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Keep Ewing Drop Roberson...
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Cookdcokehop
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10/25/2008  2:55 PM
Why are you guys infatuated with Patrick Ewing Jr.? What can he do for this team? How can he help us win games? He is 23yr old with very little skills and very little upside. He will never be his father. Of course it would be a great PR move but aren't we trying to improve our ball club or are we trying to sell tickets? Waiving Jerome James because his contract will be very valuable when it is about to expire, which is in 2010 the Lebron sweepstakes. Roberson is garbage but by all reports it seems likeDonnie doesn't want to admit to his mistake. Collins is playing very well and has recently been extended. This is whats gonna happen...Ewing gets waived plays in Reno for a year then returns to the Knicks in 09-10 or Walsh admits he made a mistake in signing Roberson (let alone paying of his Euro club) and waives him. I will see you in 09 Ewing.
AUTOADVERT
kam77
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10/25/2008  2:59 PM
Posted by 4949:
Posted by BasketballJones:
Posted by oohah:

If there is one more cut to make, no way Roberson should beat out ewing. We have enough small shooting guards and we need some insurance for our injury-prone swingmen.

On top of that ewing can really play defense and finish around the basket.

On top of that Ewing is just the better player.

On top of that he is Patrick Ewing Jr.

oohah

I agree, except I thought the choice was between Jr., Roberson & James.

Between the three, James is an obvious choice to be cut. It should be a no-brainer.

You guys still don't get it. dolan isn't buying anyone out. He said so himself. Jr. is a goner! The only way for a buyout to happen is if Jr. showed some super promise. Why sign Roberson to 800 thouw, and then get rid of him a month and a half later? And then what if they did' keep Jr. and he flops? The brass is out another 800 thousand and Jr. is yet another long line of bums.

why quibble over chump change. Jr and Roberson practically make nothing a piece.
lol @ being BANNED by Martin since 11/07/10 (for asking if Mr. Earl had a point). Really, Martin? C'mon. This is the internet. I've seen much worse on this site. By Earl himself. Drop the hypocrisy.
4949
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10/25/2008  3:01 PM
I hate being the carrier of not so hopeful news, but I think it's important that I point out the down sides of certain moves.

The contract situation and the whole idea of buying out between Roberson and Jr. is even worse then. You say he's 450 thousand, while Roberson is 800 thousand. Well that's even worse to our money woes. If in fact he doesn't pan out, then we are out another 1 million 250 thousand dollars.

Again, I ask 'when will it end'? I am more than willing to cut ties with Jr. and forget about of this nonsense if it means making this management fiscally responsible.

Being totally irresponsible is the foundation of 'ALL' of our problems!! When will a GM stand up finally and have some balls not to make any moves that will cost us more money??

This is bigger than Jr. or anyone else. This is about our future and that is the entire basis of my whole argument and the way we wheel and deal in moves. What to move and what not to move and when to do it. But the money has got to be the basis for all of that, plain and simple. That is the very heart of it all. The ultimate answers to whether we grow in the right direction or not. If 3 + 2 doesn't add up to 5, then don't do it. Don't take a chance and hope the number will be 7!

I will say one thing about this site. Of the sites I have been to, most of you guys (if given enough information for a period of time) seem to get it sooner or later and I expect you to get it sooner or later.
I'll never trust this' team again.
SlimPack
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10/25/2008  3:03 PM
Posted by Cookdcokehop:

Why are you guys infatuated with Patrick Ewing Jr.? What can he do for this team? How can he help us win games? He is 23yr old with very little skills and very little upside. He will never be his father. Of course it would be a great PR move but aren't we trying to improve our ball club or are we trying to sell tickets? Waiving Jerome James because his contract will be very valuable when it is about to expire, which is in 2010 the Lebron sweepstakes. Roberson is garbage but by all reports it seems likeDonnie doesn't want to admit to his mistake. Collins is playing very well and has recently been extended. This is whats gonna happen...Ewing gets waived plays in Reno for a year then returns to the Knicks in 09-10 or Walsh admits he made a mistake in signing Roberson (let alone paying of his Euro club) and waives him. I will see you in 09 Ewing.

