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Only 1 team wanted Chauncey Billups when he was 26 for the MLE
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knicksbabyyeah
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7/27/2009  5:49 PM
Yes, Full MLE and maybe a little less in year 2 to make things easier.
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sebstar
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7/27/2009  5:51 PM
Posted by BRIGGS:
Posted by sebstar:
Posted by Anji:
Posted by sebstar:

Sessions cant hit a three, which I feel is cause for the hesitation Walsh is displaying. Since 'Antoni masturbates at the three-point line, he probably dismisses all of Sessions strong suits and looks at him as a liability. Only thing I can think of for a player who is this young, has great potential, and comes relatively cheap.

[Edited by - sebstar on 07-27-2009 5:10 PM]
The kid is a scorer though. He may not be a great three point shooter, but he can go for 40. I would think all the things he can do, out weigh his 3fg%. If you But Sessions one the knicks, the for a first time in a long time you can really say the knicks have alot of young talent.

Defenses might be able to adjust to him and play off him a little if they know he cant shoot a three whatsoever.

I think that is the only thing that is holding back an offer sheet.

Can anyone name a player who is even close to his talent level who is available anytime soon?

As of this time, no. But we cant give him a deal just because the cupboard is completely bare...who knows who could be available in the future. Thats shortsighted.

As a PG, shooting a handful of threes all year and hitting them at an18% clip is a major red flag. Could be a one year wonder, because you know defenses will adjust. Especially if he is an NY PG coming in with a ton of hype.
My saliva and spit can split thread into fiber and bits/ So trust me I'm as live as it gets. --Royce Da 5'9 + DJ Premier = Hip Hop Utopia
sebstar
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7/27/2009  5:53 PM
Posted by TheGame:
Posted by BRIGGS:
Posted by sebstar:
Posted by Anji:
Posted by sebstar:

Sessions cant hit a three, which I feel is cause for the hesitation Walsh is displaying. Since 'Antoni masturbates at the three-point line, he probably dismisses all of Sessions strong suits and looks at him as a liability. Only thing I can think of for a player who is this young, has great potential, and comes relatively cheap.

[Edited by - sebstar on 07-27-2009 5:10 PM]
The kid is a scorer though. He may not be a great three point shooter, but he can go for 40. I would think all the things he can do, out weigh his 3fg%. If you But Sessions one the knicks, the for a first time in a long time you can really say the knicks have alot of young talent.

Defenses might be able to adjust to him and play off him a little if they know he cant shoot a three whatsoever.

I think that is the only thing that is holding back an offer sheet.

Can anyone name a player who is even close to his talent level who is available anytime soon?

No one, and I really don't think his shooting is that bad. As I said before, he has not been forced to shoot 3s, so he never focused on that aspect of his game. You give him a summer of shooting 300-400 3s a day and tell him he needs to be prepared to shoot 4-5 of them a game, and I think you will see his percentage get into the high 30s.

A lot of if's...

As a twenty-three year old NBA PG, he should at least be a competent three point shooter.
My saliva and spit can split thread into fiber and bits/ So trust me I'm as live as it gets. --Royce Da 5'9 + DJ Premier = Hip Hop Utopia
Paladin55
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7/27/2009  6:14 PM
Posted by sebstar:
Posted by TheGame:
Posted by BRIGGS:
Posted by sebstar:
Posted by Anji:
Posted by sebstar:

Sessions cant hit a three, which I feel is cause for the hesitation Walsh is displaying. Since 'Antoni masturbates at the three-point line, he probably dismisses all of Sessions strong suits and looks at him as a liability. Only thing I can think of for a player who is this young, has great potential, and comes relatively cheap.

[Edited by - sebstar on 07-27-2009 5:10 PM]
The kid is a scorer though. He may not be a great three point shooter, but he can go for 40. I would think all the things he can do, out weigh his 3fg%. If you But Sessions one the knicks, the for a first time in a long time you can really say the knicks have alot of young talent.

Defenses might be able to adjust to him and play off him a little if they know he cant shoot a three whatsoever.

