read the post again & calm the F down.

Posted by TMS:

just in case ur hard of reading, i'll bold if for ya

i already said i thought the package is comparable if you take either Gordon or Deng out of the equation... also gave my case for why i don't believe the Bulls would want to take on Kobe's contract after that trade kicker takes effect & risk him leaving via free agency in 2 years.

Yeah, I get it, you think the 2 offers are similar so the Bulls have to throw in Deng, the best player from either team, just to tip the scales in their favor.

That makes no sense.

Kobe would have to waive a no-trade clause in his contract before he could be moved, which he apparently would agree to do if the Bulls, Dallas Mavericks, New York Knicks or Phoenix Suns are the destination. Forget the Mavericks and the Suns -- they're in the same conference as the Lakers -- and the Knicks have no players of any great value.

Obviously just another hater filled with venom.

Who said that? Just pointing out that people, who have no reason to have a bias against the Knicks, realize that the Knicks don't have the assets to compete for Kobe.

Of course when I say it, it's just because I'm a hater and filled with venom.
[/quote]

I hope you guys realize that some of this is taken from the article itself.

Islesfan, can we get one thing straight? The Bulls are the front runners if they decide to get involved. The Knicks won't be able to beat what the Bulls can put together. That doesn't mean that they WILL decide to go after Kobe. If Kobe is available, WE WILL go after him, there is no question or hesistance on the part of the Knicks. The Bulls however have reason to pause and think long and hard about it. IF the Bulls decide not to go for Kobe, the Knicks offer is the next best thing for the Lakers. The Bulls WILL have to up the anti, because there is no doubt that we will do everything in our power to try and get Kobe. The Bulls won't be able to low ball the Lakers so long as we are involved. We can offer to take back salary in addition to Kobe and send back a player with a shorter contract, so that the Lakers can aim towards the next big FA market.

Let's get another thing straight, Chi best offer still doesn't put the Lakers in the WCF's so who cares if they get a bit ;more talent, IT STILL WON'T BE ENOUGH IN THE WEST! Ben G. and Kirk aren't gonna change a damn thing for the Lakers on their own. The Lakers will still have to have a longterm plan that would allow them to get a Stud. In that sense both the Knicks and the Bulls offers come up short.

Let's get yet another thing straight. The Bulls won't be a better team for Kobe after making the deal with LA. We would be the better team and thus Kobe would have a better chance if he agreed to a deal to come here.

Posted by 4949:

Remember, if Kobe wants to come to New York, he can nix the bulls deal and force the hand.

And the Lakers can tell Kobe to go F himself and act like a spoiled brat for 2 years before opting out. Then the Lakers can get $24M in cap space and Kobe can go sign for a lot less money with his beloved Knicks while destroying every last bit of his reputation, image and marketability.

Posted by nixluva:

Islesfan, can we get one thing straight? The Bulls are the front runners if they decide to get involved. The Knicks won't be able to beat what the Bulls can put together. That doesn't mean that they WILL decide to go after Kobe. If Kobe is available, WE WILL go after him, there is no question or hesistance on the part of the Knicks. The Bulls however have reason to pause and think long and hard about it. IF the Bulls decide not to go for Kobe, the Knicks offer is the next best thing for the Lakers. The Bulls WILL have to up the anti, because there is no doubt that we will do everything in our power to try and get Kobe. The Bulls won't be able to low ball the Lakers so long as we are involved. We can offer to take back salary in addition to Kobe and send back a player with a shorter contract, so that the Lakers can aim towards the next big FA market.

Let's get another thing straight, Chi best offer still doesn't put the Lakers in the WCF's so who cares if they get a bit ;more talent, IT STILL WON'T BE ENOUGH IN THE WEST! Ben G. and Kirk aren't gonna change a damn thing for the Lakers on their own. The Lakers will still have to have a longterm plan that would allow them to get a Stud. In that sense both the Knicks and the Bulls offers come up short.

Let's get yet another thing straight. The Bulls won't be a better team for Kobe after making the deal with LA. We would be the better team and thus Kobe would have a better chance if he agreed to a deal to come here.

