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boy this team quit so bad
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McK1
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2/13/2006  11:41 PM
Posted by crzymdups:

also, McK1, since rookies can't better, how did the Sonics do in Ridnour's rookie season? Or do you have a big fat hairy pile of excuses for why Ridnour didn't lead that team to the playoffs? and how a team with Marbury and KVH and little else blew out that team by 30 with Marbury getting 18 assists? or can rookies maybe get better? can the same group of players learn how to play together once everyone gets healthy? the Sonics make the case that you can do that.

they won 37 Luke's rookie year. Improvement from with-in can happen. Nate never had to coach effort and pride. He just had to convince these guys they can win 1 possession at a time and he did.
the stop underrating David Lee movement 1. FIRE MIKE 2. HIRE MULLIN 3. PAY AVERY 4. FREE NATE!!!
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Caseloads
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2/13/2006  11:44 PM
Posted by Bonn1997:
chris paul is better than marbury
What's Chris Paul doing this year that Marbury didn't do his first year on the Knicks? Paul has a better team than Marbury. David West is better than any teammate Marbury has. Speedy Claxton is better than any gaurd we have. Desmond Mason is better than any SG/SF we have. Chris Anderson is a druggie who has missed half the season but he's still blocked and altered more shots than any Knick! Paul's awesome and may some day be better than Marbury but his team has a better record now because he has better teammates.
The knicks have a better team. The Hornets have more heart.
Caseloads
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2/13/2006  11:49 PM
Posted by nyballer:

The hornets were the second worst team in the league last year, and they traded away an all-star center in jamal magloire for desmond mason, who is only putting up 10/4. Chris Paul turned the team around from 2nd worst in the league to 9th overall - that's impressive.
Byron Scott deserves credit. They believe and have confidence and KNOW how to win. They are winning without PAUL. THESE GUYS HUSTLE and play defense and arent afraid to take big shots and have guards that can handle the ball and BIGS that can nail J's from outside. Aaron Williams did that tonight and so did West. They have a chip on their shoulder. Plus, teams need time to mesh.
crzymdups
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2/13/2006  11:49 PM
Posted by McK1:
Posted by crzymdups:

also, McK1, since rookies can't better, how did the Sonics do in Ridnour's rookie season? Or do you have a big fat hairy pile of excuses for why Ridnour didn't lead that team to the playoffs? and how a team with Marbury and KVH and little else blew out that team by 30 with Marbury getting 18 assists? or can rookies maybe get better? can the same group of players learn how to play together once everyone gets healthy? the Sonics make the case that you can do that.

they won 37 Luke's rookie year. Improvement from with-in can happen. Nate never had to coach effort and pride. He just had to convince these guys they can win 1 possession at a time and he did.

there have been Knicks showing heart. QRich, Nate, Frye, Lee, Jackie Butler, Malik, Jalen. Crawford has looked lost. I think this team is more lost than not showing pride. Maybe that's a difference of opinion.

But even that 37win Sonics team had Rashard scoring 18ppg every night and Ray scoring 24ppg for 60 games. those are vets who take the load off the kids. right now there is no one to take the load off the kids. It's a lot to ask of Marbury, but he was shouldering the load until he hurt his shoulder.
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Caseloads
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2/13/2006  11:54 PM
Posted by ultknicks524:
Posted by McK1:

In just his 2nd season, Ridnour started point and played 31 mpg on a 50 win division winning team last season. Can Marbury say that?

Did Marbury play with anyone who are half the players Ray Allen and Rashard Lewis are?

