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Best deal for Kobe we can give up?
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Bonn1997
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6/17/2007  7:50 AM
Posted by Caseloads:
Posted by islesfan:

It's too bad Isiah was too busy Starphucking all this time when he could have been collecting lottery picks since 2004. Maybe then we'd actually have players that other teams wanted to trade for.
Or we'd be a team like the bobcats that no one would want to come to.
If Kobe comes here, it will be because of the city, not the roster. We could have the Bobcats' roster and he'd probably be even more excited about coming here to play with two way players like Okafor and G Wallace.
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blueNorange
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6/17/2007  7:58 AM
I'm on the fence with this ... I would love to have a player like Kobe but I'm not sure if I'd be willing to trade our future and our true franchise player in Lee. Also Isiah needs to keep his picks instead of trading them away because in 2 years Marbury is gone and I for one don't want to see him back.
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BRIGGS
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6/17/2007  8:41 AM
Posted by blueNorange:

I'm on the fence with this ... I would love to have a player like Kobe but I'm not sure if I'd be willing to trade our future and our true franchise player in Lee. Also Isiah needs to keep his picks instead of trading them away because in 2 years Marbury is gone and I for one don't want to see him back.


The bottom line--the barrier to the finals in the east is one that is there for the taking now. If you are talking Kobe 28 Curry 24 we realistcially have a 5-6 year timefrmae where we WILL be perenially contenders--thats is where you want to be

I dont think the Bulls will gut their roster because if they do they have kobe and no one else.

we can give them the large package + we can throw in Randolph Morris and that leaves us standing with Marbury Kobe and Curry and they can figure it out from there.
RIP Crushalot😞
franco12
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6/17/2007  8:55 AM
Posted by BRIGGS:
Posted by blueNorange:

I'm on the fence with this ... I would love to have a player like Kobe but I'm not sure if I'd be willing to trade our future and our true franchise player in Lee. Also Isiah needs to keep his picks instead of trading them away because in 2 years Marbury is gone and I for one don't want to see him back.


The bottom line--the barrier to the finals in the east is one that is there for the taking now. If you are talking Kobe 28 Curry 24 we realistcially have a 5-6 year timefrmae where we WILL be perenially contenders--thats is where you want to be

I dont think the Bulls will gut their roster because if they do they have kobe and no one else.

we can give them the large package + we can throw in Randolph Morris and that leaves us standing with Marbury Kobe and Curry and they can figure it out from there.

I'm on the fence too- Kobe is a great player- the kind that can take a team to the championship level.

Kobe might do better in a different offense than what Phil is running.

But- I'm not comparing the two- folks said that with curry, marbury & francis, we'd be right there- and that experiment didn't go as planned.

Again, world of difference between Francis and Kobe- my point is that you can say things on paper should be a certain way, but in reality, things play out differently.

I'm all for putting a deal out for the lakers- I'm ok with sending Lee in that package.

But, I don't want to send Lee & Frye & somehow Francis (or marbury) need to go to LA
Bonn1997
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6/17/2007  9:13 AM
Posted by BRIGGS:
Posted by blueNorange:

I'm on the fence with this ... I would love to have a player like Kobe but I'm not sure if I'd be willing to trade our future and our true franchise player in Lee. Also Isiah needs to keep his picks instead of trading them away because in 2 years Marbury is gone and I for one don't want to see him back.


The bottom line--the barrier to the finals in the east is one that is there for the taking now. If you are talking Kobe 28 Curry 24 we realistcially have a 5-6 year timefrmae where we WILL be perenially contenders--thats is where you want to be

I dont think the Bulls will gut their roster because if they do they have kobe and no one else.

we can give them the large package + we can throw in Randolph Morris and that leaves us standing with Marbury Kobe and Curry and they can figure it out from there.
The Bulls, Raptors, and Pistons still have better *teams* than we do. We'd just have a few stars who are known for putting themselves ahead of the team. If the Bulls add any low post threat (even Zach), then I hope I'm wrong but I think they'd wipe us out in a best of 7 series. Kobe's an awesome talent but he's not gonna accomplish things that Jordan couldn't accomplish before having another hall-of-fame level player on his team.
tkf
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6/17/2007  9:38 AM
Posted by Bonn1997:
Posted by Caseloads:
Posted by islesfan:

