DLeethal wrote:

Nalod wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

Nalod wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

Nalod wrote:Billy 2 ncaa chips and coached young thunder to finals.

Conference finals. Lost after being up 3-1. So collapsed.
Young OKC team? Durant, Westbrook, Adams, Ibaka and defensive player of the year Roberson.
Never went past first round thereafter.

Can see Knick fans putting up with losing a series up 3-1 and never getting past the first round.

Let’s not talk about what he has done in Chicago since 2020.

We just wanted permission to talk to him.
Who did Thunder lose to? WHo was out whest when they did not make it past. We all blamed Westbrook?
Im not here to say we should hire him. Just talk man, just talk.

Agree it’s just talk.
Does it really matter who they lost to? Or the fact he coached a team that was up on a team 3-1 and historically choked?
Merely stated that Donavan has yet to prove he can win a chip in the NBA. Which was, allegedly, the reason they fired Thibs. And that coaches have an advantage in college due to recruiting. Not saying he is a bad coach. But not exactly a NBA chip veteran.

Feel Knicks are seeing, like I predicted at the beginning of playoffs when some asked who we would rather play in the playoffs. That the Pacers are a very very good team. They were finally healthy and playing extremely well in the last two months of the season. We were one bad loss from taking them to a seventh game at home. Some, including Knicks FO are finally realizing how good they truly are. By what they are showing in the finals. Proving that maybe Thibs was not the problem but rather the Pacers level of talent and depth. Which for me, is on Rose more than it is on Thibs.
IMO, Rose did what a lot of FO guys have done in the past. Found someone else to take the blame.

I don't think Knicks fired him based on just losing to Pacers. FO thought depite beating the Celtiics the team struggled to thrive.
Thrive......

As for Billy, or any other coach they have their warts. Each succeeded in certain circumstances and perhaps failed with other specific circumstances. The current employed ones that FO inquired about not excluded. Billy's team was up 3-1 and that indicts him forever? Im sorry, who were they playing? What happened in that series that got turned around? Was it coaching? Injuries? Other team get it players back? IM not going that deep into this convo so color me lazy on this one.

I know bulls ownership is kind of cheap and given they are not really going anywhere soon might be happy to change coach but don't want to pay Billy, so if that's the case perhaps let him talk and interview.

Knicks definitely didn't fire Thibs based on losing to the Pacers. Maybe a run to the Finals would have saved his job, maybe it wouldn't have, but he was fired based on process not necessarily results.

And hiring a coach based purely on resume would be stupid, the same way firing a coach based purely on results it's stupid. You have to dig into the details and everything requires nuance and context.

OKC hired Dagneault off the G-League squad. They did so because they believed in his talent as a coach, not because of his resume. Knicks are looking for the right coaching talent to fit this team, not the best resume.

True. Im long on context of ones resume. Fans calling for Malone want that chip to come with him. He had Jokic and a healthy team around him. It came together.
Likewise for any coach with a chip who. They were fired also. But why is important and often it's circumstantial.
If Thibs and Mikal are simply not getting along and he won't extend he becomes more important than Thibs given as you said the process did not THRIVE.
Kat had a great season but he will not last unless we make the game easier for him.
Im not down on Thibs for the iso. Brunson perhaps second to SGA for lead guard and clutch. Playoffs do that. Jalen and Knicks did play some "Moving and grooving" but teams counted by putting a small on Kat in the perimeter and kept a rim protector to and was effective sealing some things up. Josh knees weekend his shot and Thibs was late to trust Shamet. Josh shooting was a big problem for us. He can do but he was hurting. Deuce his limits.
I have lots of opinions but no idea who the coach should be. I know trust, charisma, and schematics are important to the FO. House in Hamptons, CAA and ability to read a subway map is not quantifiable to winning.

DLeethal wrote:

Nalod wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

Nalod wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

Nalod wrote:Billy 2 ncaa chips and coached young thunder to finals.

Conference finals. Lost after being up 3-1. So collapsed.
Young OKC team? Durant, Westbrook, Adams, Ibaka and defensive player of the year Roberson.
Never went past first round thereafter.

Can see Knick fans putting up with losing a series up 3-1 and never getting past the first round.

Let’s not talk about what he has done in Chicago since 2020.

We just wanted permission to talk to him.
Who did Thunder lose to? WHo was out whest when they did not make it past. We all blamed Westbrook?
Im not here to say we should hire him. Just talk man, just talk.

Agree it’s just talk.
Does it really matter who they lost to? Or the fact he coached a team that was up on a team 3-1 and historically choked?
Merely stated that Donavan has yet to prove he can win a chip in the NBA. Which was, allegedly, the reason they fired Thibs. And that coaches have an advantage in college due to recruiting. Not saying he is a bad coach. But not exactly a NBA chip veteran.