I think that is the only thing that is holding back an offer sheet.

Can anyone name a player who is even close to his talent level who is available anytime soon?

No one, and I really don't think his shooting is that bad. As I said before, he has not been forced to shoot 3s, so he never focused on that aspect of his game. You give him a summer of shooting 300-400 3s a day and tell him he needs to be prepared to shoot 4-5 of them a game, and I think you will see his percentage get into the high 30s.

A lot of if's...

As a twenty-three year old NBA PG, he should at least be a competent three point shooter.

Rondo has improved his 3pt shot each year. Deron Williams was at 31% last year. T. Parker was at 29%. Rose was at 22%- I would prefer that Sessions be able to hit a 3 already, but if he can do everything else, I could live with him and assume that he will improve somewhat.

If Sessions can hit the midrange shot, kicks the ball out at the right time off his drives if he can't finish, and plays the 2 man game like Duhon and Lee were able to do last year, he should do fine.


The question is, though, who are we going to get in the next 2 years or more who is better?
No man is happy without a delusion of some kind. Delusions are as necessary to our happiness as realities- C.N. Bovee
BRIGGS
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7/27/2009  6:20 PM
Sessions numbers per 40 minutes--he averaged 27 last year. We know Mike D likes to play guys 40.

18.6 pts 8.5 as 5.1 reb shooting 45%--those would be all star numbers

Also were not taking into consideration that he will get better and play in a faster system that is conducive to better individual numbers. 6mm a year will look very cheap in 2 years
RIP Crushalot😞
McK1
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7/27/2009  6:27 PM
playing in a faster system doesn't necessarily mean his numbers will go up.

takes a lot of endurance to play point guard at the pace D'Antoni wants. What kind of conditioning does Sessions do?
the stop underrating David Lee movement 1. FIRE MIKE 2. HIRE MULLIN 3. PAY AVERY 4. FREE NATE!!!
sebstar
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7/27/2009  6:44 PM
Posted by McK1:

playing in a faster system doesn't necessarily mean his numbers will go up.

takes a lot of endurance to play point guard at the pace D'Antoni wants. What kind of conditioning does Sessions do?

See at least you are a little more cautious. I mean, cats around here get so excited for other players that they lose all sense of objectivity.

I wouldnt lose it if we signed him, but I am a bit skeptical about his game.
My saliva and spit can split thread into fiber and bits/ So trust me I'm as live as it gets. --Royce Da 5'9 + DJ Premier = Hip Hop Utopia
Marv
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7/27/2009  8:09 PM
Posted by BRIGGS:
Posted by sebstar:
Posted by Anji:
Posted by sebstar:

Sessions cant hit a three, which I feel is cause for the hesitation Walsh is displaying. Since 'Antoni masturbates at the three-point line, he probably dismisses all of Sessions strong suits and looks at him as a liability. Only thing I can think of for a player who is this young, has great potential, and comes relatively cheap.

[Edited by - sebstar on 07-27-2009 5:10 PM]
The kid is a scorer though. He may not be a great three point shooter, but he can go for 40. I would think all the things he can do, out weigh his 3fg%. If you But Sessions one the knicks, the for a first time in a long time you can really say the knicks have alot of young talent.

Defenses might be able to adjust to him and play off him a little if they know he cant shoot a three whatsoever.

I think that is the only thing that is holding back an offer sheet.

Can anyone name a player who is even close to his talent level who is available anytime soon?

rajon rondo. rfa 1 year from now.
Bonn1997
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7/27/2009  8:24 PM
Posted by Marv:
Posted by BRIGGS:
Posted by sebstar:
Posted by Anji:
Posted by sebstar:

Sessions cant hit a three, which I feel is cause for the hesitation Walsh is displaying. Since 'Antoni masturbates at the three-point line, he probably dismisses all of Sessions strong suits and looks at him as a liability. Only thing I can think of for a player who is this young, has great potential, and comes relatively cheap.

