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What if we need a new coach?
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Bippity10
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9/13/2006  11:18 AM
Posted by BlueSeats:

Don't worry, if we win 37 games this year no one will be able to hate on Steph, Isiah or Dolan anymore.

At last mediocrity will be ours!!!

I know, we will be right back to where we started from 2.5 years ago. 37 wins and dreaming of being one player/coach away from a championship. Praying our management holds onto youth and draft picks instead of losing them in "blockbuster" starphuchs(Nalod). Calling anyone who points out a flaw a pessimist all the while dreaming of the next season when our 50 win talent wins 40 games.

We must be honest with ourselves and make changes where changes are needed. Focusing on the amount of games we win this year is silly. Thinking that we have acheived if we win 37-42 games is also silly. Achievement is when this management team focuses on whats important. Making players understand that they win games, and that it is THEIR responsibility to play as a team. And if they can't, they will be jettisoned. Seeing our overabundance of ballhandling talent and realizing that even though we love them all, that we are better of as Knicks in trading or dumping some of them for lesser talent that fits. Watching the examples of other successful teams(including our Olympic team) and noticing how they are building teams. Using role players and taking the leadership out of the hands of rebellious players and giving it to guys that are focused on one thing: Winning!!! Building a team that will play hard every night. They may not play well, but they will play hard every night without excuses. Bust their ballz regardless of the role that they are thrust into. That' progress. 37 wins, 40 wins, 42 wins just puts us back to the level of mediocrity that we seem to view as success.
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nixluva
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9/13/2006  11:47 AM
Posted by Bippity10:

As for Marbs and his style of play. Anyone that is arguing with me over this is creating an argument where there is none. I have no problem with Marbs having problems with the system. I agree that Marbs works better with the ball in his hands. But what Marbs has to learn that when this does not occur he can't lead a rebellion against the system because others will follow.

If we say it's okay for Marbs to rebel when a coach doesn't put a ball in his hands you are forgetting the team we have. Marbs will have the ball in his hands 35-40 minutes. Steve Francis, Jamal Crawford, Nate Robinson and Jalen Rose are all contributors that want the ball too. Someone is not going to have it. When they don't have it we can't say it's okay to rebel. Someone in that group has to bite the bullet and play a role that they are not used to. Let's say Isiah decides the offense flows better when Jamal has the ball. Or when Stevie has the ball the majority of the time. Does this mean that it's okay for Steph to rebel? Of course not.

This is the complaint that people have with the roster. We have a team of 5 or 6(if you add curry) that want the ball. What happens if Frye turns into a go to guy and our best offense is to go to him 20 times a game. They can't all have the ball. They must therefore adjust to roles they aren't comfortable with no matter who is coach. If they can't adjust it may mean that we need a different mix. If they adjust and it constantly results in 35-43 wins than guess what? We may need a new mix. That's called building a champion.

[Edited by - bippity10 on 09-13-2006 10:34 AM]

Its funny how some want to characterizes Steph as leading a rebellion. Tell me what he did to make LB use a million different lineups to start the year? Why did LB refuse to use the kids who showed that they gave us a better chance to win? Was that due to Steph's rebellion? The team was losing long before Steph would've had a chance to effect anyone's atttitude towards LB. LB ticked off players all on his own. He didn't need any help in that dept. Just ask Ariza and Mo.

Its also funny that many people think Steph isn't liked by his teammates, yet he had enough influence to get them to mutiny against the coach. Which one is it? Do Steph's teammates blindly follow his lead or do they dislike him?

Instead of bashing Steph we need to recognize that he's still the best player on this team and he should be supported by the team. Especially the coach. This wasn't Detroit where you had a whole bunch of guys who could be depended on to hold down their position. On this team Steph was our most dependable performer. Unlike a Pat Riley who can recognize what he has to do with different rosters and adjust, LB didn't want to do that or couldn't. In any event what he was looking to do wasn't best for this roster. In fact it may have been the worst thing to try and do with this roster.

