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tkf
Posts: 36487 Alba Posts: 6 Joined: 8/13/2001 Member: #87 |
8/31/2010 12:45 PM
TMS wrote:tkf wrote:you really think westbrook is that much better? wow..... as they say, the grass is always interesting you mention this... OKC would not do lee for westbrook because they have options at lee's position... decent enough options.. but if OKC had a hole at PF and another PG option, would they trade westbrook for lee? maybe.. heck lee's numbers were nohting to sneeze at, plus he is an allstar... value is relative here.. remember walsh said he had other offers for lee, some even better offers.. but ultimately lee held most of the cards as to where he wanted to go... You say westbrook is a PG so he has more value than gallo... well gallo is a big and I would not trade gallo for westbrook ,especially considering we have a PG in felton who is more than adequate.. again, value is relative.. We are tall talking about pretty good players here, so to argue who is better, westbrook, AR/ gallo is useless.. and this is what brings me back to the melo talks.. melo is a great scorer, but not a superstar IMO.. you mention durant, whO I don't think is there yet, but one thing I will say, is that durant is also establishing himself on the defensive end.. that will make the difference.. So instead of looking at melo's value in terms of comparing him to gallo and AR, lets look at his value in terms of knicks need, and cost of obtaining his services.. for me, it is just too much considering what I am getting back, and that he will be a FA next year... Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser...............
TKF
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tkf
Posts: 36487 Alba Posts: 6 Joined: 8/13/2001 Member: #87 |
8/31/2010 12:48 PM
TMS wrote:tkf wrote:TMS wrote:knickstorrents wrote:Why are people so in love with Melo? why does gallo have to be as good as melo? he and randolph both can bring us things that melo doesn't.. isn't there value in that? this is not about a head for head exchange here... Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser...............
TKF
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tkf
Posts: 36487 Alba Posts: 6 Joined: 8/13/2001 Member: #87 |
8/31/2010 12:54 PM
TMS wrote:tkf wrote:BRIGGS wrote:TMS wrote:knickstorrents wrote:Why are people so in love with Melo? I think you are talking about the minority here.. I am not sure who here didn't want to move lee for KG had that been a real option... I also was not one of those who wanted to trade gallo for AR.. but again, what are we talking about here.. this is not a Gallo for melo trade.. this is gallo, AR, chandler and a pick for melo.. if anyone thinks it will be anything less is fooling themselves! this is Carmelo, the same dude who went toe to toe with Kobe Bryant in the WCF a couple years back & almost carried his team to beating them... if any of you forgot that, here's something to refresh your memory:
Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser...............
TKF
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AnubisADL
Posts: 27382 Alba Posts: 13 Joined: 6/29/2009 Member: #2771 USA |
8/31/2010 1:32 PM
knickstorrents wrote:Why are people so in love with Melo? IF this team needs scoring, he MIGHT fill a need (though on a net basis he doesn't give you that much. Check his true shooting percentage vs. other max players). What this team needs right now is a stable, defensive Center. Let this team play. If it becomes apparent that we lack scoring punch (which is highly doubtful) then I can see why we might want to trade for Melo. Carmelo isnt standing around taking wide open shots either. He is blowing players faces off with a hand in face almost all the time. NY Knicks - Retirement home for players and GMs
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nixluva
Posts: 56258 Alba Posts: 0 Joined: 10/5/2004 Member: #758 USA |
8/31/2010 1:49 PM
Thing is we DON'T need scoring. I think this team can score plenty. Not that we couldn't use a closer like Melo, but more than anything we need the length and defensive ability of the guys we have now. We lose that length and defense sending a bunch of guys away for Melo's scoring, which will likely only matter late in games.
