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Knicks going after Hayward?
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BigDaddyG
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11/20/2020  10:17 AM
Nalod wrote:If Haywood wants Indy, does that lesson the asking price for Olidipo? Boston let Kyrie walk and they signed Kemba. It was a deafacto trade concept. Not saying Indy dumps him but we have the cap space to take Victor and don’t have to give back much.

Indy might need to do a quick deal. Milwaukee can’t absorb much salary without returning in kind. ATL likley not interested.
Knox, Dennis and Dallas protected pick could get it done. Do I love this deal? Tell me what Victors prognosis is going forward is and perhaps I would. His injury history might be an opportunity. Haywood would be a great draw for Indy fans.
I would prefer Haywood over Olidipo and use Randle in a package for a guard.

Hearing Atlanta has interest, which is the worse case scenario for Boston. Knicks and Hawks can just sign Hayward outright. I think Boston is secretly hoping Hayward re-signs. Best case scenario for us is that Boston is desperate enough to take Randle in a sign and trade. Maybe throw in 2023 second-rounder to make nice. Don't think Boston ever gets that desperate, but it would allow the Knicks to overpay for Gordon and FVV.

Always... always remember: Less is less. More is more. More is better and twice as much is good too. Not enough is bad, and too much is never enough except when it's just about right. - The Tick
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BigDaddyG
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11/20/2020  10:21 AM
HofstraBBall wrote:
fishmike wrote:
Knixkik wrote:I think the fit between RJ and Toppin would be really nice with Hayward. Shooter/playmaker who won't hog usage.
this guy sees it... we will still need PG help, but RJ/Hayward/Obi/Mitch is starting to look like a real NBA team.

Have always liked him. The concern would be giving too much money and his age. Feel his injury has taken away the three level threat he was in Utah. Watching him in Boston, I rarely saw him attack to the basket they way he did in Utah. His foul shot attempts his last year in Utah was 6 a game. Lat year in Boston barely half that. Still feel, for the right price, he would help the Knicks

I think usage and role changes had something to do with it. Jaylen is the slaser, Tatum is the mid-range iso maestro and Hayward had to take on the role of spacer and tertiary facilitator. I also agree that he's lost some athleticism.

Always... always remember: Less is less. More is more. More is better and twice as much is good too. Not enough is bad, and too much is never enough except when it's just about right. - The Tick
unstopaball12
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11/20/2020  10:29 AM
*Sign hayward for max 3 years and tops at 75M
*Trade Randle and Smith for rozier and picks
*Sign Paul Millsap for MLE(1+1)

Mitch/Gibson(sign at lower cost)/Davis
Toppin/Millsap/random prospect find
Hayward/knox/Ignas
Rj/bullock/quickley
Rozier/Frank/(harper or Powell)

Team that will fight for 7th-10th seed. Good character vets to complement our young guys and a point guard that has played in the conference finals and has a year under his belt as a top option

HofstraBBall
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11/20/2020  10:54 AM
unstopaball12 wrote:*Sign hayward for max 3 years and tops at 75M
*Trade Randle and Smith for rozier and picks
*Sign Paul Millsap for MLE(1+1)

Mitch/Gibson(sign at lower cost)/Davis
Toppin/Millsap/random prospect find
Hayward/knox/Ignas
Rj/bullock/quickley
Rozier/Frank/(harper or Powell)

Team that will fight for 7th-10th seed. Good character vets to complement our young guys and a point guard that has played in the conference finals and has a year under his belt as a top option

Like Hayward. Three year $75M? Depends on Knicks plans in 2021. $25M sounds about right but Hayward on the plus 30 side? Would prefer 1-2 years with team option.
Like Rozier. Think the Hornets will want to keep him after last years season and the fact he can play off Ball with his shooting.
Millsap will be in higher demand. Feel he may get more than MLE to go to the Knicks. But more importantly, feel he will want to go/stay with/to a contender.

