Marv wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

Marv wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

Philc1 wrote:

blkexec wrote:

Jmpasq wrote:

Swishfm3 wrote:

Caseloads wrote:Julius is looking like a better version of Me7o out there

All based off of a 1 minute shoot around video. You Sir, have lost all credibility.

....and #2. What the hell has Obi Toppin done to not along start, but PUSH OUR BEST PLAYER off his natural position??? FOH

Its ridiculous, he isn't even one of the best 5 players on the team. Its the Frank nonsense all over again. Change the entire team for a back-up. Not only that but its a lineup that will get destroyed on the perimeter. At least play Obi or Randle at center if you want to run them together.

Randles the highest paid player on the team. And his best position is PF. If we are building around our best player, I would think Obi is the one who needs to either slim down or beef up. Let Randle be Randle, and we will be fine. If Obi is a future star, it doesn't matter what role he has, his star will shine. It's only his 2nd year, so no need to panic. Randle wasn't the Randle of today in his 2nd year. I'm sure Obi and staff understands the pecking order by now and Obi is stuck picking up scraps, until he proves himself over an entire season and not just the 2nd half. Worst case, he becomes a great trading chip, which gives us a player that propels us to a chip. Which could also be best case. I was caught up in his draft position, similar to frank. But regardless where he was selected, Randle is the alpha dog. And the remaining players have to adjust their game to fit in. Especially after taking a pay cu..Randle is a knick 4 life. Or at least until his contract is up. ENJOY THE RIDE

The problem is Obi will never be fast enough to guard wing players. At the same time he’s also not the rim protecting shot blocking Center that Thibs always uses. Obi could play the 5 on most NBA teams today but not a Thibs coached team

He's not a Rebounder, paint protector, defender, post player, and rarely takes mid range jumpers....He's not playing center on any team, unless it's high school...are you kidding me, they didn't even try that in SL

I don’t know man. They send him to play with his peers, 1st and 2nd year nba players, and he dominates, makes 1st-team all-SL.

Defends, blocks shots, steals, hits mid-range jumpers, 3's, strong inside play, spin drives for layups, finishes on the pick n roll, rebounds offensively and defensively, continually gets free for lobs and positions himself as a target for teammates.

We have a 23 year-old 6’9” 220 guy doing this, with a great attitude and who a demanding coach loves and we’re not happy about that? We’re not interested in getting that guy more minutes on the floor?

All I said is he can't play center in the NBA for a number of reasons, that's not hate, that's not knocking him, that's not discrediting him, that's just facts.

we are 2 deep at every position, and the starting PF is getting 35 minutes, how is going to get beyond 13 min per.
The only way you do that is to play several different positions.

actually i bolded what you said: He's not a Rebounder, paint protector, defender, post player, and rarely takes mid range jumpers

Those are the skills you need to have to be a center and he's not a center.

I think he has the skills to play PF, which is what he is

Marv wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

Philc1 wrote:

blkexec wrote:

Jmpasq wrote:

Swishfm3 wrote:

Caseloads wrote:Julius is looking like a better version of Me7o out there

All based off of a 1 minute shoot around video. You Sir, have lost all credibility.

....and #2. What the hell has Obi Toppin done to not along start, but PUSH OUR BEST PLAYER off his natural position??? FOH

Its ridiculous, he isn't even one of the best 5 players on the team. Its the Frank nonsense all over again. Change the entire team for a back-up. Not only that but its a lineup that will get destroyed on the perimeter. At least play Obi or Randle at center if you want to run them together.

Randles the highest paid player on the team. And his best position is PF. If we are building around our best player, I would think Obi is the one who needs to either slim down or beef up. Let Randle be Randle, and we will be fine. If Obi is a future star, it doesn't matter what role he has, his star will shine. It's only his 2nd year, so no need to panic. Randle wasn't the Randle of today in his 2nd year. I'm sure Obi and staff understands the pecking order by now and Obi is stuck picking up scraps, until he proves himself over an entire season and not just the 2nd half. Worst case, he becomes a great trading chip, which gives us a player that propels us to a chip. Which could also be best case. I was caught up in his draft position, similar to frank. But regardless where he was selected, Randle is the alpha dog. And the remaining players have to adjust their game to fit in. Especially after taking a pay cu..Randle is a knick 4 life. Or at least until his contract is up. ENJOY THE RIDE

The problem is Obi will never be fast enough to guard wing players. At the same time he’s also not the rim protecting shot blocking Center that Thibs always uses. Obi could play the 5 on most NBA teams today but not a Thibs coached team

He's not a Rebounder, paint protector, defender, post player, and rarely takes mid range jumpers....He's not playing center on any team, unless it's high school...are you kidding me, they didn't even try that in SL

I don’t know man. They send him to play with his peers, 1st and 2nd year nba players, and he dominates, makes 1st-team all-SL.

