[ IMAGES: Images ON turn off | ACCOUNT: User Status is LOCKED why? ]

How about this potential Bosh deal?
Forum Index  ›  NY Knicks Forum
Page 4 of 4 « First‹ Previous 2  3  4 
« Reply To Topic
Author Thread
lumbardar
Posts: 20146
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 3/12/2009
Member: #2561
4/8/2009  7:47 PM
The knicks need a young big guy in this draft like a jordan hill, maybe ed davis there rumors of him coming out in this draft or thabeet. Chris bosh is nothing special at all he is very soft and little bit overrated I rather take my chances on young big this draft then chris bosh. Chris bosh is bad leader he also doesn't have any toughness.
AUTOADVERT
sebstar
Posts: 25698
Alba Posts: 4
Joined: 6/2/2002
Member: #249
USA
4/8/2009  7:49 PM
Posted by Marv:
Posted by sebstar:

No way in hell do I give up a lottery pick for a guy who will more than likely come here in a year. Thats just a waste of an asset. Thats not even taking into account the fact that I'm not that sold on Bosh.

Melo? Now thats a different story. I'd pretty much give them whatever they asked for within reason.

ugh. what are you loving about melo so much? certainly not his playoff performances.

i got a lifelong buddy in denver who's followed every game the guy's played there. after last year’s playoffs he said – “that's it. melo's gotta go. the team is never gonna win with this guy.”

college was a LONG time ago for this guy.

This is why, Marv...

03-04 DEN 82 82 36.5 7.6-17.9 .426 0.8-2.6 .322 5.0-6.4 .777 1.2 0.5 3.0 2.7 2.2 3.8 6.0 2.8 21.0
04-05 DEN 75 75 34.8 7.1-16.4 .431 0.6-2.1 .266 6.1-7.6 .796 0.9 0.4 3.0 3.1 1.9 3.8 5.7 2.6 20.8
05-06 DEN 80 80 36.8 9.4-19.6 .481 0.5-1.9 .243 7.2-8.9 .808 1.1 0.5 2.7 2.9 1.5 3.4 4.9 2.7 26.5
06-07 DEN 65 65 38.2 10.6-22.4 .476 0.6-2.3 .268 7.1-8.7 .808 1.2 0.4 3.6 3.1 2.2 3.8 6.0 3.8 28.9
07-08 DEN 77 77 36.4 9.5-19.2 .492 0.8-2.1 .354 6.0-7.7 .786 1.3 0.5 3.3 3.3 2.3 5.1 7.4 3.4 25.7
08-09 DEN 62 61 34.6 8.2-18.3 .446 1.0-2.6 .390 5.5-7.0 .785 1.1 0.3 3.1 3.0 1.6 5.2 6.8 3.3 22.9

The Nuggets were an embarrassment for years before he arrived, since then they haven't won less than 44 games and right now he has them positioned as one of the top five teams in the league. He's young and he's arguably a top five player...definitely top ten. What more do you want?

I dont know whats good with your friend, but if he doesnt want him, I'll take him.

My saliva and spit can split thread into fiber and bits/ So trust me I'm as live as it gets. --Royce Da 5'9 + DJ Premier = Hip Hop Utopia
sebstar
Posts: 25698
Alba Posts: 4
Joined: 6/2/2002
Member: #249
USA
4/8/2009  7:54 PM
Posted by Allanfan20:

I'm not so in love with Melo either. He's had talent all around him over the years, yet he can't manage to lead his teams past the first round. He doesn't have killer instinct.