'Knicks focus should be on players that have grown up playing soccer or cricket' - Triplethreat 8/28/2020
knicks1248
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11/20/2020  10:57 AM
BigDaddyG wrote:
Nalod wrote:If Haywood wants Indy, does that lesson the asking price for Olidipo? Boston let Kyrie walk and they signed Kemba. It was a deafacto trade concept. Not saying Indy dumps him but we have the cap space to take Victor and don’t have to give back much.

Indy might need to do a quick deal. Milwaukee can’t absorb much salary without returning in kind. ATL likley not interested.
Knox, Dennis and Dallas protected pick could get it done. Do I love this deal? Tell me what Victors prognosis is going forward is and perhaps I would. His injury history might be an opportunity. Haywood would be a great draw for Indy fans.
I would prefer Haywood over Olidipo and use Randle in a package for a guard.

Hearing Atlanta has interest, which is the worse case scenario for Boston. Knicks and Hawks can just sign Hayward outright. I think Boston is secretly hoping Hayward re-signs. Best case scenario for us is that Boston is desperate enough to take Randle in a sign and trade. Maybe throw in 2023 second-rounder to make nice. Don't think Boston ever gets that desperate, but it would allow the Knicks to overpay for Gordon and FVV.

What would Randle's role be on Boston, him and Tatum have very similar games.

I think Frank and Reggie would be better fitting pieces for boston, and they combine to make 13 mill.

ES
martin
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11/20/2020  11:09 AM
BigDaddyG wrote:
Nalod wrote:If Haywood wants Indy, does that lesson the asking price for Olidipo? Boston let Kyrie walk and they signed Kemba. It was a deafacto trade concept. Not saying Indy dumps him but we have the cap space to take Victor and don’t have to give back much.

Indy might need to do a quick deal. Milwaukee can’t absorb much salary without returning in kind. ATL likley not interested.
Knox, Dennis and Dallas protected pick could get it done. Do I love this deal? Tell me what Victors prognosis is going forward is and perhaps I would. His injury history might be an opportunity. Haywood would be a great draw for Indy fans.
I would prefer Haywood over Olidipo and use Randle in a package for a guard.

Hearing Atlanta has interest, which is the worse case scenario for Boston. Knicks and Hawks can just sign Hayward outright. I think Boston is secretly hoping Hayward re-signs. Best case scenario for us is that Boston is desperate enough to take Randle in a sign and trade. Maybe throw in 2023 second-rounder to make nice. Don't think Boston ever gets that desperate, but it would allow the Knicks to overpay for Gordon and FVV.

Boston would rather do a S&T with Hayward to get the TPE, it's more valuable to them. Next year they would have Tatum, Brown, Walker, Smart on cap for like $100M, plus a bunch of rookies and a C that they will sign. Over the cap and getting closer to the luxury line.

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martin
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11/20/2020  11:10 AM
If I'm Leon, I'm all in for both Hayward and FVV. Have to figure out a way to move Randle and possibly one of Knox, Frank, DSJr but I'd move on it
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unstopaball12
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11/20/2020  11:16 AM
HofstraBBall wrote:
unstopaball12 wrote:*Sign hayward for max 3 years and tops at 75M
*Trade Randle and Smith for rozier and picks
*Sign Paul Millsap for MLE(1+1)

Mitch/Gibson(sign at lower cost)/Davis
Toppin/Millsap/random prospect find
Hayward/knox/Ignas
Rj/bullock/quickley
Rozier/Frank/(harper or Powell)

Team that will fight for 7th-10th seed. Good character vets to complement our young guys and a point guard that has played in the conference finals and has a year under his belt as a top option

Like Hayward. Three year $75M? Depends on Knicks plans in 2021. $25M sounds about right but Hayward on the plus 30 side? Would prefer 1-2 years with team option.
Like Rozier. Think the Hornets will want to keep him after last years season and the fact he can play off Ball with his shooting.
Millsap will be in higher demand. Feel he may get more than MLE to go to the Knicks. But more importantly, feel he will want to go/stay with/to a contender.

