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Treatment of David Lee


Author Poll
islesfan
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Which coach did the following to David Lee: - Jerked his minutes around - Pulled him in and out of the starting lineup - Took away his starting spot despite clearly outplaying the player who replaced him - Badmouthed his game to the media, saying that he has no offensive game to speak of
Larry Brown
Isiah Thomas
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Author Thread
holfresh
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1/2/2007  3:10 PM
Posted by MS:

Reggie Evans?

What can Reggie Evans do that David Lee can't?

AUTOADVERT
nyk4ever
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1/2/2007  3:12 PM
Posted by holfresh:
Posted by MS:

Reggie Evans?

What can Reggie Evans do that David Lee can't?


So we're only allowed 1 rebounder?
"OMG - did we just go on a two-trade-wining-streak?" -SupremeCommander
holfresh
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1/2/2007  3:13 PM
Posted by Andrew:

DeSagana Diop instead of JJ

Yeah you could say that..Eveyone would be a great GM with the gift of hindsight...Diop stunk and still stinks...You would have killed Isiah for signing a guy that avg 1 pts 2 rebs a game...



simrud
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1/2/2007  3:13 PM
Regardless of David Lee,, but none of our guards outside of Q are actually shooting guards. Getting one considering how injury prone Q is would have been a good idea.

We have a lot of combo boards/point guards, not one of them a shooting guard, either because they are too small or can't shoot.

JR Smith would have been nice, and so would have been Bell. I don't think he would come here over Suns though. But I'm sure we could have gotten some kind of decent SG as opposed to having none outside of Q.

This team is just built very badly. A lot of redundancies while needs are not filled. We really should trade away some people to fill those needs. But now IT has a no trade leash on him by Dolan who wants to see if IT's current group of "his" players even has any potential.

So the situatation is about as bad as it can get.
A glimmer of hope maybe?!?
holfresh
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1/2/2007  3:15 PM
Posted by nyk4ever:
Posted by holfresh:
Posted by MS:

Reggie Evans?

What can Reggie Evans do that David Lee can't?


So we're only allowed 1 rebounder?

Yes especially when they can't shoot...look at the issues we are having now with Lee and JJ in the lineup together...Weren't you the one creaming for Jeffries...Did you have a change of heart???

I hated the signing and said so many times...now you are trying to tag me with it...



[Edited by - holfresh on 01-02-2007 3:20 PM]
Andrew
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1/2/2007  3:16 PM
Posted by holfresh:


Yeah you could say that..Eveyone would be a great GM with the gift of hindsight...Diop stunk and still stinks...You would have killed Isiah for signing a guy that avg 1 pts 2 rebs a game...

If he signed him for the full MLE I would....but that was not what he was signed for.

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holfresh
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1/2/2007  3:17 PM
Posted by simrud:

Regardless of David Lee,, but none of our guards outside of Q are actually shooting guards. Getting one considering how injury prone Q is would have been a good idea.

We have a lot of combo boards/point guards, not one of them a shooting guard, either because they are too small or can't shoot.

JR Smith would have been nice, and so would have been Bell. I don't think he would come here over Suns though. But I'm sure we could have gotten some kind of decent SG as opposed to having none outside of Q.

This team is just built very badly. A lot of redundancies while needs are not filled. We really should trade away some people to fill those needs. But now IT has a no trade leash on him by Dolan who wants to see if IT's current group of "his" players even has any potential.

So the situatation is about as bad as it can get.

You just can't say we should have got a guy who could shoot...What is his name and was he available...like people say we need a shot blocker who can rebound...Where is he and who is he?

nyk4ever
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1/2/2007  3:19 PM
Posted by holfresh:



Yes especially when they can't shoot...look at the issues we are having now with Lee and JJ in the lineup together...Weren't you the one creaming for Jeffries...Did you have a change of heart???