Defends, blocks shots, steals, hits mid-range jumpers, 3's, strong inside play, spin drives for layups, finishes on the pick n roll, rebounds offensively and defensively, continually gets free for lobs and positions himself as a target for teammates.

We have a 23 year-old 6’9” 220 guy doing this, with a great attitude and who a demanding coach loves and we’re not happy about that? We’re not interested in getting that guy more minutes on the floor?

this sort of nails it.. the dude deserves to play. Similarly, if Obi and Randle can't coexist on the roster, we need to be sure. And let's say it doesn't work, well we need Obi to put some numbers up so we don't get peanuts for a guy who has Amar'e potential

Reality is guys do get hurt or will need rest. Its not like a static set rotation. Thibs will have to go 11 deep. He played 13 guys last year. Everyone but Harper and Pinson got time/opportunity at some point.
If Obi is worthy, he will play. If Knox is competitive he will play. Thibs will play the best lineups with guys his GM has given him to win with.

Frank had plenty of opportunity to demonstrate his talents. same for Knox. Grimes and Mcbride will get moments but that might come later if they are not up to speed. Thats does not mean “never”.

Really, there is little way any of us can predict what will happen. Bad things happen also, and somtimes from that good rises. Randle might get hurt at anytime and we OBI needs to be ready to step in and up. Not that he will duplicate Randle’s production, but enough to hold down the fort as best as possible.
Also are we trying to make Knox into a 4? We all know what he has or has not been. Kid is all of 22 and his contract puts him in a precarious crossroad of his career. He will have had all last seaosn and this with a great support system of coaching to make it happen. We’llsee.

knicks1248 wrote:

Philc1 wrote:

blkexec wrote:

Jmpasq wrote:

Swishfm3 wrote:

Caseloads wrote:Julius is looking like a better version of Me7o out there

All based off of a 1 minute shoot around video. You Sir, have lost all credibility.

....and #2. What the hell has Obi Toppin done to not along start, but PUSH OUR BEST PLAYER off his natural position??? FOH

Its ridiculous, he isn't even one of the best 5 players on the team. Its the Frank nonsense all over again. Change the entire team for a back-up. Not only that but its a lineup that will get destroyed on the perimeter. At least play Obi or Randle at center if you want to run them together.

Randles the highest paid player on the team. And his best position is PF. If we are building around our best player, I would think Obi is the one who needs to either slim down or beef up. Let Randle be Randle, and we will be fine. If Obi is a future star, it doesn't matter what role he has, his star will shine. It's only his 2nd year, so no need to panic. Randle wasn't the Randle of today in his 2nd year. I'm sure Obi and staff understands the pecking order by now and Obi is stuck picking up scraps, until he proves himself over an entire season and not just the 2nd half. Worst case, he becomes a great trading chip, which gives us a player that propels us to a chip. Which could also be best case. I was caught up in his draft position, similar to frank. But regardless where he was selected, Randle is the alpha dog. And the remaining players have to adjust their game to fit in. Especially after taking a pay cu..Randle is a knick 4 life. Or at least until his contract is up. ENJOY THE RIDE

The problem is Obi will never be fast enough to guard wing players. At the same time he’s also not the rim protecting shot blocking Center that Thibs always uses. Obi could play the 5 on most NBA teams today but not a Thibs coached team

He's not a Rebounder, paint protector, defender, post player, and rarely takes mid range jumpers....He's not playing center on any team, unless it's high school...are you kidding me, they didn't even try that in SL

These are the sentiments I don’t get. Obi played well as a rookie and was good in the playoff series vs the hawks. It’s not his fault the guy ahead of him at PF played like a league MVP the entire regular season

You guys must watch a lot of ESPN talking head shows

Philc1 wrote:

SupremeCommander wrote:the team is going to have to get creative to free up deserved minutes for Obi, bottom line. If Randle can play 5-10mpg as a SF or a C it gets Obi some burn. Hopefully Randle's minutes get reduced a bit too

You don’t want Randle playing by the wing. Opposing teams will go small with 3 guard alignment and run circles on us