How will Jerome James' contract be valuable when it's about to expire? it expires the year before Lebron has his player option, so if we trade Jerome's contract for a longer one, that will just make it harder to sign Lebron because we'd have picked up extra salary. Unless I'm missing something I don't see how James' contract will ever be valuable.
4949
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10/25/2008  3:05 PM
Posted by SlimPack:
Posted by Cookdcokehop:

Why are you guys infatuated with Patrick Ewing Jr.? What can he do for this team? How can he help us win games? He is 23yr old with very little skills and very little upside. He will never be his father. Of course it would be a great PR move but aren't we trying to improve our ball club or are we trying to sell tickets? Waiving Jerome James because his contract will be very valuable when it is about to expire, which is in 2010 the Lebron sweepstakes. Roberson is garbage but by all reports it seems likeDonnie doesn't want to admit to his mistake. Collins is playing very well and has recently been extended. This is whats gonna happen...Ewing gets waived plays in Reno for a year then returns to the Knicks in 09-10 or Walsh admits he made a mistake in signing Roberson (let alone paying of his Euro club) and waives him. I will see you in 09 Ewing.

How will Jerome James' contract be valuable when it's about to expire? it expires the year before Lebron has his player option, so if we trade Jerome's contract for a longer one, that will just make it harder to sign Lebron because we'd have picked up extra salary. Unless I'm missing something I don't see how James' contract will ever be valuable.

Again, it's not expiring. He still has another year after this one and it's his option.
I'll never trust this' team again.
nixluva
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10/25/2008  3:10 PM
Posted by 4949:
Posted by SlimPack:
Posted by Cookdcokehop:

Why are you guys infatuated with Patrick Ewing Jr.? What can he do for this team? How can he help us win games? He is 23yr old with very little skills and very little upside. He will never be his father. Of course it would be a great PR move but aren't we trying to improve our ball club or are we trying to sell tickets? Waiving Jerome James because his contract will be very valuable when it is about to expire, which is in 2010 the Lebron sweepstakes. Roberson is garbage but by all reports it seems likeDonnie doesn't want to admit to his mistake. Collins is playing very well and has recently been extended. This is whats gonna happen...Ewing gets waived plays in Reno for a year then returns to the Knicks in 09-10 or Walsh admits he made a mistake in signing Roberson (let alone paying of his Euro club) and waives him. I will see you in 09 Ewing.

How will Jerome James' contract be valuable when it's about to expire? it expires the year before Lebron has his player option, so if we trade Jerome's contract for a longer one, that will just make it harder to sign Lebron because we'd have picked up extra salary. Unless I'm missing something I don't see how James' contract will ever be valuable.

Again, it's not expiring. He still has another year after this one and it's his option.
I believe he was saying that Jerome has one more year after this one. He said "it expires the year before Lebron has his player option". Jerome get's another 6.6 mil next year and then he's done.
SlimPack
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10/25/2008  3:19 PM
Posted by 4949:
Posted by SlimPack:
Posted by Cookdcokehop:

Why are you guys infatuated with Patrick Ewing Jr.? What can he do for this team? How can he help us win games? He is 23yr old with very little skills and very little upside. He will never be his father. Of course it would be a great PR move but aren't we trying to improve our ball club or are we trying to sell tickets? Waiving Jerome James because his contract will be very valuable when it is about to expire, which is in 2010 the Lebron sweepstakes. Roberson is garbage but by all reports it seems likeDonnie doesn't want to admit to his mistake. Collins is playing very well and has recently been extended. This is whats gonna happen...Ewing gets waived plays in Reno for a year then returns to the Knicks in 09-10 or Walsh admits he made a mistake in signing Roberson (let alone paying of his Euro club) and waives him. I will see you in 09 Ewing.

How will Jerome James' contract be valuable when it's about to expire? it expires the year before Lebron has his player option, so if we trade Jerome's contract for a longer one, that will just make it harder to sign Lebron because we'd have picked up extra salary. Unless I'm missing something I don't see how James' contract will ever be valuable.

Again, it's not expiring. He still has another year after this one and it's his option.

I know. I was responding to cookdcokehop who seemed to say that eventually when Jerome's contract is about to expire, it will be valuable. However, I don't see how that would be the case.

[Edited by - Slimpack on 10-25-2008 3:19 PM]
SlimPack
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10/25/2008  3:28 PM
Posted by 4949:

I hate being the carrier of not so hopeful news, but I think it's important that I point out the down sides of certain moves.

The contract situation and the whole idea of buying out between Roberson and Jr. is even worse then. You say he's 450 thousand, while Roberson is 800 thousand. Well that's even worse to our money woes. If in fact he doesn't pan out, then we are out another 1 million 250 thousand dollars.

Again, I ask 'when will it end'? I am more than willing to cut ties with Jr. and forget about of this nonsense if it means making this management fiscally responsible.