[Edited by - sebstar on 07-27-2009 5:10 PM]
The kid is a scorer though. He may not be a great three point shooter, but he can go for 40. I would think all the things he can do, out weigh his 3fg%. If you But Sessions one the knicks, the for a first time in a long time you can really say the knicks have alot of young talent.

Defenses might be able to adjust to him and play off him a little if they know he cant shoot a three whatsoever.

I think that is the only thing that is holding back an offer sheet.

Can anyone name a player who is even close to his talent level who is available anytime soon?

rajon rounduo. rfa 1 year from now.
Unless his attitude/baggage is as bad as some rumors suggest, Boston should match any offer he gets.
BRIGGS
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7/28/2009  2:04 AM
Posted by Marv:
Posted by BRIGGS:
Posted by sebstar:
Posted by Anji:
Posted by sebstar:

Sessions cant hit a three, which I feel is cause for the hesitation Walsh is displaying. Since 'Antoni masturbates at the three-point line, he probably dismisses all of Sessions strong suits and looks at him as a liability. Only thing I can think of for a player who is this young, has great potential, and comes relatively cheap.

[Edited by - sebstar on 07-27-2009 5:10 PM]
The kid is a scorer though. He may not be a great three point shooter, but he can go for 40. I would think all the things he can do, out weigh his 3fg%. If you But Sessions one the knicks, the for a first time in a long time you can really say the knicks have alot of young talent.

Defenses might be able to adjust to him and play off him a little if they know he cant shoot a three whatsoever.

I think that is the only thing that is holding back an offer sheet.

Can anyone name a player who is even close to his talent level who is available anytime soon?

rajon rondo. rfa 1 year from now.

I would bring in Marcus Williams for the year as Duhon's back up if the Sessions things never materializes. I think Williams has some upside that we saw signs of this summer if given a chance. I am open to giving 2-3 players opportunity. I really believe Skita should make the team--I liked him and I thought Marcus really showed himself as good as any draft pick taken as a PG this year in a good crop. Heck hes the same age as Toney Douglas.
RIP Crushalot😞
fishmike
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7/28/2009  10:06 AM
Posted by sebstar:
Posted by McK1:

playing in a faster system doesn't necessarily mean his numbers will go up.

takes a lot of endurance to play point guard at the pace D'Antoni wants. What kind of conditioning does Sessions do?

See at least you are a little more cautious. I mean, cats around here get so excited for other players that they lose all sense of objectivity.

I wouldnt lose it if we signed him, but I am a bit skeptical about his game.
I am skeptical as well. He's got a small body of work and put up good #s on a losing team. You cant just say "look at how good he will be over 40 minutes and 82 games." It just doesnt work that way.

BUT

I would be open minded an enthusiastic about (if only I could learn to spell)

He's young
He's in the right situation to grow and get better as a PG
MDA's brother coached him so we have some inside info on what he is and isnt

So I would be trusting management on this one

"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
Bonn1997
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7/28/2009  10:52 AM
Forget the per 40 min stuff then. He averaged 15/8/4 as a starter for half the season last year. Obviously it's a small body of work but the most likely scenario is that a player improves upon his game after his first full season.
Paladin55
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7/28/2009  11:16 AM
Posted by fishmike:
Posted by sebstar:
Posted by McK1:

playing in a faster system doesn't necessarily mean his numbers will go up.

takes a lot of endurance to play point guard at the pace D'Antoni wants. What kind of conditioning does Sessions do?

See at least you are a little more cautious. I mean, cats around here get so excited for other players that they lose all sense of objectivity.

I wouldnt lose it if we signed him, but I am a bit skeptical about his game.
I am skeptical as well. He's got a small body of work and put up good #s on a losing team. You cant just say "look at how good he will be over 40 minutes and 82 games." It just doesnt work that way.

BUT

I would be open minded an enthusiastic about (if only I could learn to spell)

He's young
He's in the right situation to grow and get better as a PG
MDA's brother coached him so we have some inside info on what he is and isn't

So I would be trusting management on this one

He has only played one full year so far (96 games), and last year played with a Buck's team that was hit by major injuries, so you figure that his assist numbers would have been better with Redd and Bogut- who did not even play 70 games between them last year.