Last year MDA admitted that he slowed things down and we still scored a lot of points. The problem was how many we gave up. Melo doesn't effect our defense ONE BIT. Does anyone think our problem is likely to be scoring? I think being able to have superior length, mobility and shotblocking out there in crunchtime is gonna mean more to our win totally than adding a great scorer. Without Melo I expect this team will avg 107 ppg or so. What would that be with him 120? I don't think so. I think it avg's out about the same. It's the D that i'm worried about. |
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NYKBocker
Posts: 38414 Alba Posts: 474 Joined: 1/14/2003 Member: #377 USA |
8/31/2010 1:55 PM
nixluva wrote:Thing is we DON'T need scoring. I think this team can score plenty. Not that we couldn't use a closer like Melo, but more than anything we need the length and defensive ability of the guys we have now. We lose that length and defense sending a bunch of guys away for Melo's scoring, which will likely only matter late in games. The thing with Melo is that he had a stacked team the past couple of years in Denver. He had AI, Billups, KMart, Nene, Camby, JR Smith and yet he could not carry the team past the third round. |
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AnubisADL
Posts: 27382 Alba Posts: 13 Joined: 6/29/2009 Member: #2771 USA |
8/31/2010 2:19 PM
nixluva wrote:Thing is we DON'T need scoring. I think this team can score plenty. Not that we couldn't use a closer like Melo, but more than anything we need the length and defensive ability of the guys we have now. We lose that length and defense sending a bunch of guys away for Melo's scoring, which will likely only matter late in games. I disagree. We dont have CONSISTENT scoring. NY Knicks - Retirement home for players and GMs
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BigDaddyG
Posts: 39923 Alba Posts: 9 Joined: 1/22/2010 Member: #3049 |
8/31/2010 2:28 PM
AnubisADL wrote:knickstorrents wrote:Why are people so in love with Melo? IF this team needs scoring, he MIGHT fill a need (though on a net basis he doesn't give you that much. Check his true shooting percentage vs. other max players). What this team needs right now is a stable, defensive Center. Let this team play. If it becomes apparent that we lack scoring punch (which is highly doubtful) then I can see why we might want to trade for Melo. For what it's worth, Melo's TS% is comparable to Kobe Bryant's - not only this past season but for their careers. I think Melo's shooting is solid considering how many shots he takes. Always... always remember: Less is less. More is more. More is better and twice as much is good too. Not enough is bad, and too much is never enough except when it's just about right.
- The Tick
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martin
Posts: 76310 Alba Posts: 108 Joined: 7/24/2001 Member: #2 USA |
8/31/2010 2:31 PM
AnubisADL wrote:nixluva wrote:Thing is we DON'T need scoring. I think this team can score plenty. Not that we couldn't use a closer like Melo, but more than anything we need the length and defensive ability of the guys we have now. We lose that length and defense sending a bunch of guys away for Melo's scoring, which will likely only matter late in games. Amare? Official sponsor of the PURE KNICKS LOVE Program
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GodSaveTheKnicks
Posts: 23952 Alba Posts: 21 Joined: 11/21/2006 Member: #1207 USA |
8/31/2010 2:45 PM LAST EDITED: 8/31/2010 3:08 PM
TMS wrote:tkf wrote:you really think westbrook is that much better? wow..... as they say, the grass is always Zach Randolph = superstar? Stephon in his prime = superstar? Do we have a tendency to just say 20/10 = superstar or 20 pts 6 assists = superstar without considering - does the guy give a **** about defense? Not saying Melo = Zach or Steph but I think we've advanced beyond simply saying the guy puts up X pts X rebounds he has to be worth max money for max years no? I think Franchise Player + Young cheap talent = winning formula. Unless u get Pau Gasol gift wrapped or KG. Boston drafted Al Jefferson..let him blossom and traded him for KG. We drafted David Lee...he developed..we traded him for Randolph/Azubuike/Turiaf. Imagine if we kept Camby and traded him..or kept Nene and either kept him or traded him or kept Trevor Ariza until his trade value was high. Right now just Gallo or Randolph plus an expiring like Curry doesn't seem to be enough to land Melo/Chris Paul types. But Gallo or Randolph as promising young stars instead of just promising players plus an expiring would be a much better asset. I think we can all agree this is the ideal scenario: We play the season out, Gallo becomes Detlef Schrempf, Randolph becomes a Camby-Odom hybrid. We sign Melo as a FA and trade one of our budding young stars (Randolph or Gallo) for Chris Paul. Chris Paul
Let's try to elevate the level of discourse in this byeetch. Please
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kam77
Posts: 27664 Alba Posts: 25 Joined: 3/17/2004 Member: #634 |
8/31/2010 3:08 PM
I'd give up anyone not named Amare and build a team around those two guys.
lol @ being BANNED by Martin since 11/07/10 (for asking if Mr. Earl had a point). Really, Martin? C'mon. This is the internet. I've seen much worse on this site. By Earl himself. Drop the hypocrisy.