For an example look at the Suns. They dropped off in production quite considerably when Nash wasn't in there, perhaps not as much now as they did the year before. Still you could clearly see that they didn't have a lot of good decision makers other than him. If you took the ball out of his hands more that wouldn't help that team. Sometimes Nash dribbles around the floor endlessly until he finds a teammate open or simply takes the shot himself. It wouldn't benefit that team to take the ball out of his hands. A coach has to trust that he's gonna make the right play. The good thing is that Nash has dependable finishers and shooters on the team. Mike D'Antoni is making the most of his roster. Which is what I don't think that LB did here. Now we all know that Steph doesn't play like Nash. He's primarily a scorer that looks to soften up the D and then when they pay more attention to him, he can hit the open man. Its a different approach but it can be effective as he showed during the good stretch of games we had last year.

Isiah has a plan and I think he's gonna be the right coach for this team. I don't see us needing another coach and then starting all over AGAIN! He's picked players that fit into his philosophy and I think he's gonna know what to do with these players.
Bippity10
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9/13/2006  12:57 PM
nixluva you have to understand the team dynamic. Steph is our leader. If he rebels at all others will follow. When you are the leader you have to be able to bite your tongue even when in a situation that sucks. This is why Colonels and Majors and Captains in the military don't complain in front of their men. They hate war as much as the next guy but when you are the leader you can't have others see you sweat. That's leadership. And as a leader I'm sure you know this.

LB as the coach/leader and Marbs as player/leader both went to the press. Both started and helped to continue the demise of our season. Noone on our roster had the leadership ability to stand up and quell the madness. Thus the rest of our TEAM helped to start and continue the demise of the season. Management did nothing to stop it. This was a team malfunction. Nobody stepped to the plate to stop anything. The entire team failed. A small blow-up was therefore allowed to explode and lead to team collapse. It was a TEAM COLLAPSE. Everyone was responsible. How is anyone excusing any of them. It's so customary with the Knicks to point out one guy and not even realize that not one person on this roster stepped up to the plate. THEY ALL CONTRIBUTED TO ONE OF THE WORST SEASONS IN OUR HISTORY, IF NOT THE WORST.

Nixluva for a guy that loves the Knicks team so much, you seem to want to narrow it down to one guy more than alot. I don't care about the old Marbs/Nash comparisons. NOne of that crap matters. I don't care about LB or Isiah or anyone else in the context of this conversation. What matters is that Marbs did not do his part to uplift the team last year. He contributed to the malaise just like everyone else. I'm sick of hearing excuses for him.
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Bippity10
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9/13/2006  1:02 PM
Posted by nixluva:
Posted by Bippity10:

As for Marbs and his style of play. Anyone that is arguing with me over this is creating an argument where there is none. I have no problem with Marbs having problems with the system. I agree that Marbs works better with the ball in his hands. But what Marbs has to learn that when this does not occur he can't lead a rebellion against the system because others will follow.

If we say it's okay for Marbs to rebel when a coach doesn't put a ball in his hands you are forgetting the team we have. Marbs will have the ball in his hands 35-40 minutes. Steve Francis, Jamal Crawford, Nate Robinson and Jalen Rose are all contributors that want the ball too. Someone is not going to have it. When they don't have it we can't say it's okay to rebel. Someone in that group has to bite the bullet and play a role that they are not used to. Let's say Isiah decides the offense flows better when Jamal has the ball. Or when Stevie has the ball the majority of the time. Does this mean that it's okay for Steph to rebel? Of course not.

This is the complaint that people have with the roster. We have a team of 5 or 6(if you add curry) that want the ball. What happens if Frye turns into a go to guy and our best offense is to go to him 20 times a game. They can't all have the ball. They must therefore adjust to roles they aren't comfortable with no matter who is coach. If they can't adjust it may mean that we need a different mix. If they adjust and it constantly results in 35-43 wins than guess what? We may need a new mix. That's called building a champion.