Being totally irresponsible is the foundation of 'ALL' of our problems!! When will a GM stand up finally and have some balls not to make any moves that will cost us more money??

This is bigger than Jr. or anyone else. This is about our future and that is the entire basis of my whole argument and the way we wheel and deal in moves. What to move and what not to move and when to do it. But the money has got to be the basis for all of that, plain and simple. That is the very heart of it all. The ultimate answers to whether we grow in the right direction or not. If 3 + 2 doesn't add up to 5, then don't do it. Don't take a chance and hope the number will be 7!

I will say one thing about this site. Of the sites I have been to, most of you guys (if given enough information for a period of time) seem to get it sooner or later and I expect you to get it sooner or later.

Again, I don't see how not buying out Jerome James is fiscally responisble. I explained in my last post why I don't see how it is. even if Ewing Jr turns out to be a waste and the Knicks wind up flushing 1 million or so dollars for one season, who cares? That's in insignificant amount of money in NBA terms. I'd still say it was worth the gamble. That's why I'd consider keeping him to be a low risk fair reward type of move. Like I said before, even though he doesn't have all-star potential, if we can sign a player who can be a contributor down the road for a small cost, why not do it?

As for your question of when will it end. My thinking is it would when the GM of our team stops giving out, or trading for, outrageous contracts to guys who haven't earned them, like Jerome James for example.

I mean, I agree that the Knicks shouldn't waste money or be financially irresponsible, I just don't think that cutting Jerome James falls into that category. However I do think that signing a player based off of a couple of good playoff games when he's been horrible his entire career to a 5 year 30 million dollar contract falls into that category. If Donnie Walsh did something like that, then I could see how the fiscally irresponsible argument could come into play, but I don't see how it does here.

If Ewing jr is cut I won't be that upset about it because I don't think he can be all that good. but I'd still disagree with it.
Cookdcokehop
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10/25/2008  3:48 PM
Jerome James has an option in his contract in which he can opt out after this year. Do you honestly think he is going to do that? No. So he has 2 yrs and 12 mill left on his contract. His last year as a Knick will be the summer of 09-10 season. Not 08-09. Lebron will opt out the same season James contract expires meaning whoever gets Jeromes contract anytime before the summer of 09-10 will be losing a little more than 6 million off their cap. 6 million more to throw at Lebron James.

Source: http://hoopshype.com/salaries.htm
oohah
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10/25/2008  3:50 PM
Posted by Cookdcokehop:

Why are you guys infatuated with Patrick Ewing Jr.? What can he do for this team? How can he help us win games? He is 23yr old with very little skills and very little upside. He will never be his father.


What if he grows 4-5 inches?

oohah


Good luck Mike D'Antoni, 'cause you ain't never seen nothing like this before!
Ira
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10/25/2008  4:00 PM
Ewing and Roberson each give us something we need. Ewing plays d and Roberson can hit the 3. Neither has a chance to make the rotation. But Ewing is the younger player and may improve his game.

The Knicks said that they signed Roberson, because other teams were interested in him. So perhaps the Knicks can get a second round pick for him from some team under the cap.
Cookdcokehop
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10/25/2008  4:26 PM
Posted by oohah:
Posted by Cookdcokehop:

Why are you guys infatuated with Patrick Ewing Jr.? What can he do for this team? How can he help us win games? He is 23yr old with very little skills and very little upside. He will never be his father.


What if he grows 4-5 inches?

oohah

Men stop growing at the age of 21 at max 22. So Ewing will be a 6'6 PF as long as he is in the NBA.
oohah
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10/25/2008  4:34 PM
Posted by Cookdcokehop:


Men stop growing at the age of 21 at max 22.

If you watched discovery channel you would know that isn't necessarily true.

And he is 6'8".

oohah



Good luck Mike D'Antoni, 'cause you ain't never seen nothing like this before!
KNICKSdom
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10/25/2008  4:45 PM
Posted by Andrew:

James has got to go. He has no value in a trade, and even his expiring contract would only bring back more salary, which the Knicks have said they don't want. I say let him go.

Yes yes that's what I been sayin all along. Just cut James for the love of turd. No sense cutting one of the young players who actually likes to play basketball.
Knicks are happening and have a Unicorn.
SlimPack
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10/25/2008  5:09 PM
Posted by Cookdcokehop:

Jerome James has an option in his contract in which he can opt out after this year. Do you honestly think he is going to do that? No. So he has 2 yrs and 12 mill left on his contract. His last year as a Knick will be the summer of 09-10 season. Not 08-09. Lebron will opt out the same season James contract expires meaning whoever gets Jeromes contract anytime before the summer of 09-10 will be losing a little more than 6 million off their cap. 6 million more to throw at Lebron James.