[Edited by - ultknicks524 on 02-13-2006 11:22 PM]
you mean the cameo appearances of a broken, hobbled, no knees and no legs Allan Houston the past few seasons didnt remind you of Ray Allen and make you say "Rashard WHO!?"
crzymdups
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2/13/2006  11:54 PM
I mean, the Rockets are 0-13 without Tmac this season. Did their players quit in every game Tmac missed?
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Caseloads
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2/13/2006  11:54 PM
Posted by jaydh:
Posted by McK1:
Posted by jaydh:
Posted by McK1:

In just his 2nd season, Ridnour started point and played 31 mpg on a 50 win division winning team last season. Can Marbury say that?

how many elite players, outside of maybe shaq, can say that?



a division title too high a bar

what about the fifty win thing?

one player doesnt carry a team unless hes micheal jordan.
jordan never won ish without Pippen and Zen Master.
Caseloads
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2/13/2006  11:56 PM
Posted by tkf:
Posted by Bonn1997:
chris paul is better than marbury
What's Chris Paul doing this year that Marbury didn't do his first year on the Knicks? Paul has a better team than Marbury. David West is better than any teammate Marbury has. Speedy Claxton is better than any gaurd we have. Desmond Mason is better than any SG/SF we have. Chris Anderson is a druggie who has missed half the season but he's still blocked and altered more shots than any Knick! Paul's awesome and may some day be better than Marbury but his team has a better record now because he has better teammates.



oh bonn that is bullcrap, West is agood, but come on and at one point in this season Claxton could not hold Jamals Jock strap, chris anderson is a clown, always has and always will be, and Desmond mason? please, people said the same thing about nash, they bitched that nash had marion and amare and Joe Johnson and Q rich, and marbury had nothing. Now JJ is gone, Q is on the knicks, Amare has been out all year and the suns are still kicking ass, are you now going to tell me how good diaw and House are? and how great KT is? please man...

Dont mess with Kurt "Pinkie" Thomas
McK1
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2/13/2006  11:58 PM
Posted by crzymdups:

I mean, the Rockets are 0-13 without Tmac this season. Did their players quit in every game Tmac missed?

tonight marked the how manyeth time NY has lost by 15 or more this season. I haven't followed Houston that closely, do they come close to our total number of blow-out losses?
the stop underrating David Lee movement 1. FIRE MIKE 2. HIRE MULLIN 3. PAY AVERY 4. FREE NATE!!!
crzymdups
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2/14/2006  12:03 AM
Posted by McK1:
Posted by crzymdups:

I mean, the Rockets are 0-13 without Tmac this season. Did their players quit in every game Tmac missed?

tonight marked the how manyeth time NY has lost by 15 or more this season. I haven't followed Houston that closely, do they come close to our total number of blow-out losses?

well, I'm not going to look all that up, feel free, but how's this for an example: Houston played Dallas without Tmac at home, not on the road and lost

Dallas 103 - Houston 76. sound familiar?

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/boxscore;_ylt=AtvQif4zSIdY9WZL710u4q2kvLYF?gid=2006011810


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McK1
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2/14/2006  12:07 AM
1 thing with Houston, they have a pretty decent record with Yao and T-Mac on the floor.

David Lee led line-ups hold that lone distinction here. Lee, KMart, or Boozer for staring four post trade deadline.
the stop underrating David Lee movement 1. FIRE MIKE 2. HIRE MULLIN 3. PAY AVERY 4. FREE NATE!!!
crzymdups
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2/14/2006  12:10 AM
Posted by McK1:

1 thing with Houston, they have a pretty decent record with Yao and T-Mac on the floor.

David Lee led line-ups hold that lone distinction here. Lee, KMart, or Boozer for staring four post trade deadline.

agreed, but that's a team that's played together under the same coach and won 51 games last year. this team never got a chance to have a camp together, had a new coach, had nagging injuries to Curry, QRich and James and then lost Marbury right when Curry and Q were turning it around.

This is an embarassing season and I hope like hell it looks better with Marbury back, but I don't think it's fair to condemn anyone for this clusterf*cck.
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tomverve
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2/14/2006  12:19 AM
hey crzy, you'll get a kick out of this... sound familiar?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fundamental_attribution_error

I guess it's hard to argue with human nature sometimes.
help treat disease with your spare computing power : http://www.worldcommunitygrid.org/
crzymdups
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2/14/2006  12:30 AM
Posted by tomverve:

hey crzy, you'll get a kick out of this... sound familiar?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fundamental_attribution_error

I guess it's hard to argue with human nature sometimes.

that's pretty interesting. yeah, I mean it's human nature to see your team lose by 30 and say "we suck, we need changes." I understand that, but watching these games, I don't see a group of guys that has quit or who sucks, I see a bunch of guys who need time and help and who have a lot of talent.

