Chandler and Gallo has had nice NBA careers and their upside was not known then. We got hindsight. Felton was still a good player and Mozgov was proved a good servicable center and back up. That was the trade then and as mentioned Melo had leverage as he was prepared to walk. CBA now has extensions that could have made things differnt. At some point DM could extend here way in front of his contract season.

Both teams seemed to have faired about the same in retrospect. WE had a 54 win season, they had a 57 with Karl winning COTY. Both teams retooled in the aftermath with Denver getting Joikic has made them relevant for a while now. Injuiries to Murray and MPJ delicate gamble has yet to really pay off. This is a team that can go all the way or bounce out as they have.

The mega trade era now involved picks. I don’t see the “Well melo did not work so we should not do this”. Thats kind of silly unless you believe we don’t have a good core to work with. Then we had Amare on Fragile knee but playing very well, Melo, Billups who was on his last leg. Then we got JR Smith. The cupboard was empty.

What does it look like in the aftermath and do we really think the folks that developed this core of yoot some of youu are super excited about cannot duplicate it going forward? Teh trade is likey not going to be 5 picks and Obi,Grimes, Deuce, IQ and Sims.
We still have yoot and picks left over. Also:
One seaosn removed All NBA/all star Randle. We needed a playmaking guard. We get two. He should be more efficient player.
22 year old trending allstar RJ on the rise.
One of the better rim protectors in MRob.

That is very different than the aftermath of the MElo trade. Its not a championship team on paper. But I don’t see one in the horizon if we don’t. I believe we are better with Brunson and am fine either with or without DM.

Yes, another star might become available. Yes, one of the picks might prove to be very good. Its how things work.
Our 54 win season built on 5 retiring players was super fun and nobody really cared how good Denver was or was not. We had our fun, the garden rocked and on paper the deal for Bargnani was a reasonable Risk based on his health. It failed miserably. We gave up Novak, Camby, 2 2nd round picks and the 1st which became https://www.sportsnet.ca/basketball/nba/players/jakob-poeltl/844478 a good player. For sure would have been better than Bargs. But, if healthy Bargs at 7 foot and could shoot was a bit of a visionary concept for this new era. (Not saying he was transcend). Like many knick risk attempts it did not execute well and it continued the drain on rebuilding assets going forward. I doubt Grunwald was fired over that but it was the type of move a GM does to save his ass. The next season the mass retirments occured and we dropped to under .500. Woodson was let go and the Phil era ensued after a brief Mills reign. Very brief. Phil did not have his all his picks and had to attempt a quasi relevant team while rebuilding. Core of Drose, Noah and Melo could have been a low seed playoff team on paper. Too bad we don’t play on paper. The rest we know all to well. My guess was Grunwald was on thin ice given he was really left behind by Isiah and unless he got them to playoffs he was toast. Stupid to do that to a gm and make trades. Then even dumber to cut Phil off before he traded KP for max value. Dolan seems to get things wrong even when he does the right thing.

My point is the cupboard is much more robust and was filled to make a trade like this. None of it played out like we thought it would. The Brunson signing was very telegraphed and we played it good. If he had extended at any time last season we were out. So dumping Kemba was not awful. It was not a high price. That DM was made available after is curious. Ainge and the world knew knicks and him are a good fit and we had the assets. If anything getting Brunson works out of his favor as we are not so motivated as would be if he did not sign here. Seems as if they got an offer they could not refuse on Rudy and he went first. Im not so sure utah is that desperate to trade DM. Utah wants to be motivated and knicks under leon don’t chase fi the price is not right.

I only know what I read. Seems media says it gets done and knicks have best package to offer but that don’t mean leon will spend all the booty on one trade.

ramtour420 wrote:I am not so sure anymore. Mitchell's d is helped by his absurd 6'10 wingspan and he is top 10 in steals. We could and should see an improvement on that end playing for Thibs.With the new rule on fast break fouls that could prove to be immensely valuable. It could catapult our offense. But we would have to fully commit to a run and gun style. It's actually not so far fetched as we have already upped our pace last season

Mitchell needs the ball in his hands. I don’t see him playing well off ball. We are going to need 3 basketballs when Mitch, Randle and Brunson are all on the court

Philc1 wrote:

ramtour420 wrote:I am not so sure anymore. Mitchell's d is helped by his absurd 6'10 wingspan and he is top 10 in steals. We could and should see an improvement on that end playing for Thibs.With the new rule on fast break fouls that could prove to be immensely valuable. It could catapult our offense. But we would have to fully commit to a run and gun style. It's actually not so far fetched as we have already upped our pace last season

Mitchell needs the ball in his hands. I don’t see him playing well off ball. We are going to need 3 basketballs when Mitch, Randle and Brunson are all on the court

I don't really think this as a problem. 2 guards that can create and play off the ball. I mean I hated the Bad Boys but Popcorn Man and Dumars were awesome. I don't think Donovan will be exposed in defense playing the 2 either. Dude is the biggest 6'1" basketball player I have ever seen. I mean he plays big and the 6'10" wingspan is absurd. The only question to me would RJ be able to handle guarding the 3 spot in a consistent basis. Then again not a lot of post guys anymore so I don't think that will be a problem either.