Feel Knicks are seeing, like I predicted at the beginning of playoffs when some asked who we would rather play in the playoffs. That the Pacers are a very very good team. They were finally healthy and playing extremely well in the last two months of the season. We were one bad loss from taking them to a seventh game at home. Some, including Knicks FO are finally realizing how good they truly are. By what they are showing in the finals. Proving that maybe Thibs was not the problem but rather the Pacers level of talent and depth. Which for me, is on Rose more than it is on Thibs.
IMO, Rose did what a lot of FO guys have done in the past. Found someone else to take the blame.

I don't think Knicks fired him based on just losing to Pacers. FO thought depite beating the Celtiics the team struggled to thrive.
Thrive......

As for Billy, or any other coach they have their warts. Each succeeded in certain circumstances and perhaps failed with other specific circumstances. The current employed ones that FO inquired about not excluded. Billy's team was up 3-1 and that indicts him forever? Im sorry, who were they playing? What happened in that series that got turned around? Was it coaching? Injuries? Other team get it players back? IM not going that deep into this convo so color me lazy on this one.

I know bulls ownership is kind of cheap and given they are not really going anywhere soon might be happy to change coach but don't want to pay Billy, so if that's the case perhaps let him talk and interview.

Knicks definitely didn't fire Thibs based on losing to the Pacers. Maybe a run to the Finals would have saved his job, maybe it wouldn't have, but he was fired based on process not necessarily results.

And hiring a coach based purely on resume would be stupid, the same way firing a coach based purely on results it's stupid. You have to dig into the details and everything requires nuance and context.

OKC hired Dagneault off the G-League squad. They did so because they believed in his talent as a coach, not because of his resume. Knicks are looking for the right coaching talent to fit this team, not the best resume.

I like that

martin wrote:

DLeethal wrote:

Nalod wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

Nalod wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

Nalod wrote:Billy 2 ncaa chips and coached young thunder to finals.

Conference finals. Lost after being up 3-1. So collapsed.
Young OKC team? Durant, Westbrook, Adams, Ibaka and defensive player of the year Roberson.
Never went past first round thereafter.

Can see Knick fans putting up with losing a series up 3-1 and never getting past the first round.

Let’s not talk about what he has done in Chicago since 2020.

We just wanted permission to talk to him.
Who did Thunder lose to? WHo was out whest when they did not make it past. We all blamed Westbrook?
Im not here to say we should hire him. Just talk man, just talk.

Agree it’s just talk.
Does it really matter who they lost to? Or the fact he coached a team that was up on a team 3-1 and historically choked?
Merely stated that Donavan has yet to prove he can win a chip in the NBA. Which was, allegedly, the reason they fired Thibs. And that coaches have an advantage in college due to recruiting. Not saying he is a bad coach. But not exactly a NBA chip veteran.

Feel Knicks are seeing, like I predicted at the beginning of playoffs when some asked who we would rather play in the playoffs. That the Pacers are a very very good team. They were finally healthy and playing extremely well in the last two months of the season. We were one bad loss from taking them to a seventh game at home. Some, including Knicks FO are finally realizing how good they truly are. By what they are showing in the finals. Proving that maybe Thibs was not the problem but rather the Pacers level of talent and depth. Which for me, is on Rose more than it is on Thibs.
IMO, Rose did what a lot of FO guys have done in the past. Found someone else to take the blame.

I don't think Knicks fired him based on just losing to Pacers. FO thought depite beating the Celtiics the team struggled to thrive.
Thrive......

As for Billy, or any other coach they have their warts. Each succeeded in certain circumstances and perhaps failed with other specific circumstances. The current employed ones that FO inquired about not excluded. Billy's team was up 3-1 and that indicts him forever? Im sorry, who were they playing? What happened in that series that got turned around? Was it coaching? Injuries? Other team get it players back? IM not going that deep into this convo so color me lazy on this one.

I know bulls ownership is kind of cheap and given they are not really going anywhere soon might be happy to change coach but don't want to pay Billy, so if that's the case perhaps let him talk and interview.

Knicks definitely didn't fire Thibs based on losing to the Pacers. Maybe a run to the Finals would have saved his job, maybe it wouldn't have, but he was fired based on process not necessarily results.

And hiring a coach based purely on resume would be stupid, the same way firing a coach based purely on results it's stupid. You have to dig into the details and everything requires nuance and context.

OKC hired Dagneault off the G-League squad. They did so because they believed in his talent as a coach, not because of his resume. Knicks are looking for the right coaching talent to fit this team, not the best resume.

I like that

Don’t get the take. Professional sports is solely based on results.
You guys are telling me the Knicks would have fired Thibs if he won the chip?
Losing coaches are being retained because they have a good process?
This was because Dolan and maybe Rose felt they should have been in the finals.
Btw, process, player content and team chemistry all contribute to one thing…winning!

Do agree that SOME teams need to match their team dynamic to the right coach.
OKC was a young team that was building. Therefore picking a young coach to lead them was a good idea. Take the same coach and have him try to lead a bunch of MBA vets and maybe it goes badly.
Don’t think Dolan or Rose see the Knicks as a young team needing time to develop.