I've already said that "IF" the Bulls decide to get into the Kobe market. That's obvious. But if they don't, the Lakers aren't even close to being forced to accept the Knicks offer, especially with Kobe 2 years away from being able to opt out. They can open it up to other teams that Kobe is said to have put on his list, like the Suns and Mavs to see if they can get a better package. Obviously the Lakers prefer not to trade him to a team in their division or conference but if the alternative is to accept 10 cents on the dollar from the Knicks, then they'll have to consider it.

If the Lakers really want to aim towards the next big free agent market, their best bet is to just let Kobe walk and have 24M+ in cap space that Kobe opting out frees up.

"Who cares if they get a bit more talent"??? Yeah, getting back the best package means nothing.

Last years Bulls team won 49 games and went 6 games in the conference semis. Replace Gordon with Kobe and they're even better. Thomas didn't play a huge role last year and Nocioni is replaceable. The Knicks won 34 games and you yourself cried about how much they missed Lee and Crawford, the 2 main components of the Knicks trade offer. Get it straight, Kobe joining Hinrich, Deng and Wallace is much better than anything that he'd be joining in NY. They've already proven that.

Posted by TMS:

Posted by islesfan:

Posted by 4949:

Remember, if Kobe wants to come to New York, he can nix the bulls deal and force the hand.

And the Lakers can tell Kobe to go F himself and act like a spoiled brat for 2 years before opting out. Then the Lakers can get $24M in cap space and Kobe can go sign for a lot less money with his beloved Knicks while destroying every last bit of his reputation, image and marketability.

i think we all saw that Kobe is easily capable of repairing his public image... all it would take is a memorable season in a Knicks' uniform.

isles, why are you taking this so personal? i've heard your arguments, i just don't agree w/you... you obviously have dismissed everything any one who's argued against your points have said, so why should anyone seriously consider anything you have to say on the matter? people have repeatedly been saying that we all realize the Bulls have the best pieces to offer... the question is will they go for it? & will they be willing to accept that trade kicker that comes along w/Kobe in the process? will Paxson be willing to mortgage what he's been building there & cap that team out for the foreseeable future to bring Kobe in? i have my doubts... obviously you don't... it's OK to disagree without going postal dude... i think we all pretty much agree that Isiah wouldn't blink an eyelash when it comes to money or cap issues though, so that right there eliminates that roadblock from a Knicks' standpoint.

People are sick of Kobe afer 3 weeks of this. Imagine what people will be feeling after 2 more years of it. Kobe isn't interested in coming to NY to do local commercials.

Sure, why consider simple logic when you can think that Chicago throwing in Luol Deng as a trade sweetener is the only way the Bulls can make a deal.

Posted by nixluva:

Posted by islesfan:

People are sick of Kobe afer 3 weeks of this. Imagine what people will be feeling after 2 more years of it. Kobe isn't interested in coming to NY to do local commercials.

Sure, why consider simple logic when you can think that Chicago throwing in Luol Deng as a trade sweetener is the only way the Bulls can make a deal.

What you and others keep proposing is utterly ridiculous. There's NO WAY that the Lakers would allow Kobe to sit for 2 years just to stand on some moral ground that there's no deal to be made. When has that EVER happened with a bigtime NBA player that wanted to be traded? That would be the Dumbest thing any team has ever done.

Chi would have to START with Deng, cuz that's the player even Memphis was asking for in a trade. But let's get real for a minute here. There's really no sense to the idea of Chi making a deal for Kobe. It would be too costly and too disruptive and they'd still be short of an NBA Finals winner.

I'm saying that's an option the Lakers have if Kobe decides to force them into accepting an offer that's far below what other teams on his list are offering. Freeing up $24M in cap space for a big free agent market is hardly the dumbest thing ever. For many examples, check out Isiah's tenure as Knicks GM.

If the Knicks can start with Jamal Crawford, why do the Bulls have to start with Deng? Memphis' unmet trade demands have absolutely nothing to do with anything.

There's really no sense to the idea of Chi making a deal for Kobe. It would be too costly and too disruptive and they'd still be short of an NBA Finals winner.

You were talking about the dumbest thing ever earlier. Well this is pretty damn close.

Posted by islesfan:
Kobe isn't interested in coming to NY to do local commercials.

didn't realize you'd spoken to him about it.