It's too bad Isiah was too busy Starphucking all this time when he could have been collecting lottery picks since 2004. Maybe then we'd actually have players that other teams wanted to trade for.
Or we'd be a team like the bobcats that no one would want to come to.
If Kobe comes here, it will be because of the city, not the roster. We could have the Bobcats' roster and he'd probably be even more excited about coming here to play with two way players like Okafor and G Wallace.

so you think kobe would be happy having both guys on the floor for a combined 100 games, while they spend the other 64 in street clothes.... please....
Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
tkf
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6/17/2007  9:43 AM
Posted by Bonn1997:
Posted by BRIGGS:
Posted by blueNorange:

I'm on the fence with this ... I would love to have a player like Kobe but I'm not sure if I'd be willing to trade our future and our true franchise player in Lee. Also Isiah needs to keep his picks instead of trading them away because in 2 years Marbury is gone and I for one don't want to see him back.


The bottom line--the barrier to the finals in the east is one that is there for the taking now. If you are talking Kobe 28 Curry 24 we realistcially have a 5-6 year timefrmae where we WILL be perenially contenders--thats is where you want to be

I dont think the Bulls will gut their roster because if they do they have kobe and no one else.

we can give them the large package + we can throw in Randolph Morris and that leaves us standing with Marbury Kobe and Curry and they can figure it out from there.
The Bulls, Raptors, and Pistons still have better *teams* than we do. We'd just have a few stars who are known for putting themselves ahead of the team. If the Bulls add any low post threat (even Zach), then I hope I'm wrong but I think they'd wipe us out in a best of 7 series. Kobe's an awesome talent but he's not gonna accomplish things that Jordan couldn't accomplish before having another hall-of-fame level player on his team.

you are talking about kobe as if he has never won. Putting himself ahead of his team. Please cut the foolish talk. Kobe is a winner, he has 3 got damn rings, and he did that arguably as the best player on the lakers... Curry has not been known as a player that puts himself ahead of the team, where are you getting this utter BS? Marbury had that label, but has shown last year that he will defer, as he did to curry. Kobe is the best player on the frigging planet, marbs and curry are no fools, they will defer, they will get their shots, and you can fill in the team with guys like balkman, Q, mardy collins and a Free agent and roll over the east.....

[Edited by - tkf on 06-17-2007 09:44 AM]
Anyone who sits around and waits for the lottery to better themselves, either in real life or in sports, Is a Loser............... TKF
BRIGGS
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6/17/2007  10:12 AM
Posted by Bonn1997:
Posted by BRIGGS:
Posted by blueNorange:

I'm on the fence with this ... I would love to have a player like Kobe but I'm not sure if I'd be willing to trade our future and our true franchise player in Lee. Also Isiah needs to keep his picks instead of trading them away because in 2 years Marbury is gone and I for one don't want to see him back.


The bottom line--the barrier to the finals in the east is one that is there for the taking now. If you are talking Kobe 28 Curry 24 we realistcially have a 5-6 year timefrmae where we WILL be perenially contenders--thats is where you want to be

I dont think the Bulls will gut their roster because if they do they have kobe and no one else.

we can give them the large package + we can throw in Randolph Morris and that leaves us standing with Marbury Kobe and Curry and they can figure it out from there.
The Bulls, Raptors, and Pistons still have better *teams* than we do. We'd just have a few stars who are known for putting themselves ahead of the team. If the Bulls add any low post threat (even Zach), then I hope I'm wrong but I think they'd wipe us out in a best of 7 series. Kobe's an awesome talent but he's not gonna accomplish things that Jordan couldn't accomplish before having another hall-of-fame level player on his team.

