fishmike wrote:

djsunyc wrote:

MS wrote:How much better is this team with Amare? I don't think he elevates you and wins playoff series.

unlike 99% of the teams in the league, the knicks CAN take on salaries. so getting 1 guy this summer is good b/c you can go get other guys teams are looking to dump in salary deals. again, this ain't memphis...you think dolan is going to sit on the sidelines for another year? or d'antoni for that matter? the lebron thing has warped everyone's thinking. amare > anybody on the knicks.

and if it was me? I would bring back Lee. I would offer max to Lebron. After that Wade. After that Amare. After that Bosh. I'm assuming Dirk is staying. Bosh and Amare arent franchise guys but they are max players. Max doesnt = top 5 player. I agree about the salaries. I almost see Bosh as a worst case scenario, but your frontline for the next 8 years is 6'10 Gallo (best Italian in the NBA), 6'10 Bosh and 6'9 Lee in an MDA system. Then you have Dolan's $$$ to use to take on guys in Jan when Curry/JJ's contracts have great value. Keep buying picks and looking for diamonds in the rough like they did with Douglas.

You nailed it. That's pretty much the real plan imo. LeBron James, Dwyane Wade, Chris Bosh, Joe Johnson and Amare Stoudemire in that order. As much as I disagree with it, no doubt in my mind Donnie Walsh and Mike D'Antoni will offer a Max contract to Bosh, Johnson or Stoudemire if King James and Flash turn them down.

I guess Bosh wouldn't be terrible. After Dwight Howard, there isn't another big in the East who is better. And in D'Antoni's system, you know Bosh's stats will be better and probably reach MVP status. And Bosh is only 26 and has no history of injuries so a Max contract salary and length of contract isn't a total killer.

I love Stoudemire and think he's a better overall player than Bosh but his injury history scares me to death. I would feel much better giving Bosh a Max contract than giving one to Stoudemire and hoping every game he doesn't get hurt.

And signing Johnson to a Max contract would be suicide. He's not that good and he's already 28 and will be 29 at the start of next season. He'll be on the decline for the majority of his Max contract.

fishmike wrote:

djsunyc wrote:

MS wrote:How much better is this team with Amare? I don't think he elevates you and wins playoff series.

unlike 99% of the teams in the league, the knicks CAN take on salaries. so getting 1 guy this summer is good b/c you can go get other guys teams are looking to dump in salary deals. again, this ain't memphis...you think dolan is going to sit on the sidelines for another year? or d'antoni for that matter? the lebron thing has warped everyone's thinking. amare > anybody on the knicks.

and if it was me? I would bring back Lee. I would offer max to Lebron. After that Wade. After that Amare. After that Bosh. I'm assuming Dirk is staying. Bosh and Amare arent franchise guys but they are max players. Max doesnt = top 5 player. I agree about the salaries. I almost see Bosh as a worst case scenario, but your frontline for the next 8 years is 6'10 Gallo (best Italian in the NBA), 6'10 Bosh and 6'9 Lee in an MDA system. Then you have Dolan's $$$ to use to take on guys in Jan when Curry/JJ's contracts have great value. Keep buying picks and looking for diamonds in the rough like they did with Douglas.

Johnson is a better fit with this roster, more durable, and more capable of controlling the team at this point.

Bosh is younger, maybe a little more deadly, and a frontcourt of Bosh, Lee, and Gallo does look great on paper.

So i don't know, but i still think JJ would be a solid pickup regardless of money, and like lebron, he would really bring out even more in lee. I'm not sure how lee's game would change with bosh here.

And since you know so much, please tell me why Phoenix was so happy to Jettison D'Antoni despite his great regular seasons?

t they do hang their hopes on a coach: Exhibit A: Larry Brown.

I know you worship Mark Jackson and every used tissue he throws in the trash so its a useless point to get into you with. Might as well argue big bang with a jesus freak. Thats not a knock, its good to be a fan. Just passing on that discussion. He's not a coach, and despite several vacancies and very low budget hirings he's been passed over. Maybe he is one day, maybe he isnt.

I'm not the one that says MDA is a great coach. Nash is. Kobe is. Lebron is. All the guys that played on the Olympics think that. Only Larry Hughes doesnt think that. And you.

I like that we have have a coach that has the players giving 100%, playing defense, winning games and featuring (most of)our young talent in favor of overpaid veterans. Its a nice departure from recent years. Thats all. Its about that complicated for me.

Knixkik wrote:
This is a great plan, and i'm still tore between bosh or johnson if lebron doesn't come, but you have to resign lee. I think Amare at this point is a last resort. When comparing johnson and bosh

Johnson is a better fit with this roster, more durable, and more capable of controlling the team at this point.

Bosh is younger, maybe a little more deadly, and a frontcourt of Bosh, Lee, and Gallo does look great on paper.

So i don't know, but i still think JJ would be a solid pickup regardless of money, and like lebron, he would really bring out even more in lee. I'm not sure how lee's game would change with bosh here.

oh and I'd lean a bit more towards Joe Johnson if only because we have promising players at SF,PF in Lee (hope we keep him if we can't find sum1 better to pay), Gallo, and The Mayor.

JJ at guard is a HUUUUUGE upgrade over duhon vs. the edge we get with Bosh over Lee

Nalod wrote:I think cap space is very valuable for trades even if we don't land Lebron.