The Western Conference is ultra-competitive and has been loaded for years. Was there any playoff matchup that he was hands down supposed to win?
My saliva and spit can split thread into fiber and bits/ So trust me I'm as live as it gets. --Royce Da 5'9 + DJ Premier = Hip Hop Utopia
Marv
Posts: 35540
Alba Posts: 69
Joined: 9/2/2002
Member: #315
4/8/2009  7:57 PM
those are nice numbers, seb, but i think it's one of those deals where the peeps in denver have seen him pull a tmac so many years that they just aren't feeling his potential for leadership anymore. maybe this year will be the difference. in any case, i am PSYCHED for the playoffs to start. knicks or no knicks, the nba playoffs are by FAR my favorite sporting event of the year.
TMS
Posts: 60684
Alba Posts: 617
Joined: 5/11/2004
Member: #674
USA
4/9/2009  4:51 AM
Posted by lumbardar:

The knicks need a young big guy in this draft like a jordan hill, maybe ed davis there rumors of him coming out in this draft or thabeet. Chris bosh is nothing special at all he is very soft and little bit overrated I rather take my chances on young big this draft then chris bosh. Chris bosh is bad leader he also doesn't have any toughness.

IMO Bosh is a better player than Jordan Hill or Ed Davis will ever be, & i like both those guys... right now Bosh is the closest thing to KG in the NBA other than KG IMHO... please, don't tell me Kevin Durant, he's a glorified 3 pt. shooter... all Bosh needs to do to take it to the elite franchise level is to develop that killer instinct... young players sometimes take a while to get that, but the talent & the skillset is all there already for him if u ask me... even w/o that killer instinct he's already a top 5 PF in the NBA... u'd be nuts to pass up a chance to get that guy if he could be had w/in reason.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
Allanfan20
Posts: 35947
Alba Posts: 50
Joined: 1/16/2004
Member: #542
USA
4/9/2009  5:50 AM
Posted by TMS:
Posted by lumbardar:

The knicks need a young big guy in this draft like a jordan hill, maybe ed davis there rumors of him coming out in this draft or thabeet. Chris bosh is nothing special at all he is very soft and little bit overrated I rather take my chances on young big this draft then chris bosh. Chris bosh is bad leader he also doesn't have any toughness.

IMO Bosh is a better player than Jordan Hill or Ed Davis will ever be, & i like both those guys... right now Bosh is the closest thing to KG in the NBA other than KG IMHO... please, don't tell me Kevin Durant, he's a glorified 3 pt. shooter... all Bosh needs to do to take it to the elite franchise level is to develop that killer instinct... young players sometimes take a while to get that, but the talent & the skillset is all there already for him if u ask me... even w/o that killer instinct he's already a top 5 PF in the NBA... u'd be nuts to pass up a chance to get that guy if he could be had w/in reason.

You don't develop killer instinct. You're born with it. I actually had a convo with enyspree about this awhile back ago. I think Bosh would be a great player to have, but relying on him to develop killer instinct is not a good idea, b/c it's just not in his personality. Very few players have it, and I think these are them:

Kobe
Wade
LeBron
Chris Paul
Duncan

These are MAYBEs:
Paul Pierce
Kevin Garnett
Steve Nash
Jason Kidd

The 5 definites had that killer instinct the instant they walked into the league and everyone knew it. The maybes have shown it, but not always. In Steve Nash's case, he just took awhile to get himself out there, but as soon as he started playing real well, he threw more and more flashes of it, and when he hit Phoenix, he showed it all of the time.

I'd be very very impressed if Chris Bosh just magically developed it, b/c it just doesn't happen.
“Whenever I’m about to do something, I think ‘Would an idiot do that?’ and if they would, I do NOT do that thing.”- Dwight Schrute
TMS
Posts: 60684
Alba Posts: 617
Joined: 5/11/2004
Member: #674
USA
4/9/2009  6:05 AM
those aren't the only players w/killer instincts... u'r talking about the top assassins in the NBA right there... u telling me guys like Chauncey Billups, Ray Allen, Mike Bibby, Baron Davis, Allen Iverson, Deron Williams, etc. don't have the killer instinct? i disagree w/u completely on that one.

