:

TMS wrote:

cheers wrote:

TMS wrote:no one said he shouldn't sit.

as for MDA being as ass, if u wanna defend his right to be an ass & embarass a bench warmer then would u also be defending him if he made some unnecessary crack about a player that was actually producing on the floor? is the coach always right no matter what? i don't think that's fair... when a player acts like a pro & the coach acts like a douche, i don't see why it's objectionable to disagree w/it.

yea its just bad karma. mda was a d!ck to marbury and that is what caused the drama; that lead to a buyout. marbury his whole career played hard and this is the one coach he refused to suit up for when his number was called. mda has issues not saying we dont all have. but lets not kid ourselves, mda burns bridges with players unnecessarily.

[ps] PLAY AR.

Marbury deserved the treatment he got, he acted like a selfish primadonna ever since he got here & had no problems embarassing the franchise w/his behavior on & off the court... i had no problem w/how MDA treated him... not sure what Mason has done to deserve any kinds of sarcastic digs in the press by the coach if that was his intent

you can say that but look how marbury played.. he tried to play mda system of chucking up threes, which was completely outside of steph's game. as for embarrassing the franchise off the court. pls. like when he donated a million of his salary to katrina or when he started up a shoe company so poor kids can buy affordable sneakers to ball in.

allan houston never embarrass the knicks franchise, once. he also didnt do anything close to the good steph did.

i don't even have a clue where u get this stuff... Allan Houston played a major role in getting us to an NBA Finals, made the Allstar team as a Knick & is one of the most prolific scorers in franchise history... don't think Marbury ever came close to doing any of those things... the best thing Marbury ever did as a Knick was donating a ton of money to charity, which was applauded... Allan Houston was also involved in a variety of charitable causes over his Knicks tenure, he just never sought recognition for it.

that was over a decade ago.. larry brown likes to live off of past glory too. and what does "variety of charitable causes" even mean when you can not even name em off top of your head. forget that token stuff. im talking about stepping up in the moment it matters. coming out with affordable sneaks parents can afford +1. being the first nba player to publicly come out (crying) and support katrina donating a million of his salary +1.

can you name anything allan houston has done that comes close? without having to try to google to find it. lol.

ok so those were the positive things steph did while he was a knick. what were the negative things?

Marv wrote:

cheers wrote:

TMS wrote:

cheers wrote:

TMS wrote:

cheers wrote:

TMS wrote:no one said he shouldn't sit.

as for MDA being as ass, if u wanna defend his right to be an ass & embarass a bench warmer then would u also be defending him if he made some unnecessary crack about a player that was actually producing on the floor? is the coach always right no matter what? i don't think that's fair... when a player acts like a pro & the coach acts like a douche, i don't see why it's objectionable to disagree w/it.

yea its just bad karma. mda was a d!ck to marbury and that is what caused the drama; that lead to a buyout. marbury his whole career played hard and this is the one coach he refused to suit up for when his number was called. mda has issues not saying we dont all have. but lets not kid ourselves, mda burns bridges with players unnecessarily.

[ps] PLAY AR.

Marbury deserved the treatment he got, he acted like a selfish primadonna ever since he got here & had no problems embarassing the franchise w/his behavior on & off the court... i had no problem w/how MDA treated him... not sure what Mason has done to deserve any kinds of sarcastic digs in the press by the coach if that was his intent

you can say that but look how marbury played.. he tried to play mda system of chucking up threes, which was completely outside of steph's game. as for embarrassing the franchise off the court. pls. like when he donated a million of his salary to katrina or when he started up a shoe company so poor kids can buy affordable sneakers to ball in.

allan houston never embarrass the knicks franchise, once. he also didnt do anything close to the good steph did.

i don't even have a clue where u get this stuff... Allan Houston played a major role in getting us to an NBA Finals, made the Allstar team as a Knick & is one of the most prolific scorers in franchise history... don't think Marbury ever came close to doing any of those things... the best thing Marbury ever did as a Knick was donating a ton of money to charity, which was applauded... Allan Houston was also involved in a variety of charitable causes over his Knicks tenure, he just never sought recognition for it.

that was over a decade ago.. larry brown likes to live off of past glory too. and what does "variety of charitable causes" even mean when you can not even name em off top of your head. forget that token stuff. im talking about stepping up in the moment it matters. coming out with affordable sneaks parents can afford +1. being the first nba player to publicly come out (crying) and support katrina donating a million of his salary +1.

can you name anything allan houston has done that comes close? without having to try to google to find it. lol.

ok so those were the positive things steph did while he was a knick. what were the negative things?

^^^you dont have enough internet space on this board to write all of marbury's negatives lol

martin wrote:

cheers wrote:

martin wrote:

Marv wrote:

cheers wrote:

martin wrote:

Marv wrote:

martin wrote:

cheers wrote:

Marv wrote:when isiah had chaney thrown out of the building i said i didn’t give a s**t as long as the man wins. when he showed that he knew less than nothing about building a basketball team i jumped down his throat for every little thing he said and did.

same way for me with mda. the coach of my team can be the biggest pr**k in the world and it's all right with me if he's leading us to victories. if i want a role model i turn on tnt and watch sir charles.

isiah got good players for the cards he had at the time, he just didnt have anything to tie it all together. plus though the fans were behind isiah in the beginning. most ny sports press hated on isiah from day one. brought up everything from the continental basketball association to some quote about larry bird that he agreed with.

