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Wilson Chandler or the 8th pick to move up to #5?
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BRIGGS
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6/21/2009  8:33 PM
Posted by nychamp:

Stop already. Chandler for the #5 in this draft is bad, as I immediately thought when I read it in the other thread. In Chandler you know you have a solid, two-way player with physical gifts and confidence who knows he can hang and excel in the NBA. Could possibly be a star even, maybe. Even if not, there's nobody clearly available at #5 this year about whose NBA future you can confidently project to be better than Chandler's.

I also agree that we should not be auto-bailing on Nate, we need to see what the market does and make hard decisions about his value to our team.

For this draft and our team right now it is not worth it.

Chandler's a good player. If I had my pick of two I d rather have Stephon Curry or Tyreke Evans and Andray Blatche than Wilson Chandler and Jrue Holiday.
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Finestrg
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6/21/2009  9:54 PM
Posted by BRIGGS:
Posted by nychamp:

Stop already. Chandler for the #5 in this draft is bad, as I immediately thought when I read it in the other thread. In Chandler you know you have a solid, two-way player with physical gifts and confidence who knows he can hang and excel in the NBA. Could possibly be a star even, maybe. Even if not, there's nobody clearly available at #5 this year about whose NBA future you can confidently project to be better than Chandler's.

I also agree that we should not be auto-bailing on Nate, we need to see what the market does and make hard decisions about his value to our team.

For this draft and our team right now it is not worth it.

Chandler's a good player. If I had my pick of two I d rather have Stephon Curry or Tyreke Evans and Andray Blatche than Wilson Chandler and Jrue Holiday.

This is how I look at this if this rumored Washington thing has any legs:

I want Curry and we're not gonna get him at 8. That seems clear now. The dude's a great, great shooter while every other part of his game, while it might need a little time to develop fully, is solid already - take to the basket, FT shooting, defense, his handle, passing, court vision - all at least average, more toward above average. There are areas he could improve in just like every other kid in this draft but man, I just don't see any glaring weaknesses at all with this kid. He's my man. If we got Curry and allowed him to take over for Duhon after next year, we're in tremendous shape moving forward IMO. Regarding a move up for the Wizards' pick, I'm in favor of using a package either built around (a) Wilson Chandler OR (b) the 8th pick. Either or but not inclusive. No way you include both in a deal like this and I think Walsh understands that so I'm not even worried.

The Chandler scenario isn't bad - Wilson's a good player that's proven so far that he's good enough to be a main cog in any team's rotation out there. And he's only gonna get better. He'll be a tough loss but we'll be OK if he were immediately replaced - that's the key for me here. I'm OK with dealing him for #5 as long as we have a plan in place to replace him (with Chandler gone and the possibility that we'll lose a few other wings like Harrington, Hughes, Nate and/or Q, we'll definitely need to replace him either in this deal or in a follow up move - whether it's with a Dominic McGuire (Blatche is intriguing, no doubt, but I wouldn't necessarily require him to be included in this deal - McGuire to immediately replace Chandler is good enough for me - in my mind in this draft, we should be concentrating on adding the best lead guard possible - the big men will come later), a SF we can get with the Wizards' #32, a mid to late 1st that we can acquire somehow in a seperate deal or with a move down with the 8th pick to a team with multiple lower picks where we can maximize value once securing the guy we want at 5. As long as there's a plan to replace Chandler (along with adding an additional wing or two - another concern I have - we could be on the verge of losing all of our wing players by the end of next year), I'm in favor of moving him for the 5th pick. That's how much I like Curry for us. And I'd have no problem sweetening the deal some (the Mobley expiring, whatever, as long as it's reasonable - i.e. you're not also getting the 8th pick Washington, get real) in order to get it done.

Man, make this happen. If this went down I'd take Curry at 5 and then if Hill and DeRozan are off the table at 8, I'd seriously look into dealing the 8th pick to the highest bidder that's willing to give me as many additional assets as possible - an additional lower pick or two this year and maybe even a 1st rounder for next year - that would go a long way in building this roster in a short amount of time. There will be a few more big center prospects available next year - I want Walsh to put us in a position to have a crack at one. I think AJ Ogilvy from Vandy is a guy D'Antoni would really like. I'm looking forward to watching him play next year...

