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hey... we were neck and neck with Milw with 4 weeks left to go
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SKY
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5/25/2005  9:49 PM
Whatever happened happened, whether we liked it or not.

It is obvious that this current management does not believe in what some of us do - the importance of playing the youth, the value of good draft position, etc. What can you do about it? Nothing.

So we got the 8th pick. Fine. I'm interested in seeing who's gonna come up big in the workouts and camps. Personally. I'm very much keen on Bynum. He's got all the physical & mental tools to be great down the road. it seems. If Calhoun is so high on him... that's a good sign. I don't care if we wait 3-4 yrs for him to develop. I just want to see a great dominant C wearing the Knick uniform and excitment in the Garden again.

Now, do I have my hopes high? NO... I'm just not convinced that Isiah & Dolan are willing to invest in a kid who's gonna take 3-4 yrs to develop. So, I'm "hoping for the best, expecting the worst." And that worst, I think, is something like Isiah trading the 8th pick & TT for Ilgauskas & filler, or some shi t like that. If he doesn't trade away the picks and get us 3 young solid prospects, I'd be happy. As for coaching search, if he can hire a defensive minded coach who is willing to play the youth, that'd be great. Who do I want? Nate McMillan.
AUTOADVERT
Bonn1997
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5/25/2005  11:14 PM
Posted by Killa4luv:

I thik you guys are being a bunch of cry babies. Get over it.
I agree; we knew for a few weeks that there was about a 70% chance of getting the 8th pick. And then, *shockingly*, we found out that we actually did get the 8th pick and people are talking like this is a disaster and they never saw it coming. 48 hours ago the 8th pick was fine, but once it was confirmed Tuesday, the 8th pick became a disaster on dozens of threads here.

They shoulda played the young'ns more regardless of 3 percentage points, but they didn't.
I'd agree with regard to Butler. I think Sweetney got at least as many minutes as he deserved if not more. Ariza could have had slightly more minutes but there's nothing wrong with 18 mpg. A lot of organizations played older, first rd picks fewer min.
gunsnewing
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5/25/2005  11:17 PM
we wanted the 7th pick and the chance at Gerald Green not the 8th pick!
TMS
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5/26/2005  12:38 AM
Posted by Bonn1997:
Posted by Killa4luv:

I thik you guys are being a bunch of cry babies. Get over it.
I agree; we knew for a few weeks that there was about a 70% chance of getting the 8th pick. And then, *shockingly*, we found out that we actually did get the 8th pick and people are talking like this is a disaster and they never saw it coming. 48 hours ago the 8th pick was fine, but once it was confirmed Tuesday, the 8th pick became a disaster on dozens of threads here.

Bonn, i seem to remember plenty of us agreeing at the beginning of the season that the worst possible outcome of this season would be missing out on the playoffs while winning just enough games to end up w/a #8-#10 pick in the lottery...*shockingly* that's exactly where we find ourselves today...excuse us for being disappointed.

[Edited by - TMS on 05/26/2005 00:39:39]
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
Allanfan20
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5/26/2005  1:49 AM
Posted by TMS:
Posted by Bonn1997:
Posted by Killa4luv:

I thik you guys are being a bunch of cry babies. Get over it.
I agree; we knew for a few weeks that there was about a 70% chance of getting the 8th pick. And then, *shockingly*, we found out that we actually did get the 8th pick and people are talking like this is a disaster and they never saw it coming. 48 hours ago the 8th pick was fine, but once it was confirmed Tuesday, the 8th pick became a disaster on dozens of threads here.

Bonn, i seem to remember plenty of us agreeing at the beginning of the season that the worst possible outcome of this season would be missing out on the playoffs while winning just enough games to end up w/a #8-#10 pick in the lottery...*shockingly* that's exactly where we find ourselves today...excuse us for being disappointed.

[Edited by - TMS on 05/26/2005 00:39:39]

Don't even bother with him anymore TMS. He's not gonna change his mind no matter how ugly things get. Not worth the reply anymore.
“Whenever I’m about to do something, I think ‘Would an idiot do that?’ and if they would, I do NOT do that thing.”- Dwight Schrute
fishmike
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5/26/2005  7:17 AM
well he's always got Trevor Ariza and his almost 20 minutes a game to dispell any notion that the Knicks are a win now veteran team with no direction or management.

While I do think you (Bonn) have no idea what your talking about and you strike me as a guy who's never seen a live basketball game in your life I do like you. Its not personal at all
Everytime I read your posts you just strike me as someone screaming for attention and above all a need to be right. And if your not right you have to find something to be right about. Its annoying but your cool with me. Everyone here is... if I can find love in my heart for Isles theres some there for you too.
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
diderotn
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5/26/2005  7:24 AM
Check, it is what it is. Mistake were made and we just have to move on now. Isiah still has multiple chances to undo all of last seasons wrong...He has no choice but to hire a new coach...I don't particularly like the position that Herb is holding right now, because in all actuality, it is not fair to him. It will be very disappointing if Isiah decides to bring in a new cat to coach this squad, and around the NBA he will have a bad rap amongst younger coaches. I know that it is a business, and Isiah has to do what he has to do. But he has to make us his mind about Herb now.

