martin wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

martin wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

martin wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

martin wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:Why not give obi a chance at 5 in a 4-1 set. I think part of an issue is he’s not the lead lob object— he’s forced outside

The Knicks are exceeding expectations this year and it’s predicated on their defense first. The defense is predicated on Mitch and Nerlens being almost exactly the same type of defensive player and solidifying things at the rim outward.

But let’s mess all that up and blindly throw something against the wall to see if it sticks?

Did I sum that up right?

Unless u give a guy a chance u don’t know what u have. We could easily give him a 4-1set for ten minutes

Again, that's just throwing something against the wall and hoping it sticks.

We of course don't know what happens in practice and don't have that insight.

Obi's upside is on the offensive end of things and it is generally assumed his defense is much longer away. He has barely been able to get on track offensively and that's being generous.

The Knicks are a defensive team first. Just knowing Thibs, he won't shake things up just to try something.

Defense teams first won’t win enough. I’m sure there’s a happy medium?
What do you mean throw something against the wall??? You can take the time to watch the video I provided for u???? It shows how obi can thrive at the 5 position. If that doesn’t correlate with what TT does they should’ve passed on him in the draft

That was against Indian State college. Here is their roster: https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/schools/indiana-state/2020.html

All of their guys are like 6'9" and below. Starting 5: 6'3", 5'10", 6'9", 6'4", 6'7".

Were they even ranked as a top 100 college team in the nation?

What is this video supposed to show us?

We already know Obi can overwhelm college players. They are small. He is big and fast.

But against NBA players?

Obi did most of his work in college in the paint. He did not play very much behind the 3 point line. That’s what we bought

OK, defensively speaking though I don't know if he played C in college. Either way, he is in the NBA now.

And he did shoot some from outside at school and did it OK.

The Knicks FO and coach WANTED Taj because they have seen enough of Obi to know he is not a C. He is not strong enough at PF as it stands.

His center of gravity is very high, like at his neck. He can't post up and uproot players.

Maybe you would like to see him at C but the coaching staff doesn't and really it's a moot point.

Martin what was the downside of using Obi at back up C today? This is the downside of Tibs. Id rather go with Obi as the back up than Taj jmo

BRIGGS wrote:

martin wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

martin wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

martin wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

martin wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:Why not give obi a chance at 5 in a 4-1 set. I think part of an issue is he’s not the lead lob object— he’s forced outside

The Knicks are exceeding expectations this year and it’s predicated on their defense first. The defense is predicated on Mitch and Nerlens being almost exactly the same type of defensive player and solidifying things at the rim outward.

But let’s mess all that up and blindly throw something against the wall to see if it sticks?

Did I sum that up right?

Unless u give a guy a chance u don’t know what u have. We could easily give him a 4-1set for ten minutes

Again, that's just throwing something against the wall and hoping it sticks.

We of course don't know what happens in practice and don't have that insight.

Obi's upside is on the offensive end of things and it is generally assumed his defense is much longer away. He has barely been able to get on track offensively and that's being generous.

The Knicks are a defensive team first. Just knowing Thibs, he won't shake things up just to try something.

Defense teams first won’t win enough. I’m sure there’s a happy medium?
What do you mean throw something against the wall??? You can take the time to watch the video I provided for u???? It shows how obi can thrive at the 5 position. If that doesn’t correlate with what TT does they should’ve passed on him in the draft

That was against Indian State college. Here is their roster: https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/schools/indiana-state/2020.html

All of their guys are like 6'9" and below. Starting 5: 6'3", 5'10", 6'9", 6'4", 6'7".

Were they even ranked as a top 100 college team in the nation?

What is this video supposed to show us?

We already know Obi can overwhelm college players. They are small. He is big and fast.

But against NBA players?

Obi did most of his work in college in the paint. He did not play very much behind the 3 point line. That’s what we bought

OK, defensively speaking though I don't know if he played C in college. Either way, he is in the NBA now.

And he did shoot some from outside at school and did it OK.

The Knicks FO and coach WANTED Taj because they have seen enough of Obi to know he is not a C. He is not strong enough at PF as it stands.

His center of gravity is very high, like at his neck. He can't post up and uproot players.

Maybe you would like to see him at C but the coaching staff doesn't and really it's a moot point.

