yellowboy90 wrote:This game was more about d. A interesting thing will be if Shump has retained his defensive quickness. If so then the Knicks will not have to worry about helping so much and can stay on the 3 pt shooters. They will not have to cheat or double unlike when Felton is posted up by bigger players. No Shump will not play pg but will defend especially when going Offense to defense down the stretch.

3G4G wrote:

dk7th wrote:

3G4G wrote:

Uptown wrote:

3G4G wrote:When we needed a last shot in a close game Melo choked...

That's why I prefer winning games with comfortable leads, don't want to see Zero Ball A.K.A. Hero Ball

Choked?! Get out of here!! Dude had 35 and 13 in 50 mins. He cant make every shot. To be honest, it should have never come down to the last shot. The 2 playes before that shot were horrible play calls by Woodson. Those triple screen plays is either going to result in a runner from Felton or an alley oop to Tyson. Nets sagged and let Felton shoot.

You're confirming my stance on this. Melo filled up the stat sheet...I don't care I've been told for a while now Melo clutch gene separates him from so many players. I don't care about clutch gene I want to win games where we aren't dependent on Hero Ball or last second shot. Because at the end of the day as Melo likes to say a player is probably only going to make 30% of those opportunities which means you watch them fail more than they succeed in such situations.

win or lose melo most of the time will get his-- in the regular season. face it he's a stat sheet stuffer, a player that isaiah thomas covets. it's a disturbing and by now predictable pattern. of course against superior defensive teams come playoff time it's almost always been a lose.... there are stats and then there's floor impact in terms of making others better.

something has to change-- he can't continue to play in a vacuum in a team game.

nets have a nice squad and i am not a fan of johnson.

Johnson played pretty bad in terms of individual offense but what separates Johnson from a player like Melo isn't clutch gene and it isn't scoring ability, it's his penchant to trust his teammates and make plays for others. Something he's done his whole career. It was Joe Johnson's assists not hockey assists to Jerry Stackhouse. Stack made every back breaking 3 tonight and at least 2-3 of them came from Joe.

as I said, those were backbreakers..

CrushAlot wrote:

tkf wrote:

Uptown wrote:

3G4G wrote:

Uptown wrote:

3G4G wrote:When we needed a last shot in a close game Melo choked...

That's why I prefer winning games with comfortable leads, don't want to see Zero Ball A.K.A. Hero Ball

Choked?! Get out of here!! Dude had 35 and 13 in 50 mins. He cant make every shot. To be honest, it should have never come down to the last shot. The 2 playes before that shot were horrible play calls by Woodson. Those triple screen plays is either going to result in a runner from Felton or an alley oop to Tyson. Nets sagged and let Felton shoot.

You're confirming my stance on this. Melo filled up the stat sheet...I don't care I've been told for a while now Melo clutch gene separates him from so many players. I don't care about clutch gene I want to win games where we aren't dependent on Hero Ball or last second shot. Because at the end of the day as Melo likes to say a player is probably only going to make 30% of those opportunities which means you watch them fail more than they succeed in such situations.

Yes, its team ball. Other than Tyson, his teammates came up small on the offensive end. Woodson didnt help either with the two plays he called that proceeded the Melo miss. My point is, it should have never come down to that shot.

uptown, this team wasn't built to have multiple playmakers. which is why melo wanted lin out of town, and honestly, I am not sure woodson was so hot on lin as well, said he needed a PG who shot less.. well felton is taking a lot of shots.. but we lack guys who can create for others off the dribble.. this team is built that way, for better or worse.... what we can hope is that kid doesn't miss many games as he tends to make sense of the madness on the court most of the time...

Lin conspiracy anti -melo posting makes its appearance.

no conspiracy, I think it is clear the way this team is built.. supports my theory..

nixluva wrote:

tkf wrote:

nixluva wrote:I think Kidd makes all the difference in the world with this team. Just think about how many games Kidd helped us win in the 4th qtr when he comes in and turns up the tempo on D and helps us get good shots. Look this Knicks team is playing without Kidd, Amar'e and Shump. Those are actually key players for this team. Kidd in particular was missed the most tonight, but when we have all of our players this team is going to be really tough to beat

right now we don't know how shump and amare affects this team.. so I am not going to say we are really missing them as we have started off well without them.. but I will say we miss kidd, who I think is the most important player on this team right now....

To me it doesn't matter that the Knicks won games early in the season without a couple of our best players. Over the course of 82 games the more talent you have makes it easier on everyone. You don't want guys like Kidd and Sheed to have to log so many minutes just to get wins. We need our top line players in the mix. It's not like we don't know how good Amar'e or Shump are when healthy. Even coming off long layoffs it's still gonna be important to have more guys that can give this team minutes and take the edge of the older guys on the bench.

My assumption is that neither Amar'e nor Shump will be put back into the rotation until they show they can help the team. There's no need to rush them back at this point, since the team is doing well. Still we do need those guys down the stretch to help this team get deep in the playoffs.

I understand your point, I don't disagee, but what I am saying is that the knicks are very capable of playing well, but it takes discipline, kidd helps a lot in that area, if amare and shump are back, it won't make much of a difference if we don't tighten up the way we play... this team is going to really have to adjust for amare, and so far, I really don't know what that team will look like...

K22 wrote:

Love when carton talks over him in his Frankenstein voice.

dk7th wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

dk7th wrote:

3G4G wrote:

Uptown wrote:

3G4G wrote:When we needed a last shot in a close game Melo choked...