[Edited by - finestrg on 06-21-2009 10:14 PM]
Finestrg
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6/21/2009  10:18 PM
Or better yet, I might just sit tight and see who drafts Curry ahead of us. I mean he might be there at 8. Gun to my head, I'd have to say he won't be, but who the hell knows. In the event that he is taken earlier then I'd attempt to trade directly with that team in order to get him. I mean it'd be tough if he's indeed our guy, we blow our load to trade up to 5 and then Sacramento takes him at 4. Maybe we let the top part of the draft play out first, then see what's what. Maybe that's how you go about this...

[Edited by - finestrg on 06-21-2009 11:16 PM]
Anji
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6/21/2009  10:31 PM
Posted by McK1:

dismissing what Nate and Wil bring at such an early age and trading them for unknowns and crap players is the reason the league could care little about a winner in NY anymore
Yeah, getting high draft picks for role players is what has the knicks in it's current situation.
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Finestrg
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6/21/2009  11:34 PM
Posted by Anji:
Posted by McK1:

dismissing what Nate and Wil bring at such an early age and trading them for unknowns and crap players is the reason the league could care little about a winner in NY anymore
Yeah, getting high draft picks for role players is what has the knicks in it's current situation.

Really? Give me some examples of how we traded away "role players" for high draft picks? I can't think of any. If anything, it's the opposite - we traded away big-time rebuilding assets for guys like Eddy Curry and Stephon Marbury and got burned. And since those moves, we've been dreadful and as a result we continue to hover around the 6th-8th pick come draft time and then haven't gotten a key player yet at that spot. Hopefully Gallo pans out, but so far we haven't gotten a return on that pick either, although I'm willing to give Gallo some time 'cause he was hurt...

No doubt that Nate, Lee and Chandler are good players that have produced. But with those 3 on the roster, coming into their own last year and producing at a pretty high level, we won what, 30-something games again right? Now we're gonna have to pay through the nose to keep 2 of them here (you figure it'll cost at least $12 mil. a year for both Lee and Nate and that's a low ball initial - it might take more than that & those salaries will only increase over the length of their contracts). I just don't see how we're gonna get better w/o doing some bold tinkering here. I just think, for the time being, the way to go now is to keep the cap in mind at all times & re-tool with younger, cost-effective players and through the draft. I don't think we necessarily need to keep Nate, Lee and Chandler to get better, but that's my humble opinion, and definitely not if we can grab big-time assets by trading any of them. I realize everyone likes these three and believe me so do I, but provided our braintrust does their homework and starts thinking a few steps ahead (which they should be doing on all of their moves from here on in), they'll find they can replace these guys with younger options at a much better cost w/o losing too much (say a Jordan Hill, Taj Gibson or Jeff Pendergraph sliding into Lee's role, a guy like Jack McClinton filling Nate's role, Dominic McGuire or some other capable young SF we can find to fill Chandler's spot, etc.). We do that, we stay par for the course pretty much, keep the roster young and attractive and continue to shed salary and open up more and more cap room and maneuverability along the way. That's the way to go and this plan should've been implemented a long time ago. That's where we've gone wrong - we've dug ourselves such a huge cap hole and only have marginal talent along with a perennial losing record to show for it. We need to start with this draft and continue to keep this philosophy in mind. Lee, Nate and Chandler are good players but I'm not ready to call any of them difference makers or absolute keepers. What difference did any of them really make last year, with all 3 playing well and producing? I'm completely open to dealing anyone on this roster in order to get better, bottom line. None of these guys we have are untouchable as far as I'm concerned...

[Edited by - finestrg on 06-22-2009 12:31 AM]
Finestrg
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6/22/2009  1:04 AM
Hahn reporting that the Wizards may actually be interested in guys like Hughes and Jeffries??? Wow. Dude, I'll volunteer to drive these guys to the airport. Whatever, if they are interested it's just more trade fodder we can potentially use to get something done I guess. This can't be true can it??

http://weblogs.newsday.com/sports/basketball/knicks/blog/2009/06/not_taking_the_fifth_but_perha.html
Nalod
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6/22/2009  10:02 AM
WE get the 5, give it to Memphis for the 2?

Give the 8 and the 5 for the 2?

Swap the 5 for the 2 and that Darko and Marko thing?

Wilson Chandler or the 8th pick to move up to #5?

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