fishmike wrote:Trading KP is the worst move this org will ever make and will hurt for a decade plus. Can we move on now?

I don't think so. I was worried about locking up a player like KP that had shown flashes, but had yet to actually sustain a performance through a whole season. He's young, and yet may mature and be able to perform for an entire season.

The jury is still out, but when the Knicks made their move, I think a not horrible move.

Dallas is lucky and smart. They found their Batman in Luka, and they added a pretty neat Robin in KP.

KP is not Batman, and never will be. Not for us, not for Dallas.

jrodmc wrote:Can we also have a thread when he's hurt for 10 or 12 games in a row?

Whats the difference in a load management ERA, healthy players are barely playing back to back games.

franco12 wrote:

fishmike wrote:Trading KP is the worst move this org will ever make and will hurt for a decade plus. Can we move on now?

I don't think so. I was worried about locking up a player like KP that had shown flashes, but had yet to actually sustain a performance through a whole season. He's young, and yet may mature and be able to perform for an entire season.

The jury is still out, but when the Knicks made their move, I think a not horrible move.

Dallas is lucky and smart. They found their Batman in Luka, and they added a pretty neat Robin in KP.

KP is not Batman, and never will be. Not for us, not for Dallas.

My only point is to move on from it.

knicks1248 wrote:

smackeddog wrote:

houston20 wrote:

smackeddog wrote:https://dailyknicks.com/2020/08/02/knicks-kristaps-porzingis-trade-mavs-originally-wanted/

Tim Jr's dad claims the Mavs originally contacted the Knicks to enquire about Tim Jr (remember at the time the rumours were them trading DSJr to us), and we asked them about KP. If so that's infuriating, because we could have done a separate Tim Jr to the Mavs trade to clear a contract and then traded KP either by himself or with Courtney Lee's contract to another team for a better return. If we'd already lined up Tim Jr for DSJ and Wes Mathews or DeAndre Jordan, essentially we just traded KP for 2 1sts (likely to be mid to late now) and $12 mil in cap space (which we ended up not needing) and either DeAndre Jordan or Wes Mathews expiring.

The mavs won't make the playoffs next year they just got lucky the spurs,blazers, and warriors had a bunch of injuries it won't happen next year .

Spurs are on the decline, they won’t make the playoffs next season, don’t see how the Mavs won’t make it unless Doncic or KP gets injured. Maybe if the season gets cancelled we get lucky

This is more about what KP haters hopes to happen so we don't continue to look like fools.

They are hating on KP for not buying into the tank culture.

Chandler wrote:

Nalod wrote:

Chandler wrote:
Trading KP was stupidity of epic proportions, and clearly the consequence of having an insecure front office in way over its head. Yes KP had his stupid ass moments too but so have a lot of other start and super star players. The list of stars who have their diva moments is very long. In this case i think it was further triggered by a dysfunctional franchise saying and doing stupid things -- i.e., i don't not believe him to be an intrinsic ahole. He didn't want to waste his prime years with a bunch of bozos. Dolan should have cleaned house. It's a lot harder to find the next KP then it was to replace the threes stooges we had at the time. The front office should have been the adults in that situation.

Whatever...they decide to trade him: Phil came to the same conclusion. However, trading KP for the package they got was just salt in an open wound. The only reason DSJ is even on the team is that team can't stomach the idea that the trade was that bad. And, whereas KP threw hissy-fits from the team's losing and dysfunction, DSJ is just an all around loser, sulking when he doesn't play etc. We sold way, way too low

Revisit the timeline. The beef was with Phil. We fired Phil, moved from Hornacek all while KP was in Rehab from his injury. Fiz never coached him. Basically everything was done. KP had the keys to the franchise.
Basically nothing I have read really defines why he left.
My take is basically aligns with Triple’s insistence that things are not always planned but reacted to. The egregious act as I see it was Knicks delayed extending KP’s money for two reasons:

1. Knicks have 10mm more to spend on talent.
2. Knicks get to see KP is not defective and rehab is smooth.

Remember the timeline. Remember KP does not step on the court and knicks publicly are not pressuring him at all. My take is knicks did not embrace him as the face of the franchise under and it was about money and when it was to come. With everyone’s back up the good faith from both sides was done. KP physically is fragile, has some form of anemic conditions, and is off the court immature. Knicks wait and see does not foster trust. Janis applies leverage he has to get his client to a team that wants him and will pay him.

What’s left? Blame. you have to go back to the moment that trade was done and realize the leverage and who had it.

It's no mystery. He was tired of losing, and moreover of seeing a dysfunctional franchise. THere's no other reason to think he didn't want to be in NY Whether it was Phil saying the right things (debatable but assume arguendo) and then doing stupid things, or the next front office saying they want smart, two-way players and then doing the exact opposite, he was sick of it. ANd frankly so would any other player worth a damn (i.e., one who is good and cares about winning). And if you don't believe that go and look at all the press whether it's for KD, KI or any other player wanting to stay away from the Knicks . So who do we get instead? Players who need a job or care more about money. Guys getting max at the team of their choosing, are not choosing the Knicks (personally i;m not a fan of max FA but say this because it shows the point; it's not KP it's everyone worth a damn) I would have preferred he be more patient but regardless FO has to make that work or get value

Talking about his flaws is a diversion. Giannis can't hit 3s; Harden doesn't play defense; Lebron couldn't hit threes early and has always been an ego-maniac. Just stop with that. Embiid and Simmons missed huge time.

If you think KP is/was worth mental-midget DSJ and 2 (almost certainly) late 1st round picks, then you have the exact same mindset as Mills and Perry. Embrace that!