Philc1 wrote:

DLeethal wrote:

Nalod wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

Nalod wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

Nalod wrote:Billy 2 ncaa chips and coached young thunder to finals.

Conference finals. Lost after being up 3-1. So collapsed.
Young OKC team? Durant, Westbrook, Adams, Ibaka and defensive player of the year Roberson.
Never went past first round thereafter.

Can see Knick fans putting up with losing a series up 3-1 and never getting past the first round.

Let’s not talk about what he has done in Chicago since 2020.

We just wanted permission to talk to him.
Who did Thunder lose to? WHo was out whest when they did not make it past. We all blamed Westbrook?
Im not here to say we should hire him. Just talk man, just talk.

Agree it’s just talk.
Does it really matter who they lost to? Or the fact he coached a team that was up on a team 3-1 and historically choked?
Merely stated that Donavan has yet to prove he can win a chip in the NBA. Which was, allegedly, the reason they fired Thibs. And that coaches have an advantage in college due to recruiting. Not saying he is a bad coach. But not exactly a NBA chip veteran.

Feel Knicks are seeing, like I predicted at the beginning of playoffs when some asked who we would rather play in the playoffs. That the Pacers are a very very good team. They were finally healthy and playing extremely well in the last two months of the season. We were one bad loss from taking them to a seventh game at home. Some, including Knicks FO are finally realizing how good they truly are. By what they are showing in the finals. Proving that maybe Thibs was not the problem but rather the Pacers level of talent and depth. Which for me, is on Rose more than it is on Thibs.
IMO, Rose did what a lot of FO guys have done in the past. Found someone else to take the blame.

I don't think Knicks fired him based on just losing to Pacers. FO thought depite beating the Celtiics the team struggled to thrive.
Thrive......

As for Billy, or any other coach they have their warts. Each succeeded in certain circumstances and perhaps failed with other specific circumstances. The current employed ones that FO inquired about not excluded. Billy's team was up 3-1 and that indicts him forever? Im sorry, who were they playing? What happened in that series that got turned around? Was it coaching? Injuries? Other team get it players back? IM not going that deep into this convo so color me lazy on this one.

I know bulls ownership is kind of cheap and given they are not really going anywhere soon might be happy to change coach but don't want to pay Billy, so if that's the case perhaps let him talk and interview.

Knicks definitely didn't fire Thibs based on losing to the Pacers. Maybe a run to the Finals would have saved his job, maybe it wouldn't have, but he was fired based on process not necessarily results.

And hiring a coach based purely on resume would be stupid, the same way firing a coach based purely on results it's stupid. You have to dig into the details and everything requires nuance and context.

OKC hired Dagneault off the G-League squad. They did so because they believed in his talent as a coach, not because of his resume. Knicks are looking for the right coaching talent to fit this team, not the best resume.

Thibs got outcoached in the pacers series. Knicks had no offensive creativity and finally caught up with them in the east finals. The pistons we beat simply because of superior talent, depth and experience. Celtics were too busy reading their own headlines to be prepared to play us so we punched them in the mouth games 1 and 2.

Thibs is way too limited a coach on offense. He is a Van Gundy clone and we have a 2-3 year window left to win a championship

How would you have improved “offensive creativity “?
How did the Knick players compare to the Pacers players statistically?
Who was the deeper team?
Who was the better defensive team ?
Would you say it was the reason that up to the 7th game, Pacers had outscored us a combined 3 points?
Do you think OKC, a much better team , did a better job of “offensive creativity “?

GustavBahler wrote:My guess is Thibs will be an asst with the Spurs or Celtics next season. I would be surprised if he gets offered a HC position before next season. Might have to wait a season to be a head coach again.

There are no open positions. I bet you'd be surprised.
He would be a tough assistant as perhaps very head strong to support a young coach.
Maybe a euro team or team USA gig?

GustavBahler wrote:

Nalod wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:My guess is Thibs will be an asst with the Spurs or Celtics next season. I would be surprised if he gets offered a HC position before next season. Might have to wait a season to be a head coach again.

There are no open positions. I bet you'd be surprised.
He would be a tough assistant as perhaps very head strong to support a young coach.
Maybe a euro team or team USA gig?

I'm surprised we're the only team without a coach.

As you know, Thibs was a long time assistant on other teams. He knows the do's and don'ts I imagine.

The Spurs still have Pops in the organization, so I doubt he would stir things up. In Boston he would be playing under a championship coach, which he won recently. I was thinking Dallas, but Im not so sure Kidd and Thibs would make for a great pairing. Thibs might have problems there.

I think Thibs will always be up for Team USA. But I doubt he goes to Europe. As good as they are over there now, he would probably still see it as a big step down.

I see him transcending his ego for a high purpose. Much like Larry Brown did going to SMU. Sometimes it's about the purity of being a coach. I could see Thibs going to a small school perhaps.