Guy just turned down 35m, no way he accepts 2 years 50m with the second year as team option. Someone else will overpay.

Hornets need a big and need to de load a guard after the ball pick. Ball and Graham fit better vs ball and rozier

MS
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11/20/2020  11:19 AM
A one year $35MM deal? Play out the short season let everyone know you’re still elite and sign a long term deal. Not crazy.

Is it smarter just to give Bogey 18MM a year for three. He’s certainly traceable down the road.

martin
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11/20/2020  11:21 AM
MS wrote:A one year $35MM deal? Play out the short season let everyone know you’re still elite and sign a long term deal. Not crazy.

Is it smarter just to give Bogey 18MM a year for three. He’s certainly traceable down the road.

RFA though right?

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martin
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11/20/2020  11:21 AM
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martin
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11/20/2020  11:40 AM
I wonder if Utah is in play for Hayward by moving Conley and his deal to the Knicks. That would be interesting
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BigDaddyG
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11/20/2020  11:50 AM
martin wrote:I wonder if Utah is in play for Hayward by moving Conley and his deal to the Knicks. That would be interesting

Forgot about our sister city, Utah. Do they need to make additional moves for Clarkson? Conley comes off after this year anyway, so there might not be pressure to move him. But if they do, we'll be there to extend a helping hand to our lol Bros in the west

Always... always remember: Less is less. More is more. More is better and twice as much is good too. Not enough is bad, and too much is never enough except when it's just about right. - The Tick
HofstraBBall
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11/20/2020  11:54 AM    LAST EDITED: 11/20/2020  11:56 AM
unstopaball12 wrote:
HofstraBBall wrote:
unstopaball12 wrote:*Sign hayward for max 3 years and tops at 75M
*Trade Randle and Smith for rozier and picks
*Sign Paul Millsap for MLE(1+1)

Mitch/Gibson(sign at lower cost)/Davis
Toppin/Millsap/random prospect find
Hayward/knox/Ignas
Rj/bullock/quickley
Rozier/Frank/(harper or Powell)

Team that will fight for 7th-10th seed. Good character vets to complement our young guys and a point guard that has played in the conference finals and has a year under his belt as a top option

Like Hayward. Three year $75M? Depends on Knicks plans in 2021. $25M sounds about right but Hayward on the plus 30 side? Would prefer 1-2 years with team option.
Like Rozier. Think the Hornets will want to keep him after last years season and the fact he can play off Ball with his shooting.
Millsap will be in higher demand. Feel he may get more than MLE to go to the Knicks. But more importantly, feel he will want to go/stay with/to a contender.

Guy just turned down 35m, no way he accepts 2 years 50m with the second year as team option. Someone else will overpay.

Hornets need a big and need to de load a guard after the ball pick. Ball and Graham fit better vs ball and rozier

Two years with a team option not so bad. A chance for him to prove he is worth the money. Do agree that a team may overpay but hopefully its not us. Devonte is cheaper but think more of a risk after just one year of results. Rozier fits better in the sense he can help Lamelo since he has 5 years under his belt. If you look at both options a better case can be made they will need a SG more than either of those two. In terms of bigs, agree Randle would fit although they just added a big by drafting Carey Jr. who I think can come in right away and contribute. Although he is a C and Randal would fit with him as well. The bigger question is why would they want DSJR?

'Knicks focus should be on players that have grown up playing soccer or cricket' - Triplethreat 8/28/2020
BigDaddyG
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11/20/2020  11:56 AM
knicks1248 wrote:
BigDaddyG wrote:
Nalod wrote:If Haywood wants Indy, does that lesson the asking price for Olidipo? Boston let Kyrie walk and they signed Kemba. It was a deafacto trade concept. Not saying Indy dumps him but we have the cap space to take Victor and don’t have to give back much.