You have to trust MDA and his brother on this one, but based on last year, you would think that Sessions is on his way to becoming a solid PG in the NBA.

Still don't know about his 3Pt shot, and I have heard good and bad things about his D, but he is the same age as Toney Douglas, and has already proven that he will not be overwhelmed as an NBA PG.

If you sign him to a decent contract for 4/5 years (4-5M/yr- team or player option year to be determined based on whether it is 4 or 5 M.) you still have the ability to trade him in a few years if you want to upgrade.


No man is happy without a delusion of some kind. Delusions are as necessary to our happiness as realities- C.N. Bovee
BRIGGS
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7/28/2009  4:04 PM
This is what Im scared of--a team like Philly walking in while we are waiting to save .50 or talking the Bucks into taking something they dont want S+T--just give the guy the full MLE and do it soon--you are asking to be undercut by another team. Put everything into the MLE to deter the Bucks from matching full price --player option-bonus whatever--this contract will look cheap two years from now anyway. If we sit on our arse were going to get burned.
RIP Crushalot😞
sebstar
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7/28/2009  4:12 PM
Posted by Paladin55:
Posted by fishmike:
Posted by sebstar:
Posted by McK1:

playing in a faster system doesn't necessarily mean his numbers will go up.

takes a lot of endurance to play point guard at the pace D'Antoni wants. What kind of conditioning does Sessions do?

See at least you are a little more cautious. I mean, cats around here get so excited for other players that they lose all sense of objectivity.

I wouldnt lose it if we signed him, but I am a bit skeptical about his game.
I am skeptical as well. He's got a small body of work and put up good #s on a losing team. You cant just say "look at how good he will be over 40 minutes and 82 games." It just doesnt work that way.

BUT

I would be open minded an enthusiastic about (if only I could learn to spell)

He's young
He's in the right situation to grow and get better as a PG
MDA's brother coached him so we have some inside info on what he is and isn't

So I would be trusting management on this one

He has only played one full year so far (96 games), and last year played with a Buck's team that was hit by major injuries, so you figure that his assist numbers would have been better with Redd and Bogut- who did not even play 70 games between them last year.

You have to trust MDA and his brother on this one, but based on last year, you would think that Sessions is on his way to becoming a solid PG in the NBA.

Still don't know about his 3Pt shot, and I have heard good and bad things about his D, but he is the same age as Toney Douglas, and has already proven that he will not be overwhelmed as an NBA PG.

If you sign him to a decent contract for 4/5 years (4-5M/yr- team or player option year to be determined based on whether it is 4 or 5 M.) you still have the ability to trade him in a few years if you want to upgrade.

So if we're on this trusting MDA kick, does the fact that they aren't jumping all over Sessions tell you something?
My saliva and spit can split thread into fiber and bits/ So trust me I'm as live as it gets. --Royce Da 5'9 + DJ Premier = Hip Hop Utopia
martin
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7/28/2009  4:16 PM
Posted by BRIGGS:

This is what Im scared of--a team like Philly walking in while we are waiting to save .50 or talking the Bucks into taking something they dont want S+T--just give the guy the full MLE and do it soon--you are asking to be undercut by another team. Put everything into the MLE to deter the Bucks from matching full price --player option-bonus whatever--this contract will look cheap two years from now anyway. If we sit on our arse were going to get burned.

I think there is a bit of not negotiating against yourself from the Knicks perspective going on here. Philly has got 2 young PGs in Holiday and Williams and are not going to sigh Sessions on top of that.

My guess is that LAC is not a place Sessions wants to go to with Baron signed for like 10 more years, although Sessions would be able to play 50-60 games a year without worry of not starting.

If Sessions was hotly sought after, he would have had a full MLE in hand already.
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djsunyc
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7/28/2009  4:22 PM
Posted by martin:
Posted by BRIGGS:

This is what Im scared of--a team like Philly walking in while we are waiting to save .50 or talking the Bucks into taking something they dont want S+T--just give the guy the full MLE and do it soon--you are asking to be undercut by another team. Put everything into the MLE to deter the Bucks from matching full price --player option-bonus whatever--this contract will look cheap two years from now anyway. If we sit on our arse were going to get burned.