OR he will hold his own with team help defense while he takes his opponent apart limb by limb forcing them to change who is guarding him.
We also imporoved out offense to help him. ATL last year was able to move Capella off Taj who was starting when Noel went down, and pushed him into bad spots. RJ was golden from the corner, but Rose was cooked, and the rest of team did not step up. WE are deeper this year.
Again, where was randle when he got the ball? If you PF is running the point and bringing up the ball what do you call that? Don’t matter, If Randle want to be quicker thats fine. The Melo comps were more about Melo getting bigger and slower before he shrank in Portland to regain his quickness to play wing. Melo was a gifted rebonder at at 6-8 has the size and frame to play PF. ITs not what he wanted so he had to get his quick back which renewed his career.
We don’t know to what degree Jules is doing this. Jimmy Butler can play 2-3-4. Maybe Thibs is using Jimmy as a templete for Jules which will improve his defense. Jules upper body strenght is not going away which makes him a beast near the rim. Not the kind of “amare/obi” type of quickess but one more of solid fundamentals then high flying. Jules never had that kind of hops and is why his injuries have been minor other than his rookie broken leg.
Teams should be more worried about Jules then we should be about their 3 “running circles around us”.
ATL thru a lot at him and it worked. If that happens again and we healthy with this improveed offense it won’t happen again. Not saying we win the series but not 1-4.

Philc1 wrote:

Nalod wrote:

Philc1 wrote:

SupremeCommander wrote:the team is going to have to get creative to free up deserved minutes for Obi, bottom line. If Randle can play 5-10mpg as a SF or a C it gets Obi some burn. Hopefully Randle's minutes get reduced a bit too

You don’t want Randle playing by the wing. Opposing teams will go small with 3 guard alignment and run circles on us

OR he will hold his own with team help defense while he takes his opponent apart limb by limb forcing them to change who is guarding him.
We also imporoved out offense to help him. ATL last year was able to move Capella off Taj who was starting when Noel went down, and pushed him into bad spots. RJ was golden from the corner, but Rose was cooked, and the rest of team did not step up. WE are deeper this year.
Again, where was randle when he got the ball? If you PF is running the point and bringing up the ball what do you call that? Don’t matter, If Randle want to be quicker thats fine. The Melo comps were more about Melo getting bigger and slower before he shrank in Portland to regain his quickness to play wing. Melo was a gifted rebonder at at 6-8 has the size and frame to play PF. ITs not what he wanted so he had to get his quick back which renewed his career.
We don’t know to what degree Jules is doing this. Jimmy Butler can play 2-3-4. Maybe Thibs is using Jimmy as a templete for Jules which will improve his defense. Jules upper body strenght is not going away which makes him a beast near the rim. Not the kind of “amare/obi” type of quickess but one more of solid fundamentals then high flying. Jules never had that kind of hops and is why his injuries have been minor other than his rookie broken leg.
Teams should be more worried about Jules then we should be about their 3 “running circles around us”.
ATL thru a lot at him and it worked. If that happens again and we healthy with this improveed offense it won’t happen again. Not saying we win the series but not 1-4.

Did you forget the 2019-2020 season? We played 3x PFs all the time and teams constantly countered it with 3 guards and scored at will

Part of the reason our D was so much better last year was Thibs never did this

Yes, I have forgotten that season. Not sure Why you bring an arguement. Its all abstract.

Allanfan20 wrote:

BigDaddyG wrote:

blkexec wrote:

Philc1 wrote:

Marv wrote:i think thibs is gonna give fournier a lot of minutes. 6'7", 28 y.o., 30 mins/p.g.last year, 41% 3's, i see him and rj crushing the minutes at the 2/3

This.

Randle may be getting leaner to develop more quickness but that doesn’t mean he’s still not a PF

It's less about Randle playing the 3....more about finding ways to get obi on the floor. If his only opportunity to get mins is when Randle sits, might as well trade obi. That's wasted talent riding the bench. Unless obi comes in for Randle, RJ or Fournier, which forces Randle to the 3. But you have Burks ready to come in as well. Will be an interesting rotation problem for thibs.

Or, you can run small ball lineups with Randle at the "5" and Obi at "4". Randle guarded 5s with the Lakers and I think he might be done it with the NOPs. It's a more natural fit. Randle would provide more space and Obi would get his minutes without eating into RJ's time. Lastly, we should wait until Obi proves he's worthy of those minutes. Obi is not at the point where we should worry about moving Randle around to accommodate him.

Except you are assuming Noel won’t play.

I think there is one single way Obi gets significant playing time and that’s if he dominates training camp and the preseason so insanely that someone like Noel and even Fournier sniffs the shelf. They would need to get traded immediately.

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https://twitter.com/IanBegley/status/1443262507112701952

Allanfan20 wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:Love Randle and I know his work ethic is there, but ISO work outs in an empty gym, I don't know how much you can take away from that.

Do you think he's quick enough to Guard NBA wings?

I would rather him play Center When OBI comes in

Agreed 100%. I think Obi and JuJu can actually mesh well together but either of them at the 3 does not work. Julius is quick for his size but not that quick.

When we play teams in the East like the Bucks, 76ers, or Hawks, we gonna need a lineup of Randle/Obi/and MitchRob to control the paint on both sides of the court.