Martin what was the downside of using Obi at back up C today? This is the downside of Tibs. Id rather go with Obi as the back up than Taj jmo

I'm guessing that Thibs and staff want to establish a defense first mentality with the team. All guys on the same page. Right now they are good EXCEPT defending the 3point line. I'd guess they are working on that.

The Knicks have played about 20 games. Is that enough time to establish your defense and then start to figure out what to do on the offense end? No less experiment with Obi at C?

You always put rookies in a place to succeed for a long time to establish their identity and get them rolling. It's why you wont see IQ start for a while. 20 games is just not enough to establish long term habits.

Obi is barely able to keep up with his first games as a rookie. He has been hurt, had zero training camp like in previous years. He has played 10 games so he is barely out of the gate. Play to his strengths as best as you can within the context of the team (and maybe that isn't exactly how he will play long term but you do your best). He was an offensive MONSTER in college and yet has barely been able to do the things we KNOW he can do at an even average level. In college he is playing against these scrawny dudes who he can overpower or out-quick, not in the NBA though. I bet he can't back down RJ. He is missing easy layups, easy midrange shots and hesitant everywhere.

You just can't throw more at a player like that. At C, there is a TON of defensive responsibility. It would crater all the good vibes the Knicks have established.... just to see if Obi can what? Post up on the offensive end?

Coaching staffs have plans, or at least should. The Knicks with Thibs have plans and they start with defense.

Let's be direct. You want to try something new after every game. No continuity. You wouldn't have played IQ cause he didn't fit some weird physical profile.

Can't be that reactive to get in the way of long term building.

Welpee wrote:This is why I never liked the tanking strategy. The draft is the most uncertain way to acquire talent compared to trades and free agency.

But when it works you get talent like Mitch, RJ, KP, and Quickley. KP dipped but still we got three of those guys on rookie deals so we can afford say Randle, and now we have about 60 mil in cap space to add the Free agent/trade talent and potentially two more lotto picks.

Like we can be a legit good, young team next year. We haven’t been that since what. Maybe the 1991 NY Knicks that had Mark Jackson, Ewing, Starks, Mason, X-Man, Greg Anthony and Oakley......

That’s the type of end result of what the Knicks are doing now. They only got to get good players in this draft and free agency and I think they are set for a decade.

martin wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

martin wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

martin wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

martin wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

martin wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:Why not give obi a chance at 5 in a 4-1 set. I think part of an issue is he’s not the lead lob object— he’s forced outside

The Knicks are exceeding expectations this year and it’s predicated on their defense first. The defense is predicated on Mitch and Nerlens being almost exactly the same type of defensive player and solidifying things at the rim outward.

But let’s mess all that up and blindly throw something against the wall to see if it sticks?

Did I sum that up right?

Unless u give a guy a chance u don’t know what u have. We could easily give him a 4-1set for ten minutes

Again, that's just throwing something against the wall and hoping it sticks.

We of course don't know what happens in practice and don't have that insight.

Obi's upside is on the offensive end of things and it is generally assumed his defense is much longer away. He has barely been able to get on track offensively and that's being generous.

The Knicks are a defensive team first. Just knowing Thibs, he won't shake things up just to try something.

Defense teams first won’t win enough. I’m sure there’s a happy medium?
What do you mean throw something against the wall??? You can take the time to watch the video I provided for u???? It shows how obi can thrive at the 5 position. If that doesn’t correlate with what TT does they should’ve passed on him in the draft

That was against Indian State college. Here is their roster: https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/schools/indiana-state/2020.html

All of their guys are like 6'9" and below. Starting 5: 6'3", 5'10", 6'9", 6'4", 6'7".

Were they even ranked as a top 100 college team in the nation?

What is this video supposed to show us?

We already know Obi can overwhelm college players. They are small. He is big and fast.

But against NBA players?

Obi did most of his work in college in the paint. He did not play very much behind the 3 point line. That’s what we bought

OK, defensively speaking though I don't know if he played C in college. Either way, he is in the NBA now.

And he did shoot some from outside at school and did it OK.

The Knicks FO and coach WANTED Taj because they have seen enough of Obi to know he is not a C. He is not strong enough at PF as it stands.

His center of gravity is very high, like at his neck. He can't post up and uproot players.

Maybe you would like to see him at C but the coaching staff doesn't and really it's a moot point.