A little, but not really. When I said I wanted Jeffries, my plan was for him to be used off the bench and give the team about 22 minutes a game. In no way would I or did I want Jeffries starting for this basketball team. My plan was Jeffries to be the 5th man on offense and be the #1 man on defense and so far Isiah is using Jeffries in all the wrong situations. He's playing him in lineups with Balkman, Lee and Malik and that is where Jeffries flaws become more than evident. A guy like Jeffries is a role player and he can be a good one if used properly, which isn't happening right now.
"OMG - did we just go on a two-trade-wining-streak?" -SupremeCommander
simrud
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1/2/2007  3:22 PM
Holfresh, I mentioned JR Smith, I believe he could have been had. We could have made a play for Raja Bell. Matt Carrol comes to mind, at least as a guy of the bench. There are many guys. It is not my job to scout the league for shooters. I'm sure IT is aware of more shooters that were available than me. That is his damn job. Too bad he sucks at it.
A glimmer of hope maybe?!?
holfresh
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1/2/2007  3:23 PM
Posted by nyk4ever:
Posted by holfresh:



Yes especially when they can't shoot...look at the issues we are having now with Lee and JJ in the lineup together...Weren't you the one creaming for Jeffries...Did you have a change of heart???




A little, but not really. When I said I wanted Jeffries, my plan was for him to be used off the bench and give the team about 22 minutes a game. In no way would I or did I want Jeffries starting for this basketball team. My plan was Jeffries to be the 5th man on offense and be the #1 man on defense and so far Isiah is using Jeffries in all the wrong situations. He's playing him in lineups with Balkman, Lee and Malik and that is where Jeffries flaws become more than evident. A guy like Jeffries is a role player and he can be a good one if used properly, which isn't happening right now.

Bro anyway you slice it..Jeffries is not the stopper people think he is...He plays hard and is good in certain situations...Like on Rip for the last shot of the game because he is long and can stay up with him not because he is a lock down player...

Allanfan20
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1/2/2007  3:23 PM
nyk4ever is hitting it on the head. Isiah is acting as if Jefferies is the savior of the franchise, when in fact, he's a defensive specialist who can do a few other things, but not really that good at them. If he's in a lineup with a balanced rotation, then he's perfect. If he's relied on to be our leader on both ends, then we're screwed and setting ourselves up for dissapointment. Isiah tried convincing us that he's a good offensive player, when in fact he isn't.
“Whenever I’m about to do something, I think ‘Would an idiot do that?’ and if they would, I do NOT do that thing.”- Dwight Schrute
bigbeast
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1/2/2007  3:28 PM
Posted by Allanfan20:

nyk4ever is hitting it on the head. Isiah is acting as if Jefferies is the savior of the franchise, when in fact, he's a defensive specialist who can do a few other things, but not really that good at them. If he's in a lineup with a balanced rotation, then he's perfect. If he's relied on to be our leader on both ends, then we're screwed and setting ourselves up for dissapointment. Isiah tried convincing us that he's a good offensive player, when in fact he isn't.
Jeffries starts with 4 offensive players which is supposed to balance out the lineup. When was Jeffries ever asked to be the leader onthe offensive end? He played one 5-7 minute segment with Malik, Balk and Lee against the clips and you act like he plays with unit all the time.

"Man, who knows with this team." Aguirre.
holfresh
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1/2/2007  3:31 PM
Posted by Allanfan20:

nyk4ever is hitting it on the head. Isiah is acting as if Jefferies is the savior of the franchise, when in fact, he's a defensive specialist who can do a few other things, but not really that good at them. If he's in a lineup with a balanced rotation, then he's perfect. If he's relied on to be our leader on both ends, then we're screwed and setting ourselves up for dissapointment. Isiah tried convincing us that he's a good offensive player, when in fact he isn't.