why can't Bosh develop a killer instinct? it's not as if KG was always a killer his entire career... he had to gain confidence in his game as he grew in the NBA & became one eventually... i'm not expecting Bosh to become Kobe or D Wade, but he can be a money player.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
Pharzeone
Posts: 32183
Alba Posts: 14
Joined: 2/11/2005
Member: #871
4/9/2009  7:20 AM
Tim Duncan doesn't have a killer instinct. Dude was being questioned during the 2005 Finals for being overrated because he was sucking it up against the Pistons. Shaq first put that out there and the media ran with it. You can make a great case that Duncan put up numbers in some games and blows in others while others put in the daggers. Such as Avery, Parker, Horry, Jackson and Manu. He is shaky in the big moments. You never know which Tim you are going to get.
I don't like to play bad rookies , I like to play good rookies - Mike D'Antoni
Bonn1997
Posts: 58654
Alba Posts: 2
Joined: 2/2/2004
Member: #581
USA
4/9/2009  7:30 AM
Posted by Pharzeone:

Tim Duncan doesn't have a killer instinct. Dude was being questioned during the 2005 Finals for being overrated because he was sucking it up against the Pistons. Shaq first put that out there and the media ran with it. You can make a great case that Duncan put up numbers in some games and blows in others while others put in the daggers. Such as Avery, Parker, Horry, Jackson and Manu. He is shaky in the big moments. You never know which Tim you are going to get.
I'd agree with this. I think terms like "killer instinct" and "clutch" are over-used. We tend to ignore how much the context impacts behavior and, more importantly, our interpretations of behavior. It's very easy to completely overlook a soft, quiet 14/7 performance from Duncan in a crucial game when he has all-star teammates picking him up, whereas if Bosh puts up the exact same 14/7 performance, people would say he disappeared under pressure.
fishmike
Posts: 53902
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 7/19/2002
Member: #298
USA
4/9/2009  8:39 AM
now Bosh is KG? The guy is soft. He's not better than Jermaine Oneil was pre injury. Bosh is a fringe star. He's a good player but more a numbers guy than anything else. He has never carried a team and doesnt make guys better.

If I want to put all my eggs into a frontcourt player he better have some kind of defensive pressence. Bosh has none. Nobody is afraid to attack the glass or take it too the hole because Chris Bosh is patrolling the paint.

If the choice was Melo or Bosh its not even debatable... its Melo all the way.

I think Bosh is a good player, but vastly overrated by people here. This year should be a wakeup call
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
TMS
Posts: 60684
Alba Posts: 617
Joined: 5/11/2004
Member: #674
USA
4/9/2009  9:09 AM
reading comprehension fish... i said he's the closest thing to KG other than KG... a 23 & 10 guy who blocks a shot per game & shoots 49% from the floor is a fringe star in your world maybe, not mine... but i'm talking to someone who thinks he's no better than Zach Randolph, a guy who doesn't even know the meaning of the words "blocked shot" & brings all kinds of baggage w/him to boot, so really there's no point in trying to argue this one w/u.

i'd rather have Amare over Bosh like i said before... not even interested in Melo at the price he would cost us to get him, he's not a guy we can build around either... my argument was that you'd be an idiot to pass up a chance to trade for Bosh if the cost was just David Lee, Harrington & our lottery pick, & i stand by that.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
djsunyc
Posts: 44929
Alba Posts: 42
Joined: 1/16/2004
Member: #536
4/9/2009  9:26 AM
Posted by fishmike:

now Bosh is KG? The guy is soft. He's not better than Jermaine Oneil was pre injury. Bosh is a fringe star. He's a good player but more a numbers guy than anything else. He has never carried a team and doesnt make guys better.

If I want to put all my eggs into a frontcourt player he better have some kind of defensive pressence. Bosh has none. Nobody is afraid to attack the glass or take it too the hole because Chris Bosh is patrolling the paint.

If the choice was Melo or Bosh its not even debatable... its Melo all the way.

