GustavBahler wrote:Most posters liked the player, not the deal. RJ and IQ was a high price, we gave up a lot of production.

But as I pointed out early on, it doesnt matter if the cost for OG was 2 good, young, players, and no picks. And the deal for another star is mostly about 1st rounders and some cap relief. Its the end result that matters, what the roster looks like after its been largely assembled, not how we got there.

I'd rather read a hot take from MS (or anyone else) than nothing but a lot of boring ass groupthink.

I think the key point is just to ignore what other people say and stay firmly committed to your views. Since before the season started I have been saying that the key for this team to improve is to get rid of RJ. In the post just previous I restated the point, yet you still consider RJ as part of the "high price" rather than realizing that including RJ vs EF's salary is likely the reason we had to give up a third mid level draft pick we don't have a roster spot for in a weak draft.

Not sure about "groupthink" comment. This site exists because it's a lot of independent thinkers taking time to develop arguments about the team they love rather than a single journalist and a bunch of comments.

RJ I had no problem moving, it had to happen if you're going to keep Randle, I thought IQ had another level to go and scorers aren't easy to find.

It's been beautiful to watch the ball moving, the cutting, the extra passes. Sometimes you just have too many guys to juggle and 2 for 1s open things up. I just hope they don't move Grimes, because he has another level to go.

EwingsGlass wrote:

@Martin. I don’t make this request often. My last one was for the D’antoni Pringles guy. But given how OG has performed this last month and my absolute adoration for OG - stemming from an embarrassing affectation going on 2 years. Followed by my standing against the overwhelming crowd here that hated this trade. I would be grateful. No, indebted, if you could create an emoticon in honor of OG Anunoby that captures the above image. I respect the work you put into this site and don’t mean to ask for more. But… the crow. It is time to mark its place in immortality.

Will do it. Need a bit of time (I am overwhelmed on the personal side these days), and if I forgot, just nudge me a bit.

MS wrote:Honestly, I am very happy to be wrong here. OG has been better than advertised, he's selfless, one of the smarter guys we've had an compliments guys like Hart, DDV much better than anyone we could have imagined, not to mention it keeps the ball in Brunsons hands (it's clear he is that guy)

RJ I had no problem moving, it had to happen if you're going to keep Randle, I thought IQ had another level to go and scorers aren't easy to find.

It's been beautiful to watch the ball moving, the cutting, the extra passes. Sometimes you just have too many guys to juggle and 2 for 1s open things up. I just hope they don't move Grimes, because he has another level to go.

All aboard the OG Bandwagon!!! The first class reservation section is open for your pleasure.

Any chance you can create a "Grimes has been so bad on Knicks bench" jinx thread?

newyorknewyork wrote:They been chasing OG for like 2 years. The price was long established. Knicks had to pull the trigger on the deal or allow another team to get him.

Knicks signed DDV for just cap space with the idea that they would probably move IQ. Which effectively reduced the impact of losing IQ. Simultaneously OG is a far greater impact than RJ. The combination of DDV & OG with a sprinkle of Precious tilted the results.

DDV as a starter. 27gms, 24mins, 13.8pts, 3.5rebs, 2.6ast, 49/43/74% 668TS% 130Ortg 113Drtg

DDV is such a good shooter while being low usage, zero sticky and a very very good cutter and passer too.

Exactly what Grimes, uh, should be. With a teensy less on ball defense.

nycericanguy wrote:OG is bigger and more impactful than I imagined. The issue isn't the player, it's what we gave up and whether we can replace it. Otherwise our ceiling is largely the same.

We struggled against all the top teams this year before the trade. We couldn't hang with any of them. We have beaten the crap out of all the top 3 teams in each conference we have played so far after the trade. Not a huge sample size, but it's hard to say our ceiling hasn't been raised. Our floor and our ceiling has been raised.

I think you are ignoring too much how this team was trending before the trade and focusing too much on how they played in the second half of last year instead. Different year, we weren't the same team.

Also, there is zero point of judging this team as if it's the finished product. We have a gazillion picks we will need to move. So even if the move was made to solidify a super important role next to Brunson and Randle, and in your mind was a lateral move (it's not), it allows us to build a much stronger team with another tweak or two. You have to build your team brick by brick and never in one swoop. If this was one step sideways it allows us to take two steps forward with another move.

This team would school the team that was giving up 130 a night though, there is no doubt about it.

martin wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:They been chasing OG for like 2 years. The price was long established. Knicks had to pull the trigger on the deal or allow another team to get him.