Martin what was the downside of using Obi at back up C today? This is the downside of Tibs. Id rather go with Obi as the back up than Taj jmo

I'm guessing that Thibs and staff want to establish a defense first mentality with the team. All guys on the same page. Right now they are good EXCEPT defending the 3point line. I'd guess they are working on that.

The Knicks have played about 20 games. Is that enough time to establish your defense and then start to figure out what to do on the offense end? No less experiment with Obi at C?

You always put rookies in a place to succeed for a long time to establish their identity and get them rolling. It's why you wont see IQ start for a while. 20 games is just not enough to establish long term habits.

Obi is barely able to keep up with his first games as a rookie. He has been hurt, had zero training camp like in previous years. He has played 10 games so he is barely out of the gate. Play to his strengths as best as you can within the context of the team (and maybe that isn't exactly how he will play long term but you do your best). He was an offensive MONSTER in college and yet has barely been able to do the things we KNOW he can do at an even average level. In college he is playing against these scrawny dudes who he can overpower or out-quick, not in the NBA though. I bet he can't back down RJ. He is missing easy layups, easy midrange shots and hesitant everywhere.

You just can't throw more at a player like that. At C, there is a TON of defensive responsibility. It would crater all the good vibes the Knicks have established.... just to see if Obi can what? Post up on the offensive end?

Coaching staffs have plans, or at least should. The Knicks with Thibs have plans and they start with defense.

Let's be direct. You want to try something new after every game. No continuity. You wouldn't have played IQ cause he didn't fit some weird physical profile.

Can't be that reactive to get in the way of long term building.

Basketball is basketball it is t brain science. With Noel out give Obi 20-22 minutes at 5. I want to see what he can do even slightly undersized. He’s shooting 50% of his shots from 3 right now. I’d like to see what he can do with more space. The warriors make the time for wiseman.

martin wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:Basketball is basketball it is t brain science. With Noel out give Obi 20-22 minutes at 5. I want to see what he can do even slightly undersized. He’s shooting 50% of his shots from 3 right now. I’d like to see what he can do with more space. The warriors make the time for wiseman.

Yeah I don't know how to respond to that level of thinking. The Warriors, who drafted a C at the #2 pick in the draft and who are bereft of any starting center or any reliable big man over the height of 6'7" (Draymond; Looney does not even qualify to be anything but off the bench fodder), are not just "making time" for Wiseman.

You think the Knicks are in that same position with Obi as GS is with Wiseman? The mental gymnastics to get here are Olympic level bendy

On the scale of dumb to dumber, this one rates in the middle. And that's just a funny joke by me

Do I think the 20 year drought Knicks are in the same position as the championship Warriors who still have Steph Curry Dray Green? No. You’re making these comments without watching GS play. They make time for wiseman particularly starting him until recently. He had some minor disappointments at first especially on the D. But GS is highly committed to developing him immediately.
With Noel out Id like to give the back up position to obi and give him more space. By the way if yiu actually watched basketball you’d know that Looney( crap fodder) took Wisemans starting spot at C. Please watch a game w gs to see what I’m saying.

Are the Knicks developing Obi at the same caliber as Wiseman— not closr

martin wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

martin wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:Basketball is basketball it is t brain science. With Noel out give Obi 20-22 minutes at 5. I want to see what he can do even slightly undersized. He’s shooting 50% of his shots from 3 right now. I’d like to see what he can do with more space. The warriors make the time for wiseman.

Yeah I don't know how to respond to that level of thinking. The Warriors, who drafted a C at the #2 pick in the draft and who are bereft of any starting center or any reliable big man over the height of 6'7" (Draymond; Looney does not even qualify to be anything but off the bench fodder), are not just "making time" for Wiseman.

You think the Knicks are in that same position with Obi as GS is with Wiseman? The mental gymnastics to get here are Olympic level bendy

On the scale of dumb to dumber, this one rates in the middle. And that's just a funny joke by me

Do I think the 20 year drought Knicks are in the same position as the championship Warriors who still have Steph Curry Dray Green? No. You’re making these comments without watching GS play. They make time for wiseman particularly starting him until recently. He had some minor disappointments at first especially on the D. But GS is highly committed to developing him immediately.
With Noel out Id like to give the back up position to obi and give him more space. By the way if yiu actually watched basketball you’d know that Looney( crap fodder) took Wisemans starting spot at C. Please watch a game w gs to see what I’m saying.