I think Bosh is a good player, but vastly overrated by people here. This year should be a wakeup call

why is it melo all the way? i'm failing to understand that. what has melo done for his team that trumps bosh?

lol @ jermaine pre injury - that was like 7 years ago.

raptors won 47 games and the division title 2 years ago.
raptors won 41 games and made the playoffs last year.

bosh was their #1 scorer and rebounder in both situations.

this year's wakeup call is that the raptors cashed in all their depth for the superstar jermaine o'neal...that's why they didn't win.

you have to watch a guy play every night to really see what he brings to the table. you have to watch how a guy is used in the offense, the defense, and the coaching philosophy to truly get an idea of what someone can or can't do.

i am not a big bosh fan, but i'm telling y'all that he is a coach away from being the best pf in the game.

i'll break down bosh for y'all:

1. he is a very very good scorer. at times unstoppable.
2. he might be the best jumpshooting bigman outside of dirk.
3. he gets to the ft line at ease.
4. he is a team player.
5. he is a good rebounder.
6. he is an OK help defender.
7. he is weak so big men can back him down.
8. he takes too long to make decisions - this is his biggest obstacle.
9. he is not clutch when it comes time for a big shot.

look at his november. he was playing at an MVP level before he got hurt. took him 2-3 months to come out of the injury (while still posting up good #'s) and now look at him the past few weeks - dominating again. and his defense...i will say that he can be a much better defender (shown in the olympics) but he plays way too many minutes and is expected to carry the offensive load. so that wears him out.

i'm not overrating him. i am surveying the landscape of the nba and telling you that he could be the best young pf in the league. d'antoni would make bosh a stud - no questions asked. and again, i'm not a big fan of his.

[Edited by - djsunyc on 04-09-2009 09:26 AM]
fishmike
Posts: 53902
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 7/19/2002
Member: #298
USA
4/9/2009  9:40 AM
Posted by TMS:

reading comprehension fish... i said he's the closest thing to KG other than KG... a 23 & 10 guy who blocks a shot per game & shoots 49% from the floor is a fringe star in your world maybe, not mine... but i'm talking to someone who thinks he's no better than Zach Randolph, a guy who doesn't even know the meaning of the words "blocked shot" & brings all kinds of baggage w/him to boot, so really there's no point in trying to argue this one w/u.

i'd rather have Amare over Bosh like i said before... not even interested in Melo at the price he would cost us to get him, he's not a guy we can build around either... my argument was that you'd be an idiot to pass up a chance to trade for Bosh if the cost was just David Lee, Harrington & our lottery pick, & i stand by that.
he's better than Zach, but not as better as you think. Kurt Thomas blocked a shot a game. Blocking a shot a game doesnt make you a shot blocker.

Bosh is a very good player. Can you say he's better than Brand? Boozer? Dirk? Amare?

So when you give up your assets to build around Bosh are you going to put a better team around him than Toronto did this year? How did that work out?

Not trying to ride you man, but whats the point? I think Bosh has shown he's not a guy that you build a team around. Is he better than anything else we have? Yes. But Marbury, Curry, Zach and Crawford were also better than anything else we had when we traded for them.

Knicks need to collect as much talent as possible. If they can get a star then do it. I dont think Bosh is a star. He's a hell of a player.

"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
Bonn1997
Posts: 58654
Alba Posts: 2
Joined: 2/2/2004
Member: #581
USA
4/9/2009  10:19 AM
Posted by fishmike:
Posted by TMS:

reading comprehension fish... i said he's the closest thing to KG other than KG... a 23 & 10 guy who blocks a shot per game & shoots 49% from the floor is a fringe star in your world maybe, not mine... but i'm talking to someone who thinks he's no better than Zach Randolph, a guy who doesn't even know the meaning of the words "blocked shot" & brings all kinds of baggage w/him to boot, so really there's no point in trying to argue this one w/u.

i'd rather have Amare over Bosh like i said before... not even interested in Melo at the price he would cost us to get him, he's not a guy we can build around either... my argument was that you'd be an idiot to pass up a chance to trade for Bosh if the cost was just David Lee, Harrington & our lottery pick, & i stand by that.
he's better than Zach, but not as better as you think. Kurt Thomas blocked a shot a game. Blocking a shot a game doesnt make you a shot blocker.

Bosh is a very good player. Can you say he's better than Brand? Boozer? Dirk? Amare?

So when you give up your assets to build around Bosh are you going to put a better team around him than Toronto did this year? How did that work out?

