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Chad Fraud interesting rumor
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TMS
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1/6/2009  5:58 PM
calm down caca-fresh... i'm just sayin' what i think D Lee's current value is.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
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sebstar
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1/6/2009  5:59 PM
Posted by TMS:
Posted by martin:
Posted by TMS:
Posted by sebstar:
Posted by TMS:
If they take Curry AND Jefferies and give back Salmons I'd say go for it.

that's the rumor being discussed here.

For real!!!!!....saracam.

i'm just sayin cuz seemed like u said unless we get back their 1st rounder u wouldn't do it... i think the absolute most u could get for D Lee now is a late lottery pick or mid 1st rounder.

you mean straight up or in addition to the proposed Chad trade?

straight up... i don't see any team willing to give us a top 10 pick for D Lee right now when there's no guarantee they will be able to re-sign him after the season... definitely SAC ain't throwing in their 1st rounder in any deals for D Lee when that pick's likely to be a top 3.

[Edited by - TMS on 01-06-2009 2:30 PM]

See, I dont agree. I think Lee is worth a top 10 pick. Especially considering this draft lineup. Might have to agree to disagree. If you can sign Lee, he will be a significant contributor for at least ten years. He is still pretty young and has proven himself in this league.
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TMS
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1/6/2009  6:06 PM
Posted by sebstar:
Posted by TMS:
Posted by martin:
Posted by TMS:
Posted by sebstar:
Posted by TMS:
If they take Curry AND Jefferies and give back Salmons I'd say go for it.

that's the rumor being discussed here.

For real!!!!!....saracam.

i'm just sayin cuz seemed like u said unless we get back their 1st rounder u wouldn't do it... i think the absolute most u could get for D Lee now is a late lottery pick or mid 1st rounder.

you mean straight up or in addition to the proposed Chad trade?

straight up... i don't see any team willing to give us a top 10 pick for D Lee right now when there's no guarantee they will be able to re-sign him after the season... definitely SAC ain't throwing in their 1st rounder in any deals for D Lee when that pick's likely to be a top 3.

[Edited by - TMS on 01-06-2009 2:30 PM]

See, I dont agree. I think Lee is worth a top 10 pick. Especially considering this draft lineup. Might have to agree to disagree. If you can sign Lee, he will be a significant contributor for at least ten years. He is still pretty young and has proven himself in this league.

the big question is if u can sign D Lee tho... u have to consider the fact that any team with a top 10 pick to give up for D Lee is gonna be a crappy team to begin with... if they have cap space they're gonna want to spend it on a face of the franchise type talent, something D Lee is not... or they're gonna want to use that top 10 pick to take someone who they feel will be able to grow into that face of the franchise type player in the future.

u also gotta consider whether or not D Lee's even gonna want to play on a crappy team for the next 5-6 years... NY is an exception since we drafted him, he's built up his fanbase here already & he loves playing in NY... send him away to some team like Charlotte, Sacramento or Oklahoma City & u gotta think he's not gonna be crazy about the idea of re-signing there.

i think realistically a top 10 pick is too optimistic for a potential half season of D Lee... a crappy team has little to gain in that type of tradeoff... the types of teams that will be bigtime interested in D Lee & more willing to give up 1st round picks for are teams on the cusp of playoff contention this season who need to shore up their frontcourt for the stretch run IMO.

in your mind he might be worth a top 10 pick & i agree w/u in principle, but in reality i don't see us getting one.

[Edited by - TMS on 01-06-2009 3:08 PM]
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King1
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1/6/2009  6:14 PM
What is the future of the Knicks. You have been one of the worst organization in the last 8 years in basketball. I still havent seen the memo that 2 free agents are coming. I think Bosh is a no brainer he is really making the Raptors a better team if he comes here we are an instant contender for the 7th spot in the playoffs.
sebstar
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1/6/2009  6:18 PM
Yeah, but Lee's a solid building block. Not a franchise talent, but somebody that you can sell to your fan base as a hard working, ultra-productive, big man in his prime that will be around for 7-10 years. Thats not something to be undersold. Oklahoma might be a stretch, but I can see that flying in Sacramento and elsewhere.
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TMS
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1/6/2009  6:20 PM
put it this way... if the Knicks had a top 10 pick do u think we would trade that away for D Lee right now? i don't... i wouldn't expect other teams to think any different.
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sebstar
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1/6/2009  6:23 PM
Posted by TMS:

put it this way... if the Knicks had a top 10 pick do u think we would trade that away for D Lee right now? i don't... i wouldn't expect other teams to think any different.