If we aquired Kobe in the east to pair with Curry and Marbury we would be the best team in the east. You are talking about the best player in the gamne paired with a top 3 center and a very very good PG. Filling in the dots after that is the easy part.
RIP Crushalot😞
Bonn1997
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6/17/2007  11:09 AM
Posted by tkf:
Posted by Bonn1997:
Posted by Caseloads:
Posted by islesfan:

It's too bad Isiah was too busy Starphucking all this time when he could have been collecting lottery picks since 2004. Maybe then we'd actually have players that other teams wanted to trade for.
Or we'd be a team like the bobcats that no one would want to come to.
If Kobe comes here, it will be because of the city, not the roster. We could have the Bobcats' roster and he'd probably be even more excited about coming here to play with two way players like Okafor and G Wallace.

so you think kobe would be happy having both guys on the floor for a combined 100 games, while they spend the other 64 in street clothes.... please....

So if we had the Bobcats' roster, you think he wouldn't want to come here? He really just wants to come here because we have such an amazing roster?
tomverve
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6/17/2007  11:14 AM
Posted by BRIGGS:

If we aquired Kobe in the east to pair with Curry and Marbury we would be the best team in the east.

Again, it's not that easy. To be the best in the east we'd have to make up for the rebounding lost in the prospective Kobe trade and somehow become a good defensive team. It's not a given that those things happen.
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islesfan
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6/17/2007  11:18 AM
Posted by nixluva:
Posted by Caseloads:
Posted by islesfan:

It's too bad Isiah was too busy Starphucking all this time when he could have been collecting lottery picks since 2004. Maybe then we'd actually have players that other teams wanted to trade for.
Or we'd be a team like the bobcats that no one would want to come to.

EXACTLY! You know there's always this revisionist attitudes about what Isiah has done and yet we're still in a position to make something happen. If you've been sticking to the draft and only have youth, you don't really have anything BUT your best young studs and if you give them up then you don't really have much to win with. In our case we can absorb the loss and we STILL have enough talent to field a good team. We can add some MLE pickup and we'd be ready for war. We have assets and even if they aren't all great the fact that we are in NY, have money, don't mind giving up some young players, picks and maybe some cash, all makes our position stronger.

It's gonna be interesting to see how this all plays out. Kobe stands to make more money if he moves, due to the trade kicker and if he comes to NY i'm SURE that other revenue streams will open up for him instantly. It's the best move for him and his career. LA can't do anything for him anymore. Buss should really consider a trade to NY. We are on the East Coast so he won't have to deal with Kobe against his team, but once a year. You know we'll give up a lot of young talent and picks to get Kobe. Kobe would accept a trade here. He's not gonna get a better situation than that. You know Isiah's not gonna play hardball with him.

Isiah's not going to like hearing you question his drafting ability. So you think that if Isiah hadn't starphucked and used his lottery picks, they wouldn't be better than the Charlotte Bobcats?

BTW, the Bobcats are a lot closer to being a good team than the Knicks are, the only reason Kobe would want to come here is because it's NY and there's no chance they're getting him with the garbage that we can offer.
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VDesai
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6/17/2007  11:20 AM
Posted by tomverve:
Posted by BRIGGS:

If we aquired Kobe in the east to pair with Curry and Marbury we would be the best team in the east.

Again, it's not that easy. To be the best in the east we'd have to make up for the rebounding lost in the prospective Kobe trade and somehow become a good defensive team. It's not a given that those things happen.


You would think that by putting Balkman at SF and signing a PF like Fortson we could put something together to help that.
VDesai
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6/17/2007  11:22 AM
Anyway, when I see Lebron beat the Pistons with a hobbled Hughes, an over the hill Z and a bunch of roleplaying guys, I think we could get something done if Kobe was added to a team with Marb and Curry.
tomverve
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6/17/2007  11:24 AM
Perhaps the rebounding might be relatively easy to replace, but I dunno. The D is not going to come just by playing the Balkman more minutes. It's not necessarily a player or two we need to get better at D, but just a teamwide strategy and commitment. Look at Cleveland. They don't have any outstanding individual defenders but still manage to do it on D. So why can't the Knicks then? Good question, but it hasn't come for a while for whatever reason.