[Edited by - bippity10 on 09-13-2006 10:34 AM]

Its also funny that many people think Steph isn't liked by his teammates, yet he had enough influence to get them to mutiny against the coach. Which one is it? Do Steph's teammates blindly follow his lead or do they dislike him?


It's funny how people use other people's opinions to explain MY INCONSISTENCIES. I have never once joined into the his teammates hate him arguments because I do not try to pretend I know what's going on in the locker room. Please, when you respond to my post limit it to MY ARGUMENT. Once again, I am not bashing Steph anymore than I am bashing LB or Isiah or nate or anyone else. I am pointing out things that we need to improve on so that we can get out of this malaise of mediocrity. I think it's as fair to say that Marbs has to improve his leadership skills as it is to say I think he's a great player. But in your world if I say one bad thing about him that means I'm bashing him. I call it the way I see it. Our players have good and bad things about them. Marbs has been here through 33 wins and 23 wins. There are definitely things he can improve upon. Talent is not one of them.



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nixluva
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9/13/2006  2:01 PM
The thing is Bippity, that this team has been in a continual retooling process during Steph's time here. Its never been a stable situation where you could really evaluate him as a player or leader. The team has been so flawed over the last 2.5 seasons, so how can you really say what Steph should've been able to accomplish. I think last year should've been about making a start in the right direction. It wasn't too much to ask for this team to begin to form a base to start from. I think that we have players who WANTED to do the right thing and WANTED to be part of a winning team. I don't think LB created an atmosphere where that could happen. EVERY Coach knows that you have to gain the trust and support of your best player. If that's the case WHAT THE HELL WAS LB DOING? It just ran counter to everything that we know about the Coach and Star Player relationship.

By all rights, last year should've been a stepping stone towards our goals. We weren't expecting a finals teams last year, so as long as the young players showed good progress and the team started to form an identity, that would've made last year a success. You're right! 23 wins is EVERYONE doing wrong, however if the team had gone on to win 6-10 more wins than the year before, the majority of the praise would've gone to LB, so why can't he get the blame for winning 10 games less than the year before? Just as its Isiah's neck on the block this year and the bulk of the praise will go his way or blame if they lose.
Bippity10
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9/13/2006  2:12 PM
Posted by nixluva:

The thing is Bippity, that this team has been in a continual retooling process during Steph's time here. Its never been a stable situation where you could really evaluate him as a player or leader. The team has been so flawed over the last 2.5 seasons, so how can you really say what Steph should've been able to accomplish. I think last year should've been about making a start in the right direction. It wasn't too much to ask for this team to begin to form a base to start from. I think that we have players who WANTED to do the right thing and WANTED to be part of a winning team. I don't think LB created an atmosphere where that could happen. EVERY Coach knows that you have to gain the trust and support of your best player. If that's the case WHAT THE HELL WAS LB DOING? It just ran counter to everything that we know about the Coach and Star Player relationship.

By all rights, last year should've been a stepping stone towards our goals. We weren't expecting a finals teams last year, so as long as the young players showed good progress and the team started to form an identity, that would've made last year a success. You're right! 23 wins is EVERYONE doing wrong, however if the team had gone on to win 6-10 more wins than the year before, the majority of the praise would've gone to LB, so why can't he get the blame for winning 10 games less than the year before? Just as its Isiah's neck on the block this year and the bulk of the praise will go his way or blame if they lose.

I disagree. I think this constant upheavel and retooling was a perfect opportunity for Steph to step up and show his leadership ability. Leaders are needed as much when everything is going according to plan. That means that obviously someone above them is leading so well that things are going smoothly. But when things are f'd up that's when leaders need to step up and lead. Instead of doing that Steph went down the road of sniping to the press. Imagine the respect he would have received if LB had lambasted him in the press and he just played. No one would have a problem with him. Instead he carried on with the "im the best" "it's not my fault", all the while losing once again.

