Posted by crzymdups:

No offense, guys, but I have extreme faith in Isiah's talent evaluation. If Isiah looks at Bynum, Granger, Wright, Webster, Warrick, Blatche, Taft, Green, Ellis, Simien, etc and decides Frye is his guy, I trust that. (Knicks are working out Blatche today).

Frye didn't bang in the post in college because that's not the system Olsen favors. He favors quick decisions with the ball. One dribble, then shoot or pass unless the ball was in Salim Stoudimire's hands. Look at Jefferson's numbers at Arizona - 11ppg and 4rpg, nothing to write home about - but looking back, Jefferson could arguably be the best player from that draft.

Zeke has never made a catastrophic mistake in the draft like you guys are predicting Frye to be, so IF he takes him, can we all agree to have a little patience to see how he fits with the actual team and how his game actually translates?

For all the Bynum hype, how do we know he has the mental makeup to be anything more than Yinka Dare or Dasagana Diop. Judging players on their physical attributes is nice, but it only tells you so much. Look at all the power forwards every year that are built like Elton Brand and get compared to him. None of them ever have the success Elton did. There is more to evaluating a player than size, strength and length. Strength, in particular, can be worked on and Frye has the frame to add more and he's working with the best trainer in basketball. And IF he comes to the Knicks, he'll be working with one of the best big man coaches in the league in Agguire. Sorry, but I trust Zeke to evaluate talent in the draft.

Posted by nyk4ever:

I am one of Isiah's biggest supporters and I am so in every facet of him being the GM. This is why I am completely and have the utmost confidence that he will NOT select Channing.

Originally posted by nyk4ever:

I am one of Isiah's biggest supporters and I am so in every facet of him being the GM. This is why I am completely and have the utmost confidence that he will NOT select Channing.

But, all I'm saying is IF IF IF he does, can we agree to wait and see what Frye looks like in the NBA before declaring him a bust? For one thing, people here have been dogging Frye's makeup, saying he took it easy in college games, but that had a lot to do with the way the offense was run. Camby only averaged 7 rebounds a game in college, I'm not saying Frye will be Camby, but I am saying a guy's college rebounding totals can be misleading. It all depends on a team's defensive and offensive schemes.

Edit: Also, I can pretty much guarantee you Granger will be gone by pick 8. I would take Granger over Frye too. But Granger might go 5th at this rate and he'll certainly go 7th.

[Edited by - crzymdups on 06/15/2005 11:54:32]

Posted by crzymdups:

Originally posted by nyk4ever:

I am one of Isiah's biggest supporters and I am so in every facet of him being the GM. This is why I am completely and have the utmost confidence that he will NOT select Channing.

But, all I'm saying is IF IF IF he does, can we agree to wait and see what Frye looks like in the NBA before declaring him a bust? For one thing, people here have been dogging Frye's makeup, saying he took it easy in college games, but that had a lot to do with the way the offense was run. Camby only averaged 7 rebounds a game in college, I'm not saying Frye will be Camby, but I am saying a guy's college rebounding totals can be misleading. It all depends on a team's defensive and offensive schemes.

Edit: Also, I can pretty much guarantee you Granger will be gone by pick 8. I would take Granger over Frye too. But Granger might go 5th at this rate and he'll certainly go 7th.

[Edited by - crzymdups on 06/15/2005 11:54:32]

From what I've heard, I don't like the idea of drafting Frye at #8, but I agree with you that if he is drafted at #8, he deserves a chance before we kill him.

Posted by crzymdups:

Posted by nyk4ever:

Posted by crzymdups:

But, all I'm saying is IF IF IF he does, can we agree to wait and see what Frye looks like in the NBA before declaring him a bust? For one thing, people here have been dogging Frye's makeup, saying he took it easy in college games, but that had a lot to do with the way the offense was run. Camby only averaged 7 rebounds a game in college, I'm not saying Frye will be Camby, but I am saying a guy's college rebounding totals can be misleading. It all depends on a team's defensive and offensive schemes.

Thats fine Crzy and I would agree with you 99.9% of the time, but you have to take a look at other big men that have come out of Arizona and away from Lute's system. The big men that have come out of that system and into the NBA, not them has done a thing in the NBA and there have been a few who were just as succesful as Channing was in college, guys like Loren Woods, Tom Tolbert just to name a few.

Lute's system doesn't produce good NBA big men as well as it produces good NBA guards. I just don't see Channing having the ability to change his game for the better in the NBA becuase 1. he doesnt have the body and 2. it hasn't been done before by any other former Arizona big man yet.

[Edited by - nyk4ever on 06/15/2005 11:58:32]

That's a decent point, but I think WHERE a guy comes from shouldn't really preclude him from being elavuated on his own merits. Loren Woods also had three back surgeries which sapped him of any leaping ability and from what I've heard does not have the mental makeup of Frye. Also Woods' stats were probably inflated by playing with Arenas and Jefferson on one of the best college teams of the last ten years or so.

I mean, yeah, I have my reservations about Frye too, but honestly, it's the 8th pick, I have reservations about every single guy who will be there. Even Granger, who would be my no.1 option if I thought he would fall that far, has had a torn meniscus in his knee and has had a few surgeries. It's a draft with a lot of potential players, but to me, every single player has at least one red flag. But, yeah, I trust Zeke to grab two players (at least) in this draft, and if he takes Frye, I'll be happy to wait and see.

Posted by nyk4ever:


Theres nothing with that I don't agree with there, we're just going to have to wait and see. Just curious though, who do you like at 8 besides Frye and say Granger is off the board already.

Posted by crzymdups:

Posted by nyk4ever:


Theres nothing with that I don't agree with there, we're just going to have to wait and see. Just curious though, who do you like at 8 besides Frye and say Granger is off the board already.

After those two? I would avoid Felton because I think that would make the backcourt FAR too small. I'd avoid Wright, for some reason I don't trust him, he only shot 38% for his first two years of school. Mostly, I'd avoid him because I feel the Knicks need a SF far more than another SG. The guys I like:

1) Graham
2) Warrick
3) Green (not sure if he'll be there at 8)
4) Bynum
5) Webster
6) Diogu (we'd have to move some guys out)
7) Blatche