OMG

OMG II

OMG Send Closk

so i take it when isiah signed marbury you and marv were against the signing

totally for it. and after the larry brown year when all 3 showed what little pricks they were i thought all 3 should be removed from the franchise. look which 2 stayed. how did that work out for the franchise?

Dare I mention the name Jerome James, does that influence your current thinking on the subject at hand?

ok so i take that as a yes you were on board with the marbury signing, as most fans were. did you remember that the ny press would not even credit isiah? but gave credit to layden saying it was a old plan laying on his desk. pfft.

I think it was well documented that Layden had been working with PHO on a trade for Marbury before he was dumped for Isiah. I really have no clue were I was on the trade 10 years ago but I would have to say I was probably happy about the talent that was brought in - both Marbury and Penny.

But back then we as fans also did not have any insight to the full details of the trade and its downwind impact - salary cap, first round picks, injury report on Penny, etc. I think it's pretty safe to say that if that type of trade happened to day (and with full consideration of hindsight no doubt), we would all be hedging mightily.

And then the whole Isiah and Marbury thing unfolded and it's hard to find anyone that would be insane enough to want to defend either of them... until now of course.

not defending cause nothing to defend. just understanding that neither were villains. both honestly tried for ny.

props to donnie but he got a pass for two years to blow the team up, and mda got a pass for two to be a d!ck. but right now i dont think it is a good time for mda to continue to be a d!ck. and donnie should not have to feel he has to continue to blow things up.. right now i feel mda is forcing donnie into blowing up the bench.

dont blow up the bench PLAY AR and give the rest of the bench burn when available because this aint the 1980s. the game is faster, players break down more often. we dont need a great or good bench we need an active bench who puts in just enough time to give our winning five the rest they need to bring the game home.

Marv wrote:

TMS wrote:

BlueSeats wrote:

TMS wrote:i don't see anyone arguing that Mason deserves minutes... not sure why that's even an issue on this thread... the issue is the head coach making unnecessarily ass-holish comments to the press about his own players

That's fair, TMS, and I'm not one to start a lot of threads so sometimes I shoehorn a proposition into an existing one, and it's not always the best fit. None the less, between the various threads that include grumping about who isn't getting enough minutes; who's getting too many; how MDA doesn't like rookies; picks his favorites; has a dog house; is too smug; etc; I felt the need to make a point, and that is that his methods are not uncommon, and I really don't care if he hurts some feelings along the way.

Seriously, if every warrior was as sensitive as our bench guys are assumed to be we wouldn't have standing armies, as no one would survive boot camp.

But that's just me. It was when I found out Marbury was giving speeches about personal sacrifice and then spending practice getting massaged that I knew there was something wrong in the Coach/GM/player power structure. There are certain players who need to be bitch-slapped to force an effect. We may not always see it (Balkman, Darko, etc) but coaches do. They might not get it right every time, but they are entitled (even obliged) to try. It's their job prepare the team for battle, not give every individual a tug job. It's not just about massaging the ego of the individual, but making an example for the rest of the team. And a lot of times when a guy is dogging it the players want to see repercussions too. It's about order, and I see no reason to assume it's all madness without method.

In general I see this team as overachieving, and I really don't get why we have so many sour grapes over it. In the big picture I think MDA is having a great season, who are we to micro-manage it when we have virtually nothing to go on?

my only concern comes in when i think this type of stuff breeds resentment inside the lockerroom... i think we've got some good karma working here this season & would hate for some unnecessary drama to bring any bad into the equation.

if this were Mason criticizing the coach for not playing him & saying he thought he deserved to be in the rotation right now, i would have agreed with everyone else & said Mason needs to stfu & wait his turn, but i didn't get that from his comments... it might not be a big deal to diss bench players but really, what's the point? what good is achieved by dissing a veteran who has conducted himself like a pro since he's been here? does that benefit the team in any way? that's my simple point... if u disagree that's up to u but that's my take.

our locker room leaders appear to be our on-court leaders as well - amear and ray. they've both seen a lot of drama in their careers, and i think they're both the type to say, "F it, it's time to ball" and blow all that peripheral stuff off. mike's just being human. you put a microphone in front of any our mouths every day and what kind of drivel do you think's gonna come out? except for blob of course.

u put a mike in front of my face & u might have a how many times does the word 'bukkake' get used trivia question in the making... but hey, i'm not expected to conduct myself with any sense of professionalism as a fan.

i agree w/u about Amare & Ray being our on court leaders... i could never see them singling anyone out in the press & embarassing them... even when Amare called out his teammates for their crappy play, he used the word "we" & included himself into his own criticism... to MDA & to a lot of fans, a little remark like this one doesn't mean a whole lot of nothing, but athletes are prideful guys & no one likes to be made a fool of in the press, especially when they did nothing to instigate it... if MDA were to make a wise crack comment about Amare or Ray i doubt they'd much appreciate it either (not that he ever would diss the 2 best players on his team, just saying)