As for your second paragraph. Again don't lump my opinions in with others. I was one of the voices that screamed during the season that the LB would not make a difference to the record. We would not add 10 wins because of LB. That if we added 10 wins to the previous year it was because the players made the improvements. It was because Curry came into camp in shape, JJ cared, the backcourt meshed and marbs lead. Not because of LB. The same things I am citing for our failures. The players did not do it. The same reason I am saying that Isiah should not have an ultimatum. Because it should not be about him. For once we have to understand that coach's aren't miracle workers. If you want to win a title it has to be about the players. I am a coach. I have won year after year. Not because of me. I am just a guide. The players decide how the season will go. All I do is guide them in the direction of what is right. Once they figure it out I can be a spectator just like the fans.

We need to stop looking for miracle worker coach's. We have 45-50 win talent. You and I agree on this. But if Isiah underaacheives and wins 37-41 games he will be kept around and viewed as a success. This should tell you everything you need to know about the changes we need to make to this team. But for some reason it doesn't to us. We seem to be okay with a team that underacheives. Do we not realize that if this team played to it's true potential we would be a Beast in the East. Why is it happy times to take a small step and strive for 500 ball? That in itself should be an indictment. To some of us it is. To others it isn't.

[Edited by - bippity10 on 09-13-2006 2:13 PM]
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rvhoss
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9/13/2006  4:16 PM
it's not a miracle worker...why is it so painful to admit that if we have 45 - 50 win talent, then we should win 45 to 50 games.

The only reason people are tempering their predictions is because of islesfat and his rude couter posts.

if he wins 41 games, he should be kept around, not because he did a bang up job, but because we are moving in the right direction with the players he select and 10 of the players are new to the team, town and system.

That's what we are saying...

LB had the same new players, system, town, team and SUCKED.

if Isiah reverses the trend, and remember what you are typign and what everyone is saying, then everyone was wrong, but wait, no they were right because he needs to win 50 games.

You sound like dolan, the one thing you criticize.

37 - 41 wins is not underachieving, and if you believe that, I'd like to see how many wins you expect from the next coach, and then the next coach.

there are no changes that need to be made from the team, the only change this team needs is stability.

I believe the knicks have an identity (one thing we were "lacking") and we have the talent and we have the direction.

who is to say that some other teams haven't gotten better? Why does it have to be 50 wins or failure, why can't it be halfway there and success?

You see what we are asking?

You are on this goal to make sure that everyone knows it's a failure if the knicks don't win 50 games because we are settling (that's the term you used, settling) but meanwhile, everyone applauds the bulls (41 wins) and washington (42 wins), indiana (41 wins) for being franchises headed in the right direction.

So, yeah, that's why I get sick of seeing your rants claiming that you are a supporter of the knicks, when all the while you just bash and bash and bash.

42 wins is a success, in any league, an 80% increase in wins over the previous year is an EXTREME SUCCESS.

But no, not for bip and heaven forbid not for anybody that's a fan of the knicks.

According to you bip, it's 50 wins or everyone is fired.

You sound just like Dolan.

41 wins and the playoffs is an immense success...not because we say so, but because EVERYBODY else says it's impossible.

You're just covering your tracks in case they do win 41 games and make the playoffs (last season 41 wins was a 6th seed).

Well, you will be in the minority, because if the knicks win 41 gawmes next year, they will be the success story of the season (or one of them).

So, read what you write, and simply admit it...you think the knicks will turn it around and win 41 games and instead of knowing it's a success to turn the team around (with the same exact players, including the 6 that HAD TO BE CUT THIS SUMMER FOR LB).

So, like i said, stop blowing smoke up our asses.

an 18 game turn around is a humungous step in the right direction. In ANY SPORT. (yes, baseball included)
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Panos
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9/13/2006  4:25 PM
You're not even listening to what he's saying.
He said the win total is not what matters.
Its the team's chemistry and attitude. What about that don't you get?
Bippity10
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9/13/2006  4:26 PM
Posted by rvhoss:

it's not a miracle worker...why is it so painful to admit that if we have 45 - 50 win talent, then we should win 45 to 50 games.

