martin wrote:

foosballnick wrote:

martin wrote:

joec32033 wrote:Barrett is my favorite player in this team. I love his style. But he NEEDS to finish better at the rim, and learn to close out games. He has missed several key shots this season. Also needs to get more consistent.

It's the consistency and decision-making that still make me scratch my head and go more pessimistic than most.

There are so many fast breaks where he puts his head down, clearly with the blinders on, and goes right at defender instead of making the simple pass to teammate for a very make-able bucket. I am going to try to dunk on Myles Turner, one of the best shot blockers in the league, instead of making this easy pass.

Or, literally WFT was that pass, multiple times a game. I get the young guy, almost rookie player, still 20 years old. But WTF with the passing/decision making.

And he can get hot from 3, and then also get another pass while wide open and not hit the rim. I don't even know what that is.

IMHO Barrett will never have a shooters touch. He will grind the hell out of his shooting form and make it mechanically better, but never a natural, instinctive, sweet shot.

Clutch? Hit some free throws at end of game when it counts. At least one of them.

Almost every player in the league makes wtf plays. You seem to be holding RJ to a higher standard while perhaps ignoring the flaws in other players.

?

When the discussion is about Barrett, what does statement "ignoring the flaws of other players" have to do with anything? I am literally talking about RJ and you want me to... discuss other players flaws?

Let's be realistic: RJ, given his age, has probably been in the top 1% of having been coached and exposed to higher levels of play at his age bracket for all kids at 20 years old who are slated for the NBA. His father was a pro player, he has been on the pre-NBA and international circuit for his whole life, and he has had a pro shooting coach for at least 2 off seasons (Hanson, regarded as one of the best). All things that 95+% of kids capable of getting to this level don't have.

The decision making he is executing shouldn't even come into question IMHO, they should be more natural and instinctive at this point of his pro lifecycle.

I've just never seen a player, when so wide open, miss the rim as much as he does. I don't even know how to fathom that

RJ is getting better and doing things he was not good at last year but he should be miles ahead of where he is IMO

You've never seen a player miss the rim as much? Should be MILES ahead of where he is?

Uh, just a bit of hyperbole. A second year player should be miles better than RJB this season? Who are you comparing RJ to? Jordan? Drexler?

PS Go check Morant's numbers for this year. Not that amazing are they.

martin wrote:

Tweet was deleted or there was problem with the URL:

https://twitter.com/nyknicks/status/1366467021483905024

To me this is the most important improvement. This is what everyone said he needs to become a star someday.

martin wrote:

foosballnick wrote:

martin wrote:

joec32033 wrote:Barrett is my favorite player in this team. I love his style. But he NEEDS to finish better at the rim, and learn to close out games. He has missed several key shots this season. Also needs to get more consistent.

It's the consistency and decision-making that still make me scratch my head and go more pessimistic than most.

There are so many fast breaks where he puts his head down, clearly with the blinders on, and goes right at defender instead of making the simple pass to teammate for a very make-able bucket. I am going to try to dunk on Myles Turner, one of the best shot blockers in the league, instead of making this easy pass.

Or, literally WFT was that pass, multiple times a game. I get the young guy, almost rookie player, still 20 years old. But WTF with the passing/decision making.

And he can get hot from 3, and then also get another pass while wide open and not hit the rim. I don't even know what that is.

IMHO Barrett will never have a shooters touch. He will grind the hell out of his shooting form and make it mechanically better, but never a natural, instinctive, sweet shot.

Clutch? Hit some free throws at end of game when it counts. At least one of them.

Almost every player in the league makes wtf plays. You seem to be holding RJ to a higher standard while perhaps ignoring the flaws in other players.

?

When the discussion is about Barrett, what does statement "ignoring the flaws of other players" have to do with anything? I am literally talking about RJ and you want me to... discuss other players flaws?

Let's be realistic: RJ, given his age, has probably been in the top 1% of having been coached and exposed to higher levels of play at his age bracket for all kids at 20 years old who are slated for the NBA. His father was a pro player, he has been on the pre-NBA and international circuit for his whole life, and he has had a pro shooting coach for at least 2 off seasons (Hanson, regarded as one of the best). All things that 95+% of kids capable of getting to this level don't have.

The decision making he is executing shouldn't even come into question IMHO, they should be more natural and instinctive at this point of his pro lifecycle.

I've just never seen a player, when so wide open, miss the rim as much as he does. I don't even know how to fathom that

RJ is getting better and doing things he was not good at last year but he should be miles ahead of where he is IMO

I agree with most of what your saying...or maybe some. 🤔 But where I disagree is projecting where a young player should be, based on whatever stats and history you want to use. Instead focus on how hard he wants to improve and whats his basketball mentoring environment? Background and even current structure and coach. Itz like predicting when a piece of art will become valuable....when a car turns into an expensive classic. Just my opinion on that.