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GodSaveTheKnicks
Posts: 23952 Alba Posts: 21 Joined: 11/21/2006 Member: #1207 USA |
8/31/2010 3:48 PM LAST EDITED: 8/31/2010 3:55 PM
Ok..so we trade Randolph or Gallo or both in some package for Melo
PG: $35-$40 Million on 2 starters. How much does that leave to fill out the rest of the roster? Is that roster just doomed to losing in the ECF to Miami every season or... does the remaining money which Miami is paying to Bosh allow us to fill out the roster in a more balanced way? this kind of all goes back to the horrible mismanagement of the past decade. Normally when teams suck as much as we do you come out of it with a Derrick Rose
Instead we somehow came out of a decade of being the laughingstock of the league without a single young superstar potential player on the roster. Which means a) we have to keep Gallo or Randolph in a Melo trade b) whoever we keep has to be as good as Lamar Odom/Ray Allen/Manu (3rd best player on a championship squad) or it looks like, realistically, we'll just be the Patrick Ewing to someone else's Michael Jordan. Let's try to elevate the level of discourse in this byeetch. Please
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AnubisADL
Posts: 27382 Alba Posts: 13 Joined: 6/29/2009 Member: #2771 USA |
8/31/2010 3:59 PM
GodSaveTheKnicks wrote:Ok..so we trade Randolph or Gallo or both in some package for Melo PG: Felton We use the MLE and spend on buying picks to help fill out the roster year after year. NY Knicks - Retirement home for players and GMs
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GodSaveTheKnicks
Posts: 23952 Alba Posts: 21 Joined: 11/21/2006 Member: #1207 USA |
8/31/2010 4:03 PM
AnubisADL wrote:GodSaveTheKnicks wrote:Ok..so we trade Randolph or Gallo or both in some package for Melo PG: Felton $7-8 M (he got a 2 year deal for $15.8) M so $42.8- 47.8 M for Felton, Amare, Melo. I think this is close to what Miami is paying for their big 3..around $48 M per season... our extra $6 M better be WISELY spent and I guess we could get some guys to sign for a discount..? Let's try to elevate the level of discourse in this byeetch. Please
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rp
Posts: 20756 Alba Posts: 0 Joined: 10/31/2009 Member: #2965 USA |
8/31/2010 4:04 PM
GodSaveTheKnicks wrote:Ok..so we trade Randolph or Gallo or both in some package for Melo I recall an article or board discussion but the discussion was about Boston having one home grown star (Paul) to go with two others (KG/Ray). If we can keep one to get Melo great but again if what NJ is offering is true we don't have enough draft choices to trade to compete. What Miami did to get three stars is ridiculous and hard to compete. Then again we are one of the top teams as far as high salary not enough stars. It would be interesting to have a big three of melo/amare/cpaul but have so so other players like Miami. The scary part of that three to compete with Miami is injury history :). "Failure is only postponed success as long as courage coaches ambition. The habit of persistence is the habit of victory" -Herbert Kaufman
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AnubisADL
Posts: 27382 Alba Posts: 13 Joined: 6/29/2009 Member: #2771 USA |
8/31/2010 4:18 PM
GodSaveTheKnicks wrote:AnubisADL wrote:GodSaveTheKnicks wrote:Ok..so we trade Randolph or Gallo or both in some package for Melo Ideally we would take back JR Smith or Nene to give us more salary to trade for future assets. NY Knicks - Retirement home for players and GMs
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