And yes, it was me that bought the term "starphuch" to the UK, so all reference of meaning is thru me.

Im going to speculate on what will happen but IM happy we are not the sixers who have Iggy making like 18mil a year and Brand with 15mil and climbing a year and are screwed for 3-4 years with those two. Why they would bring in Eddy Jordan with Brand to be in his motion offense is akin to hiring Larry Brown to coach Isiahs malcontents. Stupid is as stupid does. Shit, Im quoting Gump! Sixers are screwed.

Why does Wade beginning to remind me of Marbury? He is a much nicer guy of course, but nasty divorce and business lawsuits tells me his marketing is not so squeeky clean and this is an opt out so he is playing some damm good ball this year but the last few he breaks down and perhaps he does not have longevity. I say marbury because Wade as 6-3 plays a very athletic game and needs to be healthy to light it up.

Our utes with an alpha dog will enrich their value and production.

In fact, Lebron is really the only name. Wade is a starphuch as is Amare. Bosh is not a max player unless somehow we put the right pieces and system around him and he improves. Guess we can say this about any player.

Regarding out coachs, bringing in Mark Jax would be a starphuch. He is inexperienced and unproven so its his name alone that brings value. Same for Ewing.

MDA was the best available without a doubt.

We are winning a bit on the road and he got david phuching lee as the go to guy down the stretch!!!! This guy not a great coach or what?

Wade..starphuch...hmmm

really? i don't see it. how many games do we win on average with

Wade + Gallo, Chandler, whoever.

MS wrote:Considering the Hawks already offered him a 4-year $60 million extension I think you are mistaken. Someone is always stupid enough to overpay. If the Hawks go deep into the playoffs he can get whatever he wants. Rashard Lewis got the max and he is an not a top 25 player in this league.

Since everyone has cap space they'll overpay

or

Wouldn't JJ be less likely to get overpaid when competing with all these other guys that are FAs. so if JJ makes ridiculous demands can't a team say screw it an try to get get someone else. i have this funny feeling he'll end up in Chicago.

Rose
Joe Johnson
Deng
PF X
Noah

Salmons, Hinrich, Taj Gibson on bench.

is that better than...

Toney Douglas/Duhon
Joe Johnson
Chandler
Gallo
Lee

Jefferies, X, X on bench ?

does signing Johnson mean kissing Lee bye bye? Is that worth it?

djsunyc wrote:

MS wrote:Amare isn't worth 17 million. If he wants to take $13-14 fine. But he hasn't done anything to warrant that money. He is injury prone and not the player he once was.

it doesn't matter b/c after signing 1 guy next year, chances are the team will no longer be under the cap for the forseeable future.

Well, if by "the foreseeable future" you mean 2011. THat's the year we drop another $18+mil from our cap.

GodSaveTheKnicks wrote:

MS wrote:Considering the Hawks already offered him a 4-year $60 million extension I think you are mistaken. Someone is always stupid enough to overpay. If the Hawks go deep into the playoffs he can get whatever he wants. Rashard Lewis got the max and he is an not a top 25 player in this league.

Since everyone has cap space they'll overpay

or

Wouldn't JJ be less likely to get overpaid when competing with all these other guys that are FAs. so if JJ makes ridiculous demands can't a team say screw it an try to get get someone else. i have this funny feeling he'll end up in Chicago.

Rose
Joe Johnson
Deng
PF X
Noah

Salmons, Hinrich, Taj Gibson on bench.

is that better than...

Toney Douglas/Duhon
Joe Johnson
Chandler
Gallo
Lee

Jefferies, X, X on bench ?

does signing Johnson mean kissing Lee bye bye? Is that worth it?

And johnson on chicago may look nice, but they aren't a better team than us now, so why would the addition of johnson make them better than the knicks with johnson. The jury on rose is still out, and both gallo and chandler have the potential to be better than deng. Noah is good, maybe the next camby, but i'm happy with lee as our top big man. I'm not that high on chicago.

Knixkik wrote:If we don't get LeBron it would obviously suck, but i'm still a fan of getting Joe Johnson. I know it sounds like houston all over again, but he's one of the best players in the league at what we need. He is a versatile guard who is a classic SG but makes the needs for a PG less important because he controls the game. And not only that, but he has the ability to play off the ball like a non-lebron/kobe/wade wing would if we had the opportunity a year or two after that to acquire a tony parker or chris paul.

I no longer see the major reason to spend on bosh or amare because lee is almost as good and less injury prone, and less expensive. I would much rather have a homegrown talent who is durable and fits well within the system. I'm not going to be disappointed if we get one of these guys because they are stars, but if we get one at the expense of lee what have we gained, and on top of that we still don't have a solid PG. Adding Johnson alongside Lee makes you much better no doubt about it, and because of his versatility, you can add whoever you want the following year, like melo, parker, richardson, west, ellis, or whoever, and it's still a good fit. Johnson is a pretty complete player, and i know there's concern about his age, but he's more of a skills player than athletic, and i don't see him declining as quickly with age. Plus you know he can lead a team, you just need to find players to put around him. He's no LeBron, but i would be fine adding him this summer.

WE SHOULD ABSOLUTELY NOT GET ANOTHER ALBATROSS CONTRACT WITH A GUY CALLED JJ -- When are we ever going to learn?