So I've noticed the clunky drives and movements RJ has with an inconsistent jumpshot. This is nothing new. Since I knew we would possibly pick him or zion....I followed him during his duke season. And I told a friend...b4 we picked him....that RJ has the potential to be more impactful than zion. I trust dukes coach and when I saw him repeatedly draw up plays with the ball in RJs hand....NOT ZION.....I said ok coach. He sees something. Then I hear his name is the Canadian black mamba.....I said ah...ah..ah....thats where his base comes from since a little kid. He's built to play like a finisher....and a killer who takes over games mentally and physically.... Like having a pitbull who's very aggressive. You don't want to remove her aggressiveness, just control it. That's RJ....

hes a late bloomer the IQ you are referring to. And as a former player, it's not easy to be able to turn that aggressive button on and off like that at a young age. Especially thats what made you become the 3rd pick....But one thing is certain....he models his work ethic and determination like these great nba players around him, he's the type to fill any hole he needs to fill. If we are seeing something in his game, believe me he has nash, pops, his dream to be like kobe, and now thibs and the pressure of ny as the 3rd pick. Regardless where his talent or skill is at right now, RJ is most certainly a BULL DOG type player. And we need more not less bull dogs. Just watch how Randle is blossoming....RJ is the guard version. We just need to build around that muscle. Add some specialists....

technomaster wrote:Just to put things into perspective, 26 players were named all-stars this 2020-2021 season. Of those 26 players, here's my take of players that looked like borderline all-stars+ within their first 2 seasons:
Lebron, Doncic, Durant, Kyrie, Paul, Mitchell, Zion, Booker (year 2), Lillard, Mitchell, Davis (year 2), Embiid, Curry, Jokic

These guys took a little longer to develop - some had depth holding them back from big enough numbers, while others some of them still were projects after year 2: Giannis, Leonard, Harden, Vucevic, Randle, Sabonis, Gobert, George, Brown, Tatum, Beal, Lavine

It's close to an even split (14-12). (you might argue that CP3 and Curry weren't quite all-star quality over their first 2 seasons; you might argue that Tatum showed a lot of alpha scorer potential over his first 2 seasons)

Even among the very best players, there's some very major variation in their paths to stardom.

Where does that leave RJ? Well, his numbers are up across the board. That's without a doubt a good sign. (Certainly a better sign than Knox/Ntilikina's progression)

Regarding RJ's finishing at the rim - yeah, he's below average for someone who gets so many shots near the basket, that's a fact. He can get better, sure. He has a few paths to improvement: better decision making, adding to his arsenal of moves - using a floater, fadeaway jumper, hesitation up and under, improving his touch on the moves he already has, selling in the contact for a foul.

And as good as RJ's training may have been in terms of reaching his athletic potential, you still have to rise to the level of competition. He may have been getting some reps against the Team Canada mens team, but even that isn't the same as facing the elite wings of the NBA with different skill sets night in and night out. What's great is that he's making adjustments.

He is a crafty and he will outwork 95% of NBA players. His athletic ability concerns me. Will that keep him from being a top tier player instead of a borderline All Star

martin wrote:

Tweet was deleted or there was problem with the URL:

https://twitter.com/RJBarrettStats/status/1367673086900899847

He's becoming that guy that doesn't look like a shooter, but makes shots. And we know he will continue to get better. He may have small regressions here and there but the overall improvement will continue. I don't think there's any question he's showing star potential, it just may take him some years to put it all together. I'm very confident in Randle and Barrett as 2 out of 3 big pieces for a contending team down the road.

martin wrote:

Tweet was deleted or there was problem with the URL:

https://twitter.com/RJBarrettStats/status/1367673086900899847

50% from the floor?
Does that include or exclude the 60% from 3?

BigDaddyG wrote:

Panos wrote:

martin wrote:

Tweet was deleted or there was problem with the URL:

https://twitter.com/RJBarrettStats/status/1367673086900899847

50% from the floor?
Does that include or exclude the 60% from 3?

FG% is overall, including those chippy shots he missed in the clutch Still, impressive. But everyone continues to ride Herro's jock.

I’m not hearing much about Herro to be honest. He lost his starting spot after a failed PG experiment and has been solid but not really taking a step forward like Barrett. Barrett’s offensive numbers have been better plus he’s a far better defender. I don’t see where Herro excels over Barrett these days. Barrett looks like the better prospect again by far. Those who feel Herro is better and has more upside I would be interested to hear the argument for that.

martin wrote:

Tweet was deleted or there was problem with the URL:

https://twitter.com/MikeVorkunov/status/1368235066061713417

Martin I know you were somewhat down on his overall upside. Has your thoughts changed at all?