Good question and I think I would in just a pure talent vacuum. But since we're gunning for '10, thats not an option. Thats the key.
My saliva and spit can split thread into fiber and bits/ So trust me I'm as live as it gets. --Royce Da 5'9 + DJ Premier = Hip Hop Utopia
TMS
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1/6/2009  6:41 PM
Posted by sebstar:
Posted by TMS:

put it this way... if the Knicks had a top 10 pick do u think we would trade that away for D Lee right now? i don't... i wouldn't expect other teams to think any different.

Good question and I think I would in just a pure talent vacuum. But since we're gunning for '10, thats not an option. Thats the key.

most other crappy teams like us are also keying in on 2010 as well, so u gotta keep that in mind... D Lee isn't going to impact a bad franchise to the level where they want to go... he's the type of supporting cast player u look for to add to a good team to make them better.

personally i think D Lee's options aren't all that great to begin with after this season... there aren't that many teams out there that will have the cap space to sign him to begin with next year... SAC will gain his Bird rights so they could go over the cap to re-sign him, but will they want to do it is the question... personally i find it hard to believe they would even consider taking on Jefferies & Curry's longterm contracts to get D Lee as it is... OKL will have the cap space to make him an offer but i don't see him wanting to sign there... MEM has some nice young talent like Mayo & Gay & are in desperate need for a true PF, so maybe they're a possibility... they will have the cap space next year to sign him as well... however if those rumors are true about D Lee's agent warning MEM that he wouldn't re-sign w/them during that alleged failed draft day trade to get Mayo to NY, then they're no longer a viable option.

i think the better teams are the more realistic trade partners for us... POR will be able to make an offer to him if they trade for him now cuz their cap situation isn't that bad next year (depends on the contracts being traded obviously), & they're already a good team so i think they're the most logical destination for him right now.
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sebstar
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1/6/2009  6:43 PM
Agreed with most of that - but 95% of the teams in the league dont really have a shot at Lebron or Bosh. I think Lee is a good consolation prize, especially given his age and durability which disqualifies the Novitzki's and Amare's of the world.
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martin
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1/6/2009  6:51 PM
Posted by King1:

What is the future of the Knicks. You have been one of the worst organization in the last 8 years in basketball. I still havent seen the memo that 2 free agents are coming. I think Bosh is a no brainer he is really making the Raptors a better team if he comes here we are an instant contender for the 7th spot in the playoffs.

that's funny that you didn't get the memo cause most all of the competent GM's in the league did get the memo and have a pretty big notion to hold on to cap space for 2010. Bosh is not the Knicks first target.
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TMS
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1/6/2009  6:54 PM
if Lee was part of that 2010 class, i would agree w/u that he's a solid consolation prize... but i can't imagine any teams throwing in the towel before they even get there to at least see if they can land 1 of the bigger names.

if i were a crappy team that couldn't get Lebron, i'd target 2nd tier guys like Joe Johnson first... then after i get me a scorer, i would look to guys like D Lee to pair them with... i wouldn't sacrifice my cap space in 2010 so i could secure D Lee now... that's just how i look at it & from how Donnie Walsh has been approaching matters he seems to think along those lines too.
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sebstar
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1/6/2009  6:55 PM
Posted by King1:

What is the future of the Knicks. You have been one of the worst organization in the last 8 years in basketball. I still havent seen the memo that 2 free agents are coming. I think Bosh is a no brainer he is really making the Raptors a better team if he comes here we are an instant contender for the 7th spot in the playoffs.

The idea is to get two top line free agents. Obviously Lebron and Bosh would shut NY down, but Bosh and Wade? Bosh and Joe Johnson? Or we can sign Bosh and chill until 2011 when D Howard and Yao are available. Not really pumped off Yao, but Stern would blackout from joy if Yao was in NY.
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EnySpree
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1/6/2009  7:18 PM
Posted by martin:
Posted by King1:

What is the future of the Knicks. You have been one of the worst organization in the last 8 years in basketball. I still havent seen the memo that 2 free agents are coming. I think Bosh is a no brainer he is really making the Raptors a better team if he comes here we are an instant contender for the 7th spot in the playoffs.

that's funny that you didn't get the memo cause most all of the competent GM's in the league did get the memo and have a pretty big notion to hold on to cap space for 2010. Bosh is not the Knicks first target.

Martin you missed the part about the Knicks being the worst organization for 8 years......how many of those years has Lee been on the team?