Just saying, anyone who expects a prospective Kobe trade to instantly vault us into the top of the east is going to be disappointed in the unlikely event that it goes through.
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TMS
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6/17/2007  11:31 AM
it's not about Kobe vaulting us to the top of the East instantaneously... it's about getting ourselves a legitimate franchise calibre player, something each & every one of us have wanted in NY ever since Patrick's knees gave out... after that, you build around him & take your chances... we're not on the road to a championship building with the players we have right now... we need a true superstar, & Kobe is definitely that.
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VDesai
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6/17/2007  11:33 AM
I agree about the D. That's up to the coaching and player committment. I think we'll get a little closer when the lineup has a couple guys more focused on playing defense than offense (which having Kobe in there allows you to do). It's not gonna make Eddy Curry an inside force, but theoretically we'd have fewer breakdowns without a guy like Channing Frye letting everyone go by him. And Kobe, when committed is, a worlds bettere defender than Crawford (7 time all NBA defense).
nixluva
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6/17/2007  11:42 AM
I can't believe how some of us are simply forgetting who Kobe is. If you have him and Balkman on the floor with Steph that's PLENTY of D. We'll still have Q as well and we'd be able to rebound like we always have. We didn't fall off the planet in terms of rebounding when Lee went down. We still hit the boards hard. Some of us forget that fact. Yeah Lee would've gotten a few more of those late game rebounds, but i'm POSITIVE that we can get a rebounder to put next to Curry. We already have good rebounding everywhere else.

The key to this is that we'd be an almost impossible team to STOP from scoring. Steph, Kobe and Curry is a lot of dominant scoring at each key position. Is there any doubt that Steph still has it? The guy went off on the league when he had to. Now he won't have to carry so much of the load and his input will be more impactful whenever he does get involved. Curry will be able to see so much more one on one and if they double ... well you can imagine what will happen. You think Kobe won't be able to convince Curry to pass more and to work on it in practice everyday? It's a LOCK that Curry would become a better assist man with Kobe cutting and slashing to the basket or settting up outside for a jumper.
bitty41
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6/17/2007  11:42 AM
Briggs,

I have question for you or really anyone who thinks we automatically will have the best team if Kobe comes to NY. You have Curry whose only success came when he was the vocal point of the offense. Not to mention the Knicks would lose most of their rebouding and any sort of defensive presence under the basket. Now he would essentially have to revamp himself into a center that rebounds and gets most of his scoring from putbacks and being a possible distant 2nd option on offense now would you say that Curry has been successful in those situations?

Secondly there is Marbury who has shown time and time again that he is primarily a scoring point guard. Marbury has played with Amare Stoudamire, Shawn Marion, and in his prime Keith Van Horn; Marbury had no successes playing with any of these guys but now you bring in a scorer who is probably 20 times more demanding of the ball and shots; and Marbury will become his set-up man?

Thirdly how would this Knicks team be any different than Iverson 76ers team or the high scoring Gilbert Arenas Wizards, Michael Redd Bucks, Vince Carter Nets and Paul Pierce Celtics? Now obvisously Kobe is better than all of these players but still at the end of the day your talking about high scoring guards who can only take their team to either a first round exit or no playoff appearance at all. What makes NY so much different why would they be the exception to the rule?

Finally lets take the teams around the league which I think most of us would agree are the elite teams. Are they teams that center around a scoring machine with very little involvement from his teammates or are they teams that yes have a big player on their squad but they still have strong benches and 2 or 3 other legitimate scoring options. These teams also have vetran leaders who can knock down big shots when needed. So would the Knicks fit into this category if Kobe comes to NY?
VDesai
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6/17/2007  11:52 AM
The Stephon Marbury of today takes 3-4 less shots per game than the Stephon Marbury of yesteryear, and that's without a dominant scorer on the floor. Deferring to Kobe for him will be easy, cause his confidnence in being "the man" is shot.
Bonn1997
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6/17/2007  12:17 PM
Posted by TMS:

we're not on the road to a championship building with the players we have right now.
So if we don't get Kobe, will you be disappointed with the Roster Isiah and Dolan have built?
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