That's why I prefer winning games with comfortable leads, don't want to see Zero Ball A.K.A. Hero Ball

Choked?! Get out of here!! Dude had 35 and 13 in 50 mins. He cant make every shot. To be honest, it should have never come down to the last shot. The 2 playes before that shot were horrible play calls by Woodson. Those triple screen plays is either going to result in a runner from Felton or an alley oop to Tyson. Nets sagged and let Felton shoot.

You're confirming my stance on this. Melo filled up the stat sheet...I don't care I've been told for a while now Melo clutch gene separates him from so many players. I don't care about clutch gene I want to win games where we aren't dependent on Hero Ball or last second shot. Because at the end of the day as Melo likes to say a player is probably only going to make 30% of those opportunities which means you watch them fail more than they succeed in such situations.

win or lose melo most of the time will get his-- in the regular season. face it he's a stat sheet stuffer, a player that isaiah thomas covets. it's a disturbing and by now predictable pattern. of course against superior defensive teams come playoff time it's almost always been a lose.... there are stats and then there's floor impact in terms of making others better.

something has to change-- he can't continue to play in a vacuum in a team game.

nets have a nice squad and i am not a fan of johnson.

He busted his @ss. Played a man's game. His free throw shooting was really disappointing However, Knicks aren't in this game if melo isn't the hardest working guy on the court. Knicks missed Kidd. Felton, and melo played flawed games. They need kidds presence and guidance.

first off he did not play hard on defense tonight. his closeouts and help on doubling were atrocious. so on one end of the court he did not play hard enough.

even when he plays hard on offense it does not have a positive impact on his teammates. that means he is not playing smart in addition to hard. this has always been the story with anthony. he takes too many shots while he hits his career average for TS% tonight. meanwhile 1 assist means he is not actively playmaking.

i saw a typical melo performance and it has never been enough!

He did choke on that last shot. He is expected to make that shot. With that said Joe Johnson is a guard, Melo is a forward. They have different roles, Melo had 13 rebs 6 offensive to Johnson's 3ast. Melo had 16ft attempts and usually gets teams in the penalty which forces defenses to play his teammates differently. We need to take advantage of that more though.

newyorknewyork wrote:

tkf wrote:

Uptown wrote:

3G4G wrote:

Uptown wrote:

3G4G wrote:When we needed a last shot in a close game Melo choked...

That's why I prefer winning games with comfortable leads, don't want to see Zero Ball A.K.A. Hero Ball

Choked?! Get out of here!! Dude had 35 and 13 in 50 mins. He cant make every shot. To be honest, it should have never come down to the last shot. The 2 playes before that shot were horrible play calls by Woodson. Those triple screen plays is either going to result in a runner from Felton or an alley oop to Tyson. Nets sagged and let Felton shoot.

You're confirming my stance on this. Melo filled up the stat sheet...I don't care I've been told for a while now Melo clutch gene separates him from so many players. I don't care about clutch gene I want to win games where we aren't dependent on Hero Ball or last second shot. Because at the end of the day as Melo likes to say a player is probably only going to make 30% of those opportunities which means you watch them fail more than they succeed in such situations.

Yes, its team ball. Other than Tyson, his teammates came up small on the offensive end. Woodson didnt help either with the two plays he called that proceeded the Melo miss. My point is, it should have never come down to that shot.

uptown, this team wasn't built to have multiple playmakers. which is why melo wanted lin out of town, and honestly, I am not sure woodson was so hot on lin as well, said he needed a PG who shot less.. well felton is taking a lot of shots.. but we lack guys who can create for others off the dribble.. this team is built that way, for better or worse.... what we can hope is that kid doesn't miss many games as he tends to make sense of the madness on the court most of the time...

The team was built for the PG to feed the bigs Amare/Chandler/Camby and get them going offensively. Lin would have just come off the bench and would be playing the Jr Smith role on this team.

really? and how is that possible when we don't play pick and roll.. and if lin was here he would be starting and running pick and roll if woodson had a brain...

nixluva wrote:

tkf wrote:

nixluva wrote:I think Kidd makes all the difference in the world with this team. Just think about how many games Kidd helped us win in the 4th qtr when he comes in and turns up the tempo on D and helps us get good shots. Look this Knicks team is playing without Kidd, Amar'e and Shump. Those are actually key players for this team. Kidd in particular was missed the most tonight, but when we have all of our players this team is going to be really tough to beat

right now we don't know how shump and amare affects this team.. so I am not going to say we are really missing them as we have started off well without them.. but I will say we miss kidd, who I think is the most important player on this team right now....

To me it doesn't matter that the Knicks won games early in the season without a couple of our best players. Over the course of 82 games the more talent you have makes it easier on everyone. You don't want guys like Kidd and Sheed to have to log so many minutes just to get wins. We need our top line players in the mix. It's not like we don't know how good Amar'e or Shump are when healthy. Even coming off long layoffs it's still gonna be important to have more guys that can give this team minutes and take the edge of the older guys on the bench.

My assumption is that neither Amar'e nor Shump will be put back into the rotation until they show they can help the team. There's no need to rush them back at this point, since the team is doing well. Still we do need those guys down the stretch to help this team get deep in the playoffs.

Yep, I agree. It's been especially tough given how many games we play November and December- but the real killer is March when we have 18 games, I think, crammed into the month. All those games towards the end of the season are going to be tough on the older players.

Anyways it's been exactly a month since Amar'es surgery, so hopefully we'll get a clearer time frame soon (original timeline was 4-6 weeks, but that they have a better idea after a month). Shump targetting January is good because we don't play that many games and there will be plenty of days off and practice time. Only a month and a bit to go!