Its a shame the Knicks can't keep Lee but Lee is a terrible defender and he has a cap to how good he is.....right now he's hit his cap. He's a good player, but he's no Bosh and he's no Amare. Knicks might not even be able to sign either but its better to go all out for the chance....
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sebstar
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1/6/2009  7:20 PM
Posted by EnySpree:
Posted by martin:
Posted by King1:

What is the future of the Knicks. You have been one of the worst organization in the last 8 years in basketball. I still havent seen the memo that 2 free agents are coming. I think Bosh is a no brainer he is really making the Raptors a better team if he comes here we are an instant contender for the 7th spot in the playoffs.

that's funny that you didn't get the memo cause most all of the competent GM's in the league did get the memo and have a pretty big notion to hold on to cap space for 2010. Bosh is not the Knicks first target.

Martin you missed the part about the Knicks being the worst organization for 8 years......how many of those years has Lee been on the team?

Its a shame the Knicks can't keep Lee but Lee is a terrible defender and he has a cap to how good he is.....right now he's hit his cap. He's a good player, but he's no Bosh and he's no Amare. Knicks might not even be able to sign either but its better to go all out for the chance....

Thats not fair, Lee has played on pitiful, dysfunctional squads. He would beast in Phx --- not on an Amare level but remember also that he's not working on a microfracture impaired knee as well. That means something.
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Pharzeone
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1/6/2009  7:31 PM
Posted by sebstar:
Posted by EnySpree:
Posted by martin:
Posted by King1:

What is the future of the Knicks. You have been one of the worst organization in the last 8 years in basketball. I still havent seen the memo that 2 free agents are coming. I think Bosh is a no brainer he is really making the Raptors a better team if he comes here we are an instant contender for the 7th spot in the playoffs.

that's funny that you didn't get the memo cause most all of the competent GM's in the league did get the memo and have a pretty big notion to hold on to cap space for 2010. Bosh is not the Knicks first target.

Martin you missed the part about the Knicks being the worst organization for 8 years......how many of those years has Lee been on the team?

Its a shame the Knicks can't keep Lee but Lee is a terrible defender and he has a cap to how good he is.....right now he's hit his cap. He's a good player, but he's no Bosh and he's no Amare. Knicks might not even be able to sign either but its better to go all out for the chance....

Thats not fair, Lee has played on pitiful, dysfunctional squads. He would beast in Phx --- not on an Amare level but remember also that he's not working on a microfracture impaired knee as well. That means something.

I agree. I wouldn't let Lee go unless you get a top 5 lottery pick for him much like Memphis was willing to offer. Lee has improved his play this season so why should the Knicks get less for him. Keep Lee at a reason price. Walsh needs to concentrate on moving Curry and Jeffries. If he moves just Curry then he can sign a top FA.
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King1
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1/6/2009  7:45 PM
so Martin who is the Knicks first choice? The Knicks have never signed a free agent that is a superstar. They have bad ownership and the Warrior, Wizards, and Blazers have won championships since the Knicks. Walsh left Indiana in such great shape also. If you dont get Lebron then what is the plan?
TMS
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1/6/2009  7:53 PM
King, under that type of pessimistic logic, the Knicks should never target any top FA's & instead should just continue along the same road we've been on for the past 8 years... that's a ridiculous defeatist attitude to take... Walsh is trying to change things here... he's doing something that should have been done a long time ago... clearing up some dead weight & bad contracts & looking to use his best trade assets to help build his vision of what he thinks can be a contender in the future... i have no idea why any Knick fan would be opposed to that vision.
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martin
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1/6/2009  7:53 PM
Posted by King1:

so Martin who is the Knicks first choice? The Knicks have never signed a free agent that is a superstar. They have bad ownership and the Warrior, Wizards, and Blazers have won championships since the Knicks. Walsh left Indiana in such great shape also. If you dont get Lebron then what is the plan?

take your pick.

http://www.realgm.com/src_contractoptions/2010/

Lakers never got a free agent superstar either, until they got Shaq.

I was thinking that Jerry West left the Grizz in great shape too.
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King1
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1/6/2009  7:54 PM
I dont Lee is better than Bosh but Bosh has won 12 games at toronto and they have as much talent as the Knicks. WHat I am saying if you gut the team and one MAx isnt coming to get his brains beat in. Bosh isnt coming with Jeffires and Gallo as his four. He would get doubled and have to get every rebound.
King1
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1/6/2009  7:56 PM
The Lakers are a great organization and winning compaing the Lakers to the Knicks is like comparing Filet mignon and hambruger helper. What I am saying is it will be easier to sign one guy than two and if you dont get any of them you dont have any players. The Lakers got SHaq and they had Kobe. These guys want to win not rebuild a program. If you had Wilson, Lee, Duhon, Gallinari if he is decent and Lebron that teams is a top two team in the east.
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