When did Isiah ever push the offensive Jeffries on us...He thought he would have been a good fit at the 3 with all the offense we have in the starting lineup....The problem comes up when you play him with Lee and Balkman because they are not that good offensively...

izybx
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1/2/2007  3:37 PM
Posted by bigbeast:
Posted by Allanfan20:

nyk4ever is hitting it on the head. Isiah is acting as if Jefferies is the savior of the franchise, when in fact, he's a defensive specialist who can do a few other things, but not really that good at them. If he's in a lineup with a balanced rotation, then he's perfect. If he's relied on to be our leader on both ends, then we're screwed and setting ourselves up for dissapointment. Isiah tried convincing us that he's a good offensive player, when in fact he isn't.
Jeffries starts with 4 offensive players which is supposed to balance out the lineup. When was Jeffries ever asked to be the leader onthe offensive end? He played one 5-7 minute segment with Malik, Balk and Lee against the clips and you act like he plays with unit all the time.

That was one 5-7 minute stretch that should have never happened...what kind of coach puts that lineup on the floor when the its obvious to any idiot that the knicks were having most of their problems on offense?!?!? And as any fan of this team knows, when the Knicks are not playing well on offense they lose all steam and desire to play Defense. I just dont understand what he was thinking, the Knicks are floundering on offense and hes like, "okay theyre taking away Curry and we have no shhoters on the floor, I need to put in Renaldo and JJ to hit some jumpshots...and while im at it, ill put in Lee...wait, screw Lee make that Malik."

WHAT AN IDIOT ISIAH HAS BEEN

Beat the Evil Empire. BEAT MIAMI
izybx
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1/2/2007  3:38 PM
btw big beast, i wasnt trying to imply that you are an idiot or not a fan...just reading what i wrote and i see it might come across the wrong way
Beat the Evil Empire. BEAT MIAMI
holfresh
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1/2/2007  3:43 PM
Posted by nyk4ever:
Posted by holfresh:



Yes especially when they can't shoot...look at the issues we are having now with Lee and JJ in the lineup together...Weren't you the one creaming for Jeffries...Did you have a change of heart???




A little, but not really. When I said I wanted Jeffries, my plan was for him to be used off the bench and give the team about 22 minutes a game. In no way would I or did I want Jeffries starting for this basketball team. My plan was Jeffries to be the 5th man on offense and be the #1 man on defense and so far Isiah is using Jeffries in all the wrong situations. He's playing him in lineups with Balkman, Lee and Malik and that is where Jeffries flaws become more than evident. A guy like Jeffries is a role player and he can be a good one if used properly, which isn't happening right now.

In all you post previous to the west coast trip you said JJ should start along with Lee...U just can't have it both ways....So now he should come off the bench...


bigbeast
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1/2/2007  3:47 PM
Posted by izybx:
Posted by bigbeast:
Posted by Allanfan20:

nyk4ever is hitting it on the head. Isiah is acting as if Jefferies is the savior of the franchise, when in fact, he's a defensive specialist who can do a few other things, but not really that good at them. If he's in a lineup with a balanced rotation, then he's perfect. If he's relied on to be our leader on both ends, then we're screwed and setting ourselves up for dissapointment. Isiah tried convincing us that he's a good offensive player, when in fact he isn't.
Jeffries starts with 4 offensive players which is supposed to balance out the lineup. When was Jeffries ever asked to be the leader onthe offensive end? He played one 5-7 minute segment with Malik, Balk and Lee against the clips and you act like he plays with unit all the time.

That was one 5-7 minute stretch that should have never happened...what kind of coach puts that lineup on the floor when the its obvious to any idiot that the knicks were having most of their problems on offense?!?!? And as any fan of this team knows, when the Knicks are not playing well on offense they lose all steam and desire to play Defense. I just dont understand what he was thinking, the Knicks are floundering on offense and hes like, "okay theyre taking away Curry and we have no shhoters on the floor, I need to put in Renaldo and JJ to hit some jumpshots...and while im at it, ill put in Lee...wait, screw Lee make that Malik."

WHAT AN IDIOT ISIAH HAS BEEN

I feel what you are saying about the lineup, but keep in mind, Brand was torching us in the first quarter. Almost got his seasons average in the first 12 minutes of the game. Frye and Lee had no answers for Brand so he tried Malik who actually did about as well as anyone could expect him to do.

