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This sporting news guy kills Isiah and the Knicks. Ouch
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Bippity10
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1/18/2007  6:09 PM
as for Lampe-I've never understood how fans can be high about a player that they've NEVER SEEN PLAY!
I just hope that people will like me
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Solace
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1/18/2007  7:10 PM
Posted by Bippity10:

as for Lampe-I've never understood how fans can be high about a player that they've NEVER SEEN PLAY!

What do you mean never seen play? He played during summer league. He was very hyped up by scouts and the media. Having seen him for the bit I did, I thought he was going to be good.

Anyway, isn't the same true for Balkman? The whole board fell in love with him before they saw him play a single game. The main reason I got was, "he looks kinda like Sprewell". I found it almost embarassing.
Wishing everyone well. I enjoyed posting here for a while, but as I matured I realized this forum isn't for me. We all evolve. Thanks for the memories everyone.
nyk4ever
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1/18/2007  7:11 PM
Posted by Solace:
Posted by Bippity10:

as for Lampe-I've never understood how fans can be high about a player that they've NEVER SEEN PLAY!

What do you mean never seen play? He played during summer league. He was very hyped up by scouts and the media. Having seen him for the bit I did, I thought he was going to be good.

Anyway, isn't the same true for Balkman? The whole board fell in love with him before they saw him play a single game. The main reason I got was, "he looks kinda like Sprewell". I found it almost embarassing.

He played in summer league AFTER he was drafted. Bip means fans wanted Lampe before the Knicks even drafted and thats when they'd never seen him play.
"OMG - did we just go on a two-trade-wining-streak?" -SupremeCommander
Solace
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1/18/2007  7:14 PM
Posted by nyk4ever:
Posted by Solace:
Posted by Bippity10:

as for Lampe-I've never understood how fans can be high about a player that they've NEVER SEEN PLAY!

What do you mean never seen play? He played during summer league. He was very hyped up by scouts and the media. Having seen him for the bit I did, I thought he was going to be good.

Anyway, isn't the same true for Balkman? The whole board fell in love with him before they saw him play a single game. The main reason I got was, "he looks kinda like Sprewell". I found it almost embarassing.

He played in summer league AFTER he was drafted. Bip means fans wanted Lampe before the Knicks even drafted and thats when they'd never seen him play.

People loved Balkman BEFORE summer league. That mystified me. Oh Isiah said he's like Rodman, WHOA!!!

As for Lampe, there were also a LOT of clips of him being sent around before the draft. I was high on him because the scouts were so high on him. Miami considered taking him at #5 in an extremely deep draft. They may have, had the untrue fiasco about his European team not allowing him out of contract not happened on the DAY of the draft.
Wishing everyone well. I enjoyed posting here for a while, but as I matured I realized this forum isn't for me. We all evolve. Thanks for the memories everyone.
gunsnewing
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1/18/2007  7:22 PM
good thing they took Wade for their sake lol
buddapaw
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1/18/2007  10:04 PM
Posted by Solace:
Posted by buddapaw:

Layden passed on Artest and Amare enuff said

Isiah passed on Bynum, and Marcus Williams. Enuff said.

See the double standard yet?

Bynum and Marcus Williams puhleeze!!!
"Low Percentage Shots r US, these are our Knicks" "NY KNICKS the cure for basketball fanatic"
Solace
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1/18/2007  10:19 PM
Posted by buddapaw:
Posted by Solace:
Posted by buddapaw:

Layden passed on Artest and Amare enuff said

Isiah passed on Bynum, and Marcus Williams. Enuff said.

See the double standard yet?

Bynum and Marcus Williams puhleeze!!!

Thanks for proving my point about the double standard. I appreciate your help in illustrating it so clearly.
Wishing everyone well. I enjoyed posting here for a while, but as I matured I realized this forum isn't for me. We all evolve. Thanks for the memories everyone.
buddapaw
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1/18/2007  11:16 PM
Posted by Solace:
Posted by buddapaw:
Posted by Solace:
Posted by buddapaw:

Layden passed on Artest and Amare enuff said

Isiah passed on Bynum, and Marcus Williams. Enuff said.

See the double standard yet?

Bynum and Marcus Williams puhleeze!!!

Thanks for proving my point about the double standard. I appreciate your help in illustrating it so clearly.

C'mon Amare and Artest are proven commodities, can you say the same about Bynum and Williams? What have they done so far? I call a spade a spade my friend. Double standard? where. Your main points are that Layden bringing in good players like Weatherspoon, Van Horn, Mutombo. Yeah I with you there sheesh
"Low Percentage Shots r US, these are our Knicks" "NY KNICKS the cure for basketball fanatic"
GKFv2
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1/18/2007  11:26 PM
The guy is a dick but he makes some good points. as long as Dolan is around we will always stink and I've stted this on other forums. I have gone on long rants and arguments with others who insist Dolan is good for the team because he provides money. Money doesn't buy championships. Smart management does. Knicks don't have that.
Thank you, Rick Brunson.
Nalod
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1/18/2007  11:30 PM
Nedyal rules!