Indy might need to do a quick deal. Milwaukee can’t absorb much salary without returning in kind. ATL likley not interested.
Knox, Dennis and Dallas protected pick could get it done. Do I love this deal? Tell me what Victors prognosis is going forward is and perhaps I would. His injury history might be an opportunity. Haywood would be a great draw for Indy fans.
I would prefer Haywood over Olidipo and use Randle in a package for a guard.

Hearing Atlanta has interest, which is the worse case scenario for Boston. Knicks and Hawks can just sign Hayward outright. I think Boston is secretly hoping Hayward re-signs. Best case scenario for us is that Boston is desperate enough to take Randle in a sign and trade. Maybe throw in 2023 second-rounder to make nice. Don't think Boston ever gets that desperate, but it would allow the Knicks to overpay for Gordon and FVV.

What would Randle's role be on Boston, him and Tatum have very similar games.

I think Frank and Reggie would be better fitting pieces for boston, and they combine to make 13 mill.


Wishful thinking. No one is that desperate.
Always... always remember: Less is less. More is more. More is better and twice as much is good too. Not enough is bad, and too much is never enough except when it's just about right. - The Tick
martin
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11/20/2020  12:08 PM
THREAD

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jskinny35
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11/20/2020  12:18 PM
Guess I'm in the minority on this one - don't see Hayward as worth that kind of money with his injury history, age and limited defensive ability. I'd almost rather go for Bertans (even though his defense is Novak-like) as he's younger and a better shooter.
martin
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11/20/2020  12:24 PM
jskinny35 wrote:Guess I'm in the minority on this one - don't see Hayward as worth that kind of money with his injury history, age and limited defensive ability. I'd almost rather go for Bertans (even though his defense is Novak-like) as he's younger and a better shooter.

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newyorknewyork
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11/20/2020  12:35 PM
martin wrote:THREAD

He would get all the opportunity to do so as the featured player here. As well as a ton of love if he were to somehow push us in that playoff picture. The main thing though will be can he stay healthy with that much on his shoulders?

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Chandler
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11/20/2020  12:39 PM

I live in Boston so get a lot of local color on Celts

I would not be overly concerned with the injury any more so than any other vet option who has had an injury. Yes an issue but he demonstrated this year he's back. this coming year he's that much further removed from the injury.

i think boston was a poor fit for him. too many other players with similar skills etc. here he would have the ball in his hands more and we could exploit more value from him than Boston did. We will not get the Utah version, but we also won't get the Celts version. And i don't agree with the comment he lost confidence. that's not it; his role changed a lot and it was still confusing. Is he supposed to initiate offense or dump to Brown and/or Tatum and/or Kemba

it's crazy to think he'd sign a one year deal. there is no way we get him for that short. He had that already 34M and opted out from a winning program. i suspect he's more interested in term length than a bigger one year number. I also suspect he wants to feel loved again and tired of the Ainge cloud of perpetual trade rumors.

it would be a coup to get him. i have to imagine a few other clubs (e.g., Philly and/or Bucks to name two) who would wheel and deal to get him on a contending club.

If we get him it's because (a) he likes NYC as a city; his fancy hairdo makes me think he has a city slicker vibe that's coming out (b)some relationships with the organization he trusts (in contrast to Ainge), (c) he has a much clearer opportunity than in Boston, Philly, Mil etc to be a first or second option. On the celts he was already the third or fourth.

i would much prefer Hayward and a stop gap pg than FVV (who i don't think fits us) or Westbrook

other things on my mind: we all smell significant movement in the league. Harden may be on move, Russell, Wall, etc. Even if those movements are elsewhere there is a ripple effect as teams make moves. Similarly with the draft, some teams now have too much redundant pieces. Opportunity lurks!

(5)(7)
Knicks going after Hayward?

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