[ IMAGES: Images ON turn off | ACCOUNT: User Status is LOCKED why? ]

i wouldnt add payroll UNLESS it was for a young player here is why
Author Thread
Pike
Posts: 21378
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 5/13/2003
Member: #403
1/14/2005  3:35 PM
Posted by djsunyc:

fair enough - we obviously have different opinions on KT.

only on KT's current value and who to trade him for... I do feel he should be dealt (for right player) to open up minutes for Sweets.
AUTOADVERT
bigpimpin
Posts: 22176
Alba Posts: 3
Joined: 11/17/2004
Member: #801
USA
1/14/2005  3:38 PM
fishmike okay i'm sorry i'll stop talking about kurt thomas

you are right his team loses year after year after year

but guess what. it's never "his" team.



"Anyone who sits around waiting to hit the lottery, whether basketball or real life, in order to better their position is a loser."
djsunyc
Posts: 44929
Alba Posts: 42
Joined: 1/16/2004
Member: #536
1/14/2005  3:39 PM
Posted by bigpimpin:
Posted by djsunyc:

i guess i just believe that:

marbury, crawford, ariza, swift/sweets, kwame

is better than

marbury, crawford, ariza, kurt/sweets, nazr


you may be right but i don't even think that would be the team that the knicks would have after and if they were to get kwame brown and stromile swift

if tim thomas and allan houston played up to their potential. your word then how could you have anything bad to say about kt then

i've seen kurt thomas get his arse handed to him on a couple of occasions but i also seen marbury, houston and tbig game tim thomas get theirs handed also

i think when it all comes down to it and you name the most effecient -players on our roster, then you have to put kurt in the top 4 or 5

tim has been a bust this year. i think everybody knows we'd be winning more games if tim played like he did last year (maybe a +5 in game differential) that still doesn't change my view on kurt. kurt is good and you can start him, IF you're center is duncan or shaq. but it's not. it's nazr. that's not a good enough complement. and replacing nazr is tougher b/c of his position. that's why you dump kurt who's reached his peak.

as for h20 living up to his potential? he reached his potential 2 years ago. now he's 30 coming of knee surgeries. he's done. there's no more potential there. it now the downswing and i'm afraid it may be a quick plummet.

like i said, you got a flawed star and 3 young pieces. nazr is ok AT BEST. and that's it. role players are need on every team, but heck, you can DRAFT role players. 30 year old role players are good for championship level teams, not ours.
TMS
Posts: 60684
Alba Posts: 617
Joined: 5/11/2004
Member: #674
USA
1/14/2005  3:40 PM
no team will ever be his team, no matter where he plays...he's just not a star calibre player...the point is we are searching for a star calibre player to fill that spot on this team...whether Kwame or Curry could is debateable, but it's a risk you have to take...you have enough veteran role players here to pick up the slack once KT is gone.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
fishmike
Posts: 53867
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 7/19/2002
Member: #298
USA
1/14/2005  3:43 PM
forget about taking risks with young players. Let Kwame explode somewhere else. Give me old dependable KT on the pick and roll every day.

At some point people need to look at the results and not the stats. KT plays a ton of minutes, and he plays very hard. He works hard on D for a team that doesnt play any. I understand why people over value him. The simple fact is he's overmatched most night, and the numbers dont lie: we have been killed at PF and SF all year long. Its not even close. We win the battle at center. We win the battle at PG, and SG is a slight minus (1 point). SF and PF were are -5.3 and -5.4. Maybe that will change at SF now, but whats changing at PF? I havent seen much change there for 4 years.
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
franco12
Posts: 34069
Alba Posts: 4
Joined: 2/19/2004
Member: #599
USA
1/14/2005  4:20 PM
You guys are all bashing Kurt- what team is going to want him if he is so bad?

Kurt isn't the problem with the team, the team is the problem with the team- that is to say the talent/effort level of all the players is poor.

Lets replace TT or JYD with TMAC and suddenly, no one is going to be saying Kurt has to go.

Is KT one of the better players on the team- yes.

Is that a problem that he is? Yes!

Trade him? Absolutely.

What is Kurt fetching on the open market? I don't see any news items anywhere on the internet where teams are desperate to acquire KT- if I missed any, point them out.

Until Sweets blossoms, we might be stuck with KT for a long time
Vmart
Posts: 31800
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 5/23/2002
Member: #247
USA
1/14/2005  5:55 PM
Posted by fishmike:

forget about taking risks with young players. Let Kwame explode somewhere else. Give me old dependable KT on the pick and roll every day.