To me, as long as we don't give a ton for Donovan then I see this as a win.

BRIGGS wrote:

SergioNYK wrote:I'd walk away tbh. Ainge is being such a prick. Hold off to our picks and assets until the next stay comes along - Booker? Beal? - and tell Ainge to go to hell.

100%

I don't think the price for him is off from what Ainge is asking for- be honest, if he were on the Knicks, what would you ask for? Top 10/20 player, 25 years old, 4 years on his contract.

Now- it just doesn't make sense for either side to do the deal.

NYKBocker wrote:

Philc1 wrote:

ramtour420 wrote:I am not so sure anymore. Mitchell's d is helped by his absurd 6'10 wingspan and he is top 10 in steals. We could and should see an improvement on that end playing for Thibs.With the new rule on fast break fouls that could prove to be immensely valuable. It could catapult our offense. But we would have to fully commit to a run and gun style. It's actually not so far fetched as we have already upped our pace last season

Mitchell needs the ball in his hands. I don’t see him playing well off ball. We are going to need 3 basketballs when Mitch, Randle and Brunson are all on the court

I don't really think this as a problem. 2 guards that can create and play off the ball. I mean I hated the Bad Boys but Popcorn Man and Dumars were awesome. I don't think Donovan will be exposed in defense playing the 2 either. Dude is the biggest 6'1" basketball player I have ever seen. I mean he plays big and the 6'10" wingspan is absurd. The only question to me would RJ be able to handle guarding the 3 spot in a consistent basis. Then again not a lot of post guys anymore so I don't think that will be a problem either.

To me, as long as we don't give a ton for Donovan then I see this as a win.

But Ainge wants the farm plus

Mitchell’s game is driving to the basket and stopping and popping. That would be fine but we now have Brunson. We need catch and shoot 3 and D guys who can hit at a high percentage

detnehoc wrote:Sorry...forgot to detail the bid for Donovan Mitchel...Rose plus as many picks as it takes.

You are trading all those picks for 1 or 2 years of an aged Lebron? Not knocking Lebron but where is your downside protection? And you are gift wrapping Mitchell to hang with Anthony Davis? It’s like Rich Paul crafted this trade himself.

smackeddog wrote:

Philc1 wrote:

NYKBocker wrote:

Philc1 wrote:

ramtour420 wrote:I am not so sure anymore. Mitchell's d is helped by his absurd 6'10 wingspan and he is top 10 in steals. We could and should see an improvement on that end playing for Thibs.With the new rule on fast break fouls that could prove to be immensely valuable. It could catapult our offense. But we would have to fully commit to a run and gun style. It's actually not so far fetched as we have already upped our pace last season

Mitchell needs the ball in his hands. I don’t see him playing well off ball. We are going to need 3 basketballs when Mitch, Randle and Brunson are all on the court

I don't really think this as a problem. 2 guards that can create and play off the ball. I mean I hated the Bad Boys but Popcorn Man and Dumars were awesome. I don't think Donovan will be exposed in defense playing the 2 either. Dude is the biggest 6'1" basketball player I have ever seen. I mean he plays big and the 6'10" wingspan is absurd. The only question to me would RJ be able to handle guarding the 3 spot in a consistent basis. Then again not a lot of post guys anymore so I don't think that will be a problem either.

To me, as long as we don't give a ton for Donovan then I see this as a win.

But Ainge wants the farm plus

Mitchell’s game is driving to the basket and stopping and popping. That would be fine but we now have Brunson. We need catch and shoot 3 and D guys who can hit at a high percentage

Katz was saying on the KFS podcast that he'd asked around and most front offices he asked about Ainge's negotiating style in trades said the same thing- essentially he doesn't negotiate, he just sets out his high price and leaves it to them to meet it. Clashing with Roses front office style of essentially having a bottom line he doesn't cross, leaves me thinking this trade just isn't going to happen and never was as close as the media made out. Probably just ends up in a few weeks as the standard, patented media cycle of:

Player x is heading to the Knicks! -----> Fans start to believe it based on all the coverage-----> Player x doesn't come to the Knicks ------> LOL! Knicks fans thought they were going to get player x! What idiots!"

They fooled me for a few days this time though, I'll admit

Just look at all the rumored trades in Boston that didn't go down. There is a real possibility this doesn't happen. One thing that's in our favor is that Rose already crossed the line and there is no going back. The rebuild has already started and Mitchell can't come back. Trader Dan wants 'dem picks. He ' effin craves them.