The only reason people are tempering their predictions is because of islesfat and his rude couter posts.

if he wins 41 games, he should be kept around, not because he did a bang up job, but because we are moving in the right direction with the players he select and 10 of the players are new to the team, town and system.

That's what we are saying...

LB had the same new players, system, town, team and SUCKED.

if Isiah reverses the trend, and remember what you are typign and what everyone is saying, then everyone was wrong, but wait, no they were right because he needs to win 50 games.

You sound like dolan, the one thing you criticize.

37 - 41 wins is not underachieving, and if you believe that, I'd like to see how many wins you expect from the next coach, and then the next coach.

there are no changes that need to be made from the team, the only change this team needs is stability.

I believe the knicks have an identity (one thing we were "lacking") and we have the talent and we have the direction.

who is to say that some other teams haven't gotten better? Why does it have to be 50 wins or failure, why can't it be halfway there and success?

You see what we are asking?

You are on this goal to make sure that everyone knows it's a failure if the knicks don't win 50 games because we are settling (that's the term you used, settling) but meanwhile, everyone applauds the bulls (41 wins) and washington (42 wins), indiana (41 wins) for being franchises headed in the right direction.

So, yeah, that's why I get sick of seeing your rants claiming that you are a supporter of the knicks, when all the while you just bash and bash and bash.

42 wins is a success, in any league, an 80% increase in wins over the previous year is an EXTREME SUCCESS.

But no, not for bip and heaven forbid not for anybody that's a fan of the knicks.

According to you bip, it's 50 wins or everyone is fired.

You sound just like Dolan.

41 wins and the playoffs is an immense success...not because we say so, but because EVERYBODY else says it's impossible.

You're just covering your tracks in case they do win 41 games and make the playoffs (last season 41 wins was a 6th seed).

Well, you will be in the minority, because if the knicks win 41 gawmes next year, they will be the success story of the season (or one of them).

So, read what you write, and simply admit it...you think the knicks will turn it around and win 41 games and instead of knowing it's a success to turn the team around (with the same exact players, including the 6 that HAD TO BE CUT THIS SUMMER FOR LB).

So, like i said, stop blowing smoke up our asses.

an 18 game turn around is a humungous step in the right direction. In ANY SPORT. (yes, baseball included)

Hoss: Give me a friggin break. It's the same nonsense over and over with you. If anyone is tempering their picks because of Islesfat then they need counseling to raise self-esteem. Get real, people are tempering their enthusiasm and lowering their numbers because they have the same reservations I do. They just are afraid to admit it because they feel that somehow means they hate the team.

As an organization if we are measuring Isiah against LB than we haven't moved on. That is my point. That means this season is still about LB, and not about building a title contender. For the 80th time we should not be holding Isiah to a win standard. The fact that we are tempering our enthusiasm over the win totals is an indictment of the roster, end of story.

Again hoss: I am not worried about IT coaching. I am not one sitting here hoping he does better than LB so that we can say "I told you so" I am not sitting here hoping he fails so that "I can say I told you so". That's for you guys to do. As I have said time and time again, everyone's predictions on this board are in the same general area. There are no "I told you so's". I don't care about that BS. I care abou this team doing the right thing. Getting a GM in here so Isiah can focus on coaching. Giving the power back to the coach and taking it away from players. You guys again and again keep making this about LB. You can have that argument with Fish or NYk20 or someone else. But why does it keep coming up with me? Guy are you flaming me? What's the deal. I don't get it
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nyk4ever
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9/13/2006  4:31 PM
Posted by rvhoss:



The only reason people are tempering their predictions is because of islesfat and his rude couter posts.

That is the absolute most ridiculous thing I've ever seen on this forum.
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nixluva
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9/13/2006  4:31 PM
Posted by Bippity10:

We need to stop looking for miracle worker coach's. We have 45-50 win talent. You and I agree on this. But if Isiah underaacheives and wins 37-41 games he will be kept around and viewed as a success. This should tell you everything you need to know about the changes we need to make to this team. But for some reason it doesn't to us. We seem to be okay with a team that underacheives. Do we not realize that if this team played to it's true potential we would be a Beast in the East. Why is it happy times to take a small step and strive for 500 ball? That in itself should be an indictment. To some of us it is. To others it isn't.