I think there is a bit of not negotiating against yourself from the Knicks perspective going on here. Philly has got 2 young PGs in Holiday and Williams and are not going to sigh Sessions on top of that.

My guess is that LAC is not a place Sessions wants to go to with Baron signed for like 10 more years, although Sessions would be able to play 50-60 games a year without worry of not starting.

If Sessions was hotly sought after, he would have had a full MLE in hand already.

or...his restricted status is scaring off potential suitors b/c they feel milwaukee will match.
sebstar
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7/28/2009  4:36 PM
Posted by djsunyc:
Posted by martin:
Posted by BRIGGS:

This is what Im scared of--a team like Philly walking in while we are waiting to save .50 or talking the Bucks into taking something they dont want S+T--just give the guy the full MLE and do it soon--you are asking to be undercut by another team. Put everything into the MLE to deter the Bucks from matching full price --player option-bonus whatever--this contract will look cheap two years from now anyway. If we sit on our arse were going to get burned.

I think there is a bit of not negotiating against yourself from the Knicks perspective going on here. Philly has got 2 young PGs in Holiday and Williams and are not going to sigh Sessions on top of that.

My guess is that LAC is not a place Sessions wants to go to with Baron signed for like 10 more years, although Sessions would be able to play 50-60 games a year without worry of not starting.

If Sessions was hotly sought after, he would have had a full MLE in hand already.

or...his restricted status is scaring off potential suitors b/c they feel milwaukee will match.

Odds are good that a team can land Sessions given that Milwaukee drafted a PG with their lotto pick. For whatever reason, teams aren't trying to commit to the guy right now.
My saliva and spit can split thread into fiber and bits/ So trust me I'm as live as it gets. --Royce Da 5'9 + DJ Premier = Hip Hop Utopia
BRIGGS
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7/28/2009  5:30 PM
Posted by martin:
Posted by BRIGGS:

This is what Im scared of--a team like Philly walking in while we are waiting to save .50 or talking the Bucks into taking something they dont want S+T--just give the guy the full MLE and do it soon--you are asking to be undercut by another team. Put everything into the MLE to deter the Bucks from matching full price --player option-bonus whatever--this contract will look cheap two years from now anyway. If we sit on our arse were going to get burned.

I think there is a bit of not negotiating against yourself from the Knicks perspective going on here. Philly has got 2 young PGs in Holiday and Williams and are not going to sigh Sessions on top of that.

My guess is that LAC is not a place Sessions wants to go to with Baron signed for like 10 more years, although Sessions would be able to play 50-60 games a year without worry of not starting.

If Sessions was hotly sought after, he would have had a full MLE in hand already.

I dont see Louis Williams as a PG and Holiday is atleast 2 maybe 3 years away from any meaningful role.
RIP Crushalot😞
martin
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7/28/2009  5:58 PM
Posted by BRIGGS:
Posted by martin:
Posted by BRIGGS:

This is what Im scared of--a team like Philly walking in while we are waiting to save .50 or talking the Bucks into taking something they dont want S+T--just give the guy the full MLE and do it soon--you are asking to be undercut by another team. Put everything into the MLE to deter the Bucks from matching full price --player option-bonus whatever--this contract will look cheap two years from now anyway. If we sit on our arse were going to get burned.

I think there is a bit of not negotiating against yourself from the Knicks perspective going on here. Philly has got 2 young PGs in Holiday and Williams and are not going to sigh Sessions on top of that.

My guess is that LAC is not a place Sessions wants to go to with Baron signed for like 10 more years, although Sessions would be able to play 50-60 games a year without worry of not starting.

If Sessions was hotly sought after, he would have had a full MLE in hand already.

I dont see Louis Williams as a PG and Holiday is atleast 2 maybe 3 years away from any meaningful role.

oh, I agree with you. Not sure Philly does.
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