As far as Balk, Jeff, and Malik being on the floor at the same time, its hard to defend that move. I'm guessing he was hoping those energy players might turn up the defensive intensisty and create turnovers and cause havoc. But to be fair, the offensive players wasn't doind a damn thing in that game either. Craw was 2-8 with 6 turnovers. Frye was off. Curry got the ball thrown back into his face how many times? Marb was way off. Like Isiah said, in that particular game he was juggling the lineup trying to see what might work.
"Man, who knows with this team." Aguirre.
nyk4ever
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1/2/2007  3:51 PM
Posted by holfresh:
Posted by nyk4ever:
Posted by holfresh:



Yes especially when they can't shoot...look at the issues we are having now with Lee and JJ in the lineup together...Weren't you the one creaming for Jeffries...Did you have a change of heart???




A little, but not really. When I said I wanted Jeffries, my plan was for him to be used off the bench and give the team about 22 minutes a game. In no way would I or did I want Jeffries starting for this basketball team. My plan was Jeffries to be the 5th man on offense and be the #1 man on defense and so far Isiah is using Jeffries in all the wrong situations. He's playing him in lineups with Balkman, Lee and Malik and that is where Jeffries flaws become more than evident. A guy like Jeffries is a role player and he can be a good one if used properly, which isn't happening right now.

In all you post previous to the west coast trip you said JJ should start along with Lee...U just can't have it both ways....So now he should come off the bench...



Yeah because Jeffries HAS TO START NOW, who else is going to play SF while QRich is hurt?

Also, I don't recall ever calling for Jeffries to start, I know I called for Lee to start though.


[Edited by - nyk4ever on 01-02-2007 3:53 PM]
"OMG - did we just go on a two-trade-wining-streak?" -SupremeCommander
newyorknewyork
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1/2/2007  4:07 PM
David Lee 2005-2006 16.48mins per game, 67games out of 82.

David Lee 2006-2007 30.00mins per game, 33games out of 33.

Another observation. When Brown left Lee for dead on the bench. You same most Anti Isiah posters defended Brown for it. Not because Brown was right just because to you Brown can't do no wrong. But yet Isiah close to doubles his mins and plays him every game. And your critiquing Isiah's treatment of Lee.

While I agree that Lee should start, and should get 30+ mins per game. So don't think im changing my tune on Lee because Isiah is now the coach like you guys do. But why was Brown right for leaving Lee for dead on the bench with 16.48mins per game.(mostly garbage time since we got blown out so much last season) & 15 DNPs when he was clearly better than the other options other than Frye. But Isiah is wrong for not playing him 30+mins and not starting him.
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islesfan
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1/2/2007  4:18 PM
Posted by newyorknewyork:

David Lee 2005-2006 16.48mins per game, 67games out of 82.

David Lee 2006-2007 30.00mins per game, 33games out of 33.

Another observation. When Brown left Lee for dead on the bench. You same most Anti Isiah posters defended Brown for it. Not because Brown was right just because to you Brown can't do no wrong. But yet Isiah close to doubles his mins and plays him every game. And your critiquing Isiah's treatment of Lee.

While I agree that Lee should start, and should get 30+ mins per game. So don't think im changing my tune on Lee because Isiah is now the coach like you guys do. But why was Brown right for leaving Lee for dead on the bench with 16.48mins per game.(mostly garbage time since we got blown out so much last season) & 15 DNPs when he was clearly better than the other options other than Frye. But Isiah is wrong for not playing him 30+mins and not starting him.

Umm you do realize that 2005-2006 was David Lee's rookie year as the 30th pick of the draft, right?

Do you honestly want to compare a rookie coming in looking to earn his PT on a veteran team to a second year player who has proved that he deserves minutes? Yeah, that's really the same thing.
If it didn’t work in Phoenix with Nash and Stoutamire... it’s just not a winning formula. It’s an entertaining formula, but not a winning one. - Derek Harper talking about D'Antoni's System
Treatment of David Lee

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