Layden sucked, Isiah sucks, sterling sucked, Ernie is overrated, Eddie Donovan rules, Debussre was our lucky charm, Willis sucked, Bianchi was a disaster and checketts at least knew how to spend and starphuch decently.

Best GM ever was Aurbach.
holfresh
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1/18/2007  11:45 PM
His claim of cablevision stock fell from $80.00 to $10.00 is true. But this drop happened to about 99 percent of tech & communications stock about the same period. He also chose to omit the stock rose from about $8.00 to $85.00 splitting a few times along the way..
Bippity10
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1/19/2007  6:37 AM
Posted by Solace:
Posted by nyk4ever:
Posted by Solace:
Posted by Bippity10:

as for Lampe-I've never understood how fans can be high about a player that they've NEVER SEEN PLAY!

What do you mean never seen play? He played during summer league. He was very hyped up by scouts and the media. Having seen him for the bit I did, I thought he was going to be good.

Anyway, isn't the same true for Balkman? The whole board fell in love with him before they saw him play a single game. The main reason I got was, "he looks kinda like Sprewell". I found it almost embarassing.

He played in summer league AFTER he was drafted. Bip means fans wanted Lampe before the Knicks even drafted and thats when they'd never seen him play.

People loved Balkman BEFORE summer league. That mystified me. Oh Isiah said he's like Rodman, WHOA!!!

As for Lampe, there were also a LOT of clips of him being sent around before the draft. I was high on him because the scouts were so high on him. Miami considered taking him at #5 in an extremely deep draft. They may have, had the untrue fiasco about his European team not allowing him out of contract not happened on the DAY of the draft.


I agree Solace. I thought that was silly too.
I just hope that people will like me
Solace
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1/19/2007  7:44 AM
Posted by buddapaw:
Posted by Solace:
Posted by buddapaw:
Posted by Solace:
Posted by buddapaw:

Layden passed on Artest and Amare enuff said

Isiah passed on Bynum, and Marcus Williams. Enuff said.

See the double standard yet?

Bynum and Marcus Williams puhleeze!!!

Thanks for proving my point about the double standard. I appreciate your help in illustrating it so clearly.

C'mon Amare and Artest are proven commodities, can you say the same about Bynum and Williams? What have they done so far? I call a spade a spade my friend. Double standard? where. Your main points are that Layden bringing in good players like Weatherspoon, Van Horn, Mutombo. Yeah I with you there sheesh

We've had four or five years to evaluate every move Layden made. We have not had as long to fully reflect on the damage of Isiah's mistakes. In 2002, 2003, people felt VERY differently about Layden's draft picks. That's all I'm saying.

[Edited by - Solace on Jan 19 2007 07:44 AM]
Wishing everyone well. I enjoyed posting here for a while, but as I matured I realized this forum isn't for me. We all evolve. Thanks for the memories everyone.
Bippity10
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1/19/2007  8:09 AM
Solace dont' fall prey to the pre-draft clips. I have a highlite film of my high school play that would make you think I was going to be the next great superstar. You really have to see a player play before you can have any evaluation. The rest is just guessing and hope as a fan.

That's why you never see me comment on any player in teh draft that is not a Uconn player.
I just hope that people will like me
fishmike
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1/19/2007  8:13 AM
Posted by buddapaw:



C'mon Amare and Artest are proven commodities, can you say the same about Bynum and Williams? What have they done so far? I call a spade a spade my friend. Double standard? where. Your main points are that Layden bringing in good players like Weatherspoon, Van Horn, Mutombo. Yeah I with you there sheesh
if your calling a spade a spade what have Curry, Crawford, Francis, Marbury, Jerome, JJSkinny or anyone else Isiah has brought in done in this league?

"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
bigbeast
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1/19/2007  8:16 AM
Posted by Solace:
Posted by nyk4ever:
Posted by Solace:
Posted by Bippity10:

as for Lampe-I've never understood how fans can be high about a player that they've NEVER SEEN PLAY!

What do you mean never seen play? He played during summer league. He was very hyped up by scouts and the media. Having seen him for the bit I did, I thought he was going to be good.

Anyway, isn't the same true for Balkman? The whole board fell in love with him before they saw him play a single game. The main reason I got was, "he looks kinda like Sprewell". I found it almost embarassing.

He played in summer league AFTER he was drafted. Bip means fans wanted Lampe before the Knicks even drafted and thats when they'd never seen him play.

People loved Balkman BEFORE summer league. That mystified me. Oh Isiah said he's like Rodman, WHOA!!!