[Edited by - bippity10 on 09-13-2006 2:13 PM]

I'm certainly not looking for mediocrity as a goal this year. Its a bit too simplistic to look at the final win totals tho. I think that given that there's more to it than just having the talent that its still a success if they only win 41 but show that they are moving in the right direction with good team play. This is a LONG TERM process. This is a young team Bip. We don't have to make up for all of the bad years in one season.

Isiah wants to get to the playoffs and whatever the final record is, if they do that and represent themselves well in the playoffs, that has to be considered a success in comparison to last year and the expectations on the team. I don't expect Isiah or the players to be putting any limits on themselves this year. So if they did win over 45 games, i'm sure that's just fine with them. I just think that we're setup to be more successful this year and start to turn this ship around.
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9/13/2006  4:31 PM
If the Knicks win 41 games it will be 2 more games higher than what I predicted. so what's the point Hoss? do you read anything? Are you lumping again? I don't scream for firings. I didn't join the "who would you keep and who would you cut" posting because I thought it was silly. I don't care who is here and who isn't when we win. If Marbs turns himself into Magic Johnson I am happy. I don't care what his name is. I don't care who is coach. If Isiah does a great job, I want him to. I'm a Knick fan, that's what I want is a great job from everyone. when I say we are underachieving not once have I said everyone should be canned. I am making what I feel is a simple point:

Everyone on this board thinks we have 45-50 win talent but are predicting 35-45 wins. Good talent, mediocre results. This goes to show that we are all looking for changes to be made. So why is it when someone makes a suggestion for a change they are blasted on this site? It doesn't make sense. People seem to be happy underachieving and not talkinga bout improvements to the team. Just pretend everything is great. I just don't get it.
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Bippity10
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9/13/2006  4:32 PM
Posted by Panos:

You're not even listening to what he's saying.
He said the win total is not what matters.
Its the team's chemistry and attitude. What about that don't you get?

I think he's flaming me on purpose. Nixluva might be too. Not sure.
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nyk4ever
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9/13/2006  4:32 PM
I still don't get why wins are the only things people are judging this team by. If this team wins 41 games and shows no semblance of defense then how is that improvement? I just can't see how people can overlook such things.
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Bippity10
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9/13/2006  4:33 PM
We must be honest with ourselves and make changes where changes are needed. Focusing on the amount of games we win this year is silly. Thinking that we have acheived if we win 37-42 games is also silly. Achievement is when this management team focuses on whats important. Making players understand that they win games, and that it is THEIR responsibility to play as a team. And if they can't, they will be jettisoned. Seeing our overabundance of ballhandling talent and realizing that even though we love them all, that we are better of as Knicks in trading or dumping some of them for lesser talent that fits. Watching the examples of other successful teams(including our Olympic team) and noticing how they are building teams. Using role players and taking the leadership out of the hands of rebellious players and giving it to guys that are focused on one thing: Winning!!! Building a team that will play hard every night. They may not play well, but they will play hard every night without excuses. Bust their ballz regardless of the role that they are thrust into. That' progress. 37 wins, 40 wins, 42 wins just puts us back to the level of mediocrity that we seem to view as success.

That is a direct post from me earlier in this conversation. Hoss is definitely flaming me.
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Bippity10
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9/13/2006  4:34 PM
LB as the coach/leader and Marbs as player/leader both went to the press. Both started and helped to continue the demise of our season. Noone on our roster had the leadership ability to stand up and quell the madness. Thus the rest of our TEAM helped to start and continue the demise of the season. Management did nothing to stop it. This was a team malfunction. Nobody stepped to the plate to stop anything. The entire team failed. A small blow-up was therefore allowed to explode and lead to team collapse. It was a TEAM COLLAPSE. Everyone was responsible. How is anyone excusing any of them. It's so customary with the Knicks to point out one guy and not even realize that not one person on this roster stepped up to the plate. THEY ALL CONTRIBUTED TO ONE OF THE WORST SEASONS IN OUR HISTORY, IF NOT THE WORST.