As for the 8th pick, I am not satisfied with it, but it is better than 10 at this point. Isiah has to get us a couple more of first round picks to undue the mistakes that were made before and after his arrival as a GM...We have assets that can be moved, and we must move them to create rooms...There is no reason what so ever to have all of the PFs that we have on our roster...Especially as costly as they are..There are plenty of teams looking for guys like: Mo T, Kurt, JYD, Sweetney, and even Rose...Find ways to move a combo of those names for early or late 1st round picks..
The true Knickabocker..........
Pharzeone
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5/26/2005  1:49 PM
Posted by Allanfan20:

Dude, he's talking about how the reserves got more and more minutes AFTER the all star game, when it was clear they were out of contention. Ariza's time decreased and decreased. Butler played like, a total of 1 minute. Marbury had some nagging injuries, yet he continued to play his usual playing time, heck, even more. Crawford and TT continued to get their playing time. KT and Mo T got theirs. We won like 3 meaningless games at the end that we definitely could have and should have lost. So really, what was the point in not giving Ariza 25 minutes, Butler maybe 10 15 minutes and Sundov, ohhh, 12 minutes. Bonn, I know you like to look at the Knicks as if they are surrounded by roses and honey, but truthfully, they are in perhaps the deepest pits of the NBA and one of the most poorly run teams in all of sports. Dolan needs to sell the team for the interest of all parties.
That is what I find more distasteful about Herb Williams was that Marbury minutes increase when he was comparing of back and knee issues. The guy played like a full year when you throw in the Olympics. But the day this organization was going downhill was the day that traded Ewing away for an over the hill Glen Rice and thought that an overrated jump shooter was worth $100 million bucks. As reported on ESPN that signing was ranked as one of the worst signings in the history of sports when Houston was a 100% healthly, now its criminal.
I don't like to play bad rookies , I like to play good rookies - Mike D'Antoni
Pharzeone
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5/26/2005  1:51 PM
Posted by fishmike:

forget about Bogut or Gerald Green... we will always have the April wins of 05 to look back on with fondness
Bogut wasn't even in my mind. Green maybe.
I don't like to play bad rookies , I like to play good rookies - Mike D'Antoni
fishmike
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5/26/2005  2:13 PM
why is it Herb's fault? Is his job not to win games? Chaney did the same thing with Houston and for all we know it will end up ruining his career (Houston's).

Now if upper managent gives instructions to get guys in games for alloted minutes than its a the coaches job to do so. There is no conspiracy theory here. This comes from the top... it isnt the coaches decision.
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
Pharzeone
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5/26/2005  3:59 PM
Posted by fishmike:

why is it Herb's fault? Is his job not to win games? Chaney did the same thing with Houston and for all we know it will end up ruining his career (Houston's).

Now if upper managent gives instructions to get guys in games for alloted minutes than its a the coaches job to do so. There is no conspiracy theory here. This comes from the top... it isnt the coaches decision.
Two things about what you said. Isiah told him to think about resting Marbury, Herb didn't listen he said the team wanted to "go out" on a highnote, this is what Mike Breen said during Wizards game. Second, please explain to me, by not playing Ariza you are looking to win games, where is this logic coming from. I would think Herb would be saying yeah i want to win these games and Ariza is our best perimeter defender. For whatever reason, Herb said Ariza ain't my guy down the stretch for games that I want to win. Tell me how is that management fault. What now management has to coach Herb's games. "look Herb you are too dumb to know this but since we are eliminated from the playoffs, it would make sense to rest our guys and let our younger players play to gain that much needed experience. I hope you realize that if you win two games down the stretch we still want to upgrade the coaching job. And btw, remember to pull down your zipper when you go #1." Come on.
I don't like to play bad rookies , I like to play good rookies - Mike D'Antoni
fishmike
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5/26/2005  4:48 PM
"Isiah told him to think about resting Marbury"
When was this? I read every article, follow every story. I never heard ANY mention of this. As for Ariza not being his guy down the stretch why is that a shock? He's 19. He makes rookie mistakes. If Herb is trying to win every game then its hard to live with Ariza's mistakes. I would, you would because we would rather lose with him than win 37 with Malik and co.

Go make Herb a scape goat... I dont care, but I can tell you with pretty good confidence that he's going to talk to Isiah every day and do everything possible to earn an extension. If Isiah tells him to rest Marbury you can bet he's going to do that.
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
Solace
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5/26/2005  5:04 PM
This was poor management. Case closed.