I'm not going to say the KP debacle set us back a decade but it is indicative of our dysfunction. We went from bad (Phil) to worse (Mills/Perry/Fizzdale). Statistically unlikely but we somehow pulled it off

I do say with confidence that it is far more likely KP will have several AS appearances and deep playoff runs, than it will be for Mills and Fizzdale to be given a repeat opportunity to run a team or head coach. Court is still out on Perry

I’m not here to defend the trade. I said it 100 times it was regrettable. I was a big KP fan and I understand i dont’’ have to like my players off the court as long as they keep it legal.
YOur view of why he wanted out is your view. Show me his words. Likely in part its about losing.
Your rant as if money is not important. Honestly, if KP blows out his leg he walks with 150mm guaranteed. This guy wanted his money first then all else is important. I don’t blame him for that. Knicks incorporated that into issue. Its not the money, its the love. Knicks were right or wrong to hesitate to bank the franchise on a guy that blew out his ACL and proven to be durable. Thats what your looking at. With RFA looming KP had leverage and when Janis sniffed another team would bank on it the there goes leverage.
Thats all.
As for the pittance we received its uglier every time KP puts up big numbers. Thats Why I beg you to look at the moment the trade when down.
Yes, we got ****ed. the moment KP broke is when we got ****ed. But also be real, He plays with a 21 year old vunderkind Who will likely garner top 5 MVP votes. Does it help? Not really.

knicks1248 wrote:Can you imagine a front court of KP and Mitch..smh

No. I. Order to envision it, they would both have to be healthy at the same time.

TripleThreat wrote:

joec32033 wrote:KP will hurt but not for a decade.

9 years, 316 days

Which is a long time. I didn't go to my high school 10 year reunion, I had a road game, but a buddy of mine did and took pictures. He showed me a girl we both had a class with, named Hannah, who had a body that could set the sun on fire. She was like 80 percent of Phoebe Cates and 20 percent of just the right mix of low self esteem and Daddy issues. But she didn't look that way a decade later. I guess she had a couple of kids and having children just wreaks hell on a woman's body apparently. Drinking too. Probably smoking. White women age like milk, what can I say really....

But she was still someone you'd bang. Sure gravity wasn't on her side anymore and she would only be worth using Redneck Foreplay on ( i.e. "Get in the truck") but she was then only on the edge of falling off that big painful cliff of sagging skin.

Also at the reunion was one of the girls who did the yearbook. She was pleasant enough and she was one of the more intelligent people in our class. Nothing got by her. Including carbs. No one was banging her. No one asked her to the prom. Her future was a roomful of cats. Ten years later, you could probably hear her walking into that reunion. Because of all that kitty litter ground into the soles of her shoes. I remember she had this strange haircut where it showed her ears, and one ear was painfully gigantic compared to the other. And I used to think, does it hurt her neck to balance her head all the time from trying to stop from tipping over? No one was ****ing her ten years before, no one was ****ing her ten years later and no one would **** her if they were stuck on a desert island with her. I don't remember her name, just that wheelbarrow sized ear, no one remembers her name.

The Knicks lost the Zinger trade the day it was made. It wasn't a good trade that will seem somewhat passable with time. It's not a hot girl who becomes just another basic bitch. It was an ugly trade that, at best, will stay that same level of ugly for a while. It's the yearbook girl whose name you don't remember because it doesn't matter.

The moral of this story is yearbook girl likely never stopped trying to put out. And neither should the Knicks.

You know what's worse than being stuck in a roomful of cats? It's not realizing that being surrounded by ***** is completely and totally overrated.

Fuck Porzingis. If he doesn't want to be here, he can pack his trash and get the **** out. You have to learn to separate the resource management assessment from one's own fandom.

You take a bad situation and you just try to make the best of it moving forward.

Triple - this is gold.

I’ll always remember “ basic bitchs with low self esteem “. This analogy summaries so much and on so many levels.

Agree f@@k KP and his horse he rides!!

smackeddog wrote:Why's this thread gone quiet? Can someone read out his latest game stats for me?

MIN FG 3PT REB AST PF PTS
27 6-18 0-7 7 2 6 22

knicks1248 wrote:

jrodmc wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

jrodmc wrote:Can we also have a thread when he's hurt for 10 or 12 games in a row?

Whats the difference in a load management ERA, healthy players are barely playing back to back games.

Load management ERA? So you'd be cool with the Knicks coaching staff if he was still on the team missing 10 games in a row? Seriously? WTF?
The unicorn spent an entire season here in a suit and then told the franchise to **** off. Maybe that was career load management?

Move on, nothing to see here. Taller, longer, more impactful version of Linsanity. But the same net/net. No playoffs.

Dude back then I was one of the first to call out all his flaws and durability. It was stupid ass mills and perry who thought he was ready to be the man at 21 yrs old, so he traded Melo for trash instead of adding adequate help. 5 months before the trade when Phil was talking about trading Melo, he was asked if he thought KP was ready for a bigger role, and he flat out said no.

Janis said 8 months before the trade request that signing his extension was going to be base mostly on the direction of the team. They were tired of the Tanking, tired of the losing. The front office had no direction other than to keep losing.

I never thought of KP as a franchise player, but more of a key piece going forward, the exact role he has in Dallas.

I really can't believe how some of you have more hate for KP, than a front office who at the time had the worst winning percentage in the franchise HISTORY, and the worst in the NBA.

The front office is remade. Perry is on a one year deal working for a new boss. The hate is anger as the kid is talented. KP was not want to be the man?
In Dallas the surge of the franchise is on the back of Luca. Not by design but its what happened. We don’t know if KP is happy about that or not. He got his money, he needs to prove healthy and for now its a great scenario for him.
Shame is Knicks were willing to do give KP what he wanted. Fans are hurt by his departure. Obviously your a far more mature and seasoned fans who has great understanding of the pro athlete and the inner thoughts of KP.