Not trying to ride you man, but whats the point? I think Bosh has shown he's not a guy that you build a team around. Is he better than anything else we have? Yes. But Marbury, Curry, Zach and Crawford were also better than anything else we had when we traded for them.

Knicks need to collect as much talent as possible. If they can get a star then do it. I dont think Bosh is a star. He's a hell of a player.

I don't get it. Brand? Boozer? Dirk? Amare? Those are all GREAT players (or at least Brand in his prime was). If you get Bosh, you then throw in whatever sweetener is necessary to get rid of Jared and/or Eddy and then pursue another max free agent in 2010. OR Bosh will be a better sign and trade piece in 2010 than anything we have right now. Fish, does Bosh get any credit for carrying a pretty weak supporting cast to a 47 win season? You make it sound like he's been on 33 win teams every year.
Bonn1997
Posts: 58654
Alba Posts: 2
Joined: 2/2/2004
Member: #581
USA
4/9/2009  10:41 AM
Posted by TMS:
Posted by nyk4ever:

This idea that Bosh wouldn't absolutely thrive with the Knicks is insane. Bosh would go for 27 and 12 with this team, no doubt in my mind.

i'd put it more at around 24 & 9, but that's still better than anything we got.

He's averaging 23 & 10 now. All you're saying is one more point and one less rebound. I definitely don't see his rebounding going down in this system and think his scoring would go up by more than one point.
TMS
Posts: 60684
Alba Posts: 617
Joined: 5/11/2004
Member: #674
USA
4/9/2009  3:34 PM
it depends how he's being used... if he's launching up 3's & taking perimeter shots in this system which i think is very likely, then yes, his rebounding will probably go down.

tell me what PF's u've known to average 27 ppg in recent years... there hasn't been many.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
TMS
Posts: 60684
Alba Posts: 617
Joined: 5/11/2004
Member: #674
USA
4/9/2009  3:39 PM
Posted by fishmike:
Posted by TMS:

reading comprehension fish... i said he's the closest thing to KG other than KG... a 23 & 10 guy who blocks a shot per game & shoots 49% from the floor is a fringe star in your world maybe, not mine... but i'm talking to someone who thinks he's no better than Zach Randolph, a guy who doesn't even know the meaning of the words "blocked shot" & brings all kinds of baggage w/him to boot, so really there's no point in trying to argue this one w/u.

i'd rather have Amare over Bosh like i said before... not even interested in Melo at the price he would cost us to get him, he's not a guy we can build around either... my argument was that you'd be an idiot to pass up a chance to trade for Bosh if the cost was just David Lee, Harrington & our lottery pick, & i stand by that.
he's better than Zach, but not as better as you think. Kurt Thomas blocked a shot a game. Blocking a shot a game doesnt make you a shot blocker.

Bosh is a very good player. Can you say he's better than Brand? Boozer? Dirk? Amare?

So when you give up your assets to build around Bosh are you going to put a better team around him than Toronto did this year? How did that work out?

Not trying to ride you man, but whats the point? I think Bosh has shown he's not a guy that you build a team around. Is he better than anything else we have? Yes. But Marbury, Curry, Zach and Crawford were also better than anything else we had when we traded for them.

Knicks need to collect as much talent as possible. If they can get a star then do it. I dont think Bosh is a star. He's a hell of a player.

i didn't say he was better than Amare or Brand... i do think he's better than Boozer & on a similar level as Dirk, but whatever, we're arguing semantics here... tho like i said i'd prefer to go w/a banger downlow like Amare, i'd still not pass up a chance to trade for Bosh if it presented itself... there was a time when people on this forum said KG was a guy u can't build a team around too.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
Page 4 of 4 « First‹ Previous 2  3  4 
« Reply To Topic
How about this potential Bosh deal?
Forum Index  ›  NY Knicks Forum

©2001-2025 ultimateknicks.comm All rights reserved. About Us.
This site is not affiliated with the NY Knicks or the National Basketball Association in any way.
You may visit the official NY Knicks web site by clicking here.

All times (GMT-05:00) Eastern Time.

Terms of Use and Privacy Policy