We don't know what *would've* happened, had we gotten the #6 slot, but we know the Bucks have him or Williams. Knowing this management, we wind up with a #8 pick which we trade for Tractor Traylor.
Wishing everyone well. I enjoyed posting here for a while, but as I matured I realized this forum isn't for me. We all evolve. Thanks for the memories everyone.
TMS
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5/26/2005  5:57 PM
we already have Tractor Traylor.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
Knicksfan
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5/26/2005  9:45 PM
That is Knicks at their best, too bad it makes fans feel worst. Im telling ya, one more pathetic, stupid, waste of time, meaningles mediocre year like last one, including idiotic wins at the end of the season and another 8th pick, and Im out for a while of the Knicks. I just hate it. Hate stupid managers saying how the future is great while they have nothing to prove. Hate players that have enough talent to make the NBA yet none when it comes down to playing to win, as a team. Hate being over the Cap, with little rookies and not even a great, not good, great pick to show for it.
Knicks_Fan
Pharzeone
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5/27/2005  1:56 AM
Posted by fishmike:

"Isiah told him to think about resting Marbury"
When was this? I read every article, follow every story. I never heard ANY mention of this. As for Ariza not being his guy down the stretch why is that a shock? He's 19. He makes rookie mistakes. If Herb is trying to win every game then its hard to live with Ariza's mistakes. I would, you would because we would rather lose with him than win 37 with Malik and co.

Go make Herb a scape goat... I dont care, but I can tell you with pretty good confidence that he's going to talk to Isiah every day and do everything possible to earn an extension. If Isiah tells him to rest Marbury you can bet he's going to do that.
Go back to the articles before the end of season. It was reported that Isiah wanted to talk to Herb about injury issues that some players had. This was per Breen during a home telecast. Breen said that Herb wants to win these games for pride and Clyde agreed with him. They claim that the players wanted to win those games. No one is making Herb a scape goat, he was given full authority to make his starting lineups, who to play and what not. He was and still is head coach of the Knicks. You are insulting Herb Williams if you say that he was not capable of knowing who to play, who needs to play, and what a player can bring to a team. If Herb didn't like Ariza, or thought he could have help him down the stretch that's on Herb. If Isiah had to tell him how many minutes a player should be getting the press would have killed the both of them. Ariza didn't play because Herb didn't want him to play. No one knows why, hell maybe Ariza did something in practice down the stretch that ticked off the coaching staff. Who knows but it was Herb's decision.
I don't like to play bad rookies , I like to play good rookies - Mike D'Antoni
Bonn1997
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5/28/2005  9:26 AM
Posted by Allanfan20:
Posted by TMS:
Posted by Bonn1997:
Posted by Killa4luv:

I thik you guys are being a bunch of cry babies. Get over it.
I agree; we knew for a few weeks that there was about a 70% chance of getting the 8th pick. And then, *shockingly*, we found out that we actually did get the 8th pick and people are talking like this is a disaster and they never saw it coming. 48 hours ago the 8th pick was fine, but once it was confirmed Tuesday, the 8th pick became a disaster on dozens of threads here.

Bonn, i seem to remember plenty of us agreeing at the beginning of the season that the worst possible outcome of this season would be missing out on the playoffs while winning just enough games to end up w/a #8-#10 pick in the lottery...*shockingly* that's exactly where we find ourselves today...excuse us for being disappointed.

[Edited by - TMS on 05/26/2005 00:39:39]

Don't even bother with him anymore TMS. He's not gonna change his mind no matter how ugly things get. Not worth the reply anymore.
Not true. I've already said that if things aren't improving by the trade deadline next season, I'll be disappointed in Isiah.

Bonn, i seem to remember plenty of us agreeing at the beginning of the season that the worst possible outcome of this season would be missing out on the playoffs while winning just enough games to end up w/a #8-#10 pick in the lottery...*shockingly* that's exactly where we find ourselves today...excuse us for being disappointed.
I remember it differently. I remember people saying the worst outcome would be barely missing the playoffs and getting a low lottery pick (somewhere around 11 to 14 maybe). That's obviously worse than the 8 pick.
Bonn1997
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5/28/2005  9:31 AM
Posted by fishmike:

well he's always got Trevor Ariza and his almost 20 minutes a game to dispell any notion that the Knicks are a win now veteran team with no direction or management.

While I do think you (Bonn) have no idea what your talking
Like I said, it's a mutual feeling. We both think the other knows nothing about the game. The only difference is that you obsessively need to point it out or subtly put people down.

Everytime I read your posts you just strike me as someone screaming for attention and above all a need to be right.
Not really. I have no problem admitting I was dead wrong with my 45 win prediction for this season.
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hey... we were neck and neck with Milw with 4 weeks left to go
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