Source: http://hoopshype.com/salaries.htm

I think I see what you mean. I made a mistake with the contracts. Jerome's contract does expire when Lebron's does (assuming Lebron will opt out that is). But still, if we use Jerome's contract to help clear 6 million for another team to throw at Lebron, doesn't that mean we'll have 6 millon less to throw at Lebron ourselves? I thought we were going to be in that offseason's sweepstakes as well.
4949
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10/25/2008  5:16 PM
Posted by nixluva:
Posted by 4949:
Posted by SlimPack:
Posted by Cookdcokehop:

Why are you guys infatuated with Patrick Ewing Jr.? What can he do for this team? How can he help us win games? He is 23yr old with very little skills and very little upside. He will never be his father. Of course it would be a great PR move but aren't we trying to improve our ball club or are we trying to sell tickets? Waiving Jerome James because his contract will be very valuable when it is about to expire, which is in 2010 the Lebron sweepstakes. Roberson is garbage but by all reports it seems likeDonnie doesn't want to admit to his mistake. Collins is playing very well and has recently been extended. This is whats gonna happen...Ewing gets waived plays in Reno for a year then returns to the Knicks in 09-10 or Walsh admits he made a mistake in signing Roberson (let alone paying of his Euro club) and waives him. I will see you in 09 Ewing.

How will Jerome James' contract be valuable when it's about to expire? it expires the year before Lebron has his player option, so if we trade Jerome's contract for a longer one, that will just make it harder to sign Lebron because we'd have picked up extra salary. Unless I'm missing something I don't see how James' contract will ever be valuable.

Again, it's not expiring. He still has another year after this one and it's his option.
I believe he was saying that Jerome has one more year after this one. He said "it expires the year before Lebron has his player option". Jerome get's another 6.6 mil next year and then he's done.

Not sure if I see it that way, but okay, thanks.
I'll never trust this' team again.
Cookdcokehop
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10/25/2008  5:20 PM
Posted by oohah:
Posted by Cookdcokehop:


Men stop growing at the age of 21 at max 22.

If you watched discovery channel you would know that isn't necessarily true.

And he is 6'8".

oohah

90% of the time it is. Ewing hasn't grown since he left Indiana.

Patrick Ewing 6' 6" (W/O SHOES) 6' 7.25"(W/ SHOES) 224 7' 0.25" 8' 1.5" 9.4 35.0 42.0 2 11.77 3.43 NA 43
4949
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10/25/2008  5:24 PM
Posted by Cookdcokehop:
Posted by oohah:
Posted by Cookdcokehop:

Why are you guys infatuated with Patrick Ewing Jr.? What can he do for this team? How can he help us win games? He is 23yr old with very little skills and very little upside. He will never be his father.


What if he grows 4-5 inches?

oohah

Men stop growing at the age of 21 at max 22. So Ewing will be a 6'6 PF as long as he is in the NBA.

How do you explain Nate? He stopped growing when he was born.
I'll never trust this' team again.
4949
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10/25/2008  5:27 PM
Posted by KNICKSdom:
Posted by Andrew:

James has got to go. He has no value in a trade, and even his expiring contract would only bring back more salary, which the Knicks have said they don't want. I say let him go.

Yes yes that's what I been sayin all along. Just cut James for the love of turd. No sense cutting one of the young players who actually likes to play basketball.

What are you saying? The brass would have to pay him the rest of his salary. 12 plus million of it. That's even worse then the Jr. Roberson situation. Wait until his last year and then buy out what he is owed, if' that's what they have to do to open it up for LeBron.
I'll never trust this' team again.
oohah
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10/25/2008  5:48 PM
Posted by Cookdcokehop:


90% of the time it is. Ewing hasn't grown since he left Indiana.

Patrick Ewing 6' 6" (W/O SHOES) 6' 7.25"(W/ SHOES) 224 7' 0.25" 8' 1.5" 9.4 35.0 42.0 2 11.77 3.43 NA 43

Well Patrick Ewing Junior is already taller than 90% of the population, and it is a good thing he plays with his shoes on right?

oohah



Good luck Mike D'Antoni, 'cause you ain't never seen nothing like this before!
Keep Ewing Drop Roberson...

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