Are the Knicks developing Obi at the same caliber as Wiseman— not closr

I mean, they aren't if all you consider is playing time.

Wiseman is on a team bereft of big men. If you think otherwise, list the Centers that are competing with him for minutes and help justify why THEY could be playing instead of just giving the minutes to Wiseman.

Obi is a PF. He is playing behind an all-star to be who is averaging 37 minutes a game and for good reason too. He is not a center but if he did he would be competing for minutes with Robinson and Noel. Not for nothing but Knox may be losing PF minutes to Obi too.

You are right I don't watch GS. Don't even have to to suss out the reasoning here.

Obi is going to be on a slow development path and that's OK. There is literally no reason to rush him except in the case of impatient fans who just want to see him play minutes. I'd like to see him but understand why he is not playing.

I’m not overly worried 4-5 position. We seen many undersized guys at center. All I was asking for was trying out Obi at 5 when Noel was out. Give him a shot— integrate him. In gs case yes they are actually catering to wiseman — Gs won championships with mostly green at 5

BigDaddyG wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

martin wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

martin wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:Basketball is basketball it is t brain science. With Noel out give Obi 20-22 minutes at 5. I want to see what he can do even slightly undersized. He’s shooting 50% of his shots from 3 right now. I’d like to see what he can do with more space. The warriors make the time for wiseman.

Yeah I don't know how to respond to that level of thinking. The Warriors, who drafted a C at the #2 pick in the draft and who are bereft of any starting center or any reliable big man over the height of 6'7" (Draymond; Looney does not even qualify to be anything but off the bench fodder), are not just "making time" for Wiseman.

You think the Knicks are in that same position with Obi as GS is with Wiseman? The mental gymnastics to get here are Olympic level bendy

On the scale of dumb to dumber, this one rates in the middle. And that's just a funny joke by me

Do I think the 20 year drought Knicks are in the same position as the championship Warriors who still have Steph Curry Dray Green? No. You’re making these comments without watching GS play. They make time for wiseman particularly starting him until recently. He had some minor disappointments at first especially on the D. But GS is highly committed to developing him immediately.
With Noel out Id like to give the back up position to obi and give him more space. By the way if yiu actually watched basketball you’d know that Looney( crap fodder) took Wisemans starting spot at C. Please watch a game w gs to see what I’m saying.

Are the Knicks developing Obi at the same caliber as Wiseman— not closr

I mean, they aren't if all you consider is playing time.

Wiseman is on a team bereft of big men. If you think otherwise, list the Centers that are competing with him for minutes and help justify why THEY could be playing instead of just giving the minutes to Wiseman.

Obi is a PF. He is playing behind an all-star to be who is averaging 37 minutes a game and for good reason too. He is not a center but if he did he would be competing for minutes with Robinson and Noel. Not for nothing but Knox may be losing PF minutes to Obi too.

You are right I don't watch GS. Don't even have to to suss out the reasoning here.

Obi is going to be on a slow development path and that's OK. There is literally no reason to rush him except in the case of impatient fans who just want to see him play minutes. I'd like to see him but understand why he is not playing.

I’m not overly worried 4-5 position. We seen many undersized guys at center. All I was asking for was trying out Obi at 5 when Noel was out. Give him a shot— integrate him. In gs case yes they are actually catering to wiseman — Gs won championships with mostly green at 5

Green is much stronger and I'm pretty sure he wasn't playing center his rookie year. I agree, I wouldn't mind seeing Thibs play the bench more in garbage time more. You could play Obi then and cut down the minutes of the main rotation. But , from what I've seen, Obi doesn't seem strong enough for the center position. I've seen guards hold their ground against him in the post.

He has a High center of gravity thats why he runs like Shaggy.
Sucks we didnt draft Mikal he would of fit this team so well

Knixkik wrote:For now Obi is stuck as a backup 4 for 12 mpg. If either Mitch or Noel is out with injury, that is the opportunity to play Obi some extended minutes off the bench. I love having Gibson on the roster, but he should be an emergency player only. Obi should have the opportunity to play some center minutes if one of the 2 centers is out, but you're right, he hasn't earned the minutes otherwise. He's a 5 point, 3 rebound, 12 mpg guy with everyone healthy.

Well the other day when Noel was out, Taj took his minutes.

If OBI produces during his short stints and the team is playing well with him, he will get more minutes