At some point people need to look at the results and not the stats. KT plays a ton of minutes, and he plays very hard. He works hard on D for a team that doesnt play any. I understand why people over value him. The simple fact is he's overmatched most night, and the numbers dont lie: we have been killed at PF and SF all year long. Its not even close. We win the battle at center. We win the battle at PG, and SG is a slight minus (1 point). SF and PF were are -5.3 and -5.4. Maybe that will change at SF now, but whats changing at PF? I havent seen much change there for 4 years.

Fish, these are exactly my sentiments. I have pointed out KT's faults and how he has held this team down for over 3 years now and I have been called nuts by fans on the board. But KT is not going to get this team to a championship. The Knicks have changed at every position and remain with KT it seems that the Knicks are being built around KT rather than Marbury and athletic running pg. This is no way to compliment a athletic pg with a slow as molasses PF.

I understand loyalty but I also understand winning. Its great to have loyalty to a player but most are blind to the faults of a player when Loyalty is involved. KT needs to be removed from the lineup ASAP. He is the culprit that is holding the team down. Since the day that he has taken to the lineup they have been below .500 and well below .500. People will say how do you blame one person on a team I can when the player is playing close to 37 minutes a game. At the same time if one player can make a difference in winnig one player also can be the difference in losing.
franco12
Posts: 34069
Alba Posts: 4
Joined: 2/19/2004
Member: #599
USA
1/14/2005  6:29 PM
I suppose we should just release Kurt? Offer him a buyout.
Vmart
Posts: 31800
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 5/23/2002
Member: #247
USA
1/14/2005  8:43 PM
Posted by franco12:

I suppose we should just release Kurt? Offer him a buyout.

If Isiah did that it would be admission of a mistake and we all know he will not do that. He would rather rot in hell before he admits making a mistake.
TMS
Posts: 60684
Alba Posts: 617
Joined: 5/11/2004
Member: #674
USA
1/15/2005  9:32 AM
no one here thinks KT is useless & should be released...on the contrary, we are all acknowledging that he has value & that this value should be used NOW to get ourselves a younger, more athletic bigman who has the potential to be better than he is in the near future...if we thought he was a scrub we wouldn't even be thinking along these lines...who would want to trade a young player w/talent for someone who isn't any good?
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
gunsnewing
Posts: 55076
Alba Posts: 5
Joined: 2/24/2002
Member: #215
USA
1/15/2005  11:13 AM
Posted by fishmike:

Brown's improved each year, he's dont things like attend that big man's camp in the offseason and has had some MONSTER games.

Nazr = nice player
Kwame = prospect with Jermain Oneil type upside and 6 years younger

the only similarity i see are the braids. Jneal is miles ahead of Kwame as a shotblocker/defender.

I'm all for getting rid of KT and picking up one of the potential guys like kwame, swift and chandler but they won't make us contenders. A trade for a big time player like Brand will get us a lot closer

[Edited by - gunsnewing on 01/15/2005 11:19:30]
JUNKMEIN
Posts: 20401
Alba Posts: 0
Joined: 11/14/2004
Member: #797
1/15/2005  12:59 PM
I just read through this entire thread and I have not seen any links to speculation of Nazr or Kurt for Brown. I can see why people are admant in their admiration and dislike for Kurt. Kurt maximizes his ability although it is unquestionably limited. I fall in the pat on the butt but have a nice career in Washington Kurt group. Nevertheless Washington would have to be insane to trade Brown for Kurt plus a pick. They could get infinitely more than we could offer. Nazr plus whatever makes no sense for us because who's gonna play center then...Kurt (uhh no thanks). If Isiah get's a Kurt plus pick for Brown deal done....he is truly the man. Beyond that all of this is pure unadulterated speculation.
fishmike
Posts: 53867
Alba Posts: 1
Joined: 7/19/2002
Member: #298
USA
1/15/2005  1:22 PM
Guns... of course JO is light years ahead of Kwame, but not where they were career wise. Kwame's number have gotten better each year and he had some MONSTER games last year. Oneil literally sat and average about 5 minutes a game for 4 years never seeing any stretch where he did anything at all.
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
gunsnewing
Posts: 55076
Alba Posts: 5
Joined: 2/24/2002
Member: #215
USA
1/15/2005  2:09 PM
let me just say that Kurt is better than TT but TT's expiring contract gives him value. KT is just a mediocre PF hindering the developement of Sweetney and getting torched by 95% of the PF's in this league
i wouldnt add payroll UNLESS it was for a young player here is why

©2001-2025 ultimateknicks.comm All rights reserved. About Us.
This site is not affiliated with the NY Knicks or the National Basketball Association in any way.
You may visit the official NY Knicks web site by clicking here.

All times (GMT-05:00) Eastern Time.

Terms of Use and Privacy Policy