As for Lampe, there were also a LOT of clips of him being sent around before the draft. I was high on him because the scouts were so high on him. Miami considered taking him at #5 in an extremely deep draft. They may have, had the untrue fiasco about his European team not allowing him out of contract not happened on the DAY of the draft.

Maybe I was looking at a different board, but from what I remember, 3/4 of this board was ripping Isiah to shreds for not taking Williams. Some people calmed down a little after they saw Balkman in summer league and begrudgingly tried to justify the pick by saying that Balkman was the type of hustle player we needed.
"Man, who knows with this team." Aguirre.
Solace
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1/19/2007  8:20 AM
Posted by Bippity10:

Solace dont' fall prey to the pre-draft clips. I have a highlite film of my high school play that would make you think I was going to be the next great superstar. You really have to see a player play before you can have any evaluation. The rest is just guessing and hope as a fan.

That's why you never see me comment on any player in teh draft that is not a Uconn player.

Sure. Like I said, the hype was based on what the scouts saw, same as Darko. Were they wrong? Maybe, but were so many people wrong? I honestly think, that had the "Lampe won't be able to sign" draft day fiasco not happened that he goes either #5 to Miami or #9 to us, instead of #30 to us. Him falling to 30, years later, was turned into "he was never that good", when in fact, he fell because of potential Euro contract issues.

Anyway, to tie it back in, there are two main points: 1) We've had four or five years to evaluate the results of Layden's picks, while Isiah's we've had almost no time and have already declared every Isiah pick a success. We declared all of Layden's picks a success and look how that turned out. 2) Isiah, the GM, is a different spot than Layden the GM. Layden the GM had one mandate: "playoffs". His coaches were given one mandate: "playoffs". The kids did not get much opportunity, and opportunity is necessary for success. Layden's coaches never got to do much with the kids, and their jobs were always on the line. Isiah's coaches were allowed to play the kids, but their jobs were also on the line. Finally, Isiah the coach and GM, suddenly the kids are allowed to play, the coach finally gets support from GM and ownership. This is something that has not happened in years, and now we see a few of the kids flourishing. Is it unreasonable to say that under similar circumstances, the Lampes, etc... of the world wouldn't have a better shot at developing too? They never got that chance.

One of the big misconceptions is that good players can work in every scenario. It's true for some players, but for many, no. Look at Marbury. He plays like complete garbage when we have five guards in the backcourt that all need minutes. Then a few of them get suspended, and Marbury starts playing like a star again. Could it be that the right opportunity plus talent is the real combination to showing something in this league? Also, when talking about Lampe, he's still a kid, and the door isn't closed for him to bust out. I hope he does.

To wrap up, Isiah the GM stinks, just like Layden the GM stinks. The only reason Isiah the GM is looking good at all, is because Isiah the coach has full support from Isiah the GM, which is something a Knicks coach hasn't had in 10 years.
Wishing everyone well. I enjoyed posting here for a while, but as I matured I realized this forum isn't for me. We all evolve. Thanks for the memories everyone.
misterearl
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1/19/2007  8:22 AM
Solace - did you really say Clarence Weatherspoon was a good acquisition?

And just a reminder how bad Layden was as a GM, Shandon Anderson still counts against the Knicks cap this year


But, before fish.mike jumps me, "It ain't my money"
once a knick always a knick
misterearl
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1/19/2007  8:25 AM
Solace - who is your model NBA General Manager?
once a knick always a knick
Solace
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1/19/2007  8:26 AM
Posted by misterearl:

Solace - did you really say Clarence Weatherspoon was a good acquisition?

And just a reminder how bad Layden was as a GM, Shandon Anderson still counts against the Knicks cap this year

But, before fish.mike jumps me, "It ain't my money"

I think Spoon was a good acquisition, yes. He's a great sixth or seventh man to have off the bench, almost never gets injured, plays hard, and rebounds in a way that a guy his size shouldn't be able to.

The problem with Spoon was that our other PF was Othella Harrington, with Kurt Thomas playing center and McDyess injured.... and that just isn't going to cut it. Spoon is a nice piece to have in the right situation.

The Anderson trade was TERRIBLE. Eisley and Anderson, what was he thinking, both having just gotten huge extensions. That single move was worse than any single move Isiah made, I can't deny that. Though, the fact of the matter is that we did trade away four years of Glen Rice who could barely walk, let alone shoot (which still doesn't justify the trade), and Anderson was a good player to have coming off the bench. I'd take him over Jared Jeffries any day of the week. Eisley was a nice backup too. But they should've each been making $2 - $3 mm a year for 3 years, not $6-$8 mm a year for 6. That was absurd.
Wishing everyone well. I enjoyed posting here for a while, but as I matured I realized this forum isn't for me. We all evolve. Thanks for the memories everyone.
This sporting news guy kills Isiah and the Knicks. Ouch

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