Knicks signed DDV for just cap space with the idea that they would probably move IQ. Which effectively reduced the impact of losing IQ. Simultaneously OG is a far greater impact than RJ. The combination of DDV & OG with a sprinkle of Precious tilted the results.

DDV as a starter. 27gms, 24mins, 13.8pts, 3.5rebs, 2.6ast, 49/43/74% 668TS% 130Ortg 113Drtg

DDV is such a good shooter while being low usage, zero sticky and a very very good cutter and passer too.

Exactly what Grimes, uh, should be. With a teensy less on ball defense.

The way they are looking to feature OG with that 2nd unit lineup. The more Hayward makes so much sense here.

And the more thought I've put into it the more I see Brogdon as the target we should obtain through trade. 31 Assist % with a 23% Usage 15pts in 28mins sounds about right in line for our needs.

This would still allow the Knicks to maintain the draft capital in this coming draft to be able to maneuver to attempt to land our own DM, DJM.(TYLER SMITH)

martin wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:

martin wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:They been chasing OG for like 2 years. The price was long established. Knicks had to pull the trigger on the deal or allow another team to get him.

Knicks signed DDV for just cap space with the idea that they would probably move IQ. Which effectively reduced the impact of losing IQ. Simultaneously OG is a far greater impact than RJ. The combination of DDV & OG with a sprinkle of Precious tilted the results.

DDV as a starter. 27gms, 24mins, 13.8pts, 3.5rebs, 2.6ast, 49/43/74% 668TS% 130Ortg 113Drtg

DDV is such a good shooter while being low usage, zero sticky and a very very good cutter and passer too.

Exactly what Grimes, uh, should be. With a teensy less on ball defense.

The way they are looking to feature OG with that 2nd unit lineup. The more Hayward makes so much sense here.

And the more thought I've put into it the more I see Brogdon as the target we should obtain through trade. 31 Assist % with a 23% Usage 15pts in 28mins sounds about right in line for our needs.

This would still allow the Knicks to maintain the draft capital in this coming draft to be able to maneuver to attempt to land our own DM, DJM.(TYLER SMITH)

Knicks are in a very good spot to make a ton of creative moves and still have a ton of other moves they can follow with.

Isn't this fantastic?

20+ years in the making my man!

Eager to see how Leon moves from a team building aspect. The DDV and then OG follow up has given me a lot of faith where I was questioning him previously.

martin wrote:

EwingsGlass wrote:

@Martin. I don’t make this request often. My last one was for the D’antoni Pringles guy. But given how OG has performed this last month and my absolute adoration for OG - stemming from an embarrassing affectation going on 2 years. Followed by my standing against the overwhelming crowd here that hated this trade. I would be grateful. No, indebted, if you could create an emoticon in honor of OG Anunoby that captures the above image. I respect the work you put into this site and don’t mean to ask for more. But… the crow. It is time to mark its place in immortality.

Will do it. Need a bit of time (I am overwhelmed on the personal side these days), and if I forgot, just nudge me a bit.

Thank you!!!!

nycericanguy wrote:

DLeethal wrote:

nycericanguy wrote:OG is bigger and more impactful than I imagined. The issue isn't the player, it's what we gave up and whether we can replace it. Otherwise our ceiling is largely the same.

We struggled against all the top teams this year before the trade. We couldn't hang with any of them. We have beaten the crap out of all the top 3 teams in each conference we have played so far after the trade. Not a huge sample size, but it's hard to say our ceiling hasn't been raised. Our floor and our ceiling has been raised.

I think you are ignoring too much how this team was trending before the trade and focusing too much on how they played in the second half of last year instead. Different year, we weren't the same team.

Also, there is zero point of judging this team as if it's the finished product. We have a gazillion picks we will need to move. So even if the move was made to solidify a super important role next to Brunson and Randle, and in your mind was a lateral move (it's not), it allows us to build a much stronger team with another tweak or two. You have to build your team brick by brick and never in one swoop. If this was one step sideways it allows us to take two steps forward with another move.

This team would school the team that was giving up 130 a night though, there is no doubt about it.

i get it but its a long season full of ebbs and flows and we were playing a brutal schedule. I doubt we would have been a bad defensive team all year.

I mean i've gone back and forth on the trade, OG has been better than expected so far defensively. and we probably signed DDV with the intention of moving IQ. so it's offset somewhat.

just waiting for that next move.

Why would that team not have been bad all year? There was barely any defense in that rotation and Mitch was no longer there to clean it up. We ranked 19th the year before, we were trending to being a bottom 5 or bottom 3 defense before the trade. That stretch was not just a bad stretch by a decent defensive team. It was a historically bad stretch by a bad defensive team.