I think we put ourselves in this bad cap position by not being patient (Isiah and Layden over the years), I think the best course is to be patient with the young talent we have. We have draft picks (not our own lotto picks, obv), we can maybe make some decent trades with the expiring deals over the next few seasons. I don't know, it sucks, but we need to be patient with this group.

I'm going to be very sad if I go to ESPN.com at work next week and see we've given up on Lee, Crawford, Ariza.
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McK1
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2/14/2006  1:00 AM
crzy what would you be saying if Layden brought these guys together?
the stop underrating David Lee movement 1. FIRE MIKE 2. HIRE MULLIN 3. PAY AVERY 4. FREE NATE!!!
Killa4luv
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2/14/2006  1:11 AM
Posted by BRIGGS:
Posted by crzymdups:

Rockets 0-13 without McGrady

Knicks soon to be 0-10 without Marbury (and 1-4 when he was playing hurt and couldn't attack the rim)

OMG superstars make a difference!

I consider Marbury a great player but hes no superstar--come on now he cant hold steve nash's jock--chris paul is better than marbury

You're an idiot. Chris Paul is comparable to Marbs' rookie season. Better than him now? You are just dumb.
simrud
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2/14/2006  2:51 AM
Just cause someone is a superstar, it doesnt make them a difference maker. Tmac is a superstar. So is Vince. The failed to carry awful teams by themsevles in the past.

There are superstars, and then there are franchise players. Marbury is def not a franchise player. Whether he is a superstar, I frankly don't give a shiat about.
A glimmer of hope maybe?!?
joec32033
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2/14/2006  5:19 AM
Posted by jaydh:
Posted by McK1:

In just his 2nd season, Ridnour started point and played 31 mpg on a 50 win division winning team last season. Can Marbury say that?

how many elite players, outside of maybe shaq, can say that?

Duncan?
~You can't run from who you are.~
jaydh
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2/14/2006  5:26 AM
Posted by joec32033:
Posted by jaydh:
Posted by McK1:

In just his 2nd season, Ridnour started point and played 31 mpg on a 50 win division winning team last season. Can Marbury say that?

how many elite players, outside of maybe shaq, can say that?

Duncan?


exactly, not many. so the point is, whats the big deal if marbury wasnt on a 50win division leading team in his 2nd year, neither was garnett. just another weak argument by mck1.
Marv
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2/14/2006  8:47 AM
Posted by Finestrg:

Larry's just got to implement changes, especially on defense, and I don't care how drastic or radical those changes are - play zone, try a Rick Pitino-style trap, hire a defensive-minded guy to come in here and totally re-vamp the defense like a Tex Winter, a Dick Harter, etc., make it gimmickly like how the old Duke teams used to play defense where everyone would bang their hands on the floor to motivate each other as the opponent would bring the ball up, I don't care, whatever, just show me a commitment to play better defense because this current defensive gameplan just doesn't cut it - if there even is a gameplan. It's the biggest problem I can see and one that can be corrected.

See now you're upsetting me because this was the guy I really wanted Isiah to bring in to coach all the youngs he put on the roster. I wonder whether Rick would have done it? I think his wife is another who misses New York. He would have had to once again jilt the state of Kentucky - they'll get Dick Cheney-types down there lining up to scatter some shot at him!!

Would Rick be willing to come back to the pros? How would Rick do with this team? It might not be just conjecture. I'd rather have Isiah and Dolan eat Larry's contract right now and bring in Rick than have him trade our youngs for more pathetic overpriced vets.
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boy this team quit so bad
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