I typed this one earlier and then told I blame everything on marbs.
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Bippity10
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9/13/2006  4:34 PM
Weirdest board ever!!!
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9/13/2006  4:39 PM
Posted by Bippity10:

Weirdest board ever!!!

You know what's really weird, when you try to talk logical and you're labeled a hater. Isn't that weird, Larry Brown lover/Isiah hater? Speaking of which, Bip, I talked to Allanfan the other day and he told me that you're his bitch. Is this true?
Wishing everyone well. I enjoyed posting here for a while, but as I matured I realized this forum isn't for me. We all evolve. Thanks for the memories everyone.
Bippity10
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Joined: 1/26/2004
Member: #574
9/13/2006  4:47 PM
Posted by nixluva:
Posted by Bippity10:

We need to stop looking for miracle worker coach's. We have 45-50 win talent. You and I agree on this. But if Isiah underaacheives and wins 37-41 games he will be kept around and viewed as a success. This should tell you everything you need to know about the changes we need to make to this team. But for some reason it doesn't to us. We seem to be okay with a team that underacheives. Do we not realize that if this team played to it's true potential we would be a Beast in the East. Why is it happy times to take a small step and strive for 500 ball? That in itself should be an indictment. To some of us it is. To others it isn't.

[Edited by - bippity10 on 09-13-2006 2:13 PM]

I'm certainly not looking for mediocrity as a goal this year. Its a bit too simplistic to look at the final win totals tho. I think that given that there's more to it than just having the talent that its still a success if they only win 41 but show that they are moving in the right direction with good team play. This is a LONG TERM process. This is a young team Bip. We don't have to make up for all of the bad years in one season.

Isiah wants to get to the playoffs and whatever the final record is, if they do that and represent themselves well in the playoffs, that has to be considered a success in comparison to last year and the expectations on the team. I don't expect Isiah or the players to be putting any limits on themselves this year. So if they did win over 45 games, i'm sure that's just fine with them. I just think that we're setup to be more successful this year and start to turn this ship around.

So how does this differ with anything I have said?the only difference is that when I say winning is a process I also choose to talk about the changes we need to make in order to continue this "long term process". I'm not afraid to criticize and point towards things that need fixing. I have not yet asked this team to win 50 games to be successful. Maybe I'm just not explaining it properly. What I'm saying is the fact that you and I are sitting here knowing we have a talented team but expecting them to win less than their talent dictates means that something isn't right. If you have 45-50 win talent, 45-50 games should be a given. So I will repeat myself because if I dont' it will be viewed as me hating the roster and wanting everyone to die. As a team we are not acheiving what the talent says so things need to change. here are the factors

Youth-youth hurts us but will change obviously as these players grow
New roster-the team needs to gel together. Only time can fix this
leadership-someone needs to step up and be a true leader, not a leader by default. Noone has done this yet, just pointing this out. sorry if it hurts. This has been Marbs' job. He hasn't done it yet. Either he will or we need to get someone that will.
Poor attitudes-We can ignore the history but it's true. It can change on a dime. Isiah will be good for this. Just waiting for it to occur.
I just hope that people will like me
Bippity10
Posts: 13999
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 1/26/2004
Member: #574
9/13/2006  4:49 PM
We keep saying we aren't looking for mediocrity and then calling for 35-45 wins. That's like me saying I'm not calling for the Seahawks to be mediocre I'm just looking for 7-9 wins. Call it what you want, it's still mediocrity. And again, I'm sure you guys will take it personally and cry and say I'm blasting everyone. But mediocrity IS what we are striving for this year. We